OT : Windows 8

[RJK]

I've just had a read up on Windows 8 vs Windows 8 Pro / ARM processors / how
to swipe this, and swipe that, (if you have a touchscreen).

What a hideously complicated and expensive route "they"re all forcing on us
! I recently had to buy a new mobile phone, as I couldn't find a bew
battery for my old Samsung A30, so I bought a Samsung Galaxy Mini II with a
touch screen, took the SIM out of old Samsung and put it in my new Mini II,
and for the next couple of days, couldn't answer it when it rang ! So,
(whilst on 11 days off from work), I phoned a friend at work and asked,
"When it rings, and the green and red circled handset icons appear, I prod
and prod the green handset, and it just keeps ringing ....how does one
answer the darned thing ? !!!" To which he answered, "...just swipe the
green one off to the right of the screen..." So I've now been partially
initiated into the world of swiping ! And I understand that as more and
more touchscreen hardware is forced onto us, there will be an ever
increasing number of screens with filthy horrid greasy swipe marks all over
them ! I've already developed an OCD complex with my new mobile 'phone, and
simply have to keep giving it a gentle wipe with a damp piece of J-cloth,
and buffing it up with a clean tissue. Goodness know how I would keep a
bigger touch-screen clean !

Anyhoo, considering that XP end-of-life is April 8 2014, and that I
occasionally take my XP Home hd out, (of my Startech caddyless 5 1/4"
hard-disk bay), and pop in my W7 Ultimate hd in order to have a rummage
around, and try to do things in Ultimate, I keep finding that applications
are missing, need installing, and/or won't install because theyr'e too old,
and I keep abandoning tasks because so much time and money would have to
spent on upgrading application software, that there would little or no time
left to actually do what I wanted to do in the first place !

So, I plan to keep my old XP as it is, (and not use it for the internet
after April 8 2014), use my W7 Laptop, W7 Ultimate hd in my main PC for the
web and email, ...and MS and the i-pad and tablet manufacturers CAN ALL GO
TO HELL !!!

best regards, Richard

 

[Paul]

I've just had a read up on Windows 8 vs Windows 8 Pro / ARM processors / how
to swipe this, and swipe that, (if you have a touchscreen).

What a hideously complicated and expensive route "they"re all forcing on us
! I recently had to buy a new mobile phone, as I couldn't find a bew
battery for my old Samsung A30, so I bought a Samsung Galaxy Mini II with a
touch screen, took the SIM out of old Samsung and put it in my new Mini II,
and for the next couple of days, couldn't answer it when it rang ! So,
(whilst on 11 days off from work), I phoned a friend at work and asked,
"When it rings, and the green and red circled handset icons appear, I prod
and prod the green handset, and it just keeps ringing ....how does one
answer the darned thing ? !!!" To which he answered, "...just swipe the
green one off to the right of the screen..." So I've now been partially
initiated into the world of swiping ! And I understand that as more and
more touchscreen hardware is forced onto us, there will be an ever
increasing number of screens with filthy horrid greasy swipe marks all over
them ! I've already developed an OCD complex with my new mobile 'phone, and
simply have to keep giving it a gentle wipe with a damp piece of J-cloth,
and buffing it up with a clean tissue. Goodness know how I would keep a
bigger touch-screen clean !

Anyhoo, considering that XP end-of-life is April 8 2014, and that I
occasionally take my XP Home hd out, (of my Startech caddyless 5 1/4"
hard-disk bay), and pop in my W7 Ultimate hd in order to have a rummage
around, and try to do things in Ultimate, I keep finding that applications
are missing, need installing, and/or won't install because theyr'e too old,
and I keep abandoning tasks because so much time and money would have to
spent on upgrading application software, that there would little or no time
left to actually do what I wanted to do in the first place !

So, I plan to keep my old XP as it is, (and not use it for the internet
after April 8 2014), use my W7 Laptop, W7 Ultimate hd in my main PC for the
web and email, ...and MS and the i-pad and tablet manufacturers CAN ALL GO
TO HELL !!!

best regards, Richard

Since you're running Windows 7 Ultimate, you can install WinXP Mode. It
allows running older software, and because it uses Terminal Services,
it draws windows for the applications, just like they were running under
Windows 7.

You can also try setting the "compatibility mode" on executables.
After they're installed on your Windows 7.

A 64 bit Windows, won't run 16 bit code. (My copy of MD5SUM, won't
run on my Windows 7 x64 laptop, or either of my Windows 8 installs.)
But if you had WinXP Mode, that is an x32 OS, and 16 bit code should
run in there. On some programs, it is only the "installer" for the
package that is 16 bit and broken. Whereas the executables inside
are actually 32 bit. So it's not always the situation with my copy
of MD5SUM, where the actual executable is 16 bit.

To install WinXP Mode on your Win7 Ultimate, there are two downloads.
A 500MB WinXP image, which has its own license key scheme. And
a copy of Windows Virtual PC (on the order of 20MB or so, not
nearly as big as the WinXP Mode image). The Virtual PC runs
the WinXP Mode thing as a virtual machine. So you'd have to
install them in a particular order I would guess.

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ee681616(v=ws.10).aspx

( or http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows7/install-and-use-windows-xp-mode-in-windows-7 )

I got a screenshot at the time...

http://img850.imageshack.us/img850/7848/winxpmode.gif

which may have come from a page like this (archived, as they
changed it).

http://web.archive.org/web/20110616005158/http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtual-pc/download.aspx

(WinXP Mode download)
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=8002

(Windows Virtual PC download)
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=3702

At this late date, you have to rummage around to get things done.

Have fun,
Paul

 

[Stef]

I've just had a read up on Windows 8 vs Windows 8 Pro / ARM processors / how
to swipe this, and swipe that, (if you have a touchscreen).

What a hideously complicated and expensive route "they"re all forcing on us

[big snip]

So, I plan to keep my old XP as it is, (and not use it for the internet
after April 8 2014), use my W7 Laptop, W7 Ultimate hd in my main PC for the
web and email, ...and MS and the i-pad and tablet manufacturers CAN ALL GO
TO HELL !!!

Do what a lot of Windows users have been doing since the release of
Vista: Switching to OSX, or Linux.

Stef

 

[Bert]

In "Bill in Co"

But how much of our already purchased, windows-based software, would
even run in Linux? (Just curious). Unless there is some Windows
emulation mode in Linux, I'm assuming the programs would have had to
be written to run on it from the start, which would seem to be a
narrow subset of what's out there in the software world..

If your machine has sufficient horsepower, you can run just about any
foreign OS under Linux using the free VMWare Player.

http://www.vmware.com/products/player/

You usually need a real installation DVD or CD to build the VM image of
the foreign OS, but you can often find pre-built VM images for popular
OSes on various Web sites.

Once you've created the VM, you can then install your Windows software
into the VM just as you would on a real PC.

I've been doing it the other way, running Linux and a trial copy of
Windows 8 on my XP machine.

 

[RJK]

you have read about it but you haven't tried it or experienced yourself so
you are likely to be completely wrong.

Windows 8 is the best operating system since XP was release in 2001. If
you haven't bought a new machine yet then go to your local store now and
buy one. You won't regret it.

This is my XP but I also have Win7 and Win8 machines that I use to test
our extensions. Do you want to buy a penile extension to extend your man
hood? Forget about Windows 8 for now because you haven't decided yet and
you are very confused. Penile extensions will boost your confidence.




--

Al Sparber - PVII
http://www.projectseven.com
The Finest Dreamweaver Menus | Galleries | Widgets
Since 1998

Just tell me how, for example, using a Windows 8 tablet, I could :-

Rip a commercial DVD with old faithful DVD Decrypter / or Smart Ripper,
resize, (if necessary), and "author" it, in one go using DVD2one.exe, and
burn it to 4.7gb DVD using Nero 7 ?

How would I snatch Youtube video clips, (as I've doen in the past using XP),
from XP's TIF directory ? (despite Youtube continually trying to make that
difficult) ?

How would I Install the latest MVP hosts file, so that I retain that extra
thin layer of web security, ...as part of my years old multi layered
approach to internet security ?

As for deciding ! I have decided that I am not going to spend more money on
MS OS/GUI's e.g. Windows 8

I spent years studying MSDOS and W98se, and a substantial part of that
knowledge was rendered redundant when W98se was superceded by XP platforms.

My contention is that an investment of, (usually), a couple of years getting
to grips with new MS OS/GUI offerings, soon gets made worthless by MS and
the hardware industries, who want us to move on, to something that is much
less backwards compatible with what went before, etc.

Why not MS just ask for an occasional, 5 / /7 / 10 years license renewal,
instead of this ridiculous "end of product life" scenario !!!!

regards, Richard

 

[RJK]

Since you're running Windows 7 Ultimate, you can install WinXP Mode. It
allows running older software, and because it uses Terminal Services,
it draws windows for the applications, just like they were running under
Windows 7.

You can also try setting the "compatibility mode" on executables.
After they're installed on your Windows 7.

A 64 bit Windows, won't run 16 bit code. (My copy of MD5SUM, won't
run on my Windows 7 x64 laptop, or either of my Windows 8 installs.)
But if you had WinXP Mode, that is an x32 OS, and 16 bit code should
run in there. On some programs, it is only the "installer" for the
package that is 16 bit and broken. Whereas the executables inside
are actually 32 bit. So it's not always the situation with my copy
of MD5SUM, where the actual executable is 16 bit.

To install WinXP Mode on your Win7 Ultimate, there are two downloads.
A 500MB WinXP image, which has its own license key scheme. And
a copy of Windows Virtual PC (on the order of 20MB or so, not
nearly as big as the WinXP Mode image). The Virtual PC runs
the WinXP Mode thing as a virtual machine. So you'd have to
install them in a particular order I would guess.

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ee681616(v=ws.10).aspx

( or
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows7/install-and-use-windows-xp-mode-in-windows-7 )

I got a screenshot at the time...

http://img850.imageshack.us/img850/7848/winxpmode.gif

which may have come from a page like this (archived, as they
changed it).

http://web.archive.org/web/20110616005158/http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtual-pc/download.aspx

(WinXP Mode download)
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=8002

(Windows Virtual PC download)
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=3702

At this late date, you have to rummage around to get things done.

Have fun,
Paul

Many thanks, I will be investigating the emulators you mention.

regards, Richard

 

[RJK]

< snip >

For those who want to "play" with Windows v8.1, 32bit, Professional
Preview...
English ISO
http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=302162#

Product Key: NTTX3-RV7VB-T7X7F-WQYYY-9Y92F
{ Preview good until 1/1/2014 }

Reference:
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/preview-download

I will ponder on those, but, suspect that I will not touch W8 with a
barge-pole, pretty much as I refused to touch the successor to W98se, or XP
!!!! ..but did !


regards, Richard

 

[RJK]

I've just had a read up on Windows 8 vs Windows 8 Pro / ARM processors /
how
to swipe this, and swipe that, (if you have a touchscreen).

What a hideously complicated and expensive route "they"re all forcing on
us

[big snip]

So, I plan to keep my old XP as it is, (and not use it for the internet
after April 8 2014), use my W7 Laptop, W7 Ultimate hd in my main PC for
the
web and email, ...and MS and the i-pad and tablet manufacturers CAN ALL
GO
TO HELL !!!

Do what a lot of Windows users have been doing since the release of
Vista: Switching to OSX, or Linux.

Stef

Tried Red Hat once, couldn't do a thing with it !

regards, Richard

 

[Ken Springer]

I've just had a read up on Windows 8 vs Windows 8 Pro / ARM processors /
how
to swipe this, and swipe that, (if you have a touchscreen).

What a hideously complicated and expensive route "they"re all forcing on
us

[big snip]

So, I plan to keep my old XP as it is, (and not use it for the internet
after April 8 2014), use my W7 Laptop, W7 Ultimate hd in my main PC for
the
web and email, ...and MS and the i-pad and tablet manufacturers CAN ALL
GO
TO HELL !!!

Do what a lot of Windows users have been doing since the release of
Vista: Switching to OSX, or Linux.

Stef

But how much of our already purchased, windows-based software, would even
run in Linux? (Just curious). Unless there is some Windows emulation mode
in Linux, I'm assuming the programs would have had to be written to run on
it from the start, which would seem to be a narrow subset of what's out
there in the software world..

Or learn the Linux equivalents, which would be free.


--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.4
Firefox 22.0
Thunderbird 17.0.7
LibreOffice 4.0.4.2

 

[Good Guy]

But how much of our already purchased, windows-based software, would even
run in Linux?

NONE.

He was simply suggesting an alternative OS to people who are using
computers as hobby or to browse the web. Linux is not suitable for
serious people who are keeping this planet afloat by working hard and to
pay the taxes for other people to live on welfare and to keep using
linux for fun.

 

[Paul]

I've just had a read up on Windows 8 vs Windows 8 Pro / ARM processors /
how
to swipe this, and swipe that, (if you have a touchscreen).

What a hideously complicated and expensive route "they"re all forcing on
us

[big snip]

So, I plan to keep my old XP as it is, (and not use it for the internet
after April 8 2014), use my W7 Laptop, W7 Ultimate hd in my main PC for
the
web and email, ...and MS and the i-pad and tablet manufacturers CAN ALL
GO
TO HELL !!!

Do what a lot of Windows users have been doing since the release of
Vista: Switching to OSX, or Linux.

Stef

But how much of our already purchased, windows-based software, would even
run in Linux? (Just curious). Unless there is some Windows emulation mode
in Linux, I'm assuming the programs would have had to be written to run on
it from the start, which would seem to be a narrow subset of what's out
there in the software world..

WINE provides runtime replacements for Windows routines.
So when an EXE calls a certain API, WINE provides a library
to answer the call. And fool the EXE into thinking it's still
in Windows. And the idea is, they don't just steal executable
code, because then they'd get in trouble with Microsoft. Instead,
they have to write code clean-room style - write code that performance
the same functions, without copying the X86 instructions. It requires
figuring out the parameter list, and what function the routine may
perform. They might still use a debugger, to watch what Windows does
with its code, but then write functional equivalents that don't
look the same.

Any program that does "funny stuff" for licensing reasons, may
not like such an environment. WINE keeps a C_drive, as a file
tree. If licensing code attempted to write to sector 123456
on the disk, there would be no equivalent in WINE. WINE would
do the right thing, if you open(file), write(file), close(file).
But working at the block level, I don't think that would work very
well. I didn't see any evidence of a block-level duality. That's as
opposed to a virtual machine, where the storage device is a
block level representation, so a block level operation would work
(i.e. partition and format virtual disk, install an OS). WINE is
just trying to provide a comfortable environment, to make straightforward
programs work. And that means dealing with open(), write(), close().
And leaving a Linux equivalent file in the file tree.

WINE has optional packages, so there is more tweaking now
than in previous versions. I don't know exactly, why they just
wouldn't blast all the good stuff into one monolithic install.

I don't use it for more than "installer testing", and getting
Windows installers to leave their files in %temp% long enough, for
me to have a look at them. And I've managed to get more stuff to
work this year, than when I tried a few things years ago.

WINE will show you things like failing calls, or parts of it
that have no emulation yet. So if you start a WINE run
from a terminal window, you can get some idea how well
the library calls are being supported.

You can also find info, on what it takes to get certain
programs to run. Whether it's hopeless, or just complicated.
Getting games to run, is always fun.

*******

Now that Steam is available for Linux, that's another avenue
for solving the gaming issue. Don't ask me what this costs.
I've never even been to the Steam site.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steam_(software)#Linux

Paul

 

[RJK]

"...serious people who are keeping this planet afloat by working hard and to
pay the taxes for other people to live on welfare..."

ooooh !!! ....let me sink my teeth into this one, for a few moments !

Since the banking collapse of 2008, here in the UK "...we're all in it
together..." to the tune of £37+ billion banks bail-out, and there was a
body of opinion that those banks should have been just left to collapse.
And a few months ago there was suggestion that, in as many words, those
banks should be privatised, i.e. let them off scot free. And a couple of
months ago someone on Radio 4 mentioned that since 2008, the top 100 wealthy
peoples wealth had increased by £152 billion. So, something is seriously
wrong, somewhere !

I've worked all my life but, have always considered it most disgusting to
criticise people on welfare, considering the countless thousands of middle
class Americans, that lost their jobs and homes, and are living alongside
the freeways, can only afford a couple of nights in a motel per week, and
are out on the road for the rest of the week. re: a ducumentary on UK t.v. a
few months ago. The American dream is a most disgusting model especially
considering that there is no National Health service as here in UK. and not
to mention the countless thousands here in the UK that lost their homes -
unable to keep up mortgage payments.
The establishment here, via the t.v. brainwashing tool, continually
propogates disgusting attitudes towards people desperate for a job that pays
a half decent wage, and for most of them, that aren't any out there !!!
It's the children I feel sorry for, I have two young nieces, that go from
one SHIT-POOR paid job to the next, what does the future hold for them ?
!!!!!

best regards, Richard

 

[Paul]

Stef wrote:
RJK wrote:

I've just had a read up on Windows 8 vs Windows 8 Pro / ARM processors
/
how
to swipe this, and swipe that, (if you have a touchscreen).

What a hideously complicated and expensive route "they"re all forcing
on
us

[big snip]

So, I plan to keep my old XP as it is, (and not use it for the internet
after April 8 2014), use my W7 Laptop, W7 Ultimate hd in my main PC for
the
web and email, ...and MS and the i-pad and tablet manufacturers CAN ALL
GO
TO HELL !!!
Do what a lot of Windows users have been doing since the release of
Vista: Switching to OSX, or Linux.

Stef
But how much of our already purchased, windows-based software, would even
run in Linux? (Just curious). Unless there is some Windows emulation
mode
in Linux, I'm assuming the programs would have had to be written to run
on
it from the start, which would seem to be a narrow subset of what's out
there in the software world..

Or learn the Linux equivalents, which would be free.

But I'm guessing there aren't any even close equivalents, at least, for
example, for such apps as Adobe Audition, or Cyberlink PowerDirector (for
doing some audio or video rework, for example). (Audacity doesn't quite
"cut it"

You could test this as a video editor. I installed this, and
stopped testing after about two minutes, because my file would
not import. But that's really no different than a ton of
other "failures" I've had with video in the past. I just
didn't have the energy to fight with it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinelerra

If you've got the energy, give it a try.

With Audacity, you can add filters to it. For example, I downloaded
a "notch" filter, for removing things like hum. The standard install,
might have high pass and low pass. So the tool is extensible, if you
can spend the time tracking down "good" filters. I don't really
know what Audition does, so can't compare what might be missing.

Paul

 

[Paul]

Fascinating. Thanks, Paul. So I read up a little bit more on this.

Looks like WINE can indeed run a lot of windows software. My mistake on
saying "emulation", as apparently that term applies to running it in virtual
machine, and this is quite different, as you pointed out.

So apparently they've reverse engineered enough of the code to get all the
needed APIs in their libraries for lots of apps, which really surprised me.


I just looked at a list of compatible apps (with varying degrees of
compatibility), and there were many. (Might be something for me to think
about for the future, if and when I have to get a new PC, although at this
stage I think it would be a whole lot easier just to get a used PC with XP.

It's Linux. As long as you don't expect too much
from it, you'll never be disappointed

Paul

 

[Ken Springer]

I installed this, and
stopped testing after about two minutes, because my file would
not import.

I don't count non-importing of files that should import as being a
problem between operating systems anymore. I've had that happen too
many times with software in the same OS. Sometimes, even a Word file,
created with an earlier version, wouldn't import.

<snip>


--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.4
Firefox 22.0
Thunderbird 17.0.7
LibreOffice 4.0.4.2

 

[Tim Slattery]

But how much of our already purchased, windows-based software, would even
run in Linux? (Just curious). Unless there is some Windows emulation mode
in Linux, I'm assuming the programs would have had to be written to run on
it from the start, which would seem to be a narrow subset of what's out
there in the software world..

WINE is a Linux system that allows Windows programs to run. Most
programs do very well, but there will always be exceptions.

 

[Bert]

In Good Guy

Linux is not suitable for serious people who are keeping this planet
afloat by working hard and to pay the taxes for other people to live
on welfare and to keep using linux for fun.

You've apparently not been paying much attention to the number of
large-scale commercial applications that are running on various flavors
of Linux.