Keyboard burning through batteries

W

WVMontani

I have a Microsoft wireless keyboard 6000 v3.0

Starting about two weeks ago, it started consuming batteries at at a very high rate. Where previously a set of batteries might last several months, now it uses up a set of batteries in a single day!

Any thoughts?
 
D

David H. Lipman

From: "WVMontani said:
I have a Microsoft wireless keyboard 6000 v3.0

Starting about two weeks ago, it started consuming batteries at at a very high rate.
Where previously a set of batteries might last several months, now it uses up a set of
batteries in a single day!

Any thoughts?

Use Litium batteries, not Alkaline.
 
W

WVMontani

From: "WVMontani" <wvmon***@ya***.com>








Use Litium batteries, not Alkaline.





--

Dave

Multi-AV Scanning Tool - http://multi-av.thespykiller.co.uk

http://www.pctipp.ch/downloads/dl/35905.asp

I've been using Duracell "Coppertop" Alkalines for years. That's not the problem. It just recently started doing this. I have the latest drivers but I wonder if something isn't letting the keyboard go to sleep after a periodof non-use. I cannot find any power settings for the KB.
 
D

David H. Lipman

From: "WVMontani said:
I've been using Duracell "Coppertop" Alkalines for years. That's not the problem. It
just
recently started doing this. I have the latest drivers but I wonder if something isn't
letting the keyboard go to sleep after a period of non-use. I cannot find any power
settings for the KB.


So ? How is this a Windows XP issue ?

Use Litium batteries, not Alkaline. Lithium batteries last longer.
 
B

Bob F

WVMontani said:
I have a Microsoft wireless keyboard 6000 v3.0

Starting about two weeks ago, it started consuming batteries at at a
very high rate. Where previously a set of batteries might last
several months, now it uses up a set of batteries in a single day!

Any thoughts?

The hardware is dying. Could be bad capacitors, in which case replacing them
could fix it. Otherwise, replace it.
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

David H. Lipman said:
So ? How is this a Windows XP issue ?

It isn't really (_unless_ it's a new-driver problem, which I think is
unlikely) ...
Use Litium batteries, not Alkaline. Lithium batteries last longer.
.... but that's no good as an answer to the question (which was "why has
it just started doing this"). Not to mention that "lithium" cells are
_far_ more expensive than alkalines; I'd only use them where the
capacity is really needed, such as polar expeditions and the like, or
the long shelf life is, such as an emergency torch (US: "flashlight")
(and probably not even there). I'm moving towards long-retention NiMH
cells for most things.

As for the rogue keyboard! I don't suppose it has any lights on it that
you're turning on? The only other thing I can think of is a hardware
malfunction - one of the switch contacts becoming intermittent would
make it seem a key was being pressed often enough to keep it out of
hibernation. Normally you'd detect that as unwanted keypresses, but
maybe not if it's something like shift alt or control. Perhaps use one
of those utilities (maybe even a typing tutor?) that draw a keyboard on
screen and show you which keys are being pressed, to see if this is the
problem. Other possibilities - some new vibration that's having the same
effect, or possibly some local transmitter - from mobile 'phone (or
similar), to a new security camera (yours or a neighbour's), or an
arcing contact in something - that's getting into either they keyboard
itself or the little receiver dongle.

Or you've left the "pairing" switch on the keyboard, if it has one, in
the wrong position. (But I'm not sure it'd work as a keyboard if you've
done that.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The death of democracy is not likely to be an assassination from ambush.
It will be a slow extinction from apathy, indifference, and undernourishment.
-Robert Maynard Hutchins, educator (1899-1977)
 
C

Chris S.

Bob F said:
The hardware is dying. Could be bad capacitors, in which case replacing
them could fix it. Otherwise, replace it.

Indeed. Bob is correct. Something in the KB is drawing too much current.
Bad capacitor(s) is a prime suspect.

Chris
 
T

Todd

I have a Microsoft wireless keyboard 6000 v3.0

Starting about two weeks ago, it started consuming batteries at at a very high rate. Where previously a set of batteries might last several months, now it uses up a set of batteries in a single day!

Any thoughts?

Hi WV,

It might be your batteries. Where did you buy them
from?

Had a similar problem with a wireless mouse. I was buying
alkaline batteries from Wal Mart. Figured I was safe
buying brand name batteries. They lasted about a week.
And their "Use By" dates were several years out.

I worked for a company that did business with Wal Mart.
They screw their vendors. So, Walt Mart gets a lot
of back door and almost rejects because of their
attitude to their suppliers.

I switch to Raley's for batteries. Alkaline (store
brand and name brand) lasts about 1-1/2 months.
Lithium lasts a little over 3 months.

If not your batteries, it may be time to get a new
keyboard.

-T

p.s. there are only three manufacturers of batteries
world wide, so buy the store brand -- they are
cheaper and all made by a brand name.
 
D

David H. Lipman

From: "Chris S. said:
Indeed. Bob is correct. Something in the KB is drawing too much current.
Bad capacitor(s) is a prime suspect.

Chris


Yep, I'd go with that as well.
 
D

David H. Lipman

From: "Todd said:
Hi WV,

It might be your batteries. Where did you buy them
from?

Had a similar problem with a wireless mouse. I was buying
alkaline batteries from Wal Mart. Figured I was safe
buying brand name batteries. They lasted about a week.
And their "Use By" dates were several years out.

I worked for a company that did business with Wal Mart.
They screw their vendors. So, Walt Mart gets a lot
of back door and almost rejects because of their
attitude to their suppliers.

I switch to Raley's for batteries. Alkaline (store
brand and name brand) lasts about 1-1/2 months.
Lithium lasts a little over 3 months.

If not your batteries, it may be time to get a new
keyboard.

-T

p.s. there are only three manufacturers of batteries
world wide, so buy the store brand -- they are
cheaper and all made by a brand name.

Alkalines have been tested and they all have the same life +/- 5%. Not much of a
difference to buy a big name with higher cost and ones that are no name like supermarket
brands so they will work just as well.

The ONLY device I have found that Lithium batteries can't replace Alkalines in are
filament based flashlights. They burn the filament hotter so the filament can break
easier or burn out quicker. Otherwise Lithium AA, AAA and 9v are the way to go.
 
P

Paul

David said:
Yep, I'd go with that as well.

Only certain kinds of capacitors are prone to chemical (corrosion)
failure. Not all electronics need be that flaky. For example,
ceramic caps have no liquid in them, so no pH to worry about.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague

In the example here, the casing type is meant to look like a
Polymer cap. This is to fool the observer into thinking the caps
are not the bad type. Yet, the pressure relief stamping in the top
says they're electrolytic. And if any leakage is noted, that
proves they have the bad electrolyte in them. A good electrolytic
can last for fifteen years before the rubber plug in the bottom
cracks and the electrolyte dries out. If the caps don't have the
pressure relief seams, they're more likely to be polymer type.
Or, they could be a ticking time bomb :) The pressure relief
seam is for safety, when a liquid electrolyte is used instead
of a polymer. Electrolytics could explode from overpressure, if
it wasn't for that seam. So if a manufacturer wished to hide
the internal composition, the manufacturer could remove the
seam in the top. Depends on the ethics of the manufacturer in China
as to whether this would happen or not. If you've ever seen
an electrolytic explode (even with the seam in place!), you'll
get some idea what a mess it makes. You can make an electrolytic
explode, simply by reversing the polarity - a trick done by
students to one another in university electronics labs :-(

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...d.jpg/567px-Blown_capacitor_on_video_card.jpg

You could take the bottom cover off the keyboard and do a visual
inspection. My current keyboard makes that easy. I also have an
old Apple keyboard, with steel rivets used to hold portions of
it together, and you cannot do much with that. Your keyboard
could be somewhere in between those two extremes. At most,
there would be one electrolytic in it, to reduce battery
impedance. Or, there might be none at all, shooting this
"failed capacitor" theory down.

*******

It's possible the communications on the keyboard are bidirectional.
It transits and receives. On the transmit side, the electronics
are clever enough to power down after a character is sent. On
the receive side, if the keyboard is designed to receive things
such a "turn LED on" commands, the receiver could be burning power
if the environment around the keyboard is filled with 3GHz modulation.
To test for that, you'd need a "controlled environment" for the
keyboard and USB keyboard dongle on the other end. And that's just
a little too hard to do properly.

If you recently purchased a new wireless router or other wireless
hardware, a new long range Bluetooth device, try turning those
off and retesting keyboard battery life.

You could accelerate the testing process, if you could monitor
battery current flow in the keyboard. If you had that capability,
it would be easier to walk around the room, turn off Wifi stuff,
then see if the battery current flow in the keyboard dropped or not.
That's faster than spending days seeing if the battery drain has stopped.
A cheap home multimeter can measure current flow (uses a series connected
shunt), so that's one way to do some monitoring. The shunt can be
left in place and the meter turned off and the keyboard would still
work. You only need to turn on the multimeter when making a reading.

Paul
 
B

Buffalo

"David H. Lipman" wrote in message news:[email protected]...
Alkalines have been tested and they all have the same life +/- 5%. Not
much of a difference to buy a big name with higher cost and ones that are
no name like supermarket brands so they will work just as well.

The ONLY device I have found that Lithium batteries can't replace Alkalines
in are filament based flashlights. They burn the filament hotter so the
filament can break easier or burn out quicker. Otherwise Lithium AA, AAA
and 9v are the way to go.
If they burn the filament hotter, then they have to put out a higher voltage
than the alkalines do, or is there another theory?
Thanks,
 
T

Todd

"David H. Lipman" wrote in message news:[email protected]...
If they burn the filament hotter, then they have to put out a higher
voltage than the alkalines do, or is there another theory?
Thanks,

Hi Buffalo,

I have a Bachelor of Science in Electrical Engineering,
Cum Laude. Not bragging; just letting you know my creds.

David's observation is a good one. The Voltage does not
"Sag" as fast with the Lithium and would wear out the
filament faster.

Love LED flashlights. Have a 3 AA cell, all plastic one
from C-Crane that I use inside computer cases, etc., as
I am not worried about metal parts shorting anything out.

-T
 
A

Andy

From: "Todd" <[email protected]>


















Alkalines have been tested and they all have the same life +/- 5%. Not much of a

difference to buy a big name with higher cost and ones that are no name like supermarket

brands so they will work just as well.



The ONLY device I have found that Lithium batteries can't replace Alkalines in are

filament based flashlights. They burn the filament hotter so the filament can break

easier or burn out quicker. Otherwise Lithium AA, AAA and 9v are the way to go.





--

Dave

Multi-AV Scanning Tool - http://multi-av.thespykiller.co.uk

http://www.pctipp.ch/downloads/dl/35905.asp

I have to disagree with the advice about generics being the same.

I bought PowerMax batteries from a CV* pharmacy.

They leaked and ruined a flashlight.

I eventually got $15 for a flashlight and time spent trying to neutralize the acid.

Battery holder was ruined beyond repair.

Andy
 
T

Todd

Alkalines have been tested and they all have the same life +/- 5%. Not much of a
difference to buy a big name with higher cost and ones that are no name like supermarket
brands so they will work just as well.

Makes sense. They are all made by the same three manufacturers.
The ONLY device I have found that Lithium batteries can't replace Alkalines in are
filament based flashlights. They burn the filament hotter so the filament can break
easier or burn out quicker. Otherwise Lithium AA, AAA and 9v are the way to go.

Here is a tip. If you are a reseller or know someone how
has an account with D&H Distributors, they sell Lithiums
at a good wholesale price. Retails store mark them
up through the roof. But, you have to buy the 6 packages
(2 or 4 per pack) at a time. On the bright side, they
have incredible shelf lives. (I buy mine though D&H
when I have a big order and don't have to pay shipping.
I have a Nevada resale license. The use tax on them
is minor for resellers.)

-T
 
T

Todd

I have to disagree with the advice about generics being the same.

I bought PowerMax batteries from a CV* pharmacy.

They leaked and ruined a flashlight.

I eventually got $15 for a flashlight and time spent trying to neutralize the acid.

Battery holder was ruined beyond repair.

Andy

Add CV* Pharmacy to the exclude list, along with Walmart!
They must have got a good back door deal.

I like Raley's generics. A lot of my customers get
CostCo generic. I not so sure on those.
 
K

Ken Blake, MVP

p.s. there are only three manufacturers of batteries
world wide, so buy the store brand -- they are
cheaper and all made by a brand name.


If there are only three manufacturers, that's the first time I've
heard that. What are the names of the three manufacturers? Do you have
a web citation for that?
 
B

Buffalo

"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote in message
It isn't really (_unless_ it's a new-driver problem, which I think is
unlikely) ...
... but that's no good as an answer to the question (which was "why has it
just started doing this"). Not to mention that "lithium" cells are _far_
more expensive than alkalines; I'd only use them where the capacity is
really needed, such as polar expeditions and the like, or the long shelf
life is, such as an emergency torch (US: "flashlight") (and probably not
even there). I'm moving towards long-retention NiMH cells for most things.

As for the rogue keyboard! I don't suppose it has any lights on it that
you're turning on? The only other thing I can think of is a hardware
malfunction - one of the switch contacts becoming intermittent would make
it seem a key was being pressed often enough to keep it out of hibernation.
Normally you'd detect that as unwanted keypresses, but maybe not if it's
something like shift alt or control. Perhaps use one of those utilities
(maybe even a typing tutor?) that draw a keyboard on screen and show you
which keys are being pressed, to see if this is the problem. Other
possibilities - some new vibration that's having the same effect, or
possibly some local transmitter - from mobile 'phone (or similar), to a new
security camera (yours or a neighbour's), or an arcing contact in
something - that's getting into either they keyboard itself or the little
receiver dongle.

Or you've left the "pairing" switch on the keyboard, if it has one, in the
wrong position. (But I'm not sure it'd work as a keyboard if you've done
that.)

Nice out of the box thinking. :)
Thanks,
 
B

Buffalo

"Todd" wrote in message news:[email protected]...
Hi Buffalo,

I have a Bachelor of Science in Electrical Engineering,
Cum Laude. Not bragging; just letting you know my creds.

David's observation is a good one. The Voltage does not
"Sag" as fast with the Lithium and would wear out the
filament faster.

Love LED flashlights. Have a 3 AA cell, all plastic one
from C-Crane that I use inside computer cases, etc., as
I am not worried about metal parts shorting anything out.

-T
"Todd" wrote in message news:[email protected]...
Hi Buffalo,

I have a Bachelor of Science in Electrical Engineering,
Cum Laude. Not bragging; just letting you know my creds.

David's observation is a good one. The Voltage does not
"Sag" as fast with the Lithium and would wear out the
filament faster.

Love LED flashlights. Have a 3 AA cell, all plastic one
from C-Crane that I use inside computer cases, etc., as
I am not worried about metal parts shorting anything out.

-T
Basically the only way a filament will be hotter is if there is an increase
in voltage.
Since Lithium batteries keep their peak voltage until just before they quit,
your point has 'some' merit.
It you keep the batteries fresh, than the only way the bulb filament would
burn out quicker is if the applied voltage was increased.
SO, what is the voltage of a li battery compared to an Alkaline bat of the
same published voltage rating?
 

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