Is it Dangerous to run a laptop without the battery?

[Guest]

Is it dangerous to run a laptop of AC power without the battery? i.e. won't
cause a fire.

I don't want to ruin the battery life since I don't need to use it much as I
am always near a power socket.

 

[Pegasus \(MVP\)]

Is it dangerous to run a laptop of AC power without the battery? i.e.
won't
cause a fire.

I don't want to ruin the battery life since I don't need to use it much as
I
am always near a power socket.

It's perfectly OK to run it without batteries. I've been doing
it for years. Unfortunately I cannot yet say conclusively that
this mode extends the life of the battery. The boys in a hardware
newsgroup might be able to tell you.

 

[Kenny]

I have a fairly new Advent laptop and it won't run with the battery out!

 

[Guest]

One or two manufacturers say you shouldn't do that. In the majority of cases
it's perfectly OK though.

The main fire risk is from the battery itself, and arises if it suffers an
internal short, or is severely overcharged (if the laptop's internal
charge-regulator fails, that is.) Fires are rare but when a lithium pack does
'go up' it's very hard to extinguish, most conventional fire-extinguishers
won't deal with it.

There are mostly no components in a laptop itself which present any major
fire risk, other than the battery. Thus removing the battery leads to greater
safety.

The service-life of lithium batteries depends a lot on the temperature at
which they're stored. It's also said that they deteriorate less if stored at
somewhat less than full charge (but not flat, in which case they deteriorate
quickly.) Since many laptops run hot, and constantly trickle-charge the
battery, it can be assumed that a battery stored in a cool place and
occasionally charged will retain its performance longer than one left in the
computer all the time.

 

[philo]

It's perfectly OK to run it without batteries. I've been doing
it for years. Unfortunately I cannot yet say conclusively that
this mode extends the life of the battery. The boys in a hardware
newsgroup might be able to tell you.

That's correct..most laptops (but not all) can be run without a battery...

but the battery should be cycled occasionally. If left unused for a long
period of time...it can loose capacity.

Also...even if kept fully charged ...it needs to be discharged (no more than
80%) on occasion

 

[M.I.5¾]

One or two manufacturers say you shouldn't do that. In the majority of
cases
it's perfectly OK though.

The main fire risk is from the battery itself, and arises if it suffers an
internal short, or is severely overcharged (if the laptop's internal
charge-regulator fails, that is.) Fires are rare but when a lithium pack
does
'go up' it's very hard to extinguish, most conventional fire-extinguishers
won't deal with it.

It's not hard to extinguish. It's completely impossible. Burning Li-ion
batteries generate their own oxygen. Generally, the batteries are quite
safe as long as they are properly used.

There are mostly no components in a laptop itself which present any major
fire risk, other than the battery. Thus removing the battery leads to
greater
safety.

The service-life of lithium batteries depends a lot on the temperature at
which they're stored. It's also said that they deteriorate less if stored
at
somewhat less than full charge (but not flat, in which case they
deteriorate
quickly.) Since many laptops run hot, and constantly trickle-charge the
battery, it can be assumed that a battery stored in a cool place and
occasionally charged will retain its performance longer than one left in
the
computer all the time.

Temperature is the most serious issue. Most of the so called experts tell
dire stories of life shortage if the batteries are stored at predominantly
full charge. However, I have several examples of batteries that are now
over 13 years old, and still exhibit a sunstantially full capacity in spite
of always being maintained at full charge.

I also have 2 batteries that completely died after 1 year's use, but then
they were made by Sony, so what could I expect?

 

[Guest]

I also have 2 batteries that completely died after 1 year's use, but then
they were made by Sony, so what could I expect?

Probably DRM. The battery intentionally self-destructs if it's used to play
CDs released by rival companies. <g>

 

[Mike Lowery]

It's not hard to extinguish. It's completely impossible. Burning Li-ion
batteries generate their own oxygen. Generally, the batteries are quite safe
as long as they are properly used.


Temperature is the most serious issue. Most of the so called experts tell
dire stories of life shortage if the batteries are stored at predominantly
full charge. However, I have several examples of batteries that are now over
13 years old, and still exhibit a sunstantially full capacity in spite of
always being maintained at full charge.

I also have 2 batteries that completely died after 1 year's use, but then they
were made by Sony, so what could I expect?

Assuming Lithium-ion battery:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li-on#Guidelines_for_prolonging_Li-ion_battery_life

 

[Poprivet]

Is it dangerous to run a laptop of AC power without the battery? i.e.
won't cause a fire.

I don't want to ruin the battery life since I don't need to use it
much as I am always near a power socket.

No.

Battery life may well be better by leaving it in the computer. If you stick
if on the shelf and it discharges too far, then it won't be very useful
anyway.
When ac power is on, the battery isn't being used unless it asks for a
bit of charging. Soon's it's done being charged, it's not being used
anymore.

I can't guarantee it of course, but you're very unlikely to see any lifetime
changes with the battery left in. In some cases it could even be longer
because then the battery gets exercised occasionally.

Pop`

 

[Shenan Stanley]

Poprivet wrote:

Is it dangerous to run a laptop of AC power without the battery?
i.e. won't cause a fire.

I don't want to ruin the battery life since I don't need to use it
much as I am always near a power socket.

No.

Battery life may well be better by leaving it in the computer. If
you stick if on the shelf and it discharges too far, then it won't
be very useful anyway.
When ac power is on, the battery isn't being used unless it asks
for a bit of charging. Soon's it's done being charged, it's not
being used anymore.

I can't guarantee it of course, but you're very unlikely to see any
lifetime changes with the battery left in. In some cases it could
even be longer because then the battery gets exercised occasionally.

Modern battery life is shortened by 'leaving it in' after it has achieved
maximum charge - because of the heat.

Over a lifetime of a laptop - the maximum time a computer will run off the
battery will decrease no matter what (as the battery ages) - but the speed
of this decline increases as more heat is applied to the battery - and one
way more heat gets applied is leaving the battery in at all times - even
when connected to power and the battery is already fully charged.

 

[Patrick Keenan]

Is it dangerous to run a laptop of AC power without the battery? i.e.
won't
cause a fire.

I don't want to ruin the battery life since I don't need to use it much as
I
am always near a power socket.

No, it's not dangerous in terms of fire or physical damage.

However, in case of any power interrruption, the system will instantly lose
power and this has been known to damage Windows, or corrupt data. Neither
of these are fun.

So, if you aren't going to use the battery, try to use a UPS so that if
power does go down, other than accidentally pulling the power cord, the
system will stay on for a few minutes.

Alternately, many laptops come with power management software that can be
set so the battery isn't constantly being charged and degraded.

HTH
-pk

 

[PA Bear]

Start here: http://batteryuniversity.com/

 

[M.I.5¾]

Probably DRM. The battery intentionally self-destructs if it's used to
play
CDs released by rival companies. <g>

LOL!

Though it would be tad tricky on a camcorder.

 

[M.I.5¾]

Assuming Lithium-ion battery:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li-on#Guidelines_for_prolonging_Li-ion_battery_life

Although most of that advice is valid, not all of it is. This is normal for
Wikipedia which should not be regarded as an authority on anything.

 

[M.I.5¾]

No, it's not dangerous in terms of fire or physical damage.

However, in case of any power interrruption, the system will instantly
lose power and this has been known to damage Windows, or corrupt data.
Neither of these are fun.

So, if you aren't going to use the battery, try to use a UPS so that if
power does go down, other than accidentally pulling the power cord, the
system will stay on for a few minutes.

Alternately, many laptops come with power management software that can be
set so the battery isn't constantly being charged and degraded.

It isn't constant charging that degrades the batteries. It is the heat
generated inside the laptop being transfered to the battery.

If the battery was being constantly charged, it it would betray this by
errupting in a huge fireball.

If you really want a UPS then use a $30 UPS rather than a $200 battery.

 

[M.I.5¾]

Start here: http://batteryuniversity.com/

But beware that that site is run by a manufacturer of chargers and 'battery
conditioners'. Although much of what they say is apposite, by no means all
of it is.

 

[Paul Randall]

But beware that that site is run by a manufacturer of chargers and
'battery conditioners'. Although much of what they say is apposite, by no
means all of it is.

I agree. I've reread http://batteryuniversity.com/parttwo-34.htm, all
sections on extending battery life. I have not found anything that might be
fudged to be beneficial manufacturers of chargers and 'battery
conditioners'. Have you, and if so, what parts.

Seems to me, this article tells me that laptop manufacturers could greatly
extend the life of the batteries (and lower their profit margin) by
redisgning the power management to give the user the option of specifying
the start and end charging points. If you mostly run your laptop from
110VAc, then you might set these to 45% and 35%. When you know you will be
using the laptop for frequent or long periods without 110VAC, then change
the settings to 100% and 95%.

The manual might even say to set aside a shelf in the refrigerator to store
the laptop when not in use overnight, although there may be other reasons
for not doing this. On these hot August days, a cold laptop might be nice.

I think a better method of battery installation and removal would be needed
if the battery were frequently removed.

-Paul Ranall

Drivers of