Knmoppix 5.01 first impressions

[Achim Nolcken Lohse]

Burned and loaded Knoppix 5.01 today.

It loaded fairly smoothly and quickly on my AMD K6/III 500 with 384MB
of Ram. It took just under 6 minutes to get the 3.5 KDE desktop up and
running.

I did notice that Knoppix mistakenly found and configured a
non-existent Firewire device on my system. It also showed all of my
external storage devices with a USB icon, and failed to identify the
type of media in my USB card reader as a CF card.

Unmounting drives seemed to cause KDE problems. It locked up and
X-Windows had to be restarte twice after trying to unmount a drive
(once on a ZIP100, another on the USB reader).

I discovered that The Gimp can't read Panasonic RAW files (kudos for
Irfanview 3.98, which can).

Since I have Irfanview 3.98 installed on one of the hard drives, I
thought I'd try to run Wine. All I could find was Wine Tools, and so I
went a round with that. After half a dozen "cover my butt" screens,
and several more "explanatory" screens, I was pretty well convinced it
would take a month or so to test the mere possibility of doing this
with Knoppix. Frustrating, because Irfan assures me that some of his
users have run Irfanview successfully under Wine. I'm thinking of
buying into AskSam 6.1 (since there seems to be no comparable
freeware), but am not keen to make myself indefinitely dependent on
Windows - so I need to know whether it can run under Wine.

Other problems. Well, as usual, I couldn't figure out how to get Root
access. Will have to read all the text files, I guess.

All in all, I'd say a worthwhile download. I even managed to burn it
without coasters, carefully avoiding the flakey Deepburner/Imageburn
(I can't figure this one out, I run Deepburner, pick "burn ISO"
option, and up pops a new window called Imageburn). What I do remember
is going this route last time I downloaded Knoppix. I ran the test
option, then repeated it for real. The test ran smoothly, and the
burn, with exactly the same setting burned a coaster!

So now I'm back to using ISO_Burn V1.1.

It's flakey too, if I choose any burn speed but "Max" it starts
propagating an endless stream of "divide by zero" pop-up error
windows, and can only be stopped with the CTL-ALT-Del close program
window. So on Win98SE, "Max" is the only option that works. And since
I'm still using 16X Fuji CDs I get a bit antsy when I see Iso_burn
reporting that it started writing at 24X. But it managed to do the
job, and in under six minutes for 700MB.

 

[John Jay Smith]

Its nice experimenting and learning.. but if you want to do all that
stuff...

install windows or get a mac

OR adjust yourself to what linux can do and do that...

OR wait until a good enough linux comes along that can do everything you
want.
(this will happen)

 

[mike]

(e-mail address removed) (Achim Nolcken Lohse) wrote in

I even managed to burn it
without coasters, carefully avoiding the flakey Deepburner/Imageburn
(I can't figure this one out, I run Deepburner, pick "burn ISO"
option, and up pops a new window called Imageburn). What I do remember
is going this route last time I downloaded Knoppix. I ran the test
option, then repeated it for real. The test ran smoothly, and the
burn, with exactly the same setting burned a coaster!

So now I'm back to using ISO_Burn V1.1.

Have you tried cdfre-tools?

http://www.cdrtfe.de.vu/

I've had problems with deepburner and cdxpburner (ie, producing coasters
when burning linux ISOs,) and this prog has always done the business for
me, even though it's not as pretty as some

mike

 

[Achim Nolcken Lohse]

Its nice experimenting and learning.. but if you want to do all that
stuff...

install windows or get a mac

Well, I've been running Windows steadily since 3.1. If you read my
current posts about Scandisk, you'll see why I'm looking elsewhere
too.

OR adjust yourself to what linux can do and do that...

As I've been trying to communicate, the problem is precisely in
finding out what a given linux distro can and can't do WITHOUT wasting
your time in fruitless experimentation.

OR wait until a good enough linux comes along that can do everything you
want.
(this will happen)

And how will I know this? I've been reading glowing accounts from
utter novices AND hoary Linux afficionados for years. It ALWAYS turns
out to be overblown hype based on limited hardware and software
exposure and wild extrapolation.

 

[John Jay Smith]

ok listen...

I have downloaded and tested all major distros of linux, and many versions
of them.
I have also downloaded and tried other not so well known..

i coul d say i have tested more distros that linux geeks!

The only distro that comes close to windows is linspire
that is not free, but there is another free attempt to this called
freespire. The catch here is that if you want more apps you have to
subscribe to click n run,
an online service.. but it is worth the download of freespire to see how it
is.

this has wine working out of the box... and networking with windows
automatic...

But linux users do not like this.. because they know how to configure
everything
or some geeks like fiddling for endless hours with config files....

I have yet to be able to make my ati dual head card work with both
monitors..
(I have not tried latley to tell you the truth because I started using linux
with virtual machines instead of dual- multibooting)

I have learned to not ask too much from linux at the moment until someone
makes a very good distro. It is possible 100% to do that.
Remember, MAC osx is based on BSD which is also unix....

so it will happen.. all we need is a group of people who can think in a new
way.

 

[Mark Warner]

I have yet to be able to make my ati dual head card work with both
monitors..
(I have not tried latley to tell you the truth because I started
using linux with virtual machines instead of dual- multibooting)

Might give the new SimplyMEPIS 6.0 a spin. Can't speak to ATI, but the
driver install and setup of nVidia TwinView was a simple point 'n' click
operation. SM6 offers ATI drivers as well, and I wouldn't be surprised
if the ATI dual head setup is similarly simple.

If that woks, then Ubuntu might be worth a spin as well, although there
may be some simple configuration required. (SM6 is based on Ubuntu, with
additional "impure" components included.)

 

[John Jay Smith]

I have given up on dualbooting in favor of virtual machines..
and on my other test machines I have one monitor..

I have those distros as virtual machines....

its ok... it was just something I tried doing once upon a time...

Im sure that problem with time will be solved too

 

[Roger Johansson]

an online service.. but it is worth the download of freespire to see how it
is.

this has wine working out of the box... and networking with windows
automatic...

I just downloaded and tried freespire 1.02, but it did not work as a
live-CD,
the computer started windows as usual.

I got the impression from reading about it that it should be a live-CD,
was that wrong or what?

I know there is nothing wrong with my CD-burner-reader, it worked fine
on both knoppix and mepis. The downloaded ISO looks fine too, I can
look inside it with my ISO-reader-unpacker, and I can see the files on
the burned CD.

 

[John Jay Smith]

I am not sure about if freespire is a live cd..

however linspire has a free version that is a live cd and you download it
via torrent.

You have to dig up a bit in the linspire site to find it.. but its there

 

[mike]

(e-mail address removed) (Achim Nolcken Lohse) wrote in

NO, but I did try to download it. The URL didn't work. I tried
changing it to www.cdfre.de and www.cdrfre.de. those didn't work
either.

Unfortunately, my luck with Iso_burner 1.1 didn't hold up. When I
tried to burn the Mepis ISO it, closed down repeatedly. So in
desperation I fell back on Image_Burn. I_B reported the CD was still
good, and I did two test burns at 16X. No problems!

When I checked on this yesterday before posting, I noticed there was a
later version than mine (cdrtfe1.2 pre2.zip - ut the zip is ommitted from
the link). I don't use the Setup file as it works fine as a standalone app,
and saves bothering the windoze registry!

So I downloaded it and it's fine. I just clicked on the links they give and
instantly got my "save as" dialogue. Perhaps I was overloading the server!

You also need cdrtools 2.01 final, and prolly cygwin1.dll 1.5.14, from the
link cdrtools... under "Tools" on the homepage.

It's all abit ugly, as these things tend to be (ever tried installing
Timidity++?), but IME it woorks very well

mike

 

[mike]

Might give the new SimplyMEPIS 6.0 a spin.

I thought you _had_ .

I didn't get to thank you for your advice on changing the bootloader, as I
misunderstood a bit and left "chainloader " and "boot" where they were.

So it was another unbootable PC incident, reinstall of windows to get my
MBR back, which of course trashed Mepis, then for some reason Mepis live
wouldn't run properly, the desktop didn't work, so I had to run minstall
from the file manager (thanks to you again that I could work out how to do
that, and all is well except that my squeaky clean fast w98 has been turned
back into the chubby version)

No big deal, and my own fault, but this sort of thing makes me very wary
about trying to dualboot on my main box ;-)

mike

 

[mike]

(e-mail address removed) (Achim Nolcken Lohse) wrote in

I've been using 98SE for a few years now, and have not had a system
failure yet. So, if it weren't for Microsoft's refusal to provide
security patches for its proprietary code, I'd be prepared to soldier
on or migrate to Win2K.

I have no intention of leaving 98SE for the forseeable future, and I hope I
may migrate to Linux, but my main problem with that is not the OS, but all
the wonderful apps and progs, big and small, bothe those that are
mainstream and those that live in the cracks and make everything so much
easier.

I think it takes a system that's been around as long as Windoze, or DOS to
have such a catalogue, going back to stuff like skyglobe, cakewalk
express...

mike

 

[Roger Johansson]

You are wrong.. it is ALSO a live cd.
You did not burn it correctly no doubt...
I just tested it and it is working as a live cd.

After you boot with the cd it gives you some options that you select using
your keyboard.

http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/1771/freespire1rh4.jpg
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/6676/freespire2xx7.jpg

Thanks. I can see that a folder called boot.images is missing on the
burnt CD.
I tried burning it again now and this time told Nero to verify the CD
after burning, it verified it as correct. But the new CD is still
missing this folder, so this is really a strange mystery.

I'll download a new copy of freespire and compare it, maybe see if I
can find some checksum and check it.

At least I know now that it should work as a live CD so I can search
for where the fault is.

 

[Mark Warner]

So it was another unbootable PC incident, reinstall of windows to get my
MBR back,

For future reference: you could have booted to the MEPIS Live CD,
clicked on the Install Me icon, then chosen the Repair Grub function.
That would have put the bootloader back in it's post-MEPIS-install state
(before you got to mucking around), and everything should have been fine.

Alternatively, you could have accessed the forked /boot/grub/menu.lst
file while running the Live CD and made the repairs directly. Assuming,
of course, you knew where you'd screwed up. :O)

No big deal, and my own fault, but this sort of thing makes me very wary
about trying to dualboot on my main box ;-)

Keep it up, installing, breaking, and learning, I mean. You didn't learn
what you know about Windows overnight.

 

[mike]

For future reference: you could have booted to the MEPIS Live CD,
clicked on the Install Me icon, then chosen the Repair Grub function.

I didn't know about the option, but anyhow I had no icons on a plain red
background - I tried all install options and another CD, with the same
result, but the live CD had run perfectly - once!

I was invited to send KDE a bug report, but if they'd been told what I was
installing on they'd have told me to hop it!

Alternatively, you could have accessed the forked /boot/grub/menu.lst
file while running the Live CD and made the repairs directly.
Assuming, of course, you knew where you'd screwed up. :O)

Oh, yes; I wasn't sure if the last line in each section belonged to the OS
in question or to the bootloader, so instead of enquiring further (Mumsy
told me never to speak until spoken to) I decided to take the plun

Keep it up, installing, breaking, and learning, I mean. You didn't
learn what you know about Windows overnight.

I will (but not my lovely main box istallation, yet) ;-)

mike

 

[Roger Johansson]

Downloaded a new copy from another source, and it was identical, byte
for byte, with the first.

Forgive me for asking, but you are burning the .iso file as an image
file (as opposed to a data file) aren't you?

I am well aware of the difference between burning an iso image to a CD
and copying the iso file to CD as a file.

I tried installing another burner program, Deepburner Pro, free for use
for one month.

It burnt the iso file correctly to CD with the same result as Nero, the
boot.images folder is missing in the burnt CD.

So I have burned 3 CDs as it shall be done, with two different
programs.

So this is still a mystery. For some reason the folder boot.images is
not written to the CD and the result is not bootable. This folder
contains a 2048 byte file called no_emul.

I have burnt a lot of CDs before, both bootable from an iso and data
files, with the same CD burner and the same empty disks, 700MB 52X, and
I cannot remember when it failed the last time.

I just used the last of that kind of empty disks, so I have to buy more
to continue the experiments.

 

[John Jay Smith]

perhaps that iso is not the correct one?

When you burn an ISO parts of it cannot be left out...

 

[Roger Johansson]

perhaps that iso is not the correct one?

There must be something wrong with the iso file, it does not have an
autorun.inf which most boot CDs have.

I downloaded it twice from different sources, and compared them byte
for byte and they are identical, but my guess is that both are faulty.
freespire_1.0.2.iso is the name

When you burn an ISO parts of it cannot be left out...

I think I have solved that problem. When looking at other burnt CDs
with explorer or my file manager the folder boot.images is invisible
for some reason.

So it is probably there, I just can't see it, even though both file
managers are set to show hidden and system files.

Conclusion, the freespire_1.0.2.iso that is available right now on the
web is faulty, or incompatible with my CD-unit somehow.

There is a slight delay when booting, the computer looks at the CD, but
decides to ignore it and boots into windows as usual.

 

[Achim Nolcken Lohse]

(e-mail address removed) (Achim Nolcken Lohse) wrote in

When I checked on this yesterday before posting, I noticed there was a
later version than mine (cdrtfe1.2 pre2.zip - ut the zip is ommitted from
the link). I don't use the Setup file as it works fine as a standalone app,
and saves bothering the windoze registry!

So I downloaded it and it's fine. I just clicked on the links they give and
instantly got my "save as" dialogue. Perhaps I was overloading the server!

You also need cdrtools 2.01 final, and prolly cygwin1.dll 1.5.14, from the
link cdrtools... under "Tools" on the homepage.

I couldn't even connect to the page you cite. Sure you go the URL
typed out right?

It's all abit ugly, as these things tend to be (ever tried installing
Timidity++?), but IME it woorks very well

"a bit"? Ouch! Is this the same outfit that produced the K3b burner
software in KDE? I f so, I'd better give it a pass. It doesn't seem to
like my drives.

 

[Roger Johansson]

I just tried the freespire CD in an older computer, and it actually
booted and runs from the CD, although very slowly. So there is nothing
wrong with the burning of the ISO.

It is a compac 6000, with 300mhz cpu and 168mb memory so it will
probably take hours for it to get anywhere on that machine. I watched
it for 10 minutes before I gave up. I left it running and will check on
it the next time I go to the kitchen.

(Knoppix runs nicely on that machine, by the way.)

Conclusion; my regular computer has a built in filter against stupid
linux versions, it simply refuses to boot them.

I have 2 CD burners-readers on it and both refuse to boot freespire, so
it is not the CD units, it is the computer that does not accept it.

It has no problems with Mepis, Knoppix and many other boot-CDs.

It is just Freespire it doesn't like.