Is original Samsung laser cartridge designed to fail quickly?

[David Peters]

Following soem recent threads about Samsung lasers ...

The Samsung ML-1510 desktop laser printer takes the same toner
cartridge as the old ML-1710, ML-1750, ML-1210, etc.

I bought an ML-1510 here in the UK about two years ago. Of course,
the original 'starter' toner cartridge is only partially filled.
I've filled it once since then and already I'm now getting poor
results of lighter printing on one side of the page.

I've printed 2,500 sheets in total and almost all my printed pages
are text. Sometimes I use 'toner saver' and sometimes not.

I've taken various remedial the actions including:
shaking the toner to redistribute it,
emptying the old toner out and filling with new toner,
printing a "cleaning sheet" of paper,
very gently wiping the roller,
etc.

I know that a laser toner cartridge has a finite life. Some people
say it will not last much longer than three refills (on my printer
each full refill should give approx 3,000 pages). But I have not
reached anywhere near that point yet!

In your experience, is it true that the supplied 'trial' toner
cartridge which comes with a Samsung ML-1510 desktop laser is built
to be INFERIOR and WEAR OUT FASTER than the "proper" Samsung
replacement cartridges?

A vendor told me to buy a brand-new genuine Samsung cartridge (at
about £50 - which is what I paid for the printer). He said I could
expect a longer life from refilling that one than refilling the
original 'trial' cartridge.

Does anyone have any more info about any of this?

 

[Dr Teeth]

I was just thinking how wonderful life was, when David Peters

Does anyone have any more info about any of this?

IIRC it is something to do with where the *waste* toner accumulates in
the cartridge.

--
Cheers,

Guy

** Stress - the condition brought about by having to
** resist the temptation to beat the living daylights
** out of someone who richly deserves it.

 

[kony]

Following soem recent threads about Samsung lasers ...

The Samsung ML-1510 desktop laser printer takes the same toner
cartridge as the old ML-1710, ML-1750, ML-1210, etc.

I bought an ML-1510 here in the UK about two years ago. Of course,
the original 'starter' toner cartridge is only partially filled.
I've filled it once since then and already I'm now getting poor
results of lighter printing on one side of the page.

I've printed 2,500 sheets in total and almost all my printed pages
are text. Sometimes I use 'toner saver' and sometimes not.

I've taken various remedial the actions including:
shaking the toner to redistribute it,
emptying the old toner out and filling with new toner,
printing a "cleaning sheet" of paper,
very gently wiping the roller,
etc.

I know that a laser toner cartridge has a finite life. Some people
say it will not last much longer than three refills (on my printer
each full refill should give approx 3,000 pages). But I have not
reached anywhere near that point yet!

In your experience, is it true that the supplied 'trial' toner
cartridge which comes with a Samsung ML-1510 desktop laser is built
to be INFERIOR and WEAR OUT FASTER than the "proper" Samsung
replacement cartridges?

A vendor told me to buy a brand-new genuine Samsung cartridge (at
about £50 - which is what I paid for the printer). He said I could
expect a longer life from refilling that one than refilling the
original 'trial' cartridge.

Does anyone have any more info about any of this?

Is it possible the toner you used to refill is not
appropriate for the printer?

I've refilled cartridges for years and usually when a drum
is going bad, it will have spots gone, for example in a
continuous greytone or black field. Also a visual
inspection shows the surface irregularities on the drum,
they're fairly easy to see. What I'm suggesting is that
unless there is some reclaimed toner clogging it up, what
else would be left except the drum-toner adhesion?

 

[Davy]

I have a ML1510 and refilled mine three times to date, have a look a
-

http://www.refilltoner.com/howto.htm and you'll find how its done
you can re-fill them until the OPC drum wears out

The idea you don't get a full toner is so that you'll rush out and bu
another, sometimes known as starter packs

One sure sign the OPC is worn is greyness in the prints but do mak
sure it's not due to an empty toner, sometimes holding a newspape
over the open end and shaking several times will loosen the toner an
effect a cure if the toner is running out

Only the other week I was looking at a site that actually sold the OP
drum for this model for about £14.00 (UK)

Wonder what sort of mess I'll make tryin', give the missus a tenner
send er out shoppin' and then have a bash..

Dav

 

[GB]

Following soem recent threads about Samsung lasers ...

The Samsung ML-1510 desktop laser printer takes the same toner
cartridge as the old ML-1710, ML-1750, ML-1210, etc.

I bought an ML-1510 here in the UK about two years ago. Of course,
the original 'starter' toner cartridge is only partially filled.
I've filled it once since then and already I'm now getting poor
results of lighter printing on one side of the page.

Give the cartridge a good shake, in case the toner has all accumulated on
one side.

I find it hard to believe that starter cartridges are made to fail early
because of the extra cost of manufacturing two lines of cartridges. However,
if you look on the consumablecafe website, they say this:

Although you can refill a starter cartridge (the one which comes free with
the printer) we tend not to recommend it only because they are only designed
to print 1000 pages before failing whereas a genuine or remanufactured toner
cartridge should be able to be refilled between 3-6 times (18,000+ sheets)
or even more than this if you take the time to clean it each time.

 

[Guest]

|
| Give the cartridge a good shake, in case the toner has all accumulated on
| one side.
|
| I find it hard to believe that starter cartridges are made to fail early
| because of the extra cost of manufacturing two lines of cartridges.
However,
| if you look on the consumablecafe website, they say this:
|
| Although you can refill a starter cartridge (the one which comes free with
| the printer) we tend not to recommend it only because they are only
designed
| to print 1000 pages before failing whereas a genuine or remanufactured
toner
| cartridge should be able to be refilled between 3-6 times (18,000+ sheets)
| or even more than this if you take the time to clean it each time.
|
|

I have had a number of Samsung Laser printers currently using a SCX-4100
It behaved as all the previous printers started printing on the starter
cartridge with the output faint on the right hand side. Tried shaking to
redistribute the toner no difference, opened up and found small amount of
toner present enough to provide correct output. Filled with the correct
toner guess what absolutely no difference with a full cartridge still
printing faint on the right hand side.
Obtained a brand new cartridge and it is significantly different in size to
the starter cartridge so they do manufacture in the case of the scx-4100 2
cartridges.
In future I would not waste my time filling a Samsung starter cartridge I do
believe they are manufactured for a short life.
With this in mind the main reason for buying in the first place is no longer
valid (being able to refill the as supplied cartridge) as they in my opinion
want silly prices for remanufactured toner cartridges and the price of the
original printer for a new cartridge.
My next purchase will not be a Samsung and my selection will be based on the
ability to refill from the as purchased printer cartridge.

No doubt someone will post they have refilled a starter cartridge and it
works but this will be the exception to the rule.

 

[JP]

|
| Give the cartridge a good shake, in case the toner has all accumulated
on
| one side.
|
| I find it hard to believe that starter cartridges are made to fail early
| because of the extra cost of manufacturing two lines of cartridges.
However,
| if you look on the consumablecafe website, they say this:
|
| Although you can refill a starter cartridge (the one which comes free
with
| the printer) we tend not to recommend it only because they are only
designed
| to print 1000 pages before failing whereas a genuine or remanufactured
toner
| cartridge should be able to be refilled between 3-6 times (18,000+
sheets)
| or even more than this if you take the time to clean it each time.
|
|

I have had a number of Samsung Laser printers currently using a SCX-4100
It behaved as all the previous printers started printing on the starter
cartridge with the output faint on the right hand side. Tried shaking to
redistribute the toner no difference, opened up and found small amount of
toner present enough to provide correct output. Filled with the correct
toner guess what absolutely no difference with a full cartridge still
printing faint on the right hand side.
Obtained a brand new cartridge and it is significantly different in size
to
the starter cartridge so they do manufacture in the case of the scx-4100 2
cartridges.
In future I would not waste my time filling a Samsung starter cartridge I
do
believe they are manufactured for a short life.
With this in mind the main reason for buying in the first place is no
longer
valid (being able to refill the as supplied cartridge) as they in my
opinion
want silly prices for remanufactured toner cartridges and the price of the
original printer for a new cartridge.
My next purchase will not be a Samsung and my selection will be based on
the
ability to refill from the as purchased printer cartridge.

No doubt someone will post they have refilled a starter cartridge and it
works but this will be the exception to the rule.

Thank you.
I´ve warned people for years about buying the cheap Samsung and the true
life-time costs.
At last lots of positive proof of this folly.
Oki is what I´ve recommended for medium capacity users.

 

[GB]

Thank you.
I´ve warned people for years about buying the cheap Samsung and the true
life-time costs.
At last lots of positive proof of this folly.
Oki is what I´ve recommended for medium capacity users.

I bought one of the cheap Samsungs as a spare, in case one of the main
office lasers broke down at some inconvenient moment. It has done that job
admirably, as it has never been used. )

My thoughts on cost are:

Buy printer for GBP 50
New cartridge for GBP 50

Together they should give you 4000 pages. (That's 2.5p per page)

Then buy 3 refill toners for around GBP20.
That should give you another 9000 pages.

So, that's a total of GBP 120 for 13000 pages (just less than 1p per page
including the initial purchase price of the printer).

If you want to, you can repeat the cycle with a new cartridge and 3 refill
toners for GBP 70, giving you 12000 pages at just 0.6p per page.

I imagine that by then you will need a new printer, but that's still pretty
cheap. The Samsungs are only economic if you refill the cartridges (or if
like me you don't use them).

I imagine that the Okis you have in mind are better printers. How do the
costings compare?

 

[David Peters]

I have had a number of Samsung Laser printers currently using a
SCX-4100 It behaved as all the previous printers started
printing on the starter cartridge with the output faint on the
right hand side. Tried shaking to redistribute the toner no
difference, opened up and found small amount of toner present
enough to provide correct output. Filled with the correct toner
guess what absolutely no difference with a full cartridge still
printing faint on the right hand side.

Obtained a brand new cartridge and it is significantly different
in size to the starter cartridge so they do manufacture in the
case of the scx-4100 2 cartridges.

In future I would not waste my time filling a Samsung starter
cartridge I do believe they are manufactured for a short life.
With this in mind the main reason for buying in the first place
is no longer valid (being able to refill the as supplied
cartridge) as they in my opinion want silly prices for
remanufactured toner cartridges and the price of the original
printer for a new cartridge.

I think you have hit the nail on the head with Samsung. I can't see
why I should fork out £50 for a decent Samsung cartridge in addition
to my £50 for the printer. The bargain £50 I paid suddenly turns
into £100.

Maybe the desktop Samsung ML-1510 (and similar models) are worth £100
but I would guess that the alternatives are quite possibly more
competitive.

Does anyone have any recommended home/small office mono laser
printers which are good for refilling?

 

[David Peters]

Iïve warned people for years about buying the cheap Samsung and
the true life-time costs.
At last lots of positive proof of this folly.
Oki is what Iïve recommended for medium capacity users.

Which model Oki's do you recommended?

I would like to get a small mono laser.

I print 150 to 250 pages a month.

 

[JP]

I bought one of the cheap Samsungs as a spare, in case one of the main
office lasers broke down at some inconvenient moment. It has done that job
admirably, as it has never been used. )

My thoughts on cost are:

Buy printer for GBP 50
New cartridge for GBP 50

Together they should give you 4000 pages. (That's 2.5p per page)

Then buy 3 refill toners for around GBP20.
That should give you another 9000 pages.

So, that's a total of GBP 120 for 13000 pages (just less than 1p per page
including the initial purchase price of the printer).

If you want to, you can repeat the cycle with a new cartridge and 3 refill
toners for GBP 70, giving you 12000 pages at just 0.6p per page.

I imagine that by then you will need a new printer, but that's still
pretty cheap. The Samsungs are only economic if you refill the cartridges
(or if like me you don't use them).

I imagine that the Okis you have in mind are better printers. How do the
costings compare?

Please re read the whole thread, your maths are way out as is your
assumptions on refills.
This subject has been done to death on this NG consuk dis&b.
You can google for the past threads on this subject.

 

[GB]

Please re read the whole thread, your maths are way out as is your
assumptions on refills.

No, my maths is not way out. My assumptions about refills are spot on, so
what are you on about?

This subject has been done to death on this NG consuk dis&b.

can you expand that into an actual NG name please?

You can google for the past threads on this subject.

Will do if you give the NG name

 

[GB]

Please re read the whole thread, your maths are way out as is your
assumptions on refills.

Like I said, that's not correct.

This subject has been done to death on this NG consuk dis&b.
You can google for the past threads on this subject.

Ok, found it now.

http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?s...s=GGLD,GGLD:2004-22,GGLD:en&q=samsung+refills

First thread in list involves you arguing against everyone else, telling
everyone else that there numbers are wrong, but absolutely failing to come
up with any numbers yourself. Sigh. Nothing has changed then.

If we simplify this, the samsung will give you prints for about 2p to 3p per
page if you don't refill or about 1p per page if you do refill. If you
disagree then actually put some figures together. In particular, please show
some comparison figures for your beloved okis.

 

[Jon D]

Will do if you give the NG name

JP's somewhat unnecessarily cryptic acronym ("NG consuk dis&b")
refers to the following newsgroup:

alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains


I suspect JP is referring to threads in that group like these:

(1) http://tinyurl.com/nty4n
(2) http://snipurl.com/n6bv
(3) http://snipurl.com/n6bw
(4) http://tinyurl.com/syno4
(5) http://snipurl.com/n6bz
(6) http://snipurl.com/n6c0
etc etc

See those full threads not just the individual postings linked
above.

 

[Jon D]

I have a ML1510 and refilled mine three times to date, have a
look at -:

At what?

 

[Jon D]

I have a ML1510 and refilled mine three times to date, have a
look at -:

http://www.refilltoner.com/howto.htm and you'll find how its
done, you can re-fill them until the OPC drum wears out.

The idea you don't get a full toner is so that you'll rush out
and buy another, sometimes known as starter packs.

One sure sign the OPC is worn is greyness in the prints but do
make sure it's not due to an empty toner, sometimes holding a
newspaper over the open end and shaking several times will
loosen the toner and effect a cure if the toner is running out.

Only the other week I was looking at a site that actually sold
the OPC drum for this model for about £14.00 (UK).

Which site was that? I'd be interested to know!

 

[GB]

JP's somewhat unnecessarily cryptic acronym ("NG consuk dis&b")
refers to the following newsgroup:

alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains

I did eventually work it out.

I suspect JP is referring to threads in that group like these:

(1) http://tinyurl.com/nty4n
(2) http://snipurl.com/n6bv
(3) http://snipurl.com/n6bw
(4) http://tinyurl.com/syno4
(5) http://snipurl.com/n6bz
(6) http://snipurl.com/n6c0
etc etc

I actually contributed to some of those threads.

However, in none of those threads is there a carefully worked out cost per
print for the Oki printers. I fully accept that Oki are far more
professional than Samsung, and their printers are much better. (I use one of
their colour ones.) However, it's not at all clear from those threads what
the cost of say 5 years printing with an oki is, allowing for reasonable
usage and amortising the cost of the printer. I am pretty sure the Samsung
is much cheaper, but with JP's disdainful comments that my figures are all
wrong and I should Google, we are none of us the wiser.

 

[kony]

However, in none of those threads is there a carefully worked out cost per
print for the Oki printers. I fully accept that Oki are far more
professional than Samsung, and their printers are much better. (I use one of
their colour ones.) However, it's not at all clear from those threads what
the cost of say 5 years printing with an oki is, allowing for reasonable
usage and amortising the cost of the printer. I am pretty sure the Samsung
is much cheaper, but with JP's disdainful comments that my figures are all
wrong and I should Google, we are none of us the wiser.

The lower-end Samsungs are cheap and cheaply made printers.
This should most significantly impact someone wanting to use
it long term or for high duty cycles.

I really have no idea what this thread is about, it makes no
sense at all. You can get one of the samsung printers
similar enough (say the 1710 or 1740 last year or the 2010
today) for about $50 after rebate. So the original toner
cartridge doesn't last, so what? It's a $50 printer, what
did anyone want? There are new replacement cartridges all
over for about $75 delivered, for example,
http://www.neutronexpress.com/prod.cfm/330337/SAMSUNG/ML1710D3/SAMSUNG_TONER_CARTRIDGE_BLACK

So even ignoring the starter cart, $125 isn't bad for
someone seeking to refill the cartridges themselves. Bulk
toner costs thereafter should be about the same as for other
makes. The main issues remaining might be that the smaller
drum will inherantly wear out faster (all else being equal)
than on a larger printer, and it will have to be refilled
more often. Cost per page is not going to be all that
significant in such a scenario, someone buying a $50 printer
should not be expecting to print enough pages that the cost
will ever amount to much.

 

[Mike Redrobe]

However, in none of those threads is there a carefully worked out
cost per print for the Oki printers.

Ok, here's a a quick costing for both, ignoring refills,
and including the initial cost of the printers:

Oki B4100 printer £80 (2500pages)
Oki B4100 cartridge £20 (2500pages)

2.5p per page for the first 5000 pages
1.3p per page for 10,000 pages
0.8p for 50,000 pages

Samsung 1510 £50 (1000)
Samsung cartridge £40 (3000)

2.5p per page for the first 4000 pages
1.7p per page for 10,000 pages
1.3p per 50,000

Allowing refills means you can cut the samsung's costs in half,
which will be under 1p a page for most people.

 

[Ian Bell]

Ok, here's a a quick costing for both, ignoring refills,
and including the initial cost of the printers:

Oki B4100 printer £80 (2500pages)
Oki B4100 cartridge £20 (2500pages)

2.5p per page for the first 5000 pages
1.3p per page for 10,000 pages
0.8p for 50,000 pages

Samsung 1510 £50 (1000)
Samsung cartridge £40 (3000)

Tell me where you can get a Samsung ML1510 cartridge for as little as £40.

IAn