Manufacturer Never attached COA label and I need to build a new PC due to lightning. HELP!!!

[G.L. Cross]

Hello,

Some time back, I bought a new computer from a "supposedly"
reputable manufacturer over the Internet. I bought everything
new except for the monitor and the system was equipped with
Windows-XP Professional (version 2002). Part No. X08-33951
is stamped on the CD. The install manual has a Part No. of
X08-48124. Everything was fine until last week when a storm
fried the MB, disk drive, memory,power supply, and the modem.
Now here is where things get very irritating. This manufacturer
failed to apply the Certificate of Authenticity to the computer
(or it subsequently "came off") nor is it located with the OEM
installation disk which came with the computer. Now time to get
pissed. This is when I discovered no manufacturer label either and
due to the flow of time, the manufacturer name has been lost to me.
I've been unable to locate the original sales invoice. I have the
install disk but no Product Key that I need to re-install the OS.

I refuse to buy a new copy of this expensive software since I have
already paid for it. Contacting Microsoft has been futile. How do
I go about requesting a replacement COA from Microsoft so I can
fix my computer. And I need this number soon (and preferably a
legit AOC to go with it). If Microsoft proves to be a problem about
replacing this KEY, I have both the knowledge and the KEYGEN
software to defeat this illegally (I'd prefer to get it legal but I will not
hesitate to use other methods if forced to).

Somebody out there please give advice on how to resolve this situation
(I'm sure this is not the first time something like this has happened). I've
always felt that MS was paranoid about piracy which is probably less
than 0.05% of total sales. AND, this crazy KEY thing is more of an
irritant to people like myself who want the legit product - each time I
would upgrade, I'd have a multi-day hassle getting MS to reset the damn
thing so I could run it on the modified machine. MS is only alienating
customers who seem to be flocking to Apple and Linux-based systems
that have no stupid things. Also, I DO NOT like the idea of MS
cataloguing my computer configuration hoping to catch someone installing
the OS on multiple machines. It makes me nervous that ANY information
is transmitted to MS FOR ANY REASON. Besides hacks to get around
the whole crazy mess are published openly on the Internet...

HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED GREATLY!!!!

====
You may send e-mail if you wish provided it is NOT SPAM. To decode my valid
E-mail address, you will need to remove the <NOSPAM.> and the <666>. I had
to get complicated as spammers are now doing the obvious removal of the word
"NOSPAM" to compile their lists of e-mails...

- G.L. Cross

 

[Carey Frisch [MVP]]

Sorry, Microsoft offers no support for OEM versions of Windows XP.
Support for OEM versions lies solely with the party from whom you
purchased it from. Only "retail versions" are supported by Microsoft.

It is illegal to attempt to create a "KEYGEN" generated Product Key.
You need to purchase a legitimate copy of Windows XP.

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows XP - Shell/User

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


| Hello,
|
| Some time back, I bought a new computer from a "supposedly"
| reputable manufacturer over the Internet. I bought everything
| new except for the monitor and the system was equipped with
| Windows-XP Professional (version 2002). Part No. X08-33951
| is stamped on the CD. The install manual has a Part No. of
| X08-48124. Everything was fine until last week when a storm
| fried the MB, disk drive, memory,power supply, and the modem.
| Now here is where things get very irritating. This manufacturer
| failed to apply the Certificate of Authenticity to the computer
| (or it subsequently "came off") nor is it located with the OEM
| installation disk which came with the computer. Now time to get
| pissed. This is when I discovered no manufacturer label either and
| due to the flow of time, the manufacturer name has been lost to me.
| I've been unable to locate the original sales invoice. I have the
| install disk but no Product Key that I need to re-install the OS.
|
| I refuse to buy a new copy of this expensive software since I have
| already paid for it. Contacting Microsoft has been futile. How do
| I go about requesting a replacement COA from Microsoft so I can
| fix my computer. And I need this number soon (and preferably a
| legit AOC to go with it). If Microsoft proves to be a problem about
| replacing this KEY, I have both the knowledge and the KEYGEN
| software to defeat this illegally (I'd prefer to get it legal but I will not
| hesitate to use other methods if forced to).
|
| Somebody out there please give advice on how to resolve this situation
| (I'm sure this is not the first time something like this has happened). I've
| always felt that MS was paranoid about piracy which is probably less
| than 0.05% of total sales. AND, this crazy KEY thing is more of an
| irritant to people like myself who want the legit product - each time I
| would upgrade, I'd have a multi-day hassle getting MS to reset the damn
| thing so I could run it on the modified machine. MS is only alienating
| customers who seem to be flocking to Apple and Linux-based systems
| that have no stupid things. Also, I DO NOT like the idea of MS
| cataloguing my computer configuration hoping to catch someone installing
| the OS on multiple machines. It makes me nervous that ANY information
| is transmitted to MS FOR ANY REASON. Besides hacks to get around
| the whole crazy mess are published openly on the Internet...
|
| HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED GREATLY!!!!
|
| ====
| You may send e-mail if you wish provided it is NOT SPAM. To decode my valid
| E-mail address, you will need to remove the <NOSPAM.> and the <666>. I had
| to get complicated as spammers are now doing the obvious removal of the word
| "NOSPAM" to compile their lists of e-mails...
|
| - G.L. Cross

 

[Lorne Smith]

OEM copies are permenantly tied to the first computer they are installed on,
and cannot be moved to any other machine under any circumstances, even if
the original is destroyed, so even if you had a key, you would not be
allowed to install it on the new PC (as per the terms of the EULA which you
agree to when you first installed the software). Even if you did, you would
not be able to activate it.

Also, as Carey has said, MS do not provide any support of any kind with OEM
copies. That's up to the retailer who sells you it. These are two of the
reasons why OEM copies are best avoided unless your a system builder and can
provide your own support...

Sure you can use the keygen to install windows, but you'll probably find
they won't work for the activation. Even if they do, you're still breaking
the terms of the EULA. If you want to be 100% legit, then you'll have to
buy another copy, and preferably a retail copy so that you can move it to
another PC in the future...

OH, and MS do NOT collect information about the hardware in your computer...
You've been listening to net myths... All that is sent when you activate,
is a hash code generated by your local machine based on the currently
installed hardware. This hash code is unique to your PC and is used as part
of the activation process to indentify if the PC it's being activated on is
the same one or not.

Lorne

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

You chose to save money by buying OEM.
You need to think of OEM as if it is manufactured, distributed and
supported by the seller and not Microsoft.
That is one of the many reasons OEM is cheaper than retail.

You did not take proper care of the Product Key.
You did not keep your invoice.
You do not even know who you bought the computer from.
And now it would seem you believe it to be Microsoft's fault and you
will use that to justify theft.

Microsoft is not the problem here.
How can Microsoft be a problem in an issue that is not really about
their product?

"...I will not hesitate to use other methods if forced to)"
I guess that is OK.
Who will force you to do what?
You are not forced to do anything with your computer.
You will not be forced to steal.
You may however make the choice to steal and become a thief.

Much of your last paragraph is bologna and possibly justification for
theft.
"...multi-day hassle getting MS to reset..." absolutely not, at least
not on a legal system.
Seconds, minutes at the most unless there is more to the story than
you are saying.

You really have two options since it seems impossible to contact the
OEM:
1. Buy Windows
2. You can chose to steal Windows as a thief.

 

[G.L. Cross]

You chose to save money by buying OEM.
You need to think of OEM as if it is manufactured, distributed and
supported by the seller and not Microsoft.
That is one of the many reasons OEM is cheaper than retail.

*** MY DECLARATION OF ANGER ***

IT WAS RETAIL DAMMIT BOUGHT FROM A RETAIL STORE CHAIN
OFF OF THEIR WEBSITE (I THINK THE STORE CHAIN WAS
SOMETHING LIKE "CAMPO." BUT NOT SURE). WHEN ORDERED,
I DESIGNED AND SELECTED THE MB AND OTHER COMPONENTS
I WANTED AND THEY ASSEMBLED AND TESTED - THIS WAS NO
DELL OR GATEWAY MACHINE.

IF I HAVE TO, I'LL JUST PULL OUT THE OLE KERNEL DEBUGGER
AND PATCH AWAY ALL CODE THAT CHECKS FOR THIS STUFF
AND REMOVE IT FROM THE OS INCLUDING ALL COMMUNICATIONS
WITH MS, MAKE A NEW CD AND BE FREE OF THE STUPID TYRANTS
IN REDLAND. I HAVE THE KNOWLEDGE TO DO THIS: noop-ing instructions
or function calls with a HEX editor is not all that hard - just run it until
it says you can't
do something, then trace back to the code that decided this and patch out
the algorithm
to always return "IS ALLOWED"...

BTW, don't anyone bother asking me for the resulting "liberated" XP. *THAT*
would become pirating... But I do have the right to use the one copy on my
one computer and I intend to do so!! This personal use provision has stood
up
in a many court of law...

If you don't mind being held hostage by a greedy kingpin, that is up to you.
MS
has no right to tell me I can't use a perfectly good OS CD just because
lightening
hit the computer and I have no intention of making a megalomaniac $300.00
richer
whenever lightening strikes!

*** END SOAPBOX ***

You did not take proper care of the Product Key.

WRONG, it was never attached to the computer...

You did not keep your invoice.

It is somewhere but I am not going to spend eons looking! I can patch the OS
faster than I could find the stupid invoice. BTW, where are your invoices
for the
books you bought in oh, say, 1998? My bet is you have no idea? Right?

You do not even know who you bought the computer from.

So what, I PAID for it!

And now it would seem you believe it to be Microsoft's fault and you

It is the fault of the manufacturer and the fault of Microsoft's GREED and
STUPIDITY
to try too do this...

will use that to justify theft.

Microsoft is not the problem here.
How can Microsoft be a problem in an issue that is not really about
their product?

"...I will not hesitate to use other methods if forced to)"
I guess that is OK.
Who will force you to do what?
You are not forced to do anything with your computer.

You will not be forced to steal.
You may however make the choice to steal and become a thief.

BULLS**T, I PAID FOR IT AND I HAVE THE RIGHT TO
REPAIR A BROKEN COMPUTER NO MATTER WHAT
ANYBODY SAYS... How pray tell can I steal what I already posses
by valid purchase with MY MONEY?

This whole thing is analogous to going out, buying a car, paying for
it, and then being told you cannot put your perfectly good engine in
another car after an accident totaled say the rear end. Instead you are
expected to throw away the whole car and go buy a new one.
That is ludicrous...

I believe there is a lawsuit pending over this practice of "marrying" the OS
to a component that can never be changed. Also, if piracy was such a big
ass problem, how did Bill Gates get so freaking RICH? Answer: people
were buying the product in droves LONG before he got his pirate-phobia.
I'd bet they have spent 100 times as much money developing this "activation"
BS as was ever lost to piracy...


OKAY, now you may FLAME AWAY ENJOY !!!!

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

In this post, you say "IT WAS RETAIL..."
In the last post you say "OEM installation disk"
Based on the first statement, your Windows is OEM.
Dell, Gateway etc are not the only source for OEM.
Your lack of understanding of the OEM concept does not change the
facts.

What your capable of doing and your name calling of Microsoft are not
relevant and show more of your character than anything else.

Most people here will not ask for your tricks, the honest people here
have no need for your tricks.

Your example of the car is OK.
However to be true to your example, the engine would be stolen.
It is possible to install the stolen engine in your car, but the
engine is still stolen.

My books are originals, no copies.
However anything I feel I need proof of, my receipts are safe to be
located when needed.
If a receipt is needed and I can't find it, it must be Wal-Marts fault
(they are close by)

I am not "being held hostage" by anyone or anything because I choose
to take care of the necessary documentation.
What did you choose to do?

If you have a problem, you need to contact the seller.
The fact that you chose to be careless with the important data does
not automatically shift the blame to Microsoft as you imply.

This may be a better solution for you so you do not need to deal with
"Microsoft's GREED and STUPIDITY" :
http://www.linux.com/
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/prod...44&path=0:3944:3951:41937:86796:106562:106560

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
An easier way to read newsgroup messages:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/using/newsgroups/setup.asp
http://dts-l.org/index.html

 

[Carey Frisch [MVP]]

G.L. Cross stated: "IT WAS RETAIL"

No it's not! Part No. X08-33951 is an "OEM version".
Ref: http://www.tacktech.com/display.cfm?ttid=101

Should you purchase an OEM license version of XP?
http://www.tek-tips.com/gfaqs.cfm/pid/779/fid/4004

"You can transfer a non-OEM license to a new machine.
You remove XP from the first machine and the license
will transfer to the new machine. You call Microsoft and
they will issue you a new activation code. ***You cannot do
this with the OEM license ***. It is for one machine only, the
original machine. You will not be issued an activation code
for a new machine".

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows XP - Shell/User

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

|
||
| *** MY DECLARATION OF PETTY FOOLISHNESS ***
|
| IT WAS RETAIL DAMMIT BOUGHT FROM A RETAIL STORE CHAIN
| OFF OF THEIR WEBSITE (I THINK THE STORE CHAIN WAS
| SOMETHING LIKE "CAMPO." BUT NOT SURE). WHEN ORDERED,
| I DESIGNED AND SELECTED THE MB AND OTHER COMPONENTS
| I WANTED AND THEY ASSEMBLED AND TESTED - THIS WAS NO
| DELL OR GATEWAY MACHINE.
|
| IF I HAVE TO, I'LL JUST PULL OUT THE OLE KERNEL DEBUGGER
| AND PATCH AWAY ALL CODE THAT CHECKS FOR THIS STUFF
| AND REMOVE IT FROM THE OS INCLUDING ALL COMMUNICATIONS
| WITH MS, MAKE A NEW CD AND BE FREE OF THE STUPID TYRANTS
| IN REDLAND. I HAVE THE KNOWLEDGE TO DO THIS: noop-ing instructions
| or function calls with a HEX editor is not all that hard - just run it until
| it says you can't
| do something, then trace back to the code that decided this and patch out
| the algorithm
| to always return "IS ALLOWED"...
|
| BTW, don't anyone bother asking me for the resulting "liberated" XP. *THAT*
| would become pirating... But I do have the right to use the one copy on my
| one computer and I intend to do so!! This personal use provision has stood
| up
| in a many court of law...
|
| If you don't mind being held hostage by a greedy kingpin, that is up to you.
| MS
| has no right to tell me I can't use a perfectly good OS CD just because
| lightening
| hit the computer and I have no intention of making a megalomaniac $300.00
| richer
| whenever lightening strikes!
|
| *** END SOAPBOX ***
|
| >
| > You did not take proper care of the Product Key.
|
| WRONG, it was never attached to the computer...
|
| > You did not keep your invoice.
|
| It is somewhere but I am not going to spend eons looking! I can patch the OS
| faster than I could find the stupid invoice. BTW, where are your invoices
| for the
| books you bought in oh, say, 1998? My bet is you have no idea? Right?
|
| > You do not even know who you bought the computer from.
|
| So what, I PAID for it!
|
| > And now it would seem you believe it to be Microsoft's fault and you
|
| It is the fault of the manufacturer and the fault of Microsoft's GREED and
| STUPIDITY
| to try too do this...
|
| > will use that to justify theft.
| >
| > Microsoft is not the problem here.
| > How can Microsoft be a problem in an issue that is not really about
| > their product?
| >
| > "...I will not hesitate to use other methods if forced to)"
| > I guess that is OK.
| > Who will force you to do what?
| > You are not forced to do anything with your computer.
|
| > You will not be forced to steal.
| > You may however make the choice to steal and become a thief.
|
| BULLS**T, I PAID FOR IT AND I HAVE THE RIGHT TO
| REPAIR A BROKEN COMPUTER NO MATTER WHAT
| ANYBODY SAYS... How pray tell can I steal what I already posses
| by valid purchase with MY MONEY?
|
| This whole thing is analogous to going out, buying a car, paying for
| it, and then being told you cannot put your perfectly good engine in
| another car after an accident totaled say the rear end. Instead you are
| expected to throw away the whole car and go buy a new one.
| That is ludicrous...
|
| I believe there is a lawsuit pending over this practice of "marrying" the OS
| to a component that can never be changed. Also, if piracy was such a big
| ass problem, how did Bill Gates get so freaking RICH? Answer: people
| were buying the product in droves LONG before he got his pirate-phobia.
| I'd bet they have spent 100 times as much money developing this "activation"
| BS as was ever lost to piracy...
|
|
| OKAY, now you may FLAME AWAY ENJOY !!!!

 

[G.L. Cross]

G.L. Cross stated: "IT WAS RETAIL"

No it's not! Part No. X08-33951 is an "OEM version".
Ref: http://www.tacktech.com/display.cfm?ttid=101

Should you purchase an OEM license version of XP?
http://www.tek-tips.com/gfaqs.cfm/pid/779/fid/4004

"You can transfer a non-OEM license to a new machine.
You remove XP from the first machine and the license
will transfer to the new machine. You call Microsoft and
they will issue you a new activation code. ***You cannot do
this with the OEM license ***. It is for one machine only, the
original machine. You will not be issued an activation code
for a new machine".

Alright, a question? Does Microsoft offer any mechanism to trade
in an OEM copy for a RETAIL copy + a reduced fee? I might
consider this. To me "RETAIL" has always meant places that have
actual stores in cities which this chain did. I knew nothing of this KRAZY
THING nor was I asked if I wanted one type of OS or another when
I bought the system. The use of the word "RETAIL" is very misleading
and tends to draw people who have no reason to suspect otherwise
into this "OEM TRAP." Therefore, my feeling toward Microsoft tends
to lean in the direction that the word was deliberately chosen for this
very reason. BTW, I AM going to try to locate the info on that lawsuit
I mentioned regarding this behavior by Microsoft. I seem to remember
that the Feds are after them about it as well (but I don't know to what
extent)...

- G

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

There is no option to change an OEM to retail.
The only way is to buy the retail version.
It is often on sale for a modest discount and it can be had cheaper on
places like Ebay...buyer beware of Ebay.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
An easier way to read newsgroup messages:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/using/newsgroups/setup.asp
http://dts-l.org/index.html

 

[Bruce Chambers]

Greetings --

You don't. Period. If you forgot where you parked your car,
would you expect Ford to give you another?

YOU lost (or never bothered to verify that you received it -- it
amounts to the same thing) your COA. Your lack of responsibility and
organizational skills are not Microsoft's fault. You're in a
situation entirely of your own creation, so you're most certainly not
entitled to help from Microsoft. It's time for you to grow up and
accept the consequences of your own actions. Threatening to become a
thief will avail you nothing.


Bruce Chambers

--
Help us help you:



You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on
having both at once. -- RAH

Hello,
Background snipped....

I refuse to buy a new copy of this expensive software since I have
already paid for it. Contacting Microsoft has been futile. How do
I go about requesting a replacement COA from Microsoft so I can
fix my computer. And I need this number soon (and preferably a
legit AOC to go with it). If Microsoft proves to be a problem about
replacing this KEY, I have both the knowledge and the KEYGEN
software to defeat this illegally (I'd prefer to get it legal but I will not
hesitate to use other methods if forced to).

Paranoid delusions snipped....

 

[Bruce Chambers]

Greetings --

It's a "trap" only to the completely clueless. Anyone with a lick
of sense makes sure that he knows exactly what he's getting for his
money _before_ concluding the purchase. "Caveat Emptor," and all
that. I've absolutely no sympathy for the intellectually lazy
purchaser who always fall back on the "But I didn't know.... No one
told me...." excuse, when confronted with the less pleasant
consequences of his choice.

Bruce Chambers

--
Help us help you:



You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on
having both at once. -- RAH

 

[G.L. Cross]

Greetings --

It's a "trap" only to the completely clueless. Anyone with a lick
of sense makes sure that he knows exactly what he's getting for his
money _before_ concluding the purchase. "Caveat Emptor," and all
that. I've absolutely no sympathy for the intellectually lazy
purchaser who always fall back on the "But I didn't know.... No one
told me...." excuse, when confronted with the less pleasant
consequences of his choice.

Bruce Chambers

EXCUSE ME ARSHOLE, but I hold a Master's degree in BOTH computer science
AND mathematics. I've worked as a systems engineer for more than 25 years
much of it using Windows architectures (3.1 on up to XP) and the latest
innovations
(MS Foundation classes on up to complicated Object/Linking/Embedding
Multi-Document/
Multi-Application architectures. The thing with Windows-XP (esp. OEM/RETAIL)
was never
discussed in any way in the reams of technical documents from interface
specifications on
down to Windows Internals (yes I read about the "activation" stuff in which
mister friendly "Bill" never said
a peep about any kind of differences to which the two types could be put to
use). I've read
journals, magazines, white papers, been to meetings all over the globe and
not once have
I run across any hint that one Windows was not identical to all Windows. The
only time
I ever ran across the term "OEM" was when I turned to the net to shop for
replacement parts.
Even then not on a single occasion did I EVER see this "distinction" stated
or defined. Everywhere
the terms "OEM" and "RETAIL" were used interchangeably to describe the
identical part with
the exception that "OEM" usually had little or no warranty, non-fancy
("white-box") packaging,
and may lack driver disks and/or printed manuals (both or which were
available for download).
I had to already "know" about this difference in order to search for
information on it. Not
specifically looking for this material, it slips through the cracks.

AS AN ASIDE: I have ***already*** "fixed" my XP so that it now installs
correctly WITHOUT EVER
asking for a LICENSE KEY! In less than three hours I have removed the entire
KEYGEN/VERIFICATION logic from the installation disk and a couple of places
when the system
looked in the registry for a VALID KEY (now it simply just DOESN'T LOOK AT
ALL). It appears
to be running on the new machine (for now) but I have not attempted to
"activate" it yet. This, I will
try tomorrow (with Internet still off) to locate the code areas responsible
for the "activation" (by making
it fail, the system stops at the spot I need with a nice neat trace back to
the decision making code
whereupon it becomes subject to "patching out"). Once found, I corrupt the
logic by modifying binary
instructions to skip over whole areas responsible for the license
verification (deleting logic is a LOT
easier than creating it). It's like a surgeon removing tumors in the body. I
expect to "liberate" my XP
in 7 to 15 days...

If only MS would allow an upgrade path from OEM to RETAIL, I'd have appeased
them but
this is beginning to feel like a war between ME and HIM. And my troops are
cutting them to ribbons...
NO ANTI-"PIRACY" SYSTEM can withstand attack when it's enemy has direct
access to the code
that controls it... SORRY but sometimes people just go too far...

 

[G.L. Cross]

IT IS NOT **MY** GODDAMN RESPONSIBILITY TO STICK A STICKER ON
THE MACHINE - THE COA STATES THAT IT IS THE MANUFACTURERS RESPONSIBILITY
TO DO THIS. I guess Ford is not responsible for tightening the engine mounts
on you new car either??

P.S. I just "love" a little heated argument once in a while don't you?
)

 

[Bruce Chambers]

Greetings --

Ah.... Living proof that paper degrees and certifications are no
substitute for real-life experience and common sense. But I do admire
your audacity: I would certainly be ashamed to claim such a lofty
education after so thoroughly demonstrating my ignorance of a matter
that has been widely known (particularly within the IT community) and
practiced for many years. But you go right ahead and brag about it.
Now, that's what I call chutzpah. I don't know why I'm surprised at
your lack of knowledge, though; I've met a great many "Computer
Science" graduates who can't even spell PC, and even more "Systems
Engineers" who don't know what end of a screwdriver to hold or how to
punch down a patch panel.

Oh, and bragging about how you deliberately violated your EULA for
a Microsoft product (in effect, committing software piracy) on a
server owned and operating by Microsoft is real clever, too.

You're correct in one respect though: no software anti-piracy
mechanism will deter the determined thief; just as car and home door
locks do not deter the determined burglar. I trust you'll enjoy the
company of your new fellow travelers.


Bruce Chambers

--
Help us help you:



You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on
having both at once. -- RAH

 

[Bruce Chambers]

Greetings --

YOU made the purchase. It was YOUR responsibility to ensure that
you received exactly what you paid for. YOU failed to do so. Deal
with it.

Bruce Chambers

--
Help us help you:



You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on
having both at once. -- RAH

 

[G.L. Cross]

Greetings --

Ah.... Living proof that paper degrees and certifications are no
substitute for real-life experience and common sense. But I do admire
your audacity: I would certainly be ashamed to claim such a lofty
education after so thoroughly demonstrating my ignorance of a matter
that has been widely known (particularly within the IT community) and
practiced for many years.

With little time to "surf" due to work - I can see why this escaped me as
well.
My ADHD probably contributed to the subconscious assumption that what I
"happened to notice" was "the limit of it." And, since specialized groups
like this one is virtually the only place I found any reference to this
issue
combined with the fact that my work never conflicted with my belief
theory would help explain its being overlooked. In addition, no mention
exists in any of the documentation that came with the computer about
any restrictions on replacing certain components such as the motherboard
(which as you recall got fried in my case). In fact the very idea of such
restrictions being in place was never even considered since no known
example had ever been found until now. All previous versions of Windows
cloud be installed on ANY new computer without problems (yes, I knew
of the one-computer restriction which I am NOT violating in anything I am
doing to get this thing running again). "Gluing" the OS to a specific
motherboard is the stupidest thing I've ever heard of and can have only one
purpose: making Bill Gates more money by means of underhanded "dirty-tricks"
literally robbing his customers. As far as my "ignorance" of something is
concerned so
what? Ignorance is a property of being human (unless YOU profess to be
ignorant of NOTHING thereby knowing EVERYTHING which would seem
to fit the definition of "God" which I seriously doubt you are). And, since
the
IT world is outside my area of work, missing this detail is easily
believable.
As I am sure there exist plenty of other things in which I (and YOU) are
ignorant as well.

Now, that's what I call chutzpah. I don't know why I'm surprised at
your lack of knowledge, though; I've met a great many "Computer
Science" graduates who can't even spell PC, and even more "Systems
Engineers" who don't know what end of a screwdriver to hold or how to
punch down a patch panel.

This statement clearly demonstrates YOUR ignorance (score 1 to 1) -
touché!!!!

Oh, and bragging about how you deliberately violated your EULA for
a Microsoft product (in effect, committing software piracy) on a
server owned and operating by Microsoft is real clever, too.

Ah yes!!! A wolf among the fold - I like that!!! There are certain precepts
which cannot be waived by means of contract. And I claim and will continue
to claim my right to use this copy of Windows-XP on ONE computer.
Furthermore please show me where in the license agreement, it states that
one forfeits the right to use the software without compensation in the event
of a hardware failure caused by an act of God. The EEF (as I've now been
hearing) is the group getting ready to file suit against Microsoft because
of
this particular "unfair business practice." A friend of mine is a contract
lawyer
(and a good one) and he plus reams of historical legal precedent, feels that
the EEF will have no problem forcing Microsoft to abandon this practice.
They could in fact be fined tens, even hundreds of millions of dollars!
You cannot put anything you want into contact contrary to what you may
believe. BTW, the definition of "piracy" is the manufacture and distribution
of unauthorized **copies** of copyrighted works. I have not made any
copies of my CD nor have I sold any copies of it. If fact, Microsoft in this
particular case doesn't have a legal leg to stand on. They are the ones
denying
me use of my computer in violation of their own contract. They are the ones
disrupting my work and essentially demanding a ransom to let me get on
with it. Seems to me that if you are siding with Bill on this one, I suppose
you must have obeyed everything you were told to do or not to do without
question since the very first day of your life? Seems kind of UN-American
to me since civil disobedience has been an integral part of the American way
all the way back to before the Civil War. But I guess you are just one of
those
sheep who are afraid to fight for what is fair, just, and morally correct.
Q.E.D.

You're correct in one respect though: no software anti-piracy
mechanism will deter the determined thief; just as car and home door
locks do not deter the determined burglar. I trust you'll enjoy the
company of your new fellow travelers.

I have no plans to travel with any "new" associates. Oh yes, I do have
the right to break into my own house and even steal my own stuff.
Your statement seems non-sequitor.

Are you enjoying this argument as much as I am? I hope so, its been a
while since my last great argument...

 

[G.L. Cross]

Greetings --

YOU made the purchase. It was YOUR responsibility to ensure that
you received exactly what you paid for. YOU failed to do so. Deal
with it.

Next time deal with the mistake made by your surgeon which was YOUR
responsibility to ensure that you received exactly what you paid for.
YOU failed to do so. Deal with it.



Hee Hee!!!!!

 

[Bruce Chambers]

Greetings --

The two issues aren't even vaguely similar. There can readily be
a situation in which one may not have full control over all aspects of
a medical emergency, but such doesn't apply to the simple, deliberate
purchase of consumer goods. To quote an old bromide, "You get what
you pay for."

But, rest assured that, should I ever have the need to avail
myself of a surgeon's services, I will very carefully research his/her
bonafides, record, reputation, and insurance status, and that of the
hospital, _before_ going under the knife.


Bruce Chambers

--
Help us help you:



You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on
having both at once. -- RAH

 

[Bruce Chambers]

Greetings --

You're still operating under severe misconceptions.

An normal OEM license is not necessarily bound to a specific
motherboard, but rather to the entire PC on which it is first
installed. This is clearly spelled out in the EULA on your very own
hard drive. (C:\Windows\System32\Eula.txt on standard installation,
if you'd care to read it.) And this is pretty much the way OEM
licenses for all earlier Windows versions have been written, with
minor changes.

If an OEM license is "glued" to the motherboard via BIOS-locking,
this restriction is _entirely_ the choice of the PC manufacturer, not
Microsoft. Your issue is with the PC's manufacturer, not Bill Gates.
Microsoft is not denying you the use of your computer; your own
carelessness in not ensuring the presence of, or safeguarding, the CoA
is the root cause of your problem.

And why is "... the IT world .... outside [your] area of work?"
You're the one that claimed a degree in Computer Science and to be a
Systems Engineer with 25 years experience working with Windows
operating systems. (I won't go into your math skills here, but
Windows hasn't been around 25 years, yet.)

"Act of God?" Please, let's not bring your personal superstitions
(which I do acknowledge you're fully entitled to hold), into the
discussion. Lightning is a simple, readily explained physical
phenomenon of static electricity, but it is outside the area of the
discussion.

As for your lawyer-friend's opinions, we'll just have to see.
Personally, I doubt that he'll get very far. If the US Department of
Justice and several publicity-hungry states' attorneys-general didn't
even dare raise the issue during their recent legal attacks on
Microsoft (for unfair business practices), I suspect it's because they
knew _they_ didn't have a legal leg to stand on.


Bruce Chambers

--
Help us help you:



You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on
having both at once. -- RAH

 

[Perdita X. Nightmare]

This is just getting ridiculous. Unfortuneatly for G.L. he should have
looked into what he was actually getting. He has fallen victim to bad
circumstances, only worsened by not looking into what an OEM version is.
There's nothing more he can really do except go and buy a retail copy of XP,
and learn from this lesson. There's no need for bad mouthing or yelling.
Let's just leave this at that.

Greetings --

You're still operating under severe misconceptions.

An normal OEM license is not necessarily bound to a specific
motherboard, but rather to the entire PC on which it is first
installed. This is clearly spelled out in the EULA on your very own
hard drive. (C:\Windows\System32\Eula.txt on standard installation,
if you'd care to read it.) And this is pretty much the way OEM
licenses for all earlier Windows versions have been written, with
minor changes.

If an OEM license is "glued" to the motherboard via BIOS-locking,
this restriction is _entirely_ the choice of the PC manufacturer, not
Microsoft. Your issue is with the PC's manufacturer, not Bill Gates.
Microsoft is not denying you the use of your computer; your own
carelessness in not ensuring the presence of, or safeguarding, the CoA
is the root cause of your problem.

And why is "... the IT world .... outside [your] area of work?"
You're the one that claimed a degree in Computer Science and to be a
Systems Engineer with 25 years experience working with Windows
operating systems. (I won't go into your math skills here, but
Windows hasn't been around 25 years, yet.)

"Act of God?" Please, let's not bring your personal superstitions
(which I do acknowledge you're fully entitled to hold), into the
discussion. Lightning is a simple, readily explained physical
phenomenon of static electricity, but it is outside the area of the
discussion.

As for your lawyer-friend's opinions, we'll just have to see.
Personally, I doubt that he'll get very far. If the US Department of
Justice and several publicity-hungry states' attorneys-general didn't
even dare raise the issue during their recent legal attacks on
Microsoft (for unfair business practices), I suspect it's because they
knew _they_ didn't have a legal leg to stand on.


Bruce Chambers

--
Help us help you:



You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on
having both at once. -- RAH

With little time to "surf" due to work - I can see why this escaped me as
well.
My ADHD probably contributed to the subconscious assumption that what I
"happened to notice" was "the limit of it." And, since specialized groups
like this one is virtually the only place I found any reference to this
issue
combined with the fact that my work never conflicted with my belief
theory would help explain its being overlooked. In addition, no mention
exists in any of the documentation that came with the computer about
any restrictions on replacing certain components such as the motherboard
(which as you recall got fried in my case). In fact the very idea of such
restrictions being in place was never even considered since no known
example had ever been found until now. All previous versions of Windows
cloud be installed on ANY new computer without problems (yes, I knew
of the one-computer restriction which I am NOT violating in anything I am
doing to get this thing running again). "Gluing" the OS to a specific
motherboard is the stupidest thing I've ever heard of and can have only one
purpose: making Bill Gates more money by means of underhanded "dirty-tricks"
literally robbing his customers. As far as my "ignorance" of something is
concerned so
what? Ignorance is a property of being human (unless YOU profess to be
ignorant of NOTHING thereby knowing EVERYTHING which would seem
to fit the definition of "God" which I seriously doubt you are). And, since
the
IT world is outside my area of work, missing this detail is easily
believable.
As I am sure there exist plenty of other things in which I (and YOU) are
ignorant as well.


Ah yes!!! A wolf among the fold - I like that!!! There are certain precepts
which cannot be waived by means of contract. And I claim and will continue
to claim my right to use this copy of Windows-XP on ONE computer.
Furthermore please show me where in the license agreement, it states that
one forfeits the right to use the software without compensation in the event
of a hardware failure caused by an act of God. The EEF (as I've now been
hearing) is the group getting ready to file suit against Microsoft because
of
this particular "unfair business practice." A friend of mine is a contract
lawyer
(and a good one) and he plus reams of historical legal precedent, feels that
the EEF will have no problem forcing Microsoft to abandon this practice.
They could in fact be fined tens, even hundreds of millions of dollars!
You cannot put anything you want into contact contrary to what you may
believe. BTW, the definition of "piracy" is the manufacture and distribution
of unauthorized **copies** of copyrighted works. I have not made any
copies of my CD nor have I sold any copies of it. If fact, Microsoft in this
particular case doesn't have a legal leg to stand on. They are the ones
denying
me use of my computer in violation of their own contract. They are the ones
disrupting my work and essentially demanding a ransom to let me get on
with it. Seems to me that if you are siding with Bill on this one, I suppose
you must have obeyed everything you were told to do or not to do without
question since the very first day of your life? Seems kind of UN-American
to me since civil disobedience has been an integral part of the American way
all the way back to before the Civil War. But I guess you are just one of
those
sheep who are afraid to fight for what is fair, just, and morally correct.

I have no plans to travel with any "new" associates. Oh yes, I do have
the right to break into my own house and even steal my own stuff.
Your statement seems non-sequitor.

Are you enjoying this argument as much as I am? I hope so, its been a
while since my last great argument...