Disk Defragmenter

[Jeff Gaines]

I installed Diskeeper Light - mistake, it doesn't work so I un-installed it.

Now when I right click on a drive in Explorer and select 'Defragment Now'
I get a dialog telling me the Disk Defragmenter is not installed and to
install it by clicking the Add or Remove Programs Icon in Control Panel.

a) By un-installing Diskeeper Light have I managed to un-install the Vista
defragmenter?
b) The error message is going to create some issue since there is no Add
or Remove Programs Icon in Control Panel.
c) I found the de-fragmenter through help & support and it's running now
so the message is incorrect.

Is this 'Working As Designed'?

 

[Mountain Man]

Defrag in vista is not supposed to show you what is going on.
You can change the time settings for it if you want but as to it showing you
what it is doing then there is nothing.
Uninstalling a failed defragger should not uninstall the built in one.
It pays to read up on will or will not run in vista.

 

[Ramesh, MS-MVP]

Hi Jeff,

I don't see that context menu item. I guess you're referring to the button
located in the drive's property sheet. If so, you need to fix the Defrag UI
location in the registry. Check this article:

Error "The Disk Defragmenter is not installed on your computer" when
launching Disk Defragmenter in Windows Vista:
http://www.winhelponline.com/articles/97/1/

--
Regards,

Ramesh Srinivasan, Microsoft MVP [Windows XP Shell/User]
Windows® XP Troubleshooting http://www.winhelponline.com


I installed Diskeeper Light - mistake, it doesn't work so I un-installed it.

Now when I right click on a drive in Explorer and select 'Defragment Now'
I get a dialog telling me the Disk Defragmenter is not installed and to
install it by clicking the Add or Remove Programs Icon in Control Panel.

a) By un-installing Diskeeper Light have I managed to un-install the Vista
defragmenter?
b) The error message is going to create some issue since there is no Add
or Remove Programs Icon in Control Panel.
c) I found the de-fragmenter through help & support and it's running now
so the message is incorrect.

Is this 'Working As Designed'?

 

[Jeff Gaines]

Hi Jeff,

I don't see that context menu item. I guess you're referring to the button
located in the drive's property sheet. If so, you need to fix the Defrag UI
location in the registry. Check this article:

Yes, sorry I was a bit sloppy

Error "The Disk Defragmenter is not installed on your computer" when
launching Disk Defragmenter in Windows Vista:
http://www.winhelponline.com/articles/97/1/

I down-loaded the .reg file, amazing coincidence, it has your name in it!!!

Many thanks, I wonder why MS let it out like this - particularly pointing
users to a non existent icon in Control Panel.

 

[Chad Harris]

This is a comparison chart between what MSFT ships and Raxco Ships as a
defragger. Take a look by doing a mouseover each feature:
http://www.raxco.com/products/perfectdisk2k/compareV8.cfm

Info on Perfect Disk vs. Other Defrags
http://www.raxco.com/products/perfectdisk2k/

You can do a free trial for 5 months of Perfect Disk by Raxco. It's the
difference between a little league ball player in grade school and the pros.
I'd go with the pros.

You can't expect MSFT financially or legally to ship a defrag utility that
compares with companies who make them and they won't and don't.

If I were you or anyone else, even though you can run the native defrag in
Vista, I'd not touch it because it simply does not compare in quality with
the one from www.raxco.com Perfect Disk which not only works in Vista but
can be tried for about 5 months full functionality. It will have no impact
on the native defrag that they ship with Vista, except that it's so much
better you won't be using it. It also does boot time defrag of your MFT.

Here is some info on the very low end defragger that MSFT ships with Vista
from Jill Zoeller's [MSFT] blog :

https://blogs.technet.com/filecab/articles/440717.aspx

CH

 

[Jeff Gaines]

You can't expect MSFT financially or legally to ship a defrag utility that
compares with companies who make them and they won't and don't.

Thanks for the links. I didn't expect MS to distribute a full blown
commercial de-fragger, it would be another opportunity for the competition
authorities!

I was surprised to be pointed to a non-existent icon in Control Panel
though, nobody has commented on this.

 

[Ramesh, MS-MVP]

You're welcome Jeff.

They should have fixed the message box text in Vista. That's the error
message for Windows XP defrag.

--
Regards,

Ramesh Srinivasan, Microsoft MVP [Windows XP Shell/User]
Windows® XP Troubleshooting http://www.winhelponline.com

Hi Jeff,

I don't see that context menu item. I guess you're referring to the button
located in the drive's property sheet. If so, you need to fix the Defrag UI
location in the registry. Check this article:

Yes, sorry I was a bit sloppy

Error "The Disk Defragmenter is not installed on your computer" when
launching Disk Defragmenter in Windows Vista:
http://www.winhelponline.com/articles/97/1/

I down-loaded the .reg file, amazing coincidence, it has your name in it!!!

Many thanks, I wonder why MS let it out like this - particularly pointing
users to a non existent icon in Control Panel.

 

[Chad Harris]

Jeff--

I really like Raxco but I have also used Diskeeper but they don't have as
generous an offer. Raxco taking into account that for many people, RTM may
not be available worldwide until later in January although I have already
seen it sold in Comp USA this morning along with Office 2007, is offerring
the Vista version for several months as a full functionality trial. I like
the interface for defragging at Boot Time (the MFT /Master File Table or
paging file--or running a boot time chkdsk a little better with Diskeeper
but Raxco has been my main squeeze.

If you're interested in defrag, Jill Zoeller's article has some good info
and Jill has been very concientious about posting a lot of the beta chats on
her blog, and a lot of other very good info, as has Josh at Windows
Connected who helps out frequently on these groups--including one with the
Vista defrag team/and some members of her file core services team at MSFT
that drills into the details of defrag in Vista:

From Jill Zoeller's helpful blog The Filing Cabinet:

http://blogs.technet.com/filecab/default.aspx


Disk Defragmenter Beta Chat Transcript (July 26, 2006)
Chat Topic: Disk Defragmentation
Date: Wednesday, July 26, 2006
http://blogs.technet.com/filecab/pages/447168.aspx

A quick note about Defrag.exe parameters in Windows Vista
http://blogs.technet.com/filecab/archive/2006/10/19/a-quick-note-about-defrag-exe-parameters.aspx


That MSFT is shipping utilities like this is to their credit. They try to
make them better every OS--and I wouldn't doubt that they are not going to
put out a competent utility that they've tested thoroughly if they put it
out at all. No one could possibly expect them to include for the price of
the OS many third party apps of course, and I'm sure they try to walk a fine
line legally as well and still take care of their customers that way.

They obviously deserve credit for improving defrag over the Win 9X Scan Disk
that took a long time, and was erratic, particularly in the dreaded (I so
hate to curse on the web "Win ME"--Win ME stood for 'Mental Emergency' or
''Miserable Experience' or "Most Eggregious" in IT vernacular), and they
have included a Diskmgmt tool that now will re-size partitions without
losing material and a DVD-writer in Vista.

As to the control panel icon for defrag in Vista, I don't see it on the
final relase. I've used every build they had since July, and I never
noticed one. I know you can hit defrag 3 ways:

1) you can as you can with many programs and locations simply type defrag
above the start button and it comes up immediately--Search in Vista and that
situation were quickly one of my favorite convenience type features in Vista
in contrast to Win XP's often erratic slow search
2) As in Win XP you can right click Computer or if you have it set to slide
out the Vista drive>properties>tools>defrag button
3) Defrag can be run at the command line.

If you have a CP icon, I'm not sure it's default unless I miss it, but in
addition to Ramesh's tweak/fix from his excellent site, you might try items
280 and 291 at Kelly'x XP and see if those regedits help you with defrag in
Vista. Many XP regedits there and VB scripts work in Vista, but
understandably not all.

Kelly's [MSFT MVP] Tweaks from Kelly's Korner
http://www.kellys-korner-xp.com/xp_tweaks.htm

CH

 

[David Fumento]

Thanks for pointing out PD8 which will also work with Vista.

But I disagree with others in that I think that the Windows OS should
include all of these "utilities" that you buy from third parties.

1. The best defrag including registry defrag.
2. Registry cleaner.
3. Privacy software (e.g. hide IP address if desired)
4. Windows Live (e.g. firewall, anti-spyware, anti-virus).

Especially in laptops with their slower and smaller HDs, you need the better
defrag built into Windows OS. More and more people are buying these
laptops....

If you buy all of these items separately and given that Windows Live is
subscription, you can pay much more for the additional software than for the
Windows OS itself.

Jeff--

I really like Raxco but I have also used Diskeeper but they don't have as
generous an offer. Raxco taking into account that for many people, RTM
may not be available worldwide until later in January although I have
already seen it sold in Comp USA this morning along with Office 2007, is
offerring the Vista version for several months as a full functionality
trial. I like the interface for defragging at Boot Time (the MFT /Master
File Table or paging file--or running a boot time chkdsk a little better
with Diskeeper but Raxco has been my main squeeze.

If you're interested in defrag, Jill Zoeller's article has some good info
and Jill has been very concientious about posting a lot of the beta chats
on her blog, and a lot of other very good info, as has Josh at Windows
Connected who helps out frequently on these groups--including one with the
Vista defrag team/and some members of her file core services team at MSFT
that drills into the details of defrag in Vista:

From Jill Zoeller's helpful blog The Filing Cabinet:

http://blogs.technet.com/filecab/default.aspx


Disk Defragmenter Beta Chat Transcript (July 26, 2006)
Chat Topic: Disk Defragmentation
Date: Wednesday, July 26, 2006
http://blogs.technet.com/filecab/pages/447168.aspx

A quick note about Defrag.exe parameters in Windows Vista
http://blogs.technet.com/filecab/archive/2006/10/19/a-quick-note-about-defrag-exe-parameters.aspx


That MSFT is shipping utilities like this is to their credit. They try to
make them better every OS--and I wouldn't doubt that they are not going to
put out a competent utility that they've tested thoroughly if they put it
out at all. No one could possibly expect them to include for the price of
the OS many third party apps of course, and I'm sure they try to walk a
fine line legally as well and still take care of their customers that way.

They obviously deserve credit for improving defrag over the Win 9X Scan
Disk that took a long time, and was erratic, particularly in the dreaded
(I so hate to curse on the web "Win ME"--Win ME stood for 'Mental
Emergency' or ''Miserable Experience' or "Most Eggregious" in IT
vernacular), and they have included a Diskmgmt tool that now will re-size
partitions without losing material and a DVD-writer in Vista.

As to the control panel icon for defrag in Vista, I don't see it on the
final relase. I've used every build they had since July, and I never
noticed one. I know you can hit defrag 3 ways:

1) you can as you can with many programs and locations simply type defrag
above the start button and it comes up immediately--Search in Vista and
that situation were quickly one of my favorite convenience type features
in Vista in contrast to Win XP's often erratic slow search
2) As in Win XP you can right click Computer or if you have it set to
slide out the Vista drive>properties>tools>defrag button
3) Defrag can be run at the command line.

If you have a CP icon, I'm not sure it's default unless I miss it, but in
addition to Ramesh's tweak/fix from his excellent site, you might try
items 280 and 291 at Kelly'x XP and see if those regedits help you with
defrag in Vista. Many XP regedits there and VB scripts work in Vista, but
understandably not all.

Kelly's [MSFT MVP] Tweaks from Kelly's Korner
http://www.kellys-korner-xp.com/xp_tweaks.htm

CH

Thanks for the links. I didn't expect MS to distribute a full blown
commercial de-fragger, it would be another opportunity for the
competition authorities!

I was surprised to be pointed to a non-existent icon in Control Panel
though, nobody has commented on this.

 

[Chad Harris]

David--

I see your point on the defrag in that defrag while not a very sexy concept
sure is vitally important and is underused by the general population. It's
not hard for any of us to run into people who never heard of it, and I
understand it's probably not the major topic of conversation at most
cocktail parties or clubs.

There are two schools of thought on reg cleaners and I subscribe to Ed
Bott's (Author of soon to be on sale Windows Vista Inside Out MSFT Press) in
that you really don't know what they are doing under the hood. Sure they
purport that you have x number of errors, (I've seen them say you have
hundreds), but I believe you can spell their functionality easily with
normal maintainance.

Why I Don't Use Registry Cleaners Ed Bott
www.edbott.com/weblog/archives/000643.html

Privacy Software and Windows Onecare I agree and MSFT obviously sees WOC as
a separate revenue stream. Defender comes in Vista, and is free for download
to users of other Windows.

CH

Thanks for pointing out PD8 which will also work with Vista.

But I disagree with others in that I think that the Windows OS should
include all of these "utilities" that you buy from third parties.

1. The best defrag including registry defrag.
2. Registry cleaner.
3. Privacy software (e.g. hide IP address if desired)
4. Windows Live (e.g. firewall, anti-spyware, anti-virus).

Especially in laptops with their slower and smaller HDs, you need the
better defrag built into Windows OS. More and more people are buying
these laptops....

If you buy all of these items separately and given that Windows Live is
subscription, you can pay much more for the additional software than for
the Windows OS itself.

Jeff--

I really like Raxco but I have also used Diskeeper but they don't have as
generous an offer. Raxco taking into account that for many people, RTM
may not be available worldwide until later in January although I have
already seen it sold in Comp USA this morning along with Office 2007, is
offerring the Vista version for several months as a full functionality
trial. I like the interface for defragging at Boot Time (the MFT /Master
File Table or paging file--or running a boot time chkdsk a little better
with Diskeeper but Raxco has been my main squeeze.

If you're interested in defrag, Jill Zoeller's article has some good info
and Jill has been very concientious about posting a lot of the beta chats
on her blog, and a lot of other very good info, as has Josh at Windows
Connected who helps out frequently on these groups--including one with
the Vista defrag team/and some members of her file core services team at
MSFT that drills into the details of defrag in Vista:

From Jill Zoeller's helpful blog The Filing Cabinet:

http://blogs.technet.com/filecab/default.aspx


Disk Defragmenter Beta Chat Transcript (July 26, 2006)
Chat Topic: Disk Defragmentation
Date: Wednesday, July 26, 2006
http://blogs.technet.com/filecab/pages/447168.aspx

A quick note about Defrag.exe parameters in Windows Vista
http://blogs.technet.com/filecab/archive/2006/10/19/a-quick-note-about-defrag-exe-parameters.aspx


That MSFT is shipping utilities like this is to their credit. They try
to make them better every OS--and I wouldn't doubt that they are not
going to put out a competent utility that they've tested thoroughly if
they put it out at all. No one could possibly expect them to include for
the price of the OS many third party apps of course, and I'm sure they
try to walk a fine line legally as well and still take care of their
customers that way.

They obviously deserve credit for improving defrag over the Win 9X Scan
Disk that took a long time, and was erratic, particularly in the dreaded
(I so hate to curse on the web "Win ME"--Win ME stood for 'Mental
Emergency' or ''Miserable Experience' or "Most Eggregious" in IT
vernacular), and they have included a Diskmgmt tool that now will re-size
partitions without losing material and a DVD-writer in Vista.

As to the control panel icon for defrag in Vista, I don't see it on the
final relase. I've used every build they had since July, and I never
noticed one. I know you can hit defrag 3 ways:

1) you can as you can with many programs and locations simply type defrag
above the start button and it comes up immediately--Search in Vista and
that situation were quickly one of my favorite convenience type features
in Vista in contrast to Win XP's often erratic slow search
2) As in Win XP you can right click Computer or if you have it set to
slide out the Vista drive>properties>tools>defrag button
3) Defrag can be run at the command line.

If you have a CP icon, I'm not sure it's default unless I miss it, but in
addition to Ramesh's tweak/fix from his excellent site, you might try
items 280 and 291 at Kelly'x XP and see if those regedits help you with
defrag in Vista. Many XP regedits there and VB scripts work in Vista,
but understandably not all.

Kelly's [MSFT MVP] Tweaks from Kelly's Korner
http://www.kellys-korner-xp.com/xp_tweaks.htm

CH

On 30/11/2006 in message <[email protected]> Chad
Harris wrote:

You can't expect MSFT financially or legally to ship a defrag utility
that compares with companies who make them and they won't and don't.

Thanks for the links. I didn't expect MS to distribute a full blown
commercial de-fragger, it would be another opportunity for the
competition authorities!

I was surprised to be pointed to a non-existent icon in Control Panel
though, nobody has commented on this.

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Doesn't One Care also include a registry cleaner in addition to the items
you listed for it in #4?

 

[David Fumento]

I can't find the registry cleaner in OneCare but it is available here:
http://safety.live.com which is the on-line version from Microsoft.

By charging for OneCare, Microsoft is deriving benefit from people writing
viruses, spyware, hacking, etc. who receive no "compensation for their
efforts." The maintenance (e.g. registry clean, temporary file deletion)
should certainly be built into the OS. But since it is available in the
link above, it is effectively the same.

Also, I think that partitioning such as Partition Magic and disk imaging
such as Acronis True Image should as well as all the features of CD/DVD
burning software should be built in the OS as well. After all, we are not
charged for drivers for hard drives, they come with the OS. So why
shouldn't all of the drivers/movie viewers, etc. work that way for Windows
OS?

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

CompletePC Backup is a full imaging app.

 

[Chad Harris]

Colin--

One care has these but no reg cleaner--essentially it has defrag, cleanup
capability, backup, and antivirus.

Their feeling on the backup was to make it simple.

Learn about Windows Live OneCare, the new comprehensive PC care service from
Microsoft.
www.windowsonecare.com/prodinfo/features.aspx

It plans to add some features:
http://windowsonecare.spaces.live.com/


I have used the regcleaner Registy Mechanic, from what used to be called
www.winguides.com or now www.pctools.com

http://www.pctools.com/registry-mechanic/. I felt pretty confident, because
the people associated with the site who develop their software have a
serious command and respect for the registry, but you still couldn't verify
exactly that it did what it claimed to do.

They also make a popular gui interface tweaker:
http://www.winguides.com/tweak/

As you know the common complaint on the backup for One Care and Vista (which
in One Care would be worth the price itself at $33 for 3 licenses I see in
stores and less with rebate) is that it won't backup at the file level.

While I understand somewhat MSFT's explanation voice by Jill Zoeller that
they wanted to make it user friendly for novices and they should be
applauded for trying to get backup in the hands of all Windows users, you
can't help but notice that browse is a very basic fundtion in Windows and I
believe that the company that is trying to write extensive help articles
from the help server and help web site for Vista, (helppane.exe
command at the run box in Vista), and/or their site
http://windowshelp.microsoft.com/Windows/enUS/default.mspx
could have made simple directions and screen shotted instructions so that
they could have made a more sophisticated backup. Any of us could have
written them, and MSFT could have as well.

CH

 

[Chad Harris]

David--

Nothing on that site is tantamount to the so-called 3rd party reg cleaners.
MSFT doesn't make a reg cleanre per se, and I'm betting it's because they
don't subscribe to the theory that they are all that reliable and certainly
they aren't verifiable. I don't belive anyone can link me to a "reg
cleaner" that the user can verify what's been done at the key, subkey, or
value level.

CH

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

I saw it on the online version but thought I had seen it on the local.

 

[Chad Harris]

Colin --

What do those terms mean "on line" version and local? Since the first day
of the original Beta for WOC back in 2004 or 2005 whichever it was, I have
been using on line versions.

I forgot to mention it includes the defragmenter that is the low end one
used in Vista as well.

CH

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

There is an online service equivalent of Live One Care that is something
like what Antivirus vendors provide on their websites for a one time scan.
A web-based app. I used it some a few months ago. A couple of weeks ago an
MS support person ran it on my wife's laptop in a remote assistance session.
I don't know if it is still publically available but it was at one time.

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

I just realized that we are talking about the same thing.

 

[Chad Harris]

Sure. And I recommend it to people all the time. But it seemed you were
equating it with a reg cleaner and I may have misinterpreted the sequence or
context of your post there.

I would be interested in your opinions of them. I used to collect them, and
winguides sells one and they are a good group of people and very good with
reg tweaks having offered well over a thousand on their tweaker at

www.winguides.com for gui tweaking (it would be nice if they included in
that app the actual method they use to tweak the reg--somewhat the way
Kelly MVP does on her sight with a right click and printing out the reg
edits in notepad.

CH