MSDE is a COMPLETE MARKETING FAILURE as ZERO PEOPLE USE IT for anything, even development.

[Guest]

I believe I already have Microsoft's ear.....and sometimes...with something
THIS IMPORTANT...you need to get ATTENTION....

Anyway, SQL Server is really NOT that cheap when compared to
HARDWARE...that's how the outsider, startup, mom and pop, and the general
population look at it.

You know there are a LOT more people who like and shop WAL-MART than Saks
5th Avenue.
Same with eBay......same with Charles Schwab........

sell to the masses.......

 

[Guest]

SBS is still too expensive...

Let's say $2000 for the sofware...$2000 for the hardware...and then what?
How much money will be left so that mom and pop can pay the developer or
network admin?

See what the .NET developer is up against? We are comparing to PHP and
MySql........

It's not like I want to switch...but it's a financial decision....

Look through the eyes of Mom and Pop....all they see is Pentium 4 2.4
GHz....1 GIG of RAM for under $1K....what are they supposed to think???? Do
you think they care whether it's hardware or software? DO you think they
are going to LISTEN to any developer, MVP or not MVP?

This happens over and over again.......

 

[Guest]

Anon is being smart....so that we can discuss the ISSUES at hand....

Let's take a LOOK at that research......and then look through the eyes of
MOM and POP and for that matter any Fortune 500 company....

Each and every year they have to TOTALLY Upgrade the ENTIRE system..they get
POOR customer service....BUGS all over the place, VIRUS alerts every other
day, ON TV and the Newspaper.

Software and Web Sites that are written by complete "arrogant" idiots who
could care less if it's user friendly.

Always a new software upgrade to install and always something new to
learn..I mean WRESTLE with.

ZERO guarantee if something works..

Very very poor reliability.......

Very fast depreciation.

Software UNFULFILLED PROMISES........Features that aren't compatible......

Prices that are STILL the same...AND get this......YEARLY licensing
FEES.......

The only ones who are really making any strides are HARDWARE.....at least
you can use it....sort of....and they double the power for half the
price.....can't say that about software......



Now, you tell me why Fortune 500 companies and mom and pops aren't hiring OR
spending upon IT.......

I will tell you why......BROKEN PROMISES.....

 

[Tony Rogerson]

It's been said before....

Hardware approx £600
Windows 2003 Web approx £300
MSDE version as part of Web Matrix FREE

You can use Web Matrix to build your website; MSDE can be distributed into
production as part of Web Matrix.

When your site reaches > around 10 hits per second (quite a lot!) then
upgrade to SQL Server 2000 standard - you'd need this because you aren't
allowed to use SBS on the internet.

 

[Tony Rogerson]

Box standard SQL Server engine badged as MSDE with throttling FREE
SQL Server 2000 standard processor licence
£3500
MySQL standard support cost $1500.

Going down the mysql route also FREE, however, when you need scalability or
to do analysis on your data once your site has grown then the porting costs
are very expensive.

 

[Stu Smith]

I think this poster is really one of those supposed-AI programs, along the
style of Eliza.... concatenating random phrases according to predefined
rules.

Arguing is futile, it will just keep going until some researcher somewhere
stops laughing and stops the program.

(Troll-bot?)

 

[Stephen Dybing [MSFT]]

I'd just like to jump in here as a Microsoft employee and officially state
that Tony is correct.

1. MSDE is free for use when used with Web Matrix
2. MSDE can be used in a production environment when the app being used is
built using 1.

We've put together an MSDE FAQ list that might be of help here. Tony's
referenced it below, but I'll repeat:
http://www.microsoft.com/sql/msde/howtobuy/msdeuse.asp.

--
Hope this helps,
Stephen Dybing

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
Please reply to the newsgroups only, thanks.

Microsoft highly recommends to all of our customers that they visit the
http://www.microsoft.com/protect site and perform the three straightforward
steps listed to improve your computer's security.

 

[Daniel O'Connell]

Haha, now this is a theory I like.

I think this poster is really one of those supposed-AI programs, along the
style of Eliza.... concatenating random phrases according to predefined
rules.

Arguing is futile, it will just keep going until some researcher somewhere
stops laughing and stops the program.

(Troll-bot?)

 

[Serge Shakhov]

Hello

I think this poster is really one of those supposed-AI programs, along the
style of Eliza.... concatenating random phrases according to predefined
rules.

No, he is a real human.
I've thought that nospam is bot as long as he starts debate about
Porche prices. Is it possible to write such an advanced robot?

By the way, as moderator of one of the FIDOnet conferences,
I can say that in FIDO areas religious (not technical) wars like this
are everyday occurrences.

Serge Shakhov

 

[Guest]

MySql standard SUPPORT is ZERO....

WHY?????? It's because MOM and POP paid the developer already....

It's the developer job that mom and pop hired, not MySql standard support.

 

[Guest]

You know.....in order to have humor, there must be some element of
truth.....

Since you and others are laughing sooo much...there's obviously a lot of
truth......

Ha. Ha. Ha.

 

[Guest]

Well, then please tell the others to stop laughing as it only proves my
points......

Ha ha ha ha

 

[Thomas Tomicek [MVP]]

You know.....in order to have humor, there must be some element of
truth.....

Since you and others are laughing sooo much...there's obviously a lot of
truth......

Yes, the truth is what someone said: you are a moron.

Thomas

 

[Thomas Tomicek [MVP]]

No, it prooves you area moron. Which is a point prooven 100% by you right
now.

--
Regards

Thomas Tomiczek
THONA Software & Consulting Ltd.
(Microsoft MVP C#/.NET)

 

[Tony Rogerson]

MySql standard SUPPORT is ZERO....

No it isn't - its $1500 - check the website.

 

[Guest]

CHECK THE WEB SITE????????

MOM and POP are NOT going to CHECK THE WEB SITE!!!!!!

MOM AND POP ARE GOING TO CALL THE DEVELOPER, WHO THEY PAID $$$$ DOLLARS TO.

WHY?????? It's because MOM and POP paid the developer already....

****************************************************************************
*******
It's the developer's job to provide support (that mom and pop hired), not
MySql standard support.
****************************************************************************
*******

READ...ONE CHECK...PERIOD....TO THE DEVELOPER...THAT"S IT.


READ......
MySql standard SUPPORT is ZERO....because the developer is going to EAT that
cost.

 

[Guest]

http://www.vnunet.com/News/1143671

No, it prooves you area moron. Which is a point prooven 100% by you right
now.

--
Regards

Thomas Tomiczek
THONA Software & Consulting Ltd.
(Microsoft MVP C#/.NET)

lot

 

[Groucho]

"Andrew J. Kelly" wrote in message

Obviously your the one who is clueless if you think MySql can do all that
MSDE can and better.

Vendors (and many users) embrace the idea that bigger is better.
But the broader view held by many may be less is more.
Here are two current interesting articles on the state of the relational
wars.

Enough Features Already!
Customers want simpler, cheaper databases, say analysts
http://sdtimes.com/news/086/special2.htm

It's all about the Relationship
http://sdtimes.com/news/086/special1.htm

... so I suggest you go off an play with your toy db's if they
make you happy.

Many Oracle users refer to Server with the same description.
Neither group distinguishes themselves with this kind of nonsense.
....And certainly google would take issue with you!

K.I.S.S. is no easy task but a very worthwhile goal.
www.rac4sql.net

 

[Guest]

That's the stupidity of programmers....they can't see stuff like this....

As for your Wal-Mart/Saks Fifth Avenue comparison, it too is faulty. Both of
those retailers, who by the way, are in vastly different businesses than
manufacturing software, cater to wholly different market segments.

That's why they can almost NEVER sell their own software....

Here is some MORE....

McNealy: Computing prices to fall
http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1104_2-5077619.html

HOW DOES IBM MAKE MONEY???????
The companies that will be hit when computer prices fall to their proper
level are the ones that have a vested interest in maintaining today's
complicated computing environments, McNealy told reporters after his keynote
address. He gave IBM and Microsoft as examples. "How much of IBM Global
Service's revenue (comes from) maintaining the complexity of the PC
environment?" he asked.

McNealy, with his fondness for car metaphors, had one ready for the
occasion. If cars were as complicated and custom-built as today's computing
gear, there would be vastly more mechanics, car painters, tow truck drivers,
car designers and other support workers needed to deal with the chaos and
unpredictability, he said.


The IT industry's JUDGEMENT DAY IS GETTING CLOSER.....

 

[Guest]

IF everything YOU SAY is sooooo SIMPLE and AFFORDABLE...why are Mom and Pop
still going to PHP/MySql then?????

See all those "so-called" reports and numbers......doesn't seem to jive in
this economy does it? AMI 2001 report? come ON???? 2001... the data was
probably from 2000.....

Seems like you don't even do programming anymore......

Just remember...EVEN with all the HIDDEN COSTS....it's the IT industry
job( read me, you, Microsoft) to make that clear to mom and pop.....AS MOM
and POP (as well as Fortune 500 companies) see IBM, MICROSOFT, SUN, HP, and
developers, and arrogant programmers as the SAME THING.....



READ CAREFULLY
http://www.business-standard.com/ice/story.asp?Menu=119&story=22786
"Our industry is way too complex," he said. "A lot of employees are
delivering features that we want to build into products. Hence, (IT) is way
too expensive."


http://news.zdnet.co.uk/business/0,39020645,39116219,00.htm
McNealy said that in his view the information technology industry is slowly
evolving away from a model in which every company assembles a unique data
centre with components from 80 different suppliers. In the future, he
predicted, most companies will buy preassembled, standard computer systems
or rent them, and IT departments will be much smaller.