D
Dragon
I agree.
PowerUser said:
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D
Dragon
that is exactly what I was thinking.
Stephen said:Why is 480000 / (35%) undefined?
A percentage is just that: "per cent", or "for each hundred".
Hence 35% = 35/100 = 0.35
So, 480000 / (35%) is the same as 480000/0.35
Stephen
J
John John
As far as I'm concerned,all of the above (Excel and $1 calculator or
Win Calc) are wrong. Sinner is correct. 480000 / (35%) is undefined.
It's a meaningless calculation, It's like asking how much is 48 cows
divided by 35 accordions. There is no answer.
Interesting. Now put this to equation:
Q- 480,000 is 35% of which number?
In my way of seeing things the simple answer is to divide 480,000 by
35%. In math % does not represent cows or accordions, it is just a
symbol that represents a ratio in hundredths, 35% = 35 one hundredths =
35/100, it is a way of expressing a fraction. Lotus 123 knows that %
represents hundredths and does the math correctly, as does Excel and the
$1 calculator.
John
U
Unknown
If you key that into the calculator it gives you the correct answer I.E.
480000/.35
480000/.35
D
Dragon
I have to say I agree with you. This seems primary/middle scool math. I
think there is a bug in Win Cal and this is why it is not calculating as it
should.
In 35% of nnn case, if nnnn is not defined, then it is 35 out of 100.
think there is a bug in Win Cal and this is why it is not calculating as it
should.
In 35% of nnn case, if nnnn is not defined, then it is 35 out of 100.
D
Dragon
I am not sure if you are following this correctly. I know that doing
(480000*.35 or 480000/35*100) gives me the correct answer. Doing it the
other way it should give me the same answer Just like other apps and
calculators. But it does not.
(480000*.35 or 480000/35*100) gives me the correct answer. Doing it the
other way it should give me the same answer Just like other apps and
calculators. But it does not.
S
Sinner
John John said:Ken Blake, MVP wrote:
Interesting. Now put this to equation:
Q- 480,000 is 35% of which number?
In my way of seeing things the simple answer is to divide 480,000 by 35%.
In math % does not represent cows or accordions, it is just a symbol that
represents a ratio in hundredths, 35% = 35 one hundredths = 35/100, it is
a way of expressing a fraction.
You just buggered yourself. "Q- 480,000 is 35%......." So, 35% cannot be
35/100 because 480,000 is 35/100 of something
J
John John
Sinner said:You just buggered yourself. "Q- 480,000 is 35%......." So, 35% cannot be
35/100 because 480,000 is 35/100 of something
No I didn't. Put the question into a working equation! The answer is:
480,000 divided by 35%.
480,000 is not a percent of of anything, in this case it's a number used
in an example. Your rebuttal makes no more sense than saying 480,000 is
one half or 50% of 960,000. In math plain and simply a percent is a
hundredth and to do any calculations involving percents you have to
convert them to real values. If 35% was supposed to be expressed as a
percentage of another number then that part of the equation would have
to be inside of parenthesis, by its own it simply represents a fraction
of 35 one hundredths. Saying that you can't divide a number by a value
expressed in % makes no more sense than saying that a number cannot be
divided by one half, everyone knows what one half is, if you are asked
to divide 10 by one half you will not ask "half of what?", you will give
the answer as being 5. How is that different than dividing 10 by 50%?
The question I posed is an example of a simple problem to be solved by
converting figures expressed in percents to their true numerical values.
Lotus, Excel and most calculators can do that without any fuss, the
Microsoft calculator can't, it wasn't programed to do it.
John
U
Unknown
I know what you are saying having had several computers. Some are just
different
on key entry sequences.
different
on key entry sequences.
P
PowerUser
You're right. And I think I know why it doesn't work- there are 2
operations, consecutive divisions x/y/z. Any normal calculator understands
it, but calc.exe is stupid and fusses about it. You cannot do more than one
operation and expect a right answer.
BTW did you guys see this?
http://www.appscout.com/2007/09/excel_cant_multiply.php
Quite ridiculous..
operations, consecutive divisions x/y/z. Any normal calculator understands
it, but calc.exe is stupid and fusses about it. You cannot do more than one
operation and expect a right answer.
BTW did you guys see this?
http://www.appscout.com/2007/09/excel_cant_multiply.php
Quite ridiculous..
P
PowerUser
All you guys saying this have not used calculators much. Dragon is asking
why calc doesn't perform like a normal stand alone calculator.
why calc doesn't perform like a normal stand alone calculator.
N
Nightowl
M.I.5¾ said:No Calc interprets it as 'find 480000% of 35'. And it does so correctly.
The problem is that not all calculators handle a percent key the same way.
If you're right about Calc's interpretation, why, at the point 168000 is
shown (after keying "480000 / 35%"), does pressing the "=" key give the
answer 2.85xxx, which is 480000 divided by 35% of itself?
G
Gord Dibben
If I divided 10 by one half I would expect the answer to be 20
Gord Dibben MS Excel MVP
Gord Dibben MS Excel MVP
J
John John
Oops! There goes my math...
John
John
Gord said:If I divided 10 by one half I would expect the answer to be 20
Gord Dibben MS Excel MVP
M
M.I.5¾
Nightowl said:If you're right about Calc's interpretation, why, at the point 168000 is
shown (after keying "480000 / 35%"), does pressing the "=" key give the
answer 2.85xxx, which is 480000 divided by 35% of itself?
If you press the = key again you will get yet another answer. This may be
how Microsoft have decided their percent key will work. As I noted above,
different calculators implement the % key different ways.
For egg sample: for the button sequence '480000/35%'
Calc gives 168,000 (a further '=' gives 2.8571428)
Calc in Win CE gives 1,371,428.57 (a further '=' does nothing)
The Calculator in Sun Solaris Unix gives 13714.29 - seems to have divided
but ignored the '%' (a further '=' gives 1880816.33 - Not sure what that is)
The Calc in Epoc32 behaves the same way as Calc in Win CE.
Another calculator gives 2.8571428 (a further '=' gives 16,800,000 - which
seems to be 480,000 divided by 2.87..%)
L
Laughingstar~*
Listen to your "gut."
T
Tom Porterfield
PowerUser said:I'm an engineer so I know where your coming from. The Windows Calc is the
irregular one- Even my scientific calculator can understand that you want to
divide the two and express the answer as a percentage (multiplying the
result of division my 100).
There's the key. You said even your "scientific" calculator can
understand. So put calc.exe in scientific mode (View->Scientific) and
then try again. It should yield 13714.285714285714285714285714286.
T
Tom Porterfield
Tom said:There's the key. You said even your "scientific" calculator can
understand. So put calc.exe in scientific mode (View->Scientific) and
then try again. It should yield 13714.285714285714285714285714286.
Which still isn't right, so nevermind.
P
PowerUser
Tom Porterfield said:Which still isn't right, so nevermind.
Right. And where did you find the % feature, cause I don't see it?!
U
Unknown
Did you imagine the % sign????
Tom Porterfield said:Which still isn't right, so nevermind.
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