Partitions, XP Pro ,and Raid HDD

S

Stan Hilliard

I am building a new PC. The OS is XP Pro and the motherboard is a ABIT
HU8 that has RAID capability built in.

Can a pair of SATA hard drives be configured as RAID and still have
multiple partitions?
If so, can one pair of partitions be RAID and the other partitions
not?

Information will be appreciated,
Stan Hilliard
 
J

Jerry

RAID requires two identical hard drives to be RAIDed together; you cannot
RAID two partitions.
 
S

Stan Hilliard

Hi Sengupta,

Thanks for that link.
Am I right in interpreting that page as saying that not only can two
disks be combined in a RAID array, but also that two partitions can be
combined?

Even if they are on the same drive? That is what it seems to be saying
as follows:

Quote:
"A RAID, or Redundant Array of Inexpensive Disks, is a collection of
disk drives that collectively act as a single storage system. In other
words, two or more hard disk drives which are grouped together and
appear as a single disk drive. Or, in practice, it can also be two or
more disk partitions grouped together and appear as a single
partition/logical drive."

Am I interpreting this correctly?

Stan Hilliard

RAIDing Windows XP:How to Install Windows XP
on a RAID Array of Hard Disk Drives
http://www.duxcw.com/digest/Howto/mb/abit/kx7-333/raid1.htm

regards,
S.Sengupta[MS-MVP]


Stan said:
I am building a new PC. The OS is XP Pro and the motherboard is a ABIT
HU8 that has RAID capability built in.

Can a pair of SATA hard drives be configured as RAID and still have
multiple partitions?
If so, can one pair of partitions be RAID and the other partitions
not?

Information will be appreciated,
Stan Hilliard
 
S

S.Sengupta

Hi,

RAID is a way of combining multiple disk drives into a single entity to
improve performance and/or reliability.

Software RAID operates on a partition-by-partition basis, where a number
of individual disk partitions are ganged together to create a RAID
partition. This is in contrast to most hardware RAID, which gang
together entire disk drives into an array.

There are many things which act as major factors.Operating system is one
of them as far as RAID is concerned.Servers have more advantages here.

I think the following link will help you to set up RAID in XP Professional:-
http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=830&page=5

Also:-
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;309043&sd=tech

Regarding RAID:-
http://www.staff.uni-mainz.de/neuffer/scsi/what_is_raid.html

regards,
S.Sengupta[MS-MVP]

Stan said:
Hi Sengupta,

Thanks for that link.
Am I right in interpreting that page as saying that not only can two
disks be combined in a RAID array, but also that two partitions can be
combined?

Even if they are on the same drive? That is what it seems to be saying
as follows:

Quote:
"A RAID, or Redundant Array of Inexpensive Disks, is a collection of
disk drives that collectively act as a single storage system. In other
words, two or more hard disk drives which are grouped together and
appear as a single disk drive. Or, in practice, it can also be two or
more disk partitions grouped together and appear as a single
partition/logical drive."

Am I interpreting this correctly?

Stan Hilliard


RAIDing Windows XP:How to Install Windows XP
on a RAID Array of Hard Disk Drives
http://www.duxcw.com/digest/Howto/mb/abit/kx7-333/raid1.htm

regards,
S.Sengupta[MS-MVP]


Stan Hilliard wrote:

I am building a new PC. The OS is XP Pro and the motherboard is a ABIT
HU8 that has RAID capability built in.

Can a pair of SATA hard drives be configured as RAID and still have
multiple partitions?
If so, can one pair of partitions be RAID and the other partitions
not?

Information will be appreciated,
Stan Hilliard
 
S

Stan Hilliard

I am building a new PC. The OS is XP Pro and the motherboard is a ABIT
HU8 that has RAID capability built in.

Can a pair of SATA hard drives be configured as RAID and still have
multiple partitions?
If so, can one pair of partitions be RAID and the other partitions
not?

Information will be appreciated,
Stan Hilliard

I have studied the links above and now I have some more specific
questions.

First, I am building a computer with motherboard=ABIT KU8
ULi,OS=Windows XP Pro, and hard drives=two WD-SATA 250GB. I have other
ATA100 hard drives available and a USB external 200GB drive.

My goal is to explore how I can use the on-board RAID controller of
the KU8 motherboard. I am trying to come up with a logical drive
usage/configuration strategy that will benefit me. I have read just
enough about RAID to be dangerous.

I will use the computer in various ways: to develop software with
Visual Basic, to edit my digital video files, to copy & edit DVDs,
develop and maintain a website, to upload and download large files to
the internet, and to play streaming video and audio.

Q1) Is the on-board RAID 0 controller of the KU8 motherboard
considered hardware or software?

Q2) Can I install WinXP first. I think I want to have the WinXP OS on
a non-RAID partition.

Q3) Can I arrange my hard drives as follows?
Partition the two WD-SATA 250GB hard drives into two partitions each.

Drive 1, partition 1(C:)=Operating system, not RAID. Partition 2 RAID
striped with partition 2 of drive 2.

Drive 2, partition 1(D:)=Program Files, not RAID. Partition 2 RAID
striped with partition 2 of drive 1.

My goal: My reason for Q3 if it works is that
(1) I would have fast data loads from the RAID drive, and I can
back up the data separately.
(2) Startup and loading program files will be from the fastest
drives of the computer. (I assume that those operations will not be
occurring at the same time as data operations using the logical RAID
drive.)

I am trying to figure out a strategy and am and looking for advice on
arranging my drives/partitions. At this point my computer components
are still in the box, so I am not committed to anything yet.
 
F

frodo

In microsoft.public.windowsxp.general Stan Hilliard said:
Q1) Is the on-board RAID 0 controller of the KU8 motherboard
considered hardware or software?

it's SW. you need a driver that does it for you, it gets installed at xp
setup time by pressing F6 and supplying the driver on a floppy.
Q2) Can I install WinXP first. I think I want to have the WinXP OS on
a non-RAID partition.

sure, but I would put xp on the raid, that's where you get the most
speed benefit. don't worry too much about it, the dire predictions about
"if you loose one drive you loose it all" are true regardless of whether
it's a raid 0 volume or just a normal drive. if disk crashes really
concern you and your operation, then use raid 1; 250 GB of raid 1 is a lot
of "worry free" storage [two 250GB drives in raid 1 is seen as a 250 GB
volume]. But raid 0 gives you performance that you WILL notice!
Q3) Can I arrange my hard drives as follows?
Partition the two WD-SATA 250GB hard drives into two partitions each.
Drive 1, partition 1(C:)=Operating system, not RAID. Partition 2 RAID
striped with partition 2 of drive 2.
Drive 2, partition 1(D:)=Program Files, not RAID. Partition 2 RAID
striped with partition 2 of drive 1.

No, you've got it wrong. First you create the raid volume by "joining"
the 2 disk drives into one "RAID Volume" (using a utility outside of XP,
usually in the bios itself); basically they then look like one "drive" to
the OS. Then you partition that volume just like any other.

here's the steps (simplified):

0) leave all unneccessary HW unplugged during XP setup - have just your
main HDs, floppy, and your main optical drive installed. No extra HDs, USB
things like printers, ipods or palms, no extra opticals, no extra pci's,
etc. NO NETWORK PLUGGED IN, of course! Go into bios and make sure all
settings are what you want/need. TIP: for an AMD box, make sure any APIC
option (not ACPI, APIC) is set to enabled (ie, more than 16 interrupt
levels available), otherwise you won't get the ACPI HAL to install, which
you DO want (for XP at least). Run a memtest86+ to verify that RAM has
zero errors - an over-night run is recommended. Even one error is cause
for concern - don't install the OS until you get it resolved.

1) using raid utility/bios, define the raid volume. in your case, the 2
wd250's get combined into a 500gb volume. leave stripe size set to
default, typically 128K. [smaller stripe sizes MAY provide better
benchmark results, but not better overall system performance - use the
default]. If you plan on manipulating LARGE video files a lot, go to an
even larger stripe size.

2) boot xp setup from cd, w/ the raid driver floppy disk inserted; press
f6 when prompted "for installing additionall SCSI or RAID Drivers", and
wait (response to the f6 press can take a while, just hit it a couple of
times and wait; be sure any MS Keyboard F-Lock key is active so the F6 is
a real F6)). when the popup menu of additional drivers on the floppy is
displayed select your ULI driver (prob the only one listed) and let it
install it. Note: read motherboard directions carefully; some require
choosing more than one driver, in sequence. when you've choosen all
required drivers continue on...

3) When you get to the "drive to install to" selection screen you should
see that you have only the 500 GB volume to choose from - that's your
raid. I would choose it, create a partition on it, THEN DELETE THAT
PARTITION and recreate it (a precaution against a minor bug in setup that
can cause bad partition table entries and cumbersome disk drive letter
assignments; wiping all partitions and making a new one w/ xp setup cures
this issue). create just one active primary partition, say 40 or 80 GB
[this should end up as your C: drive if you took the above precaution. if
it ends up as E: that's not a big deal tho, it'll work fine anyway].
You'll install XP onto this, then once xp is up and running you can use it
[Disk Manager] to make additional partitions on the volume as needed.
Don't feel that you must allocate all 500 GB to partitions right away;
leaving unallocated space until the time when you actually need it is a
fine stratagy. Google around and understand the diff between a Primary
Partition and an Extended Partition, and the various partitioning schemes
that you can make. For an "All Windows" box, a single Primary w/ a single
Extended taking up the rest of the space is typical; the extended can then
itself be partitioned into multiple logical drives.

Good Luck, and don't proceed until you have a solid understanding and a
good plan! Of course, you can always wipe it and start over again in a
month if you're not happy. Makng mistakes is how we learn...
 
S

Stan Hilliard

In microsoft.public.windowsxp.general Stan Hilliard said:
Q1) Is the on-board RAID 0 controller of the KU8 motherboard
considered hardware or software?

it's SW. you need a driver that does it for you, it gets installed at xp
setup time by pressing F6 and supplying the driver on a floppy.
Q2) Can I install WinXP first. I think I want to have the WinXP OS on
a non-RAID partition.

sure, but I would put xp on the raid, that's where you get the most
speed benefit. don't worry too much about it, the dire predictions about
"if you loose one drive you loose it all" are true regardless of whether
it's a raid 0 volume or just a normal drive. if disk crashes really
concern you and your operation, then use raid 1; 250 GB of raid 1 is a lot
of "worry free" storage [two 250GB drives in raid 1 is seen as a 250 GB
volume]. But raid 0 gives you performance that you WILL notice!
Q3) Can I arrange my hard drives as follows?
Partition the two WD-SATA 250GB hard drives into two partitions each.
Drive 1, partition 1(C:)=Operating system, not RAID. Partition 2 RAID
striped with partition 2 of drive 2.
Drive 2, partition 1(D:)=Program Files, not RAID. Partition 2 RAID
striped with partition 2 of drive 1.

No, you've got it wrong. First you create the raid volume by "joining"
the 2 disk drives into one "RAID Volume" (using a utility outside of XP,
usually in the bios itself); basically they then look like one "drive" to
the OS. Then you partition that volume just like any other.

here's the steps (simplified):

0) leave all unneccessary HW unplugged during XP setup - have just your
main HDs, floppy, and your main optical drive installed. No extra HDs, USB
things like printers, ipods or palms, no extra opticals, no extra pci's,
etc. NO NETWORK PLUGGED IN, of course! Go into bios and make sure all
settings are what you want/need. TIP: for an AMD box, make sure any APIC
option (not ACPI, APIC) is set to enabled (ie, more than 16 interrupt
levels available), otherwise you won't get the ACPI HAL to install, which
you DO want (for XP at least). Run a memtest86+ to verify that RAM has
zero errors - an over-night run is recommended. Even one error is cause
for concern - don't install the OS until you get it resolved.

1) using raid utility/bios, define the raid volume. in your case, the 2
wd250's get combined into a 500gb volume. leave stripe size set to
default, typically 128K. [smaller stripe sizes MAY provide better
benchmark results, but not better overall system performance - use the
default]. If you plan on manipulating LARGE video files a lot, go to an
even larger stripe size.

2) boot xp setup from cd, w/ the raid driver floppy disk inserted; press
f6 when prompted "for installing additionall SCSI or RAID Drivers", and
wait (response to the f6 press can take a while, just hit it a couple of
times and wait; be sure any MS Keyboard F-Lock key is active so the F6 is
a real F6)). when the popup menu of additional drivers on the floppy is
displayed select your ULI driver (prob the only one listed) and let it
install it. Note: read motherboard directions carefully; some require
choosing more than one driver, in sequence. when you've choosen all
required drivers continue on...

3) When you get to the "drive to install to" selection screen you should
see that you have only the 500 GB volume to choose from - that's your
raid. I would choose it, create a partition on it, THEN DELETE THAT
PARTITION and recreate it (a precaution against a minor bug in setup that
can cause bad partition table entries and cumbersome disk drive letter
assignments; wiping all partitions and making a new one w/ xp setup cures
this issue). create just one active primary partition, say 40 or 80 GB
[this should end up as your C: drive if you took the above precaution. if
it ends up as E: that's not a big deal tho, it'll work fine anyway].
You'll install XP onto this, then once xp is up and running you can use it
[Disk Manager] to make additional partitions on the volume as needed.
Don't feel that you must allocate all 500 GB to partitions right away;
leaving unallocated space until the time when you actually need it is a
fine stratagy. Google around and understand the diff between a Primary
Partition and an Extended Partition, and the various partitioning schemes
that you can make. For an "All Windows" box, a single Primary w/ a single
Extended taking up the rest of the space is typical; the extended can then
itself be partitioned into multiple logical drives.

Good Luck, and don't proceed until you have a solid understanding and a
good plan! Of course, you can always wipe it and start over again in a
month if you're not happy. Makng mistakes is how we learn...

Thanks for pointing me in a better direction. I will set up a RAID 0
array with a single primary (C:) and extended partition containing
several logical partitions.

What backup methods will work on the RAID drive? Will Ghost work?

Will Partition Magic work to create, delete, and resize partitions and
change format type?

Will the usual Windows utilities work -- like Scandisk and Defrag?

Stan Hilliard
 

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