Installing new motherboard

[Tom]

If you buy a batch of "Parts" without a motherboard, it's not a computer.
If you then add a motherboard to the system, you've created a "Computer"
that after you agree, the license is attached too.

You're just being stubborn, though you've been had by so many now. Again,
does the EULA state "MOBO" as the computer, and does the EULA say that
further terms must be read, and adhered to at the MS OEM site for further
understanding of what the term "Computer" is? Show me this, you can't, and
you won't admit that there is no definition as to what the Computer really
is in the EULA.

But using your logic, can you run a Computer with just a motherboard?

No, not true at all. My problem is that you don't seem to want to believe
that a "Computer" is the motherboard in MS's definition and that you have
decided that even though you agreed to the "Computer" in the EULA, that
because you didn't get a CLEAR picture at the time, that you're not bound
to the EULA. Well, anyone that's built computers for any reasonable amount
of time knows that the motherboard is the deciding factor in what is a
particular computer system.

See, it isn't a belief system, so are you treating the EULA as a religion
now? I am bound by the EULA, but the EULA is not clear, and does not say
"motherboard". Again, stating different terms on a site, outside the
agreement, is not an agreement, unless a caveat is in the agreement making
such an amendment; but it doesn't exist, if only in your Redmond Temple
belief system

You can be against MS, I don't care about that, as long as your facts are
correct - hell, I use RedHat and browse with FireFox and use Evolution to
access my Exchange server. I have no love or hate of anything, I only care
about the factual part of the agreement in order to keep my clients legit
and licensed properly.

Who said I was against MS? I didn't, and I already said that if I disliked
MS as much as you BELIEVE, I wouldn't use their products. I also think it is
important to be legit on anything as far as that goes, but you're not
proving anything by making words mean something else that are prescribed as
such in an actual agreement.

 

[Tom]

In

I think you might be interested in the information in the link below. I
believe this will affect the OP and answer his question.
http://www.tomshardware.com/hardnews/20050223_082546.html

Hmm, I wonder though, if this will really stop 9if even prevent) pirating of
OEM keys? In any event, the OEM suppliers are the ones who can stop
pirating, if they actually tie the install disk to the MOBO. If the MOBO
fails under warranty, then they replace it with another install disk tied to
it, and with the ability to do a non-activated repair install. The problem
with that is, the EULA (as of right now) does not say MOBO, but computer,
and the agreement is not listing the MOBO as the end all to the license.

The EULA should be reworded to reflect these changes (if they are true),
with an update to it, and the update is to inform the consumer of said
changes, and if those changes can be read outside of an update. This comes
down to what components mean in the term "Computer" in the EULA.

 

[Leythos]

The problem
with that is, the EULA (as of right now) does not say MOBO, but computer,
and the agreement is not listing the MOBO as the end all to the license.

And it goes back to what a person considers as "Computer", in this case it
doesn't make any difference what you or I consider a computer as MS has
clearly defined it for us.

 

[Leythos]

Um, isn't XP installed on the *hard drive*, usually on "C"? No hard drive,
no XP. No motherboard, no XP. No processor, no XP. No Keyboard, can't
install XP. No case to hold everything from shaking, NO XP. No little fans
twirling around, CPU burns up and NO XP. No monitor, HTF would you install
XP, etc., etc., etc.

It's ALL one computer and ALL of it is hardware which, sooner or later,
needs to be upgraded or replaced due to being defective or wear and tear. A
motherboard by itself does not a computer make. Period.

Get real, at least get into understanding computers - You can change
anything you want on a computer except the motherboard and it's still the
same limited system. Changing the motherboard is the one item that impacts
the entire system.

MS is saying that you can put any valid CPU/RAM/DRIVES/External components
in the MOTHERBOARD, without changing the foundation of what makes the
system a computer.

I would love to see you run a AMD chip in an Intel 815 series motherboard,
but you don't get it so I don't really expect much from you.

 

[Leythos]

No, and as three MVPs have now pointed out to you, it is not in any certain
terms this meaning, only to you. I have pointed out to you your penchant for
making words mean things that only you know what they mean, though in the
mainstream, they don't mean crap as you define them! The EULA says Computer,
a MS site says MOBO, but what you do not effin see, is what I agreed to!

Not at all, you agreed to COMPUTER, and since you don't know what makes
the thing a computer you don't know what you agreed too - simple enough
for you. In an effort to explain it, MS clearly documents that OEM
licenses are tied to the MOTHERBOARD - even the MVP's can't argue that
FACT.

Again, did I agree to the EULA as worded, or to the words of what an MS
site says those words mean. Should not the EULA state with real
definition what the COMPUTER is for that agreement. This is the whole
point you miss, or ignore to keep your MS butt kissing alive.

No, you agreed to something that you didn't understand the MEANING OF,
that was your choice at the time. Since you decided to blindly agree to
something you didn't understand you want to claim that it was unclear
after you've already agreed to it - you could have stopped and asked
yourself "I wonder what they mean by 'Computer'?".

I clearly understand that you agreed to Computer in the EULA and that you
don't believe that you have to understand what is meant by Computer, only
your definition of it - you're going to get screwed in a lot of
transaction if you don't clarify ambiguities like that before you sign on
the line.

 

[Tom]

Not at all, you agreed to COMPUTER, and since you don't know what makes
the thing a computer you don't know what you agreed too - simple enough
for you. In an effort to explain it, MS clearly documents that OEM
licenses are tied to the MOTHERBOARD - even the MVP's can't argue that
FACT.

It doesn't matter what I think, or what you think means a computer, the EULA
does not state what a computer means, no matter WTF you say another MS site
says it is. Again, can you run just a MOBO, and use it as a Computer? If MS
wants the Computer to mean a MOBO, then the goddam EULA (agreement) should
(makes specifications) say so!

Does the EULA say that I need to refer to the OEM website to understand what
a Computer means in the EULA, and that I also agree to that?

Answer it straight up, no punches!

No, you agreed to something that you didn't understand the MEANING OF,
that was your choice at the time. Since you decided to blindly agree to
something you didn't understand you want to claim that it was unclear
after you've already agreed to it - you could have stopped and asked
yourself "I wonder what they mean by 'Computer'?".

Really? I could say you don't understand, that a Computer is made up of many
working hardware parts that make it function as a computer. But that isn't
defined in the EULA as to what gets tied down. You say MS makes it so on its
OEM site, though it doesn't include it on it agreement it foists upon the
end user during the OS install.

If I don't understand, does MS ask in the EULA if I understand what they
mean by a Computer, or that they mean Computer means MOBO?

I clearly understand that you agreed to Computer in the EULA and that you
don't believe that you have to understand what is meant by Computer, only
your definition of it - you're going to get screwed in a lot of
transaction if you don't clarify ambiguities like that before you sign on
the line.

You are so thick it isn't funny anymore. That is the point Lamethos! You
don't CLEARLY understand what I think is the computer, the EULA doesn't
specify what a Computer is, and what Hardware it entails. I agreed to the
EULA, nothing else to sign onto, the EULA states Computer, of which I am
sitting in front of, typing these letters as I speak, but no where in it
does it specify MOBO as the computer.

Is the MOBO transposing these characters for you to see, or is it the
Computer?

Show me again where it says the Computer is the MOBO in the EULA. Again if
MS, and the OEMs want the Computer to mean MOBO, then don't effin put it on
a site that no one will ever visit, but make it part of the agreement.

Again, is the MOBO transposing these characters for you to see, or is it the
Computer?

 

[Leythos]

Does the EULA say that I need to refer to the OEM website to understand what
a Computer means in the EULA, and that I also agree to that?

Answer it straight up, no punches!

Strait answer - the EULA says "Computer", do you know what is meant by
"Computer"? If you don't know what is meant by computer do you blindly
accept an agreement?

 

[Leythos]

You are so thick it isn't funny anymore. That is the point Lamethos! You
don't CLEARLY understand what I think is the computer, the EULA doesn't
specify what a Computer is

It's fairly obvious that you are not mature enough to grasp that fact that
you agreed to something YOU didn't understand - since you must insult as
you have no valid fact.

If you agree to something you don't understand then you have only your own
self to blame.

 

[Tom]

Strait answer - the EULA says "Computer", do you know what is meant by
"Computer"? If you don't know what is meant by computer do you blindly
accept an agreement?

It is you that says a Computer means motherboard, because MS tells you that
is what it means! It does not say that in the EULA, and a computer is not
just the MOBO, it is a amalgam of hardware units that make the Computer. If
you understand the MOBO meaning simply a computer, then you are not
qualified to be giving any advice regarding anything related in words or
technical help to a PC.

 

[Tom]

It's fairly obvious that you are not mature enough to grasp that fact that
you agreed to something YOU didn't understand - since you must insult as
you have no valid fact.

If you agree to something you don't understand then you have only your own
self to blame.

I agreed to the EULA as it mentions my PC as the computer on which the OS is
installed on, and it says nothing about the computer meaning the Motherboard
ONLY! What part of the EULA, not stating that Computer means Motherboard not
being shown, do you not understand. Again, if this is so hard for you, then
bitch to MS to change their EULA around to mean what you want it to mean for
them. Or have MS mean what they really want it to mean, because I agree to a
EULA that has no reference to what you say it does, nor does it direct me to
such a reference. Until then, their EULA can mean anything an OEM license as
it is sold means with hardware, as what the computer entails, and the EULA
says Computer and Hardware.

 

[Alias]

Get real, at least get into understanding computers -

I obviously understand them better than you do, your patronizing comment
notwithstanding.

You can change

anything you want on a computer except the motherboard and it's still the
same limited system. Changing the motherboard is the one item that impacts
the entire system.

So does changing the hard drive. Take the fans out and see how your computer
is impacted. Gosh, and if you don't have a power supply, how will you
computer be impacted? And, pray tell, how will you install XP if you don't
have a keyboard? Without a monitor, how will you install XP? We *are*
talking about installing XP on a computer, are we not? A motherboard by
itself does not a computer make.

MS is saying that you can put any valid CPU/RAM/DRIVES/External components
in the MOTHERBOARD, without changing the foundation of what makes the
system a computer.

I would love to see you run a AMD chip in an Intel 815 series motherboard,
but you don't get it so I don't really expect much from you.

I get it. You don't. No one said anything about putting an AMD chip in an
Intel 815 series motherboard but you, which is your usual straw man M.O.

Alias

 

[Alias]

And it goes back to what a person considers as "Computer", in this case it
doesn't make any difference what you or I consider a computer as MS has
clearly defined it for us.

The only web site you quote is for system builders and you have to register
and get a user name and password to even see the web page. The EULA, which
is what we agreed to, does NOT define computer and many people have changed
their motherboards and got reactivated without any problem. Sooooo, you're
wrong. Live with it. Be a man and admit it or back pedal. Your choice.

Alias

 

[Leythos]

So does changing the hard drive. Take the fans out and see how your computer
is impacted. Gosh, and if you don't have a power supply, how will you
computer be impacted? And, pray tell, how will you install XP if you don't
have a keyboard? Without a monitor, how will you install XP? We *are*
talking about installing XP on a computer, are we not? A motherboard by
itself does not a computer make.

And what you don't get is that you can change everything except the
Motherboard and it's just the same old computer, the foundation is the
same, only the fluff has changed.

If you are not careful you're going to make MS's restriction on the
Motherboard look very good.

 

[Leythos]

The only web site you quote is for system builders and you have to
register and get a user name and password to even see the web page. The
EULA, which is what we agreed to, does NOT define computer and many
people have changed

Actually, if you choose ignorance and blindly accept something without
understanding it you are the one you should be complaining about, not MS.
It was you that didn't understand, and you knew it, what MS meant for a
definition of Computer and you just blindly accepted anything they wanted
it to mean by your own click - now do you get it?

their motherboards and got reactivated without any problem. Sooooo,
you're wrong. Live with it. Be a man and admit it or back pedal. Your
choice.

Actually, the MS people activating OEM XP installs on changed motherboards
fits completely within the EULA - as it's clear from the MS site that they
will allow replacement of everything in the computer except the
Motherboard, and the motherboard can be replaced if defective. If they
didn't ask if the MB was defective then that big nasty company gave you a
break and now you want to hold it against them.

Face it, the EULA states Computer, and what's funny is that if we listed
to you or some of the other's definitions of Computer then if you changed
a drive/RAM/PSU/etc... it would not be the SAME computer and would
invalidate your OEM License - as it is, MS is cutting you a LOT of slack
and only stating Motherboard.

I'm ready for you to admin two things:

1) You blindly accepted the EULA without understanding what the term
"Computer" was defined as.

2) That MS, by defining "Computer" as "Motherboard" is actually less
restrictive than many peoples definitions of "Computer".

 

[Alias]

And what you don't get is that you can change everything except the
Motherboard and it's just the same old computer, the foundation is the
same, only the fluff has changed.

Um, if you change the hard drive, you have to reinstall XP.

If you are not careful you're going to make MS's restriction on the
Motherboard look very good.

There is no such restriction. You can change *anything* as the EULA says and
as has been proven by people who have changed their motherboard without
problems, including yours truly, your posting a web site that one has to
register to see and that is NOT addressed to the end users who agree to the
EULAs notwithstanding. The idea is that you can't take an OEM from one
complete computer and install it on another complete computer. Upgrading is
taken into account by the fact that "motherboard" is not mentioned in the
EULA and the 120 days thingy.

Alias

 

[Alias]

Actually, if you choose ignorance and blindly accept something without
understanding it you are the one you should be complaining about, not MS.
It was you that didn't understand, and you knew it, what MS meant for a
definition of Computer and you just blindly accepted anything they wanted
it to mean by your own click - now do you get it?


Actually, the MS people activating OEM XP installs on changed motherboards
fits completely within the EULA - as it's clear from the MS site that they
will allow replacement of everything in the computer except the
Motherboard, and the motherboard can be replaced if defective. If they
didn't ask if the MB was defective then that big nasty company gave you a
break and now you want to hold it against them.

Face it, the EULA states Computer, and what's funny is that if we listed
to you or some of the other's definitions of Computer then if you changed
a drive/RAM/PSU/etc... it would not be the SAME computer and would
invalidate your OEM License - as it is, MS is cutting you a LOT of slack
and only stating Motherboard.

I'm ready for you to admin two things:

1) You blindly accepted the EULA without understanding what the term
"Computer" was defined as.

2) That MS, by defining "Computer" as "Motherboard" is actually less
restrictive than many peoples definitions of "Computer"

Let's take someone's definition that is in the business of defining words,
Merriam Webster:

Main Entry: com·put·er
Pronunciation: k&m-'pyü-t&r
Function: noun
Usage: often attributive
: one that computes; specifically : a programmable electronic device that
can store, retrieve, and process data

I rest my case. Motherboards cannot store, retrieve or process data. You
lose. Admit it like a man or keep back pedaling. Your choice.

One cannot move an OEM XP from one computer to another. One *can*
update/repair a computer. A computer is a complete system. A motherboard
does not a computer make. It would seem to me you would know that.

Alias

 

[Leythos]

Let's take someone's definition that is in the business of defining words,
Merriam Webster:

Main Entry: com·put·er
Pronunciation: k&m-'pyü-t&r
Function: noun
Usage: often attributive
: one that computes; specifically : a programmable electronic device that
can store, retrieve, and process data

I rest my case. Motherboards cannot store, retrieve or process data. You
lose. Admit it like a man or keep back pedaling. Your choice.

If you want the technical perspective, and according to your
websters definition, the Motherboard is a computer - the BIOS is stored in
Firmware in rewritable memory chip, it processes data on power applied to
the board, and it retrieves that firmware from flashable ROM in order to
provide the basics for booting the OS. Care to reconsider now?

One cannot move an OEM XP from one computer to another. One *can*
update/repair a computer. A computer is a complete system. A motherboard
does not a computer make. It would seem to me you would know that.

And you defined COMPUTER as ALL the parts - by your own definition if you
change the parts you change the COMPUTER, so you need to reconsider.

 

[Leythos]

The idea is that you can't take an OEM from one complete computer and
install it on another complete computer.

Sorry, you defined computer as the sum of all the parts - and that breaks
your leg - if you change the parts is not the SAME computer. MS gives you
the ability to change everything except the motherboard.

You never did address that fact that you Agreed to the MS definition of
Computer by your own ignorant clicking of acceptance to the EULA - what's
can't admit when you got it wrong?

 

[Opinicus]

I've come to the conclusion that we're just chasing our own
tales on this motherboard and OEM version issue.

MS has clearly stated that the mobo is the defining criteria
of what is a "new" computer as far as an OEM is concerned:
an OEM no longer has to support a computer he built if the
mobo is replaced with a different one. Indeed rereading what
Jim Byrd posted in
I can see how
the OEM would be *required* to install a different copy of
OEM Windows on such a machine. That's MS's position and it's
binding on those who sign an OEM agreement. But it's not
binding on end-users because it's not mentioned in the EULA.

This puts me in a "grey area" and I think a far from unique
position. This is because *I built my own machine* from
parts (including an OEM version of WinXP Home) that are
readily available on a perfectly legal and white market. I
did the same thing with my wife's machine. I bought all
these parts etc from a very large retailer. Now I'm not an
OEM, because I haven't signed an OEM agreement. So the OEM
criteria don't apply to me. The vendor who sold me the parts
and OEM CDs also sells washing machines, woks, and
electronic gadgets among other things. By no conceivable
definition could the vendor be considered an OEM so how is
he able to sell OEM CDs? Because he ordered them from MS and
MS delivered them to him, that's how. I don't know how it is
in the US, but I read somewhere that in Turkey OEM versions
of software by far outsell retail versions. (Of course
pirate versions outsell both.) The same is probably true in
many other countries.

This raises an interesting question: Are these OEM versions
of WinXP etc that are floating around part of MS's efforts
stave off piracy? It would make sense.

 

[Alias]

Sorry, you defined computer as the sum of all the parts - and that breaks
your leg - if you change the parts is not the SAME computer. MS gives you
the ability to change everything except the motherboard.

You can change everything, including the motherboard. I never meant anything
else and I have the EULA and actual proof on my side. You have a web site
that one has to register at to view and is not intended for end users.
Nowhere in the EULA does it say, see the web site Leythos posted on UseNet
for the defintion of a computer. Nowhere.

You never did address that fact that you Agreed to the MS definition of
Computer by your own ignorant clicking of acceptance to the EULA - what's
can't admit when you got it wrong?

I go by Merriam Webster's definition and, so far, I have been right and you
have been wrong, your patronizing attitude and back pedaling
notwithstanding.

Live with it.

Admit it like a man if you can (as if).

Alias