Comp USA idiots, part 897:

[Ruel Smith]

Using your hand-picked example.
GeForce 6800 GT:
http://www.compusa.com/
$400
http://www.newegg.com/
$390
http://www.zipzoomfly.com/
$380
GeForce 6800 Ultra:
http://www.compusa.com/
$500
http://www.newegg.com/
$490

Don't forget, you said "I see GeForce 6800 GT and Ultra cards all
the time much cheaper at Best Buy and CompUSA".

Sure do. It's called "on sale". Those prices you quote are not on sale. Now,
the fact that you can go to CompUSA and buy the same card and be home with
it, installing it that same day for a mere $10 more is enough to buy there
instead of online. So, you just proved my point, where I originally stated
that "Many parts are getting to be just as expensive as the store bought
stuff, and _sometimes_ it's cheaper to go to Best Buy or something."

All the reader has to do is go to the local stores (or their online
equivalents) and compare the prices with online-only stores.

In fact, the price difference is getting greater. And you can find
technical information on the Internet. And you can find opinions and
reviews on the Internet. And you can compare prices on the Internet.

Yes, you can do all of that on the internet. Except, there are fewer price
discrepancies between online retailers and big chains for parts. It was
once true because they didn't handle very much volume for do-it-yourselfers
like us. However, they're now buying stuff in bulk. Also, online sites seem
to have gotten more expensive. I've been looking to get a new Antec case or
just an Antec power supply for my current case. A visit to both New Egg and
ZipZoomFly (the only 2 retailers I buy from) have very little discounts
from the MSRP. I can occassionally catch one of those cases or power
supplies on sale at Micro Center, CompUSA, Circuit City, or Best Buy and do
better. For instance, I and a friend helped another friend pick out the
parts, shop for them, and build his first homebuilt computer. He got an
Antec Sonata case with power supply for $73 from Circuit City. ZipZoomfly
wants $99.99 and $22 for shipping. New Egg wants $105 and $15.99 for
shipping. MSRP is only $119. Some deal they got going...

 

[Ruel Smith]

That's not true in any of the CompUSAs or Best Buys I've been to. In
fact for some reason, Bet Buy, Staples, CompUSA, and Circuit City all
have the EXACT same cards for sale, usually only 2 different Vertigo
nvidia cards, ATI 9600 and 9800 (+ the AIW models), and maybe 2 or 3 PCI
cards. And they have always 100% of the time been at least $20 more
than online, and sometimes DOUBLE the price.

I don't know why the selection is so bad, maybe they can only afford to
stock a few different cards. Then there's always the "yes but you can
get better advice at Store X" argument, which would be nice if true, but
we all know the advice is skewed toward getting you to buy more than you
need.

Best Buy even tried to get me to buy a $10 replacement plan for a $20
mouse. It's one of the few times I've laughed out loud in line in a
store.

Yes, but I'm confident that those of us that have done this a few times are
a little smarter, and better shoppers than that. )

 

[David Maynard]

I know that VA=W.

Which is of no use in this case because the "W" and "A" are unknown and it
is the "A" he was asking for.

He wants to know amps? It gives amps.

He wants to know the amps that matter to the components in the computer.
I.E. what is it's amp rating on each of +12, +5, +3.3, -5, and -12? Plus
the combined ratings.

The 'box' AC amp rating does not provide that information.

If he wants
to know more he should spell it out so that somebody who knows what he's
talking about CAN help.

I suspect he did and you snipped the 'tech' response, which is incorrect
and incompetent regardless of what he asked.

"a) Computers draw volts, not amps."

'Computers' do, indeed, "draw amps." The purpose of a computer PSU is to
provide a (multiple) constant voltage source(s) that will supply as many
amps as the circuitry wants to "draw" up to the current capacity of the
PSU, which is what he was asking for: the current capacity on each of the
power rails.

"b) Amps don't matter."

If amps don't matter then your VA=W equation is meaningless.

 

[Bob Ward]

Which is of no use in this case because the "W" and "A" are unknown and it
is the "A" he was asking for.

Doesn't the 350 W count?

Doesn;'t the 120 Volts count? If we have V and W, surely we can solve
for A...

 

[The Real Bev]

Which is of no use in this case because the "W" and "A" are unknown and it
is the "A" he was asking for.


He wants to know the amps that matter to the components in the computer.
I.E. what is it's amp rating on each of +12, +5, +3.3, -5, and -12? Plus
the combined ratings.

He didn't say that in his first post. He just complained about "no
amps." Later on, after a few of us responded, he amplified his request.

The 'box' AC amp rating does not provide that information.


I suspect he did and you snipped the 'tech' response, which is incorrect
and incompetent regardless of what he asked.

Nope. Go back to his first post. You haven't been doing this long,
have you?

"a) Computers draw volts, not amps."

'Computers' do, indeed, "draw amps." The purpose of a computer PSU is to
provide a (multiple) constant voltage source(s) that will supply as many
amps as the circuitry wants to "draw" up to the current capacity of the
PSU, which is what he was asking for: the current capacity on each of the
power rails.

"b) Amps don't matter."

If amps don't matter then your VA=W equation is meaningless.

Christ, look at the attributions. The original poster said that the
salesdroid told him that amps don't matter. If you're going to harangue
somebody, figure out who it should be before you start typing.

 

[David Maynard]

Doesn't the 350 W count?

Not for knowing what the amps are on the +12, +5, +3.3, -5, and -12 power
rails.

It also doesn't "count" for the AC either since, using the earlier poster's
famous equation, it is intuitively obvious that 120 VAC times 8 Amps (the
number he says he saw on the box) is 960 and not 350.

Doesn;'t the 120 Volts count?

No. It is not the voltage(s) of interest.

If we have V and W, surely we can solve
for A...

It is not an "A" that we are interested in.

He wasn't asking what size circuit breaker he might need on the wall
outlet, he wants to know if there is enough power on each of the 12, 5,
3.3, -5, and -12 volt power rails for the computer components.

 

[David Maynard]

He didn't say that in his first post. He just complained about "no
amps." Later on, after a few of us responded, he amplified his request.

Anyone who has even a basic level of PC building experience and
understanding knows what the 'amps' of interest are.

Nope.

"Nope" what? You want to argue that I don't "suspect" what I said I
"suspect?" Or do you claim some kind of omniscient capability to 'know'
precisely what he said from a post summarizing it?

Go back to his first post. You haven't been doing this long,
have you?

Long enough to know what someone means when they ask for a PSU's "amp
ratings" and that a tech should know too.

Christ, look at the attributions.

I not only know where they came from I said so in the post.

The original poster said that the
salesdroid told him that amps don't matter.

Actually, he said "the head of the tech department." I assumed the head was
also a tech, which might be incorrect but it's a fair guess.

I referenced your "VA=W" to highlight how wrong the tech was.

If you're going to harangue
somebody, figure out who it should be before you start typing.

I already did.

 

[larry moe 'n curly]

Concerning rebates, I had a MadDog rebate (through
OfficeMax) that was supposed to show up in "6 to 8
weeks", but ended up taking 6 months. Don't know
if it was OfficeMax or MD that caused the delay.

It was definitely Mad Dog's fault, as OfficeMax rebates processed by
Parago (Florida or Texas) tend to come fairly fast unless the
manufacturer is slow with payment, the record being eleven days
(Envision monitor). My last Mad Dog rebate, like yours, took six
months, and the check bounced. Because of this, I've since verified
every rebate check processed by Citizens State Bank in Minesota, AKA
Solutran, 1-888-65-8872.

 

[Bob Ward]

Not for knowing what the amps are on the +12, +5, +3.3, -5, and -12 power
rails.

It also doesn't "count" for the AC either since, using the earlier poster's
famous equation, it is intuitively obvious that 120 VAC times 8 Amps (the
number he says he saw on the box) is 960 and not 350.


No. It is not the voltage(s) of interest.


It is not an "A" that we are interested in.

He wasn't asking what size circuit breaker he might need on the wall
outlet, he wants to know if there is enough power on each of the 12, 5,
3.3, -5, and -12 volt power rails for the computer components.

Apparently, if he wants answers that are meaningful to his
application, he should leasrn to do a better job of asking the
question,m since he still hasn't made it clear in this forum just what
it is he does want - just that none of the answers he received were
it.

 

[larry moe 'n curly]

PS
Besides, I avoid rebates like the plague.

And miss out on all the free really cheap stuff that you can resell on
Ebay if you don't want it? Every CD writer, wireless router, and 256MB
DDR memory module I've gotten was free after rebate, and every HD in
the past two years has cost $55 or less, including the 200GB I bought
last Nov. I once paid $25 for an Antec case w/ 300W PSU, but that was
stupid because a month later it was available for $5 ($15 more
recently).

 

[Matt]

I know that VA=W. He wants to know amps? It gives amps. If he wants
to know more he should spell it out so that somebody who knows what he's
talking about CAN help.

That 8 Amp spec is the maximum AC input current required. He wanted to
know the maximum currents of the several DC outputs (12V, 5V, 3.3V,
etc.). You didn't know that he wanted that because you aren't very
familiar with the issues. O' course, that's not the end of the world,
but you are looking somewhat foolish to the
alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt regulars. Good that you know some things
about electricity, but that wasn't quite enough to answer the OP's
question about building computers.

 

[larry moe 'n curly]

I was thinking of getting that supply too, but I
couldn't find meaningful specs either, and rebates
from that manufacturer have been troublesome in the past.

A person who bought either a 300W or 350W Mad Dog said that it looked
just like a Thermaltake inside, meaning it was made by Sirtec, which
produces several other brands, including High Power. IOW it should be
decent but not outstanding, and it's possible that it won't be very
quiet.

If there's a Fry's Electronics in your area, be on the lookout for
their frequent deals on Antecs, most recently a 300W one with case for
$15. Sometimes it's a 350W, with or without a case.

 

[Matt]

Matt wrote:




A person who bought either a 300W or 350W Mad Dog said that it looked
just like a Thermaltake inside, meaning it was made by Sirtec, which
produces several other brands, including High Power. IOW it should be
decent but not outstanding, and it's possible that it won't be very
quiet.
Thanks.

If there's a Fry's Electronics in your area, be on the lookout for
their frequent deals on Antecs, most recently a 300W one with case for
$15. Sometimes it's a 350W, with or without a case.

That does make my heart pine to be near a Fry's.

 

[English Speaker]

Apparently, if he wants answers that are meaningful to his
application, he should leasrn to do a better job of asking the
question,m since he still hasn't made it clear in this forum just what
it is he does want - just that none of the answers he received were
it.

What don't you understand about "Unfortunately neither the MD website nor
the product box listed anything about its amp ratings."? As a hint for the
reading impaired, note the plural noun. That means more than one Bobby.

Yet you quickly reply: "I guess the web master at Mad Dog is really on the
ball - I pulled up their website, and found the amperage rating" Note the
singular noun. Does that sound like what the OP wanted Bobby?

Other readers of the thread seem to have been able to understand the OP.

 

[The Real Bev]

That 8 Amp spec is the maximum AC input current required. He wanted to
know the maximum currents of the several DC outputs (12V, 5V, 3.3V,
etc.). You didn't know that he wanted that because you aren't very
familiar with the issues. O' course, that's not the end of the world,
but you are looking somewhat foolish to the
alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt regulars.

It's x-posted into misc.consumers (where I'm reading it) and
alt.consumers.experiences. I guess the OP didn't have all that much
faith in the expertise of the a.c.h.p-h people. Maybe he should try
sci.electronics.repair, there are actually a lot of smart people there.

Good that you know some things
about electricity, but that wasn't quite enough to answer the OP's
question about building computers.

He asked about amps. Period. That seems to be the rough equivalent of
saying "My computer isn't working. What should I do?"

--
Cheers,
Bev
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
"If you put the government in charge of the desert, there would
be a sand shortage within ten years." -- M. Friedman (?)

 

[David Maynard]

Apparently, if he wants answers that are meaningful to his
application, he should leasrn to do a better job of asking the
question,m since he still hasn't made it clear in this forum just what
it is he does want - just that none of the answers he received were
it.

Well, he wasn't asking the forum for information, he was posting about how
the manufacturer's web site lacked pertinent specifications and that the
particular CompUSA store was not only also unable to provide them (which
isn't particularly surprising since the manufacturer provided none) but was
technically ignorant to the point of providing false information such as
"amps don't matter."

I'm not terribly surprised but his question was not obtuse and one would
think that a reasonably qualified computer tech should understand it
whether or not it's 'unclear' to those less familiar with PSU
specifications and what it takes to power computer electronics.

 

[Jon Danniken]

Apparently, if he wants answers that are meaningful to his
application, he should leasrn to do a better job of asking the
question,m since he still hasn't made it clear in this forum just what
it is he does want - just that none of the answers he received were
it.

The OP didn't ask a question, but gave a rant concerning the ineptidude and
disinformation provided by CompUSA.

In any case, it made perfect sense to me. DC power supplies, switching or
otherwise, always have ratings of output amerage for each voltage output,
and that was the information the OP concerned his posting with.

Jon

 

[John Doe]

I've been looking to get a new Antec case or
just an Antec power supply for my current case. A visit to both New
Egg and ZipZoomFly (the only 2 retailers I buy from)

Again... I usually just go check out retail store prices for a
laugh. There might be exceptions from time to time. I haven't seen
any recently. Usually even their sale prices aren't lower.

... I can occassionally catch one of those cases or power
supplies on sale at Micro Center, CompUSA, Circuit City, or Best
Buy and do better. For instance, I and a friend helped another
friend pick out the parts, shop for them, and build his first
homebuilt computer. He got an Antec Sonata case with power supply
for $73 from Circuit City.

That's not what they want for it right now.

ZipZoomfly wants $99.99 and $22 for shipping. New Egg wants $105
and $15.99 for
shipping. MSRP is only $119. Some deal they got going...

Due to the high shipping costs, I think cases are an item you might
be able to get cheaper locally. However, thanks in part to some
replies in this group, I bought my last case/PS from NewEgg,
SLK3700AMB with 350W power supply for $70 total.

Here is another example, again from your choosing.
Antec case/PS, SLK3700-BQE:
http://www.newegg.com/
$96 total
http://www.bestbuy.com/
$100 plus tax
http://www.officedepot.com/
$104 plus tax

I could start listing my own examples, but it would take too long.

I appreciate your efforts. If the price difference was greater
before (that's not my experience/recollection), shopping locally
must have been awful.

You might be able to find various things on sale, but I can get much
lower regular prices at the time I want to buy a component.

In addition to the previously mentioned list of advantages, the
selection of components is vastly greater online.

Registered Linux user #378193

It's not my fault.

 

[John Doe]

....

Other readers of the thread seem to have been able to understand
the OP.

Not me, it all seems so silly/trivial. In the first place, I
wouldn't want a power supply which is allegedly free.

 

[Matt]

It's x-posted into misc.consumers (where I'm reading it) and
alt.consumers.experiences. I guess the OP didn't have all that much
faith in the expertise of the a.c.h.p-h people. Maybe he should try
sci.electronics.repair, there are actually a lot of smart people there.




He asked about amps. Period. That seems to be the rough equivalent of
saying "My computer isn't working. What should I do?"

Amazing.