MS-DOS Startup Disk

[Chad Harris]

John--

This "vista blue screen" says exactly what??????????? We know when it comes
lol 3AM but what does the blue screen say? Maybe the blue screen's
contents are a clue to your problems. But you haven't shared what it says
with us.

John's mystery blue screen:

"Lately, however, I get what is apparently the Vista blue screen and it
somehow fixes it and goes on. The blue screen happens at the strangest
times; it happened at 3 a.m. (yes, I was asleep at the time, the computer
was supposed to be asleep too). I heard the fans start up and the room lit
up and there was the blue screen. Lines of
activity showed up at the bottom of the screen and it rebooted. (I turned
the monitor off and went back to bed.) Come morning and the system seems to
work just fine."

"I heard the fans start up and the room lit up and there was the blue
screen..."

And that ole blue screen said what John?

The "lines of activity" that showed up at the bottom of that Vista boot
screen are the Vista kernel loading.

I have another question John about a matter you haven't shared. Do you have
a Vista DVD or did you get caught in the Microsoft Greed trap? If you have
a Vista DVD try these steps illustrated and explained below. If you don't,
I don't know the duration of these problems but try to use system restore to
a point before @ F8. I'd like to know what would happen if you use Startup
Repair from the DVD or try a repair install. Also try SFC first. We don't
know that the mobo is the problem. You have nothing to lose and everything
to gain. And p.s. what does that BSOD say?

***SFC as a Remedy***:

SFC or System File Checker is a bit like the spare tire in your car or a
backup battery I suppose. In Vista of course, they have changed it somewhat
and come up with a new name--Redmond stands for name it something different
twice a year and now it's part of WRP or Windows Resource Protection. It
scans protected resources including thousands of files, libraries, critical
folders, and essential registry keys, and it replaces those that are
corrupted with intact ones. It fixes a lot of problems in Windows XP, OE,
Windows Vista, Win Mail, IE6, and on Vista or if it is installed on XP, IE7.
It protects these things from changes by any source including
administrators, by keeping a spare of most of them.


How to Run SFC:

Type "cmd" into the Search box above the Start Button>and when cmd comes up
at the top of the Start menu>right click cmd and click "run as Admin" and
when the cmd prompt comes up at the cmd prompt type "sfc /scannow" no quotes
and let it run. This may fix things quite a bit. It replaces corrupt files
with intact ones, if you're not familiar with it.

***Startup Repair from the Vista DVD***

How to Use The Vista DVD to Repair Vista (Startup Repair is misnamed by the
Win RE team and it can be used to fix many Vista components even when you
***can boot to Vista):

http://www.windowsvista.windowsreinstall.com/vistaultimate/repairstartup/index.htm

If you elect to run Startup repair from the Vista DVD (it can fix major
components in Vista--I've verified this many many times; it's good for more
than startup problems, and the Win RE team simply screwed up when they named
it not understanding its full functionality):

Startup Repair will look like this when you put in the Vista DVD:

http://www.vistaclues.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/click-repair-your-computer.png

You run the startup repair tool this way (and system restore from here is
also sometimes effective):

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/925810/en-us

How To Run Startup Repair In Vista Ultimate (Multiple Screenshots)
http://www.windowsvista.windowsreinstall.com/vistaultimate/repairstartup/index.htm

It will automatically take you to this on your screen:

http://www.vistaclues.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/click-repair-your-computer.png

That will allow you to go to the Vista setup that has a Repair link on
thelower left corner>click it and then you'll see a gray backgrounded list
and I want you to click Startup Repair from it and follow the directions.

The gray screen after you click the first link in the above pic will look
like this:

http://www.windowsreinstall.com/winvista/images/repair/staruprepair/Image17.gif

Click Startup Repair, the link at the top and after it scans>click OK and
let it try to repair Vista. It will tell you if it does, and if it
doesn't, try System Restore from the Recovery Link on the DVD. If these
don't work booting into Safe Mode by tapping the F8 key and using System
Restore from one of the safe modes besides VGA may work. That means you
have the option to try 4 different safe modes to get to system restore, (one
from the Recovery link on the DVD) and sometimes one will work when the
others won't.


You could also try a Repair Install with Vista which is done exactly the
same way as in XP:

***Repair Install Steps*** (can be used for Vista) MVP Doug Knox
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/helpandsupport/learnmore/tips/doug92.mspx


***Using the F8 Environment***

***Taking Full Advantage of the F8 Options (Windows Advanced Options Menu)
by starting the PC and tapping F8 once per second when the firmware screen
with the pc manufacturer's name shows a few seconds after restarting***:

The F8 options in Vista are the same as XP, and the link for Safe Mode Boot
options is labled XP by MSFT but they are the same for Vista (they haven't
updated to add Vista to the title as they have with several MSKBs that apply
to both).

Again, pressing F8 repeatedly when you seem the firmware screen may be is a
generic way to launch Windows RE on some OEM Vista computers.

You could also:

Think: I have 4 different ways to get back my XP at F8 and try 'em in order.
1) Safe Mode 2) Safe Mode with Cmd to Sys Restore which is simply a cmd
prompt in safe mode 3) Safe Mode with Neworking 4) LKG or Last Known Good
Configuration


Try to F8 to the Windows Adv Options Menu>try 3 safe modes there (I don't
use WGA) and Last Known Good>then I go to Win RE in Vista. That gives you a
choice of Safe Mode, Safe Mode with Networking,and Safe Mode with Command
Prompt.

These methods are outlined in

A description of the Safe Mode Boot options in Windows XP/and Vista
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/315222/

Frequently Asked Questions Regarding System Restore from MSFT:

http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/plan/faqsrwxp.mspx

System Restore can be run from the Win RE recovery environment from the same
link as Startup Repair, and sometimes it will work from one F8 safe mode
location or from the Win Recovery Environment when it won't work from other
locations.

How to start the System Restore tool at a command prompt in Windows XP

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;304449

Good luck,

CH

 

[John]

But then I opened a Command Prompt as Administrator and typed Dir A: - and
there it is! 93,040 bytes, dated 4/10/2004 at 5:54 PM. This shows 13
files, including autoexec.bat and config.sys.

My posts got a little out of order. Sorry.

Here's something I haven't worked out in Vista yet: How do you open a
Command Prompt as Administrator?

John

 

[Synapse Syndrome]

I actually said "flash the BIOS of your graphics card", as these days,
all the major motherboard manufacturers let you update the BIOS through
Windows. Are you sure there is no way to do this with your motherboard?

Yes, Asus has a utility to do this, but it responds: "Sorry, there're
[their spelling] no proper BIOS image files on the server," which,
interpreted, means--I think--that a Beta BIOS file is not a
"proper"...file. So, I'm doing it the hard way.

Ah, I have Asus motherboards as well. AsusUpdate actually gives you the
option to update from file as well. You do not have to update from the
internet when using it. Use that option instead,

ss.

 

[Synapse Syndrome]

Of course you could get an external floppy drive for $30 from Fry's. I'm
not sure how much anyone needs one though these days.

I got a USB floppy drive (IBM ThinkPad branded) from eBay for less than £10
($20).

ss.

 

[John]

John--

This "vista blue screen" says exactly what??????????? We know when it
comes lol 3AM but what does the blue screen say? Maybe the blue screen's
contents are a clue to your problems. But you haven't shared what it says
with us.

The blue screens are not the old "stills" that I had back with Win/ME. They
very quickly do things, so it was hard to catch what they were. They had
timers. As I recall one, it was saving apparently the disk image at the
time; went very fast. Then some process I have not seen before--by the time
I got situated where I could read them, they were gone. At the end, the
system rebooted with no user interaction as was the case with Win/ME.

The 3 am one zinged through about five lines and rebooted. The blue screen
was up for probably no more than ten seconds. I was expecting it to stop so
I could write it down, but suddenly it rebooted.

The other possibility--and I'll check into it--is that there is probably a
log file somewhere.

Chad: I'm just going through your post. I thought I would just answer this
first before I go through the rest. I'll add as I go. Thanks.

John

 

[John]

Chad, this is a legit version of Vista Ultimate. I registered it a month
ago and activated it with no problem. As you seem to suggest, I did have a
blow up over activation because in the middle of all these problems I
upgraded memory to 4GB. Bad move. The thing really blew up then. Between
the BIOS halting and the Vista features showing error messages all over the
place, I really had a confusing time. Before the 3 am thing, I was laying
in bed thinking about everything and realized: I had changed the system and
Microsoft doesn't like that and will blow up your system if you do! So I
did the Activate thing and rebooted. Things were still broken so I rebooted
again. And things were still, still broken, so I rebooted again.
Eventually, everything worked right again.

My system problems that may relate to the BIOS are: (1) Intermittent
stalls before BIOS loading, (2) the SATA drive (C: within Vista) does not
appear in the Asus EZ Flash 2 BIOS Utility. There is A,B,C, and D. A is
the floppy. C is the IDE drive, which is my old ME system. B and D are
blank. I thought it was possible one might be my flash drive, but there are
files on it and none show up in B and D. So where is the SATA drive? I
don't know. Sounds like a BIOS problem to me. Any opinion on this?

I'll work on SFC. I am reluctant to do a Restore with all the Activation,
etc. going on. But I'll look at it.

John

 

[John]

I ran SFC which produced this message: "Windows Resource Protection did not
find any integrity violations."

Since it didn't, I don't have an obvious need to restore. Right?

Incidentally, someone else suggested I work a little harder with Asus' BIOS
Utility within Windows and do a BIOS Update from Internet. When I do, it
ends with: "Fail to reserve DMI data in EEPROM." I'm starting to wonder if
the hardware part of the BIOS is faulty. I'm going to continue working at
the boot level and see if I can't install the newer Beta version of the
BIOS.

John

 

[John]

Here is the Details from the Event Log:

Log Name: System
Source: EventLog
Date: 8/31/2007 3:02:17 AM
Event ID: 6008
Task Category: None
Level: Error
Keywords: Classic
User: N/A
Computer: jjstewart-PC
Description:
The previous system shutdown at 9:39:13 PM on 8/30/2007 was unexpected.
Event Xml:
<Event xmlns="http://schemas.microsoft.com/win/2004/08/events/event">
<System>
<Provider Name="EventLog" />
<EventID Qualifiers="32768">6008</EventID>
<Level>2</Level>
<Task>0</Task>
<Keywords>0x80000000000000</Keywords>
<TimeCreated SystemTime="2007-08-31T08:02:17.000Z" />
<EventRecordID>24006</EventRecordID>
<Channel>System</Channel>
<Computer>jjstewart-PC</Computer>
<Security />
</System>
<EventData>
<Data>9:39:13 PM</Data>
<Data>8/30/2007</Data>
<Data>
</Data>
<Data>
</Data>
<Data>303</Data>
<Data>
</Data>
<Data>
</Data>
<Binary>D707080004001E00150027000D009E02D707080005001F00020027000D009E02600900003C000000010000006009000000000000B00400000100000000000000</Binary>
</EventData>
</Event>

 

[Chad Harris]

SS--

What are the things you use it to do?

CH

I got a USB floppy drive (IBM ThinkPad branded) from eBay for less than
£10 ($20).

ss.

 

[Joe Morris]

When you right-click on Floppy Drive and click on format, there is the
option to "Create an MS-DOS startup disk." When you create it, it doesn't
contain a COMMAND.COM and when you boot to it, it errs out, saying
"COMMAND.COM is missing or corrupt."

Anybody else get that error?

Nope. A format under Vista of a floppy invoked through the context menu
successfully set up a Windows ME boot disk (not MS-DOS, despite the phrasing
of the option) which boots successfully. Disk contents are:

COMMAND.COM
DISPLAY.SYS
EGA.CPI
EGA2.CPI
EGA3.CPI
KEYB.COM
KEYBOARD.SYS
KEYBRD2.SYS
KEYBRD3.SYS
KEYBRD4.SYS
MODE.COM
IO.SYS
MSDOS.SYS
AUTOEXEC.BAT
CONFIG.SYS

The last two are empty files.

Any possibility that you've just got a bad disk?

Joe Morris

 

[Chad Harris]

John--

If you have a Vista DVD you can try the Startup Repair I gave you directions
to do. If you try a system restore from F8 it's not going to get you in any
trouble whether it works or not. The rule with using system restore @ F8 is
to try each and every safe mode on the menu because one might work when
another doesn't. You need a special command for the safe mode command for
system restore and all of that is included in my instructions.

I know we can't r/o a hdw problem, but if any of these worked then you'd
have the problem solved.

You can always set your system up so that the blue screen shown
freezes--it's a simple check box.

Windows + Pause Break Key>Advanced System Settings>Settings Button under
Startup and Recovery>check mark out of Automatic Startup.

CH

 

[John]

I just succeeded in flashing my BIOS, which was the initial goal of the
thread. It has been very little time, but so far the system has been
stable. I still can't get the BIOS flash utility to see my SATA drive,
though. (I flashed by running amdflash.exe after booting from the floppy.)
Wouldn't it be wise to wait until I had a problem before running Startup
Repair?

John

 

[Synapse Syndrome]

SS--

What are the things you use it to do?

Well, I bought it for my ThinkPad X31, which doesn't have a floppy drive, so
that I could run the IBM Maintenance Disk. I needed to do this to give it
the right serial and type number, which had been corrupted, so that I could
run the automated update program called ThinkVantage. I also needed to use
a floppy on the laptop to run the no-1802 BIOS hack so that I could use a
non-IBM approved mini-PCI wireless card.

And, I built my latest desktop machine (last August) for Vista, and did not
fit a floppy drive. This will be the last floppy drive I ever buy, and I
have it just in case I ever need one.

That machine will one day replace my server (which has a floppy drive), when
I build yet another desktop machine in a year or two. I am unlikely to
upgrade from Windows Server 2003, as it does all I need for the server, so I
will need the USB floppy drive to install the RAID drivers for it.

You need to enable legacy USB peripherals in the BIOS to use a USB floppy
drive as it was an internal one.

ss.

 

[R. C. White]

Hi, John.

There are several ways to run Cmd.exe as Administrator. Perhaps the easiest
is to click Start | All Programs | Accessories, then right-click Command
Prompt and click Run as Administrator; you'll need to furnish your Admin
password. Note that the Menu bar now says "Administrator:Command Prompt".
It's what we old-timers still often call the "DOS Window", even though we
know it is an emulator and not actually MS-DOS. I use this window so often
that I've created a shortcut and put it in my Quick Launch. Any program or
command run in this Admin window runs "elevated", so Vista requires
Administrator credentials each time you open this window.

On another part of your problem, the 3 AM wakeup... I've never had an ASUS
mobo, but it probably has at least as many features as my EPoX. My BIOS has
several Wake On... features that will wake the computer from a sleep. I
haven't used these, but they include Wake On LAN, Wake on Ring (or something
like that - it wakes when I get a call on the phone line), and Wake on
Alarm, which lets me set a time for a wake-up - even at 3 in the morning!
Since you've been having BIOS problems, you might very well have
inadvertently turned on one of these options.

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(e-mail address removed)
Microsoft Windows MVP
(Running Windows Live Mail beta in Vista Ultimate x64)

 

[John]

One of my middle-of-the-night realizations is that I think I remember one of
the Vista default schedule times was 3 a.m. I poked around but couldn't
find it; I think I changed it sometime since the system crashed. I think I
have just discovered that Vista (and maybe XP, which I skipped) has separate
scheduling programs for each device that you back up or service (defrag,
etc.). So, I've got to get all that organized with some kind of plan. I
wish Vista did it all in one place!

So: I think my 3 a.m. crash was because some schedule tried to run either
backup or defrag at 3 a.m. The crash was at about 3:02 a.m. according to
the Event Viewer. I had read that Windows wouldn't start up these scheduled
events if the system was in Sleep mode, but I guess that isn't always or
completely true. I'll have to experiment to see which program can do it.

Since I finally figured out how to flash my BIOS (since none of the
"official" methods worked), the system has been remarkably stable. We'll
see.

Thank you for your help. You began by answering my question as no other
did, and helped out with many other tips. You really know your stuff.

John

 

[Tm-Wood]

I would like to join in as I am having the same problem. In answer to the query WHY? do I want an MS-Dos boot disk - well I can't answer for John, but my reason is that a surprising number of excellent old PC games need one. Sometimes I would like to try out a golden oldie, but it won't start without an MS-Dos boot disk. Making a "boot disk" in Windows XP using the method described results in a disk that is virtually useless since, as far as I can see, you can't change directory so you are stuck in A forever! Can I copy any other files on to my floppy to create a useful boot disk that will allow me to change directory to my DVD drive and run my games? Personally I am not really interested in how many files the floppy contains but rather how to get out of it and go somewhere more useful!!