fax/adsl modem

[Some One]

And second, if you send fax from Word or any other application, you
definitely don't need ANY analog part.

If it doesn't go through an analog phoneline someplace it's an email,
not a fax.

To be a fax, it has to go through a fax machine someplace and all fax
machines recieve digitally through an analog phone line. If it doesn't
work that way it's called a printer.

 

[SleeperMan]

If it doesn't go through an analog phoneline someplace it's an email,
not a fax.

To be a fax, it has to go through a fax machine someplace and all fax
machines recieve digitally through an analog phone line. If it doesn't
work that way it's called a printer.

But first question was about FAX!!! not fax machine. It was about how to
send fax via ADSL and to be able to send fax from computer, no matter how,
you don't need ANY fax machine. AS i said, if we're talking about fax
machine, then there IS analog part involved, but if you just want to send
fax from computer, you print it into some fax program and in that case you
DON'T need analog part if receiving side has also ISDN and computer to
receive. That's what i said in previous post.
Fax itself is NOT analog dependant, fax MACHINE IS!!!

 

[Some One]

But first question was about FAX!!! not fax machine. It was about how to
send fax via ADSL and to be able to send fax from computer, no matter how,
you don't need ANY fax machine. AS i said, if we're talking about fax
machine, then there IS analog part involved, but if you just want to send
fax from computer, you print it into some fax program and in that case you
DON'T need analog part if receiving side has also ISDN and computer to
receive. That's what i said in previous post.
Fax itself is NOT analog dependant, fax MACHINE IS!!!

If it doesn't go through a fax machine, it isn't a fax though. It's an
email... One server to another. OK, calling it email may not be
correct either, but it isn't a fax. If you send a document from one
computer to another and then print it out, it isn't a fax.

Are there any stand alone fax devices that plug into an ISDN line that
you stick paper into, dial a TELEPHONE number and hit SEND? Will they
also answer a ring and recieve a FAX from any FAX device (analog or
digital)?

The assumption that I'm making from the original poster was that he
wants to use his ADSL modem to contact FAX devices, using FAX tones,
on an analog phone line. This won't happen.

 

[SleeperMan]

If it doesn't go through a fax machine, it isn't a fax though. It's an
email... One server to another. OK, calling it email may not be
correct either, but it isn't a fax. If you send a document from one
computer to another and then print it out, it isn't a fax.

Are there any stand alone fax devices that plug into an ISDN line that
you stick paper into, dial a TELEPHONE number and hit SEND? Will they
also answer a ring and recieve a FAX from any FAX device (analog or
digital)?

The assumption that I'm making from the original poster was that he
wants to use his ADSL modem to contact FAX devices, using FAX tones,
on an analog phone line. This won't happen.

Don't mix things. We were talking about sending fax via ISDN modem. We both
agree that you can't send ANY fax via ADSL, as 123xxx was asking. period.

You just don't understand it...you create a document. Then you send it from
same program you created it (let's say word) similar as you create pdf
file - by printing to fax driver. This fax driver then asks you to enter
phone number of other side. Then you hit "send" and ISDN or analogue modem
calls this line (you must not be connected to Internet when you do it) and
when other side responds that fax signal, it transmits whole page. And this
fax driver doesn't give a shit what's on the other side - either fax machine
or ISDN modem, which answered incoming call through computer or analog
converter, and started to receive fax. If other party has analogue line and
you have ISDN, then this fax is converted to analogue IN PHONE CENTRAL!!! If
it has ISDN, it's not and stays digital.

I can't tell if there are FAX machines, which can be connected to ISDN, but
that's why some ISDN modems have analogue converter, so that you can connect
normal fax machine to it. And if they are, they DO answer any calls from any
fax device and receiving fax machine also doesn't give a shit which type of
fax is sending it, as long it's in correct format so that it can understand
it.
There are no digital or analog faxes. Faxes are by nature digital ones and
modulated so they can travel via analog line. If a man has ISDN, then it's
not even analog, but digital.

 

[SleeperMan]

Ah, that's where your confusion is coming from. Fax is
analogue-dependant by definition.

From whatis.com:
"Sometimes called "telecopying," a fax is the telephonic transmission
of scanned-in printed material (text or images), usually to a
telephone number associated with a printer or other output device."

From the American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language (my
favourite dictionary):
"transmits the copy by wire or radio"

From the thoroughly excellent FOLDOC:
"A process by which fixed graphic material including pictures, text,
or images is scanned and the information converted into electrical
signals which are transmitted via telephone to produce a paper copy
of the graphics on the receiving fax machine."


It sounds like what you were referring to by printing to fax like you
do PDF, was creating a fax image - creating a TIFF, PCX (etc) image
of the page of content. This can then be sent to a program over an
ISDN connection.

Check out http://www.faximum.com/faq/fax/questions.shtml.

Gareth

All above says only that fax means convertin graphics etc.material into
Electrical pulses, and those are analog or digital, right?

sending fax is by nature digital stuff. You scan an image - thus make it
digital and at the end you print it with printer - that's digital again. In
between there's only transprotation and here where it differs - analog for
machines and/or analog line and digitalif you use computer and ISDN. I do
referring to create fax image, but not TIFF etc, those programs create exact
image of fax sent by any fax machine and that's why you can receive such fax
with any normal analog fax machine.

 

[Gareth Church]

All above says only that fax means convertin graphics etc.material into
Electrical pulses, and those are analog or digital, right?

Electronic pulses that are transmitted, um, analoguely.

sending fax is by nature digital stuff. You scan an image - thus make it
digital and at the end you print it with printer - that's digital again. In
between there's only transprotation and here where it differs - analog for
machines and/or analog line and digitalif you use computer and ISDN.

Yes, the scan of the fax is digital, and so is the print. But you can't just
pass off the transport mechanism as unimportant.

Fax machines connect directly to a(n analogue) phone line. Surely for
something to be classified as a fax it must be able to be accepted by a fax
machine? That being the case, a fax cannot be sent as all-digital signals.
Anything that is all-digital cannot be a fax. You can make systems which
behave similarly to faxes, but if they can't be accepted by a fax machine
they cannot be a fax.

Gareth

 

[Ken]

and im not yelling i just left my caps lock on, im i free to do that now???

Yes, and then you will be ignored.

 

[123xxxxx]

thats what i mean u dumbass

You are a moron.

An ADSL modem cannot fax.

If you find an ADSL modem that CAN fax all that you have is a normal
ADSL modem PLUS a regular fax modem, both stuffed in the same box. The
same can be had for MUCH less money if you just buy a regular ADSL
modem and regular FAX modem.

 

[Spajky]

A modem, by its very definition, is an ANALOGUE device. There is no such
thing as a DIGITAL modem because, as Some One stated, it doesn't need to
MOdulate/DEModulate the signal. ISDN and DSL are both DIGITAL therefore
CANNOT carry an ANALOGUE signal!

In the name of Hades, can't you understand a simple principle?!

in fact Ken was right !!! ISDN is just a network terminal, while ADSL
is in fact modem (modulating frequencies up to 1MHz range)
but there are few programs for faxing for ISDN terminals, but none for
ADSL since that is not connected like previous one to digital
telephone central but instead to another ADSL modem terminal/equipment
there & than directly to an high speed connection (optical or
microwave) to your ISP .. IMHO ...ADSL and the telefon system have no
connection (divided by band filters) ...


-- Regards, SPAJKY
- http://freeweb.siol.net/jerman55/HP/Spajky.htm
Celly-III OC-ed,"Tualatin on BX-Slot1-MoBo!"
E-mail AntiSpam: remove ##

 

[Spajky]

The ONLY way an ADSL modem can do faxing is if there is a completely
separate regulare fax modem built inside.

Save yourself TONS of hassle and just get a regular fax modem for your
PC and use two phone jacks in the wall.

....or getting prepaid to e-mail 2 fax service somewhere on the net ...

-- Regards, SPAJKY
- http://freeweb.siol.net/jerman55/HP/Spajky.htm
Celly-III OC-ed,"Tualatin on BX-Slot1-MoBo!"
E-mail AntiSpam: remove ##

 

[Perdita X. Dream]

thats what i mean u dumbass

Well that wasn't what you said, ****wit. You were (are) insisting that you
can fax via DSL.

--
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[123xxxxx]

you are obviously in your own world dumbass

Well that wasn't what you said, ****wit. You were (are) insisting that you
can fax via DSL.

--
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[SleeperMan]

Electronic pulses that are transmitted, um, analoguely.


Yes, the scan of the fax is digital, and so is the print. But you
can't just pass off the transport mechanism as unimportant.

Fax machines connect directly to a(n analogue) phone line. Surely for
something to be classified as a fax it must be able to be accepted by
a fax machine? That being the case, a fax cannot be sent as
all-digital signals. Anything that is all-digital cannot be a fax.
You can make systems which behave similarly to faxes, but if they
can't be accepted by a fax machine they cannot be a fax.

Gareth

But that is what i said...even if you send fax from your PC through ISDN,
and second party receives it on fax machine, then it is converted to analog
signal, but in phone central, exactly where your ISDN line ends and
receiver's analog line starts. However, if receiver side also has ISDN and
fax machine, then this conversion is made in ISDN 'modem' just before it's
sent into fax machine. Who say that those faxes can't be accepted by a fax
machine? Sure they can, that's why they are still called FAXes. Although i
agree with you that this is an extension of fax principle itself, but still
as long it's exactly same principle and standard, it should still be called
fax. But if you ask me, i think that faxes are dissapearing anyway -
replacing by email.

You should know that analog to digital and vice versa converters were built
into fax machines only because at the time fax was invendted there were no
ISDN or any other digital transporting system, there was only analog phone
line, so this A/D and D/A were necesarry. If nowadays a fax for ISDN
connection would be on market, it wouldn't have ANY those converters
built-in. It's stupid to convert to analog and back to digital, if this is
not strictly necessary, since with it you loose quality. That's why this
conversion is made only if it must be done.


All i can say is that i sent many faxes from my PC via ISDN 'modem'
succesfully to other's party analog fax machine and noone so far knew that
this was created with PC and not sent by fax machine. All said that they
received my FAX, not email, so...

And this discussion can go on and on and on.... right?

 

[Perdita X. Dream]

look what im tryin to say is there a adsl/fax modem around i gave out this
website address, a simple questions liads to this??? all i wanted to know is
whether that modem on the website is capable of sending faxes clear ????
now can you lot stop the insults and all plz

You must be going for Eejit of the Year too. Some One, Sleeper Man Gareth
and I have all told you that you CANNOT FAX VIA DSL and yet you still
persist?! Some One, this is another for the bozo bin, will you do the
honours?

--
Perdita X. Dream

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http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm.
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[Some One]

to know
is

You must be going for Eejit of the Year too. Some One, Sleeper Man Gareth
and I have all told you that you CANNOT FAX VIA DSL and yet you still
persist?! Some One, this is another for the bozo bin, will you do the
honours?

Already *plonked* long ago. If I added up all the IQ's in my blocked
list I still wouldn't get up to my shoe size!

 

[123xxxxx]

grow up and shut up plz

know

You must be going for Eejit of the Year too. Some One, Sleeper Man Gareth
and I have all told you that you CANNOT FAX VIA DSL and yet you still
persist?! Some One, this is another for the bozo bin, will you do the
honours?

--
Perdita X. Dream

Please help us to help you
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http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm.
Please note that the reply address is fake.
Keep all posts to the groups as private requests for assistance
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[123xxxxx]

pfft is that all you lot got to say

Already *plonked* long ago. If I added up all the IQ's in my blocked
list I still wouldn't get up to my shoe size!

 

[SleeperMan]

OK in short: no, you can't send fax via ADSL. For this you must have either
ISDN or normal 56k modem.

 

[Perdita X. Dream]

grow up and shut up plz

I don't think I'm the one showing the lack of maturity...do you?

--
Perdita X. Dream

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[Perdita X. Dream]

i do not want to send out e-faxes coz the info i want to send is private and
also contains details that i do not want the website to see thank you now
can you close the subject pls

Why? You appear not to want to admit you're wrong.

--
Perdita X. Dream

Please help us to help you
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