Microsoft cuts another feature: full HD playback in 32bit Vista goes

M

MICHAEL

http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

Microsoft revealed today that no 32-bit versions of Windows Vista will be able to play back
“next generation high definition protected content” (translation – studio-released BluRay and
HD-DVD movies).

By far the majority of PCs use 32-bit processors, because despite AMD’s efforts to push 64-bit
CPUs into the marketplace early, Intel’s first widely-promoted 64-bit CPU is the just-released
Core 2 Duo.

PC users will now have to choose between a PC that can play high definition content (64 bit)
versus one that can potentially run older devices that only have unsigned drivers available (32
bit).

“Signed drivers” are ones that have undergone a Microsoft quality-assurance process and
received a digital certificate that certifies them as stable for installation on 64-bit
Windows.

Microsoft’s move to drop support for playback of studio-released HD movies on Vista is likely
to anger the large number of people who were hoping they could use their existing 32-bit PC
with an upgrade version of Vista.

The surprising disclosure was made by Senior Program Manager Steve Riley during a presentation
on Windows Vista security at Tech.Ed 2006 Sydney today.

“Any next-generation high definition content will not play in x32 at all,” said Riley.

“This is a decision that the Media Player folks made because there are just too many ways right
now for unsigned kernel mode code [to compromise content protection]. The media companies asked
us to do this and said they don’t want any of their high definition content to play in x32 at
all, because of all of the unsigned malware that runs in kernel mode can get around content
protection, so we had to do this,” he said.

Riley then attempted to pre-empt audience concerns over the newly imposed limitation by asking
how many of the Tech.Ed attendees currently played high-definition movies at home.

“How many of you have a DVD player that you know can output a proper 1080 line non-interlaced?”

No-one raised their hands.

“OK… look around. By the time that stuff becomes popular, it’ll no longer be an issue because
everyone will be running 64-bit Windows,” he said.

However, earlier in his presentation, Riley had explained why Microsoft had decided to let
unsigned code run in 32-bit Windows, but not in 64-bit Windows.

“Imagine how difficult it would be for you [the Tech.Ed attendees] to update your environment.
It would be a non-starter, right?”

“We can’t do that [lock out unsigned drivers from 32 bit Windows]. The app-compat hit, as we
say in Microsoft, would be far too great if we did it in 32-bit Vista.”

In an interview hastily organised by Microsoft public relations staff after they learned APC
was planning to run this story, Riley was at pains to point out that Blu Ray and HD-DVD were
storage media and “you could put an MPEG-4 movie on them and play them on a 32bit Vista PC just
fine.”

But he conceded that a commercially-produced BluRay or HD-DVD movie with next-generation high
definition protected content wouldn’t play on a 32 bit PC.




--
Michael
______
"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools,
but that the lightning ain't distributed right."
- Mark Twain
 
G

Guest

ROTFLMAO......,.. MS is shooting it's self in the foot so hard, not only with
this, but the system as a whole. I can't wait to see the backlash. This WILL
be fun :-D

MICHAEL said:
http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

Microsoft revealed today that no 32-bit versions of Windows Vista will be able to play back
“next generation high definition protected content†(translation – studio-released BluRay and
HD-DVD movies).

By far the majority of PCs use 32-bit processors, because despite AMD’s efforts to push 64-bit
CPUs into the marketplace early, Intel’s first widely-promoted 64-bit CPU is the just-released
Core 2 Duo.

PC users will now have to choose between a PC that can play high definition content (64 bit)
versus one that can potentially run older devices that only have unsigned drivers available (32
bit).

“Signed drivers†are ones that have undergone a Microsoft quality-assurance process and
received a digital certificate that certifies them as stable for installation on 64-bit
Windows.

Microsoft’s move to drop support for playback of studio-released HD movies on Vista is likely
to anger the large number of people who were hoping they could use their existing 32-bit PC
with an upgrade version of Vista.

The surprising disclosure was made by Senior Program Manager Steve Riley during a presentation
on Windows Vista security at Tech.Ed 2006 Sydney today.

“Any next-generation high definition content will not play in x32 at all,†said Riley.

“This is a decision that the Media Player folks made because there are just too many ways right
now for unsigned kernel mode code [to compromise content protection]. The media companies asked
us to do this and said they don’t want any of their high definition content to play in x32 at
all, because of all of the unsigned malware that runs in kernel mode can get around content
protection, so we had to do this,†he said.

Riley then attempted to pre-empt audience concerns over the newly imposed limitation by asking
how many of the Tech.Ed attendees currently played high-definition movies at home.

“How many of you have a DVD player that you know can output a proper 1080 line non-interlaced?â€

No-one raised their hands.

“OK… look around. By the time that stuff becomes popular, it’ll no longer be an issue because
everyone will be running 64-bit Windows,†he said.

However, earlier in his presentation, Riley had explained why Microsoft had decided to let
unsigned code run in 32-bit Windows, but not in 64-bit Windows.

“Imagine how difficult it would be for you [the Tech.Ed attendees] to update your environment.
It would be a non-starter, right?â€

“We can’t do that [lock out unsigned drivers from 32 bit Windows]. The app-compat hit, as we
say in Microsoft, would be far too great if we did it in 32-bit Vista.â€

In an interview hastily organised by Microsoft public relations staff after they learned APC
was planning to run this story, Riley was at pains to point out that Blu Ray and HD-DVD were
storage media and “you could put an MPEG-4 movie on them and play them on a 32bit Vista PC just
fine.â€

But he conceded that a commercially-produced BluRay or HD-DVD movie with next-generation high
definition protected content wouldn’t play on a 32 bit PC.




--
Michael
______
"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools,
but that the lightning ain't distributed right."
- Mark Twain
 
J

Jason

There is an update direct from Microsoft Vista Team to dispute that article.
Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit Systems
Posted by NWhite
The community is buzzing with reactions to APC Magazine’s article regarding playback of protected High Definition content in 32-bit versions of Windows Vista. However, the information shared was incorrect and the reactions pervading the community are thus (understandably) ill-informed.

The real deal is that no version of Windows Vista will make a determination as to whether any given piece of content should play back or not. The individual ISV providing the playback solutions will choose whether the playback environment, including environments that use 32-bit processors, meet the performance requirements for playback of protected High Definition content.

So what does that mean?

It is up to a particular ISV to determine which environments are suitable for their playback solutions. Not Windows Vista, and not Microsoft. To help ISVs make the playback determination, the OS will expose a list of any unsigned drivers on the system; nevertheless, it remains up to the ISV to determine whether playback will be enabled.

In other words, nothing has changed with respect to Microsoft’s policies or development plans for protected HD playback -- which we addressed at WinHEC this past May -- and nothing has been cut from Windows Vista in this regard.

http://blogs.technet.com/windowsvista/archive/2006/08/24/450081.aspx

MICHAEL said:
http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista > > Microsoft revealed today that no 32-bit versions of Windows Vista will be able to play back > “next generation high definition protected content” (translation – studio-released BluRay and > HD-DVD movies). > > By far the majority of PCs use 32-bit processors, because despite AMD’s efforts to push 64-bit > CPUs into the marketplace early, Intel’s first widely-promoted 64-bit CPU is the just-released > Core 2 Duo. > > PC users will now have to choose between a PC that can play high definition content (64 bit) > versus one that can potentially run older devices that only have unsigned drivers available (32 > bit). > > “Signed drivers” are ones that have undergone a Microsoft quality-assurance process and > received a digital certificate that certifies them as stable for installation on 64-bit > Windows. > > Microsoft’s move to drop support for playback of studio-released HD movies on Vista is likely > to anger the large number of people who were hoping they could use their existing 32-bit PC > with an upgrade version of Vista. > > The surprising disclosure was made by Senior Program Manager Steve Riley during a presentation > on Windows Vista security at Tech.Ed 2006 Sydney today. > > “Any next-generation high definition content will not play in x32 at all,” said Riley. > > “This is a decision that the Media Player folks made because there are just too many ways right > now for unsigned kernel mode code [to compromise content protection]. The media companies asked > us to do this and said they don’t want any of their high definition content to play in x32 at > all, because of all of the unsigned malware that runs in kernel mode can get around content > protection, so we had to do this,” he said. > > Riley then attempted to pre-empt audience concerns over the newly imposed limitation by asking > how many of the Tech.Ed attendees currently played high-definition movies at home. > > “How many of you have a DVD player that you know can output a proper 1080 line non-interlaced?” > > No-one raised their hands. > > “OK… look around. By the time that stuff becomes popular, it’ll no longer be an issue because > everyone will be running 64-bit Windows,” he said. > > However, earlier in his presentation, Riley had explained why Microsoft had decided to let > unsigned code run in 32-bit Windows, but not in 64-bit Windows. > > “Imagine how difficult it would be for you [the Tech.Ed attendees] to update your environment. > It would be a non-starter, right?” > > “We can’t do that [lock out unsigned drivers from 32 bit Windows]. The app-compat hit, as we > say in Microsoft, would be far too great if we did it in 32-bit Vista.” > > In an interview hastily organised by Microsoft public relations staff after they learned APC > was planning to run this story, Riley was at pains to point out that Blu Ray and HD-DVD were > storage media and “you could put an MPEG-4 movie on them and play them on a 32bit Vista PC just > fine.” > > But he conceded that a commercially-produced BluRay or HD-DVD movie with next-generation high > definition protected content wouldn’t play on a 32 bit PC. > > > > > -- > Michael > ______ > "The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, > but that the lightning ain't distributed right." > - Mark Twain > >
 
C

Chad Harris

The update from Nick White does little to clarify what's going on here.
This story is reminiscent of the metaphysical contemplation of what the
meaning of "is" is, and the story of the blue dress and material deposited
on said dress that was an individual's DNA in a form formatted for a swim
meet back when the Blue dress DNA obsessed a certain country now obsessed
with Ramsey DNA--All Ramsey Circus all the time so you don't have to
consider "real news stories"mania.

At the rate MSFT is cutting features in Vista, it ought to consider getting
into the entertainment content providing business not just by selling Halo 2
(in typical sybaritic fashion Gates and Company wanted free trips to the
premier of Halo 2 on a private jet for the intelligentsia/elitsia/Redmon
aristocrisygentsia.

Yawn City. Cutting features like crazy, MSFT hurdles headlong with
developers kicking and screaming toward RTM of "Vista WannaBe--the October
RTM.

It will indeed be fun to take 5536 apart feature by feature because it has
been held out by MSFT as the magic wand that would whisk away the absolute
fact this thing needs 6 more months.

Features seem to be dropping like flies as the Redmond campus rushes towards
RTM like the guys on Prison Break on the train.

http://www.fox.com/prisonbreak/

Microsoft cuts full HD playback in 32bit Vista

http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

During the era of XP the phrase value add was tossed around. Welcome to the
erra of Value Subtract.


What do this mean with any clarity Nick?


Nick White [MSFT] offering lessons in the English language. What's the
meaning of "Is" and who is holding the blue dress Nick?


From Nick White [MSFT] on the Vista "launch team" on his blog:

https://209.34.241.68/windowsvista/default.aspx

"Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit Systems
The community is buzzing with reactions to APC Magazine's article regarding
playback of protected High Definition content in 32-bit versions of Windows
Vista. However, the information shared was incorrect and the reactions
pervading the community are thus (understandably) ill-informed.

The real deal is that no version of Windows Vista will make a determination
as to whether any given piece of content should play back or not. The
individual ISV providing the playback solutions will choose whether the
playback environment, including environments that use 32-bit processors,
meet the performance requirements for playback of protected High Definition
content.

So what does that mean?

It is up to a particular ISV to determine which environments are suitable
for their playback solutions. Not Windows Vista, and not Microsoft. To
help ISVs make the playback determination, the OS will expose a list of any
unsigned drivers on the system; nevertheless, it remains up to the ISV to
determine whether playback will be enabled.

In other words, nothing has changed with respect to Microsoft's policies or
development plans for protected HD playback -- which we addressed at WinHEC
this past May -- and nothing has been cut from Windows Vista in this
regard."


"Thursday, August 24, 2006 9:13 PM by danwarne
Just to clarify, what Microsoft is saying here is that their Senior Program
Manager Steve Riley said the wrong thing during his presentation at Tech.Ed
Sydney. APC reported his comments accurately based on a transcript of the
event.

However, regardless, Microsoft is making a very specific semantic point
here: Riley did say yesterday that the restrictions were made at the behest
of content owners, so Microsoft is really just restating here that content
owners have the ability to veto their content from being played on 32bit
systems.

I've asked Microsoft for a list of the high-definition DRM systems that WILL
play on Vista 32bit and which ones won't, so some further clarity can be
bought to the story. "
_________________________________________
# re: Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit
Systems
Thursday, August 24, 2006 11:16 PM by someone
Apart from VC-1, will Vista play/decode the following out of the box without
third party decoders:
1. MPEG-4 Simple profile/Advanced profile
2. H.264 which is mandatory for HD DVD and Blu-ray
3. Dolby Digital (AC-3) 5.1 (DVD)
4. DTS 5.1 (DVD)
5. Dolby Digital Plus, DTS HD? (HD DVD/Blu-ray)

On Windows Vista, DRM, and new monitors
http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/hardware/hdcp-vista.ars

Thoughts on MCE Beta Feedback by Matt Goyer
http://mediacenter.mattgoyer.com/archives/2006/07/26/1157

CH



MICHAEL said:
http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

Microsoft revealed today that no 32-bit versions of Windows Vista will be
able to play back “next generation high definition protected content”
(translation – studio-released BluRay and HD-DVD movies).

By far the majority of PCs use 32-bit processors, because despite AMD’s
efforts to push 64-bit CPUs into the marketplace early, Intel’s first
widely-promoted 64-bit CPU is the just-released Core 2 Duo.

PC users will now have to choose between a PC that can play high
definition content (64 bit) versus one that can potentially run older
devices that only have unsigned drivers available (32 bit).

“Signed drivers” are ones that have undergone a Microsoft
quality-assurance process and received a digital certificate that
certifies them as stable for installation on 64-bit Windows.

Microsoft’s move to drop support for playback of studio-released HD movies
on Vista is likely to anger the large number of people who were hoping
they could use their existing 32-bit PC with an upgrade version of Vista.

The surprising disclosure was made by Senior Program Manager Steve Riley
during a presentation on Windows Vista security at Tech.Ed 2006 Sydney
today.

“Any next-generation high definition content will not play in x32 at all,”
said Riley.

“This is a decision that the Media Player folks made because there are
just too many ways right now for unsigned kernel mode code [to compromise
content protection]. The media companies asked us to do this and said they
don’t want any of their high definition content to play in x32 at all,
because of all of the unsigned malware that runs in kernel mode can get
around content protection, so we had to do this,” he said.

Riley then attempted to pre-empt audience concerns over the newly imposed
limitation by asking how many of the Tech.Ed attendees currently played
high-definition movies at home.

“How many of you have a DVD player that you know can output a proper 1080
line non-interlaced?”

No-one raised their hands.

“OK… look around. By the time that stuff becomes popular, it’ll no longer
be an issue because everyone will be running 64-bit Windows,” he said.

However, earlier in his presentation, Riley had explained why Microsoft
had decided to let unsigned code run in 32-bit Windows, but not in 64-bit
Windows.

“Imagine how difficult it would be for you [the Tech.Ed attendees] to
update your environment. It would be a non-starter, right?”

“We can’t do that [lock out unsigned drivers from 32 bit Windows]. The
app-compat hit, as we say in Microsoft, would be far too great if we did
it in 32-bit Vista.”

In an interview hastily organised by Microsoft public relations staff
after they learned APC was planning to run this story, Riley was at pains
to point out that Blu Ray and HD-DVD were storage media and “you could put
an MPEG-4 movie on them and play them on a 32bit Vista PC just fine.”

But he conceded that a commercially-produced BluRay or HD-DVD movie with
next-generation high definition protected content wouldn’t play on a 32
bit PC.




--
Michael
______
"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools,
but that the lightning ain't distributed right."
- Mark Twain
 
M

MICHAEL

If I understand all this folderol correctly, Vista 32 bit isn't
"secure" enough for the movie distributors. There are
too many ways to bypass the DRM crapola. Like, using
AnyDVD from Slysoft.

Vista 64 bit won't allow such programs to run? Can't
use unsigned drivers. I thought there was an easy way
to turn that off by using one of the boot editors like
VistaBootPRO.

-Michael

Chad Harris said:
The update from Nick White does little to clarify what's going on here. This story is
reminiscent of the metaphysical contemplation of what the meaning of "is" is, and the story
of the blue dress and material deposited on said dress that was an individual's DNA in a form
formatted for a swim meet back when the Blue dress DNA obsessed a certain country now
obsessed with Ramsey DNA--All Ramsey Circus all the time so you don't have to consider "real
news stories"mania.

At the rate MSFT is cutting features in Vista, it ought to consider getting into the
entertainment content providing business not just by selling Halo 2 (in typical sybaritic
fashion Gates and Company wanted free trips to the premier of Halo 2 on a private jet for the
intelligentsia/elitsia/Redmon aristocrisygentsia.

Yawn City. Cutting features like crazy, MSFT hurdles headlong with
developers kicking and screaming toward RTM of "Vista WannaBe--the October
RTM.

It will indeed be fun to take 5536 apart feature by feature because it has
been held out by MSFT as the magic wand that would whisk away the absolute
fact this thing needs 6 more months.

Features seem to be dropping like flies as the Redmond campus rushes towards
RTM like the guys on Prison Break on the train.

http://www.fox.com/prisonbreak/

Microsoft cuts full HD playback in 32bit Vista

http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

During the era of XP the phrase value add was tossed around. Welcome to the
erra of Value Subtract.


What do this mean with any clarity Nick?


Nick White [MSFT] offering lessons in the English language. What's the
meaning of "Is" and who is holding the blue dress Nick?


From Nick White [MSFT] on the Vista "launch team" on his blog:

https://209.34.241.68/windowsvista/default.aspx

"Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit Systems
The community is buzzing with reactions to APC Magazine's article regarding
playback of protected High Definition content in 32-bit versions of Windows
Vista. However, the information shared was incorrect and the reactions
pervading the community are thus (understandably) ill-informed.

The real deal is that no version of Windows Vista will make a determination
as to whether any given piece of content should play back or not. The
individual ISV providing the playback solutions will choose whether the
playback environment, including environments that use 32-bit processors,
meet the performance requirements for playback of protected High Definition
content.

So what does that mean?

It is up to a particular ISV to determine which environments are suitable
for their playback solutions. Not Windows Vista, and not Microsoft. To
help ISVs make the playback determination, the OS will expose a list of any
unsigned drivers on the system; nevertheless, it remains up to the ISV to
determine whether playback will be enabled.

In other words, nothing has changed with respect to Microsoft's policies or
development plans for protected HD playback -- which we addressed at WinHEC
this past May -- and nothing has been cut from Windows Vista in this
regard."


"Thursday, August 24, 2006 9:13 PM by danwarne
Just to clarify, what Microsoft is saying here is that their Senior Program
Manager Steve Riley said the wrong thing during his presentation at Tech.Ed
Sydney. APC reported his comments accurately based on a transcript of the
event.

However, regardless, Microsoft is making a very specific semantic point
here: Riley did say yesterday that the restrictions were made at the behest
of content owners, so Microsoft is really just restating here that content
owners have the ability to veto their content from being played on 32bit
systems.

I've asked Microsoft for a list of the high-definition DRM systems that WILL
play on Vista 32bit and which ones won't, so some further clarity can be
bought to the story. "
_________________________________________
# re: Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit
Systems
Thursday, August 24, 2006 11:16 PM by someone
Apart from VC-1, will Vista play/decode the following out of the box without
third party decoders:
1. MPEG-4 Simple profile/Advanced profile
2. H.264 which is mandatory for HD DVD and Blu-ray
3. Dolby Digital (AC-3) 5.1 (DVD)
4. DTS 5.1 (DVD)
5. Dolby Digital Plus, DTS HD? (HD DVD/Blu-ray)

On Windows Vista, DRM, and new monitors
http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/hardware/hdcp-vista.ars

Thoughts on MCE Beta Feedback by Matt Goyer
http://mediacenter.mattgoyer.com/archives/2006/07/26/1157

CH



MICHAEL said:
http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

Microsoft revealed today that no 32-bit versions of Windows Vista will be able to play back
“next generation high definition protected content” (translation – studio-released BluRay
and HD-DVD movies).

By far the majority of PCs use 32-bit processors, because despite AMD’s efforts to push
64-bit CPUs into the marketplace early, Intel’s first widely-promoted 64-bit CPU is the
just-released Core 2 Duo.

PC users will now have to choose between a PC that can play high definition content (64 bit)
versus one that can potentially run older devices that only have unsigned drivers available
(32 bit).

“Signed drivers” are ones that have undergone a Microsoft quality-assurance process and
received a digital certificate that certifies them as stable for installation on 64-bit
Windows.

Microsoft’s move to drop support for playback of studio-released HD movies on Vista is
likely to anger the large number of people who were hoping they could use their existing
32-bit PC with an upgrade version of Vista.

The surprising disclosure was made by Senior Program Manager Steve Riley during a
presentation on Windows Vista security at Tech.Ed 2006 Sydney today.

“Any next-generation high definition content will not play in x32 at all,” said Riley.

“This is a decision that the Media Player folks made because there are just too many ways
right now for unsigned kernel mode code [to compromise content protection]. The media
companies asked us to do this and said they don’t want any of their high definition content
to play in x32 at all, because of all of the unsigned malware that runs in kernel mode can
get around content protection, so we had to do this,” he said.

Riley then attempted to pre-empt audience concerns over the newly imposed limitation by
asking how many of the Tech.Ed attendees currently played high-definition movies at home.

“How many of you have a DVD player that you know can output a proper 1080 line
non-interlaced?”

No-one raised their hands.

“OK… look around. By the time that stuff becomes popular, it’ll no longer be an issue
because everyone will be running 64-bit Windows,” he said.

However, earlier in his presentation, Riley had explained why Microsoft had decided to let
unsigned code run in 32-bit Windows, but not in 64-bit Windows.

“Imagine how difficult it would be for you [the Tech.Ed attendees] to update your
environment. It would be a non-starter, right?”

“We can’t do that [lock out unsigned drivers from 32 bit Windows]. The app-compat hit, as we
say in Microsoft, would be far too great if we did it in 32-bit Vista.”

In an interview hastily organised by Microsoft public relations staff after they learned APC
was planning to run this story, Riley was at pains to point out that Blu Ray and HD-DVD were
storage media and “you could put an MPEG-4 movie on them and play them on a 32bit Vista PC
just fine.”

But he conceded that a commercially-produced BluRay or HD-DVD movie with next-generation
high definition protected content wouldn’t play on a 32 bit PC.




--
Michael
______
"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools,
but that the lightning ain't distributed right."
- Mark Twain
 
G

Guest

Patchguard. You may be thinking of UAC. Patchguard makes sure that all kernal
based code is signed by Microsoft. The way the rippers work, is they can
remove the protection from the files on the DVD or whatever media is being
ripped. So the way that rippers work is, their code is kernal-based. The
rippers work directly.... via aspi drivers (for rom drives). So since rippers
work with the hardware, and the kernal is the first layer between the
hardware, then the code for the ripper is kernal-based, hence MS will only
only 64-bit enviroments to handle high-def media. Patchguard is only avaiable
with 64-bit systems, because 32-bit have too much legacy code.

MICHAEL said:
If I understand all this folderol correctly, Vista 32 bit isn't
"secure" enough for the movie distributors. There are
too many ways to bypass the DRM crapola. Like, using
AnyDVD from Slysoft.

Vista 64 bit won't allow such programs to run? Can't
use unsigned drivers. I thought there was an easy way
to turn that off by using one of the boot editors like
VistaBootPRO.

-Michael

Chad Harris said:
The update from Nick White does little to clarify what's going on here. This story is
reminiscent of the metaphysical contemplation of what the meaning of "is" is, and the story
of the blue dress and material deposited on said dress that was an individual's DNA in a form
formatted for a swim meet back when the Blue dress DNA obsessed a certain country now
obsessed with Ramsey DNA--All Ramsey Circus all the time so you don't have to consider "real
news stories"mania.

At the rate MSFT is cutting features in Vista, it ought to consider getting into the
entertainment content providing business not just by selling Halo 2 (in typical sybaritic
fashion Gates and Company wanted free trips to the premier of Halo 2 on a private jet for the
intelligentsia/elitsia/Redmon aristocrisygentsia.

Yawn City. Cutting features like crazy, MSFT hurdles headlong with
developers kicking and screaming toward RTM of "Vista WannaBe--the October
RTM.

It will indeed be fun to take 5536 apart feature by feature because it has
been held out by MSFT as the magic wand that would whisk away the absolute
fact this thing needs 6 more months.

Features seem to be dropping like flies as the Redmond campus rushes towards
RTM like the guys on Prison Break on the train.

http://www.fox.com/prisonbreak/

Microsoft cuts full HD playback in 32bit Vista

http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

During the era of XP the phrase value add was tossed around. Welcome to the
erra of Value Subtract.


What do this mean with any clarity Nick?


Nick White [MSFT] offering lessons in the English language. What's the
meaning of "Is" and who is holding the blue dress Nick?


From Nick White [MSFT] on the Vista "launch team" on his blog:

https://209.34.241.68/windowsvista/default.aspx

"Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit Systems
The community is buzzing with reactions to APC Magazine's article regarding
playback of protected High Definition content in 32-bit versions of Windows
Vista. However, the information shared was incorrect and the reactions
pervading the community are thus (understandably) ill-informed.

The real deal is that no version of Windows Vista will make a determination
as to whether any given piece of content should play back or not. The
individual ISV providing the playback solutions will choose whether the
playback environment, including environments that use 32-bit processors,
meet the performance requirements for playback of protected High Definition
content.

So what does that mean?

It is up to a particular ISV to determine which environments are suitable
for their playback solutions. Not Windows Vista, and not Microsoft. To
help ISVs make the playback determination, the OS will expose a list of any
unsigned drivers on the system; nevertheless, it remains up to the ISV to
determine whether playback will be enabled.

In other words, nothing has changed with respect to Microsoft's policies or
development plans for protected HD playback -- which we addressed at WinHEC
this past May -- and nothing has been cut from Windows Vista in this
regard."


"Thursday, August 24, 2006 9:13 PM by danwarne
Just to clarify, what Microsoft is saying here is that their Senior Program
Manager Steve Riley said the wrong thing during his presentation at Tech.Ed
Sydney. APC reported his comments accurately based on a transcript of the
event.

However, regardless, Microsoft is making a very specific semantic point
here: Riley did say yesterday that the restrictions were made at the behest
of content owners, so Microsoft is really just restating here that content
owners have the ability to veto their content from being played on 32bit
systems.

I've asked Microsoft for a list of the high-definition DRM systems that WILL
play on Vista 32bit and which ones won't, so some further clarity can be
bought to the story. "
_________________________________________
# re: Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit
Systems
Thursday, August 24, 2006 11:16 PM by someone
Apart from VC-1, will Vista play/decode the following out of the box without
third party decoders:
1. MPEG-4 Simple profile/Advanced profile
2. H.264 which is mandatory for HD DVD and Blu-ray
3. Dolby Digital (AC-3) 5.1 (DVD)
4. DTS 5.1 (DVD)
5. Dolby Digital Plus, DTS HD? (HD DVD/Blu-ray)

On Windows Vista, DRM, and new monitors
http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/hardware/hdcp-vista.ars

Thoughts on MCE Beta Feedback by Matt Goyer
http://mediacenter.mattgoyer.com/archives/2006/07/26/1157

CH



MICHAEL said:
http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

Microsoft revealed today that no 32-bit versions of Windows Vista will be able to play back
“next generation high definition protected content†(translation – studio-released BluRay
and HD-DVD movies).

By far the majority of PCs use 32-bit processors, because despite AMD’s efforts to push
64-bit CPUs into the marketplace early, Intel’s first widely-promoted 64-bit CPU is the
just-released Core 2 Duo.

PC users will now have to choose between a PC that can play high definition content (64 bit)
versus one that can potentially run older devices that only have unsigned drivers available
(32 bit).

“Signed drivers†are ones that have undergone a Microsoft quality-assurance process and
received a digital certificate that certifies them as stable for installation on 64-bit
Windows.

Microsoft’s move to drop support for playback of studio-released HD movies on Vista is
likely to anger the large number of people who were hoping they could use their existing
32-bit PC with an upgrade version of Vista.

The surprising disclosure was made by Senior Program Manager Steve Riley during a
presentation on Windows Vista security at Tech.Ed 2006 Sydney today.

“Any next-generation high definition content will not play in x32 at all,†said Riley.

“This is a decision that the Media Player folks made because there are just too many ways
right now for unsigned kernel mode code [to compromise content protection]. The media
companies asked us to do this and said they don’t want any of their high definition content
to play in x32 at all, because of all of the unsigned malware that runs in kernel mode can
get around content protection, so we had to do this,†he said.

Riley then attempted to pre-empt audience concerns over the newly imposed limitation by
asking how many of the Tech.Ed attendees currently played high-definition movies at home.

“How many of you have a DVD player that you know can output a proper 1080 line
non-interlaced?â€

No-one raised their hands.

“OK… look around. By the time that stuff becomes popular, it’ll no longer be an issue
because everyone will be running 64-bit Windows,†he said.

However, earlier in his presentation, Riley had explained why Microsoft had decided to let
unsigned code run in 32-bit Windows, but not in 64-bit Windows.

“Imagine how difficult it would be for you [the Tech.Ed attendees] to update your
environment. It would be a non-starter, right?â€

“We can’t do that [lock out unsigned drivers from 32 bit Windows]. The app-compat hit, as we
say in Microsoft, would be far too great if we did it in 32-bit Vista.â€

In an interview hastily organised by Microsoft public relations staff after they learned APC
was planning to run this story, Riley was at pains to point out that Blu Ray and HD-DVD were
storage media and “you could put an MPEG-4 movie on them and play them on a 32bit Vista PC
just fine.â€

But he conceded that a commercially-produced BluRay or HD-DVD movie with next-generation
high definition protected content wouldn’t play on a 32 bit PC.




--
Michael
______
"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools,
but that the lightning ain't distributed right."
- Mark Twain
 
M

MICHAEL

In the screenshot, it shows a check box that says,
"Allow use of unsigned drivers in x64 Edition".

http://www.pro-networks.org/vistabootpro/images/screenies/VBP2Advanced.png


M@dhat3rr said:
Patchguard. You may be thinking of UAC. Patchguard makes sure that all kernal
based code is signed by Microsoft. The way the rippers work, is they can
remove the protection from the files on the DVD or whatever media is being
ripped. So the way that rippers work is, their code is kernal-based. The
rippers work directly.... via aspi drivers (for rom drives). So since rippers
work with the hardware, and the kernal is the first layer between the
hardware, then the code for the ripper is kernal-based, hence MS will only
only 64-bit enviroments to handle high-def media. Patchguard is only avaiable
with 64-bit systems, because 32-bit have too much legacy code.

MICHAEL said:
If I understand all this folderol correctly, Vista 32 bit isn't
"secure" enough for the movie distributors. There are
too many ways to bypass the DRM crapola. Like, using
AnyDVD from Slysoft.

Vista 64 bit won't allow such programs to run? Can't
use unsigned drivers. I thought there was an easy way
to turn that off by using one of the boot editors like
VistaBootPRO.

-Michael

Chad Harris said:
The update from Nick White does little to clarify what's going on here. This story is
reminiscent of the metaphysical contemplation of what the meaning of "is" is, and the
story
of the blue dress and material deposited on said dress that was an individual's DNA in a
form
formatted for a swim meet back when the Blue dress DNA obsessed a certain country now
obsessed with Ramsey DNA--All Ramsey Circus all the time so you don't have to consider
"real
news stories"mania.

At the rate MSFT is cutting features in Vista, it ought to consider getting into the
entertainment content providing business not just by selling Halo 2 (in typical sybaritic
fashion Gates and Company wanted free trips to the premier of Halo 2 on a private jet for
the
intelligentsia/elitsia/Redmon aristocrisygentsia.

Yawn City. Cutting features like crazy, MSFT hurdles headlong with
developers kicking and screaming toward RTM of "Vista WannaBe--the October
RTM.

It will indeed be fun to take 5536 apart feature by feature because it has
been held out by MSFT as the magic wand that would whisk away the absolute
fact this thing needs 6 more months.

Features seem to be dropping like flies as the Redmond campus rushes towards
RTM like the guys on Prison Break on the train.

http://www.fox.com/prisonbreak/

Microsoft cuts full HD playback in 32bit Vista

http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

During the era of XP the phrase value add was tossed around. Welcome to the
erra of Value Subtract.


What do this mean with any clarity Nick?


Nick White [MSFT] offering lessons in the English language. What's the
meaning of "Is" and who is holding the blue dress Nick?


From Nick White [MSFT] on the Vista "launch team" on his blog:

https://209.34.241.68/windowsvista/default.aspx

"Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit Systems
The community is buzzing with reactions to APC Magazine's article regarding
playback of protected High Definition content in 32-bit versions of Windows
Vista. However, the information shared was incorrect and the reactions
pervading the community are thus (understandably) ill-informed.

The real deal is that no version of Windows Vista will make a determination
as to whether any given piece of content should play back or not. The
individual ISV providing the playback solutions will choose whether the
playback environment, including environments that use 32-bit processors,
meet the performance requirements for playback of protected High Definition
content.

So what does that mean?

It is up to a particular ISV to determine which environments are suitable
for their playback solutions. Not Windows Vista, and not Microsoft. To
help ISVs make the playback determination, the OS will expose a list of any
unsigned drivers on the system; nevertheless, it remains up to the ISV to
determine whether playback will be enabled.

In other words, nothing has changed with respect to Microsoft's policies or
development plans for protected HD playback -- which we addressed at WinHEC
this past May -- and nothing has been cut from Windows Vista in this
regard."


"Thursday, August 24, 2006 9:13 PM by danwarne
Just to clarify, what Microsoft is saying here is that their Senior Program
Manager Steve Riley said the wrong thing during his presentation at Tech.Ed
Sydney. APC reported his comments accurately based on a transcript of the
event.

However, regardless, Microsoft is making a very specific semantic point
here: Riley did say yesterday that the restrictions were made at the behest
of content owners, so Microsoft is really just restating here that content
owners have the ability to veto their content from being played on 32bit
systems.

I've asked Microsoft for a list of the high-definition DRM systems that WILL
play on Vista 32bit and which ones won't, so some further clarity can be
bought to the story. "
_________________________________________
# re: Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit
Systems
Thursday, August 24, 2006 11:16 PM by someone
Apart from VC-1, will Vista play/decode the following out of the box without
third party decoders:
1. MPEG-4 Simple profile/Advanced profile
2. H.264 which is mandatory for HD DVD and Blu-ray
3. Dolby Digital (AC-3) 5.1 (DVD)
4. DTS 5.1 (DVD)
5. Dolby Digital Plus, DTS HD? (HD DVD/Blu-ray)

On Windows Vista, DRM, and new monitors
http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/hardware/hdcp-vista.ars

Thoughts on MCE Beta Feedback by Matt Goyer
http://mediacenter.mattgoyer.com/archives/2006/07/26/1157

CH



http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

Microsoft revealed today that no 32-bit versions of Windows Vista will be able to play
back
“next generation high definition protected content†(translation – studio-released
BluRay
and HD-DVD movies).

By far the majority of PCs use 32-bit processors, because despite AMD’s efforts to push
64-bit CPUs into the marketplace early, Intel’s first widely-promoted 64-bit CPU is the
just-released Core 2 Duo.

PC users will now have to choose between a PC that can play high definition content (64
bit)
versus one that can potentially run older devices that only have unsigned drivers
available
(32 bit).

“Signed drivers†are ones that have undergone a Microsoft quality-assurance process
and
received a digital certificate that certifies them as stable for installation on 64-bit
Windows.

Microsoft’s move to drop support for playback of studio-released HD movies on Vista is
likely to anger the large number of people who were hoping they could use their existing
32-bit PC with an upgrade version of Vista.

The surprising disclosure was made by Senior Program Manager Steve Riley during a
presentation on Windows Vista security at Tech.Ed 2006 Sydney today.

“Any next-generation high definition content will not play in x32 at all,†said
Riley.

“This is a decision that the Media Player folks made because there are just too many
ways
right now for unsigned kernel mode code [to compromise content protection]. The media
companies asked us to do this and said they don’t want any of their high definition
content
to play in x32 at all, because of all of the unsigned malware that runs in kernel mode
can
get around content protection, so we had to do this,†he said.

Riley then attempted to pre-empt audience concerns over the newly imposed limitation by
asking how many of the Tech.Ed attendees currently played high-definition movies at home.

“How many of you have a DVD player that you know can output a proper 1080 line
non-interlaced?â€

No-one raised their hands.

“OK… look around. By the time that stuff becomes popular, it’ll no longer be an
issue
because everyone will be running 64-bit Windows,†he said.

However, earlier in his presentation, Riley had explained why Microsoft had decided to
let
unsigned code run in 32-bit Windows, but not in 64-bit Windows.

“Imagine how difficult it would be for you [the Tech.Ed attendees] to update your
environment. It would be a non-starter, right?â€

“We can’t do that [lock out unsigned drivers from 32 bit Windows]. The app-compat
hit, as we
say in Microsoft, would be far too great if we did it in 32-bit Vista.â€

In an interview hastily organised by Microsoft public relations staff after they learned
APC
was planning to run this story, Riley was at pains to point out that Blu Ray and HD-DVD
were
storage media and “you could put an MPEG-4 movie on them and play them on a 32bit Vista
PC
just fine.â€

But he conceded that a commercially-produced BluRay or HD-DVD movie with next-generation
high definition protected content wouldn’t play on a 32 bit PC.




--
Michael
______
"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools,
but that the lightning ain't distributed right."
- Mark Twain
 
G

Guest

I forgot about that..oops. On another note, know any 'regular' (computer
illiterate people) users that would know how to edit in BCDEdit? I do wonder
if having Patchguard disabled, kicks in the failure flag on the trusted
platform, and disables the user from viewing though.... don't know. I'm sure
something is up, cause the movie and music industries are too greedy to let
anything slip through.

MICHAEL said:
In the screenshot, it shows a check box that says,
"Allow use of unsigned drivers in x64 Edition".

http://www.pro-networks.org/vistabootpro/images/screenies/VBP2Advanced.png


M@dhat3rr said:
Patchguard. You may be thinking of UAC. Patchguard makes sure that all kernal
based code is signed by Microsoft. The way the rippers work, is they can
remove the protection from the files on the DVD or whatever media is being
ripped. So the way that rippers work is, their code is kernal-based. The
rippers work directly.... via aspi drivers (for rom drives). So since rippers
work with the hardware, and the kernal is the first layer between the
hardware, then the code for the ripper is kernal-based, hence MS will only
only 64-bit enviroments to handle high-def media. Patchguard is only avaiable
with 64-bit systems, because 32-bit have too much legacy code.

MICHAEL said:
If I understand all this folderol correctly, Vista 32 bit isn't
"secure" enough for the movie distributors. There are
too many ways to bypass the DRM crapola. Like, using
AnyDVD from Slysoft.

Vista 64 bit won't allow such programs to run? Can't
use unsigned drivers. I thought there was an easy way
to turn that off by using one of the boot editors like
VistaBootPRO.

-Michael

The update from Nick White does little to clarify what's going on here. This story is
reminiscent of the metaphysical contemplation of what the meaning of "is" is, and the
story
of the blue dress and material deposited on said dress that was an individual's DNA in a
form
formatted for a swim meet back when the Blue dress DNA obsessed a certain country now
obsessed with Ramsey DNA--All Ramsey Circus all the time so you don't have to consider
"real
news stories"mania.

At the rate MSFT is cutting features in Vista, it ought to consider getting into the
entertainment content providing business not just by selling Halo 2 (in typical sybaritic
fashion Gates and Company wanted free trips to the premier of Halo 2 on a private jet for
the
intelligentsia/elitsia/Redmon aristocrisygentsia.

Yawn City. Cutting features like crazy, MSFT hurdles headlong with
developers kicking and screaming toward RTM of "Vista WannaBe--the October
RTM.

It will indeed be fun to take 5536 apart feature by feature because it has
been held out by MSFT as the magic wand that would whisk away the absolute
fact this thing needs 6 more months.

Features seem to be dropping like flies as the Redmond campus rushes towards
RTM like the guys on Prison Break on the train.

http://www.fox.com/prisonbreak/

Microsoft cuts full HD playback in 32bit Vista

http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

During the era of XP the phrase value add was tossed around. Welcome to the
erra of Value Subtract.


What do this mean with any clarity Nick?


Nick White [MSFT] offering lessons in the English language. What's the
meaning of "Is" and who is holding the blue dress Nick?


From Nick White [MSFT] on the Vista "launch team" on his blog:

https://209.34.241.68/windowsvista/default.aspx

"Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit Systems
The community is buzzing with reactions to APC Magazine's article regarding
playback of protected High Definition content in 32-bit versions of Windows
Vista. However, the information shared was incorrect and the reactions
pervading the community are thus (understandably) ill-informed.

The real deal is that no version of Windows Vista will make a determination
as to whether any given piece of content should play back or not. The
individual ISV providing the playback solutions will choose whether the
playback environment, including environments that use 32-bit processors,
meet the performance requirements for playback of protected High Definition
content.

So what does that mean?

It is up to a particular ISV to determine which environments are suitable
for their playback solutions. Not Windows Vista, and not Microsoft. To
help ISVs make the playback determination, the OS will expose a list of any
unsigned drivers on the system; nevertheless, it remains up to the ISV to
determine whether playback will be enabled.

In other words, nothing has changed with respect to Microsoft's policies or
development plans for protected HD playback -- which we addressed at WinHEC
this past May -- and nothing has been cut from Windows Vista in this
regard."


"Thursday, August 24, 2006 9:13 PM by danwarne
Just to clarify, what Microsoft is saying here is that their Senior Program
Manager Steve Riley said the wrong thing during his presentation at Tech.Ed
Sydney. APC reported his comments accurately based on a transcript of the
event.

However, regardless, Microsoft is making a very specific semantic point
here: Riley did say yesterday that the restrictions were made at the behest
of content owners, so Microsoft is really just restating here that content
owners have the ability to veto their content from being played on 32bit
systems.

I've asked Microsoft for a list of the high-definition DRM systems that WILL
play on Vista 32bit and which ones won't, so some further clarity can be
bought to the story. "
_________________________________________
# re: Clarifying Windows Vista Support of Protected HD Content in 32-bit
Systems
Thursday, August 24, 2006 11:16 PM by someone
Apart from VC-1, will Vista play/decode the following out of the box without
third party decoders:
1. MPEG-4 Simple profile/Advanced profile
2. H.264 which is mandatory for HD DVD and Blu-ray
3. Dolby Digital (AC-3) 5.1 (DVD)
4. DTS 5.1 (DVD)
5. Dolby Digital Plus, DTS HD? (HD DVD/Blu-ray)

On Windows Vista, DRM, and new monitors
http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/hardware/hdcp-vista.ars

Thoughts on MCE Beta Feedback by Matt Goyer
http://mediacenter.mattgoyer.com/archives/2006/07/26/1157

CH



http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne...other-feature-full-hd-playback-in-32bit-vista

Microsoft revealed today that no 32-bit versions of Windows Vista will be able to play
back
“next generation high definition protected content†(translation – studio-released
BluRay
and HD-DVD movies).

By far the majority of PCs use 32-bit processors, because despite AMD’s efforts to push
64-bit CPUs into the marketplace early, Intel’s first widely-promoted 64-bit CPU is the
just-released Core 2 Duo.

PC users will now have to choose between a PC that can play high definition content (64
bit)
versus one that can potentially run older devices that only have unsigned drivers
available
(32 bit).

“Signed drivers†are ones that have undergone a Microsoft quality-assurance process
and
received a digital certificate that certifies them as stable for installation on 64-bit
Windows.

Microsoft’s move to drop support for playback of studio-released HD movies on Vista is
likely to anger the large number of people who were hoping they could use their existing
32-bit PC with an upgrade version of Vista.

The surprising disclosure was made by Senior Program Manager Steve Riley during a
presentation on Windows Vista security at Tech.Ed 2006 Sydney today.

“Any next-generation high definition content will not play in x32 at all,†said
Riley.

“This is a decision that the Media Player folks made because there are just too many
ways
right now for unsigned kernel mode code [to compromise content protection]. The media
companies asked us to do this and said they don’t want any of their high definition
content
to play in x32 at all, because of all of the unsigned malware that runs in kernel mode
can
get around content protection, so we had to do this,†he said.

Riley then attempted to pre-empt audience concerns over the newly imposed limitation by
asking how many of the Tech.Ed attendees currently played high-definition movies at home.

“How many of you have a DVD player that you know can output a proper 1080 line
non-interlaced?â€Â

No-one raised their hands.

“OK… look around. By the time that stuff becomes popular, it’ll no longer be an
issue
because everyone will be running 64-bit Windows,†he said.

However, earlier in his presentation, Riley had explained why Microsoft had decided to
let
unsigned code run in 32-bit Windows, but not in 64-bit Windows.

“Imagine how difficult it would be for you [the Tech.Ed attendees] to update your
environment. It would be a non-starter, right?â€Â

“We can’t do that [lock out unsigned drivers from 32 bit Windows]. The app-compat
hit, as we
say in Microsoft, would be far too great if we did it in 32-bit Vista.â€Â

In an interview hastily organised by Microsoft public relations staff after they learned
APC
was planning to run this story, Riley was at pains to point out that Blu Ray and HD-DVD
were
storage media and “you could put an MPEG-4 movie on them and play them on a 32bit Vista
PC
just fine.â€Â

But he conceded that a commercially-produced BluRay or HD-DVD movie with next-generation
high definition protected content wouldn’t play on a 32 bit PC.




--
Michael
______
"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools,
but that the lightning ain't distributed right."
- Mark Twain
 

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