Computer keeps crashing

[Ron O'Brien]

My Intel quad core PC with 4gb DDR2 RAM running XP Pro will just shutdown
and restart at any time, sometimes it can be within a few seconds of
starting other times it can be after several hours or not at all. Certainly
if it is doing something heavy like processing HD video it will probably
crash after several minutes (but not always).

I had this once with a Vista PC which turned out to be iffy RAM but I have
tried taking out individual sticks of RAM and I've swapped the graphics
card, still does it.

Is there anything within XP or any third party software that can give a hint
as to what is going on

 

[Daave]

My Intel quad core PC with 4gb DDR2 RAM running XP Pro will just
shutdown and restart at any time, sometimes it can be within a few
seconds of starting other times it can be after several hours or not
at all. Certainly if it is doing something heavy like processing HD
video it will probably crash after several minutes (but not always).

I had this once with a Vista PC which turned out to be iffy RAM but I
have tried taking out individual sticks of RAM and I've swapped the
graphics card, still does it.

Is there anything within XP or any third party software that can give
a hint as to what is going on

While your case was open, did you inspect for dust? If there are large
amounts, you need to blow it out with compressed air. Also make sure all
the fans are spinning. It sounds like your system is overheating.

If not, test each stick of RAM individually with these two programs:

http://oca.microsoft.com/en/windiag.asp

http://www.memtest.org/

If RAM is fine, try another PSU.

 

[Ron O'Brien]

While your case was open, did you inspect for dust? If there are large
amounts, you need to blow it out with compressed air. Also make sure all
the fans are spinning. It sounds like your system is overheating.

If not, test each stick of RAM individually with these two programs:

http://oca.microsoft.com/en/windiag.asp

http://www.memtest.org/

If RAM is fine, try another PSU.

Hi

It's very clean as it is quite a new build. The memory is fine and PSU is
one I had running another system of similar spec. It's a real head scratcher
this one!

Ron

 

[Daave]

Hi

It's very clean as it is quite a new build. The memory is fine and
PSU is one I had running another system of similar spec. It's a real
head scratcher this one!

Which RAM diagnostics did you use to determine this?

Even with a new build, it's possible to have faulty hardware. Check
*all* the fans once more to be sure.

Maybe it's a graphics card problem.

Check Event Viewer.

Also, try running off a live Linux CD to see if your PC stops its
crashing.

 

[Buffalo]

Hi

It's very clean as it is quite a new build. The memory is fine and
PSU is one I had running another system of similar spec. It's a real
head scratcher this one!

Ron

Perhaps a temp monitoring program such as MotherBoardMonitor or similar will
indicate whether heat is a problem or not.
A faulty motherboard could also be the problem, though somewhat unlikely.
[micro-cracks in the traces or bad capacitor(s) ].
Does the PC just shut off like you pulled the plug, or does it go into a
controlled shutdown?
Two other causes have already been mentioned (ram and psu).
When you get it solved, please post back on what the problem turned out to
be.
Buffalo

 

[db]

perhaps, it is a program that is
trying to connect to the net in
the background.

something like windows media
has the ability to link and download
information to it in the background.

it was what was causing my crashes
with my quad.

--
db·´¯`·...¸><)))º>
DatabaseBen, Retired Professional
- Systems Analyst
- Database Developer
- Accountancy
- Veteran of the Armed Forces
- @Hotmail.com
- nntp Postologist
~ "share the nirvana" - dbZen

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Jose]

My Intel quad core PC with 4gb DDR2 RAM running XP Pro will just shutdown
and restart at any time, sometimes it can be within a few seconds of
starting other times it can be after several hours or not at all. Certainly
if it is doing something heavy like processing HD video it will probably
crash after several minutes (but not always).

I had this once with a Vista PC which turned out to be iffy RAM but I have
tried taking out individual sticks of RAM and I've swapped the graphics
card, still does it.

Is there anything within XP or any third party software that can give a hint
as to what is going on

When your system crashes, do you get a blue screen of death (BSOD) and
if so, what does it say?

What does the Event Log have to offer for clues?

Disable Automatic restart on system error to stop the error on your
screen so you can see it:

Right click My Computer, Properties, Advanced, Startup and Recovery
Settings.

In the System failure section, untick the Automatically restart box,
OK, OK.

BSOD blue screen of death example information showing what you need to
provide:

http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/images/Windows_XP_BSOD.png
http://techrepublic.com.com/i/tr/downloads/images/bsod_a.jpg

Send the information indicated by the red arrows (3-4 lines total).
Skip the
boring text unless it looks important to you. We know what a BSOD
looks like,
we need to know the other information that is specific to your BSOD.

Look in the Event Viewer for clues around the time of the failure:

Here is a method to post the specific information about individual
events.

To see the Event Viewer logs, click Start, Settings, Control Panel,
Administrative Tools, Event Viewer.

A shortcut to Event Viewer is to click Start, Run and in the box
enter:

%SystemRoot%\system32\eventvwr.msc /s

Click OK to launch the Event Viewer.

The most interesting logs are usually the Application and System.
Some logs may be almost or completely empty.
Not every event is a problem, some are informational messages that
things are working okay and some are warnings.
No event should defy reasonable explanation.


Each event is sorted by Date and Time. Errors will have red Xs,
Warnings will have yellow !s.
Information messages have white is. Not every Error or Warning event
means there is a serious issue.
Some are excusable at startup time when Windows is booting. Try to
find just the events at the date
and time around your problem.

If you double click an event, it will open a Properties windows with
more information. On the right are
black up and down arrow buttons to scroll through the open events. The
third button that looks like
two pages on top of each other is used to copy the event details to
your Windows clipboard.

When you find an interesting event that occurred around the time of
your issue, click the third button
under the up and down arrows to copy the details and then you can
paste the details (right click, Paste
or CTRL-V) the detail text back here for analysis.

To get a fresh start on any Event Viewer log, you can choose to clear
the log (backing up the log is offered),
then reproduce your issue, then look at just the events around the
time of your issue.

 

[Ron O'Brien]

I'll try to answer all ideas so far given.

The memory was tested with the two programmes mentioned in the posts here
memtest and WinDiag
I assume the PSU is OK not just because it is new but because it had worked
perfectly for two months in another system of similar build
I swapped the graphics card with another.
I did wonder about services (possibly corrupt) accessing the Internet but
still got the problem running the PC in diagnostic mode.

Other factors:

When it 'crashes' it simply closes, no warning, no message - just shuts down
and restarts
Usually after it has crashed one or twice, it behaves itself for the rest of
the day - as though it needed 'warming up'
Occasionally it will crash immediately upon booting - which led me to
suspect it was a windows problem possibly a driver related issue, after
re-installed all third party drivers I don't think it has crashed
immediately on start up. but still crashes.
I did think it may have been heat at one stage, but it can crash after just
a few seconds. There are 3x 120mm case fans, a massive CPU cooler (can't
recall the make) which is visibly whirling away like crazy The PSU exhausts
its heat directly out of the case.

Ron

 

[db]

I still think it is a service that is
accessing the net and causing a
crash.

it sounds like the same problem
I had and I discovered it was
windows media connecting to
the net for new content.

however, what you might try
is to run the system in safe mode
and see how long it will take for
it to crash.

--------------------

also, did you build your own
pc?

if so, did you ensure that the
covering was removed from
the cpu fan before applying that
blackish goo that transfers
heat from the cpu?

its sort of a plastic film that
protects the contact plate.

--
db·´¯`·...¸><)))º>
DatabaseBen, Retired Professional
- Systems Analyst
- Database Developer
- Accountancy
- Veteran of the Armed Forces
- @Hotmail.com
- nntp Postologist
~ "share the nirvana" - dbZen

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Daave]

I'll try to answer all ideas so far given.

The memory was tested with the two programmes mentioned in the posts
here memtest and WinDiag
I assume the PSU is OK not just because it is new but because it had
worked perfectly for two months in another system of similar build
I swapped the graphics card with another.
I did wonder about services (possibly corrupt) accessing the Internet
but still got the problem running the PC in diagnostic mode.

Other factors:

When it 'crashes' it simply closes, no warning, no message - just
shuts down and restarts
Usually after it has crashed one or twice, it behaves itself for the
rest of the day - as though it needed 'warming up'
Occasionally it will crash immediately upon booting - which led me to
suspect it was a windows problem possibly a driver related issue,
after re-installed all third party drivers I don't think it has
crashed immediately on start up. but still crashes.
I did think it may have been heat at one stage, but it can crash
after just a few seconds. There are 3x 120mm case fans, a massive CPU
cooler (can't recall the make) which is visibly whirling away like
crazy The PSU exhausts its heat directly out of the case.

Thanks for the other info.

What is the malware status of your PC?

Was there any useful info in Event Viewer?

I still think the easiest way to rule out hardware is run the PC with a
live Linux distro like Ubuntu or Knoppix. If the PC still shuts off,
then you know it's not a Windows issue.

You can also go into Windows System Properties | Advanced | Startup and
Recovery, and under System Failure, uncheck the box next to
"Automatically restart." This should give you a BSOD the next time the
PC reboots which hopefully will contain enough info to start your
detective work.

 

[Anna]

My Intel quad core PC with 4gb DDR2 RAM running XP Pro will just shutdown
and restart at any time, sometimes it can be within a few seconds of
starting other times it can be after several hours or not at all.
Certainly if it is doing something heavy like processing HD video it will
probably crash after several minutes (but not always).

I had this once with a Vista PC which turned out to be iffy RAM but I have
tried taking out individual sticks of RAM and I've swapped the graphics
card, still does it.

Is there anything within XP or any third party software that can give a
hint as to what is going on

It's very clean as it is quite a new build. The memory is fine and PSU is
one I had running another system of similar spec. It's a real head
scratcher this one!

Ron

I'll try to answer all ideas so far given.

The memory was tested with the two programmes mentioned in the posts here
memtest and WinDiag
I assume the PSU is OK not just because it is new but because it had
worked perfectly for two months in another system of similar build
I swapped the graphics card with another.
I did wonder about services (possibly corrupt) accessing the Internet but
still got the problem running the PC in diagnostic mode.

Other factors:

When it 'crashes' it simply closes, no warning, no message - just shuts
down and restarts
Usually after it has crashed one or twice, it behaves itself for the rest
of the day - as though it needed 'warming up'
Occasionally it will crash immediately upon booting - which led me to
suspect it was a windows problem possibly a driver related issue, after
re-installed all third party drivers I don't think it has crashed
immediately on start up. but still crashes.
I did think it may have been heat at one stage, but it can crash after
just a few seconds. There are 3x 120mm case fans, a massive CPU cooler
(can't recall the make) which is visibly whirling away like crazy The PSU
exhausts its heat directly out of the case.

Ron

Ron:
While it appears from your description of the problem you're experiencing
that some type of hardware malfunction might be the root cause of the
problem - that's not definitive by any means. It's crucial that at this
point you determine whether the problem is indeed hardware-related or due to
some software problem, e.g., a corrupted OS or misconfiguration, or malware,
etc. I'm assuming that at this point you haven't traced the problem to some
sort of software issue.

Presumably you're working with a desktop PC...

1. First, check out your HDD with the HDD diagnostic available from the
disk's manufacturer. It doesn't sound as if a defective drive is the cause
of the problem but it's always a good idea to check out the hard disk at the
outset.

2. Power on the PC with *only* the power supply, processor/heatsink, RAM,
graphics card and keyboard connected. Nothing else. No sound card, no HDD,
no external devices - nothing else but those basic components. Let the
machine run for at least a couple of hours during which time you can access
the BIOS settings and go from one screen to another and in the process
determine that all BIOS settings are appropriate to your system. Check the
temps with the BIOS hardware monitor settings to see all is normal. If no
untoward events during this period it should give you some assurance there's
no hardware issue involved here (although this process is not completely
definitive).

3. Assuming the problem does arise during this time then it will be
necessary to determine which of the basic components is the defective one.
And there's no easy answer to that except by substituting components on a
one-by-one basis (unless you're visually able to determine the problem,
e.g., leaking or malformed motherboard capacitors, heat sink not properly
installed, obvious problem with PSU fan or other fans, etc.).

4. Hopefully you have a power supply tester available.

5. Assuming there doesn't seem to be a hardware-related issue causing the
problem and further assuming you're unable to precisely determine the
software issue, it probably would be advisable to undertake a Repair install
of the XP OS. I'm assuming you're familiar with this process.
Anna

 

[Jose]

I'll try to answer all ideas so far given.

The memory was tested with the two programmes mentioned in the posts here
memtest and WinDiag
I assume the PSU is OK not just because it is new but because it had worked
perfectly for two months in another system of similar build
I swapped the graphics card with another.
I did wonder about services (possibly corrupt) accessing the Internet but
still got the problem running the PC in diagnostic mode.

Other factors:

When it 'crashes' it simply closes, no warning, no message - just shuts down
and restarts
Usually after it has crashed one or twice, it behaves itself for the restof
the day - as though it needed 'warming up'
Occasionally it will crash immediately upon booting - which led me to
suspect it was a windows problem possibly a driver related issue, after
re-installed all third party drivers I don't think it has crashed
immediately on start up. but still crashes.
I did think it may have been heat at one stage, but it can crash after just
a few seconds. There are 3x 120mm case fans, a massive CPU cooler (can't
recall the make) which is visibly whirling away like crazy The PSU exhausts
its heat directly out of the case.

Ron

Try to better define what "crash" means to you and try to get more
information from my earlier post.

If Windows encounters a serious error, it will usually leave some kind
of trail and clues (except heat which may or may not). It is better
to find the clues and decipher them instead of just trying things.

Without more information, you can only guess at what the real issue is
and lose more otherwise productivity cycles.

 

[Ron O'Brien]

OK...after many hours of scratching and banging my head against the brick
wall!.....

When it crashes it simply shuts down - no warnings, no messages. I disabled
the automatic restart, it has only crashed once since then and it just shut
down.

Malware/virus: has been checked Norton Anti-Virus, Adware, Spybot Search &
Destroy - nothing found
Event Log: there are a number of instances relating to Sony Vegas video
editing and Sqldatabase trying to access the net which have a ! next to it
but these instances seem to occur every two hours and not one aligns with a
crash.

Memory: I decided that I would run the Windows Diagnotics test again, I
wrongly stated that it was run before, it was just an older version of
memtest that had previously run. When I ran it, it reprted that there were
16 basic and 24 standard errors this typically looks like:
WINVC Cache on Addr 0817c024 expected 04040404 Actual ff040404
There are similar errors under RLAND, MATS & WMATS

It wasn't helpful enough to mention which module was at fault so I will have
to test them individually. I have no idea what these tests indicate but
assume that perhaps they are causing enough of a problem..... I will be
doing so swapping about this afternoon!

 

[Ron O'Brien]

Well, something weird happened -which seems to have fixed the problem,
although it defy's logic.

It transpired that I had a total of 8gb of RAM installed from a previous
64bit installation that I was going to install until I realised that some of
my devices wouldn't work with 64bit at the time. When I installed the 32bit
XP Pro I didn't bother removing the extra 4gb that XP couldn't use.

Anyway. As stated in my last message running Windiag found a few 'address'
issues with my memory, so I took out 3 of the 2gb RAM sticks and ran the
test on each stick - all passed. So I stuck another in the second dual
channel slot so I have my maximum 4gb limit and it hasn't crashed since. The
computer has been on now for over 24 hrs (usually crashes within 24mins!)
I've had it rendering a large video file, playing music & video and various
other CPU / memory crunching tasks and all seems well....for now at least!

So, is it simply that Windows XP 32bit can't use more than 4gb RAM or does
it not like more than 4gb? does having more than 4gb RAM installed cause a
problem? - seems to in my system.

Ron