Large Hard Drive in Older Computer

[Carlos]

I want to install a 400 GB hard drive in an old PII computer so I can
use it as a backup (NAS) but I'm wondering if I'll run into issues with
the mobo/bios not being able to support the large drive size. I believe
this was an issue with Windows FAT32 file system, but I'm not sure if it
also applies to the mobo/bios.

I tried finding information on the mobo from the manufacturer's website,
but the machine is an HP machine and the information on their website is
not useful. I tried their email support, but they mentioned the
computer will support up to 20 GB drive which doesn't make much sense to me.

Has anyone had any experience with this?

Thanks.

 

[Michael Hawes]

I want to install a 400 GB hard drive in an old PII computer so I can use
it as a backup (NAS) but I'm wondering if I'll run into issues with the
mobo/bios not being able to support the large drive size. I believe this
was an issue with Windows FAT32 file system, but I'm not sure if it also
applies to the mobo/bios.

I tried finding information on the mobo from the manufacturer's website,
but the machine is an HP machine and the information on their website is
not useful. I tried their email support, but they mentioned the computer
will support up to 20 GB drive which doesn't make much sense to me.

Has anyone had any experience with this?

Thanks.

Seems clear enough, it will support upto 20Gb. You cn go to drive
manufacturers website and download their drive overlay program, which MAY
solve your problem. You may need Win2K SP4 or WinXP SP2 to support drives >
133Gb, and they may not run on a PII. What speed PII?
Mike.

 

[Rod Speed]

I want to install a 400 GB hard drive in an old PII computer so I can use it as a backup (NAS) but
I'm wondering if I'll run into issues
with the mobo/bios not being able to support the large drive size.

Yes, that can happen, but its always fixable.

I believe this was an issue with Windows FAT32 file system,

With all Win file systems in fact.

but I'm not sure if it also applies to the mobo/bios.

Yes, the bios may not support drives over a particular size.

I tried finding information on the mobo from the manufacturer's
website, but the machine is an HP machine and the information on their website is not useful.

The place to look is with the bios flashes, see if they say anything
about support for large hard drives. HP usually does list that sort of thing.

I tried their email support, but they mentioned the computer will support up to 20 GB drive which
doesn't make much sense to me.

Which machine specifically ?

Has anyone had any experience with this?

Yes, there is always some way of getting around a hard drive size limitation.

One approach is to boot a drive that the bios
supports and let the OS handle the large drive.

Another approach is to put the large hard drives
on an addon card which has its own bios.

It isnt completely clear what OS you plan to run on that NAS,
its easy enough with XP, trivial with linux, bit fiddly with W98.

 

[Paul]

I want to install a 400 GB hard drive in an old PII computer so I can
use it as a backup (NAS) but I'm wondering if I'll run into issues with
the mobo/bios not being able to support the large drive size. I believe
this was an issue with Windows FAT32 file system, but I'm not sure if it
also applies to the mobo/bios.

I tried finding information on the mobo from the manufacturer's website,
but the machine is an HP machine and the information on their website is
not useful. I tried their email support, but they mentioned the
computer will support up to 20 GB drive which doesn't make much sense to me.

Has anyone had any experience with this?

Thanks.

One of these will support a large drive. On the software side,
a modern OS plus service pack helps, plus a file system suited
to a 400GB partition.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16816102007

This doc may help explain the software side:

http://www.seagate.com/support/kb/disc/tp/137gb.pdf

Paul

 

[DaveW]

Their answer is ACCURATE. The BIOS in a motherboard that old can only
recognize and use a hrddrive of up to 20 GB of size. Your 400 GB harddrive
has no chance of working.
Time for a new motherboard.

 

[Carlos]

Yes, that can happen, but its always fixable.


With all Win file systems in fact.


Yes, the bios may not support drives over a particular size.


The place to look is with the bios flashes, see if they say anything
about support for large hard drives. HP usually does list that sort of thing.

Well this computer is pretty old. The only bios updates didn't refer to
drive size limitations.

Which machine specifically ?

This machine is an HP Pavilion 8275 PII 300MHz.

Yes, there is always some way of getting around a hard drive size limitation.

One approach is to boot a drive that the bios
supports and let the OS handle the large drive.

This sounds good... especially since I already planned on using a
separate smaller drive for the OS and another for the data.

Another approach is to put the large hard drives
on an addon card which has its own bios.

I might also do this since it might be better to buy an SATA drive since
there's not that large a price difference between PATA and SATA and an
SATA is preferable to have for future uses.

It isnt completely clear what OS you plan to run on that NAS,
its easy enough with XP, trivial with linux, bit fiddly with W98.

I'm planning on running either FreeBSD (FreeNAS) or some flavor or
linux. I think either of these will run faster on the dated hardware.

Thanks for your response.

 

[Carlos]

Seems clear enough, it will support upto 20Gb. You cn go to drive
manufacturers website and download their drive overlay program, which MAY
solve your problem. You may need Win2K SP4 or WinXP SP2 to support drives >
133Gb, and they may not run on a PII. What speed PII?
Mike.

Not too clear actually. The size limitations I read about were due to
address size issues that started at 137 GB drives. I suspect the "tech"
simply looked at what drives were originally available for the machine
(which was quite some time ago... around 1998). The PII runs at 300MHz.
I'm not planning on running Windows.

Thanks for your response.

 

[Carlos]

One of these will support a large drive. On the software side,
a modern OS plus service pack helps, plus a file system suited
to a 400GB partition.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16816102007

This doc may help explain the software side:

http://www.seagate.com/support/kb/disc/tp/137gb.pdf

Paul

Thanks for the informative links. It seems the OS will most likely
handle the problem and it may not be a mobo/bios issue after all. In
either case an add-on card is also an interesting alternative since I
was also considering purchasing an SATA drive just to allow me more
options in the future and an inexpensive add-on card would be used...
I'll probably go this route and use a smaller drive for just the OS.

Thanks again.

 

[Carlos]

Their answer is ACCURATE. The BIOS in a motherboard that old can only
recognize and use a hrddrive of up to 20 GB of size. Your 400 GB harddrive
has no chance of working.
Time for a new motherboard.

After reading one of the documents from a previous post, it would seem
that the limit would be 137GB, which would be consistent with the 48bit
addressing limitation. A 20GB limit doesn't make much sense to me. But
either way, I think I now have a couple workarounds that are acceptable.

 

[Rod Speed]

Rod Speed wrote

Well this computer is pretty old. The only bios updates didn't refer to drive size limitations.

True, tho you would expect an update if it had a problem with
drives over 32GB from an operation like HP or at least a FAQ
that says it has a problem with drives over 32G.

This machine is an HP Pavilion 8275 PII 300MHz.

OK, I confirmed that you didnt overlook anything thats on the HP site for that.

This sounds good... especially since I already planned on using a separate smaller drive for the
OS and another for the data.

You should have not problem at all given that you dont plan to run Win on it.

I might also do this since it might be better to buy an SATA drive
since there's not that large a price difference between PATA and SATA and an SATA is preferable to
have for future uses.

You'd need to be sure that FreeBSD (FreeNAS)
or some flavor of linux supports that card tho.

I would certainly go that route myself, just because there is already
some pretty minimal support for PATA drives in some of the latest
motherboards and that would restrict future use of that drive.

I'm planning on running either FreeBSD (FreeNAS) or some flavor or linux.

Then you wont have any drive size problem. Its mostly Win/DOS that has that.

I think either of these will run faster on the dated hardware.

You dont actually need much horsepower for a NAS, but it isnt
really suitable for XP and 98 doesnt like large hard drives much
and 98 isnt really bulletproof enough for a NAS. I'd certain go the
non Win route myself on that system, unless you must have NTFS
support. The non Wins dont really support that very well at all.

 

[Rod Speed]

Their answer is ACCURATE. The BIOS in a motherboard that old can only recognize and use a
hrddrive of up to 20 GB of size.

Bullshit, all of mine of that vintage handle drives of 400G fine.

Your 400 GB harddrive has no chance of working.

Wrong again.

Time for a new motherboard.

Wrong again, just run FreeBSD (FreeNAS) or some flavor of linux.

 

[Rod Speed]

DaveW wrote
After reading one of the documents from a previous post, it would seem
that the limit would be 137GB, which would be consistent with the 48bit addressing limitation. A
20GB limit doesn't make much sense to me.

There is another limit at 32G due to a bug in the award bios of that era.

But either way, I think I now have a couple workarounds that are acceptable.

Yep, its guaranteed to work fine.

 

[Guest]

I want to install a 400 GB hard drive in an old PII computer so I can
use it as a backup (NAS)

I tried finding information on the mobo from the manufacturer's website,
but the machine is an HP machine and the information on their website is
not useful. I tried their email support, but they mentioned the
computer will support up to 20 GB drive which doesn't make much sense to me.

I've never heard of a 20G limit, and very likely your BIOS has a limit
of 8.4G, 33G, 65G, or 137G. You can test for the 33G limit by running
tint13e or ext13h, but I don' t know of anything to check for the 65G
and 137G limits. But for a 400G drive you'll need a something that
supports 48-bit LBA, and according to www.48bitlba.com some motherboard
chip sets have drivers for this. Almost any PCI IDE card will add
48-bit LBA support and also include Windows drivers even for older
versions of Windows (ME, 98SE, 98).

 

[Splork]

Thanks for the informative links. It seems the OS will most likely
handle the problem and it may not be a mobo/bios issue after all. In
either case an add-on card is also an interesting alternative since I
was also considering purchasing an SATA drive just to allow me more
options in the future and an inexpensive add-on card would be used...
I'll probably go this route and use a smaller drive for just the OS.

Thanks again.

Thats the ticket. Use a small drive for the system and a pci add in card for
the Storage drive. Your choice for serial or Pata.

If you are using W98SE or earlier and fat32, you will need to do something to
get over 137GB as the windows driver will fail and corrupt data once the 137G
point is exceeded.

I think the unix/linux variants will be fine.