Are you thinking about replacing your printer?


A

Arthur Entlich

A list of options and considerations when trying to determine if you
really need that new super-duper upgrade.

E-waste is a huge issue, involving million of tons of goods, most of
which use energy dense manufacturing techniques, substantial materials,
weight, volume, and shipping histories, (all of which are resource
demanding) and use of processes which involve toxic materials during
manufacture or left behind in the devices themselves when they are
discarded.

The questions that we should each be asking when we consider replacement
of a printer (and with adaptation of these questions, with many other
electronics) are:

1) Is the improvement in speed, quality or convenience enough to justify
the costs (financial, environmental, etc) and the likely increased cost
in the use of the item/printer over an older version? (with printers in
specific, the cost of ink or toner is likely higher than with older
models, due to use of smaller cartridges, added technology to block
refilling, poorer yields, or patent protection which can prevent the
introduction of 3rd party consumables).

2) If the item is not working at its peak, can it be repaired or cleaned
to make it work as it did when new, and would this be enough to make it
a keeper for a while longer?

3) Keep in mind that some newer products require upgrades in OS software
or other hardware to operate or use advanced features, which may mean
additional costs, and more e-waste for little benefit.

4) Can the older model be used by someone else your know (family member,
school, etc) or in a different function that is desirable or needed or
can it be sold to someone who doesn't need as good a product as you do?

5) Do you have a freecycle list (freecycle.org for a full list, they are
all over the world now) or similar service in your area where you can
offer the item for free to someone out there to repair, use for parts,
etc. Or is there a program that takes these as donations where they are
refurbished and redistributed?

6) Do you have a recycling service locally which can refurbish parts or
dismantle and recycle the components? Some governments have now gone to
a taxation system which charges on new units and uses the money to offer
"free" end of life services to pay for recycling. Some charities run
drives collecting older e-waste and determine what can be refurbished or
used or sold, and the rest is taken apart and properly recycled and
disposed of.

7) Does any retailer in your area offer a trade in or recycling program
or does any manufacturer offer such a service. These services may cost
a fee for shipping and often do require a lot of shipping, which is
energy dense, so I place this option lower on the list. More local
options usually are better.

8) If there is absolutely no service for recycling, check with local
solid waste providers about toxic materials disposal that may be related
to the product.

9) If you wish to sell, trade, offer or discard a product containing a
hard drive, rather than removing and destroying the drive for security
reasons, consider downloading and using a free program that can
overwrite the drive many times to make any data non-readable even by
forensic data recovery services/programs. Many refurbishing services
(charitable, free or for profit) are finding the lack of working hard
drives has become a major barrier to them being able to clean up and
redistribute computers they receive.

Art
 
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M

Michael Johnson

Arthur said:
A list of options and considerations when trying to determine if you
really need that new super-duper upgrade.

E-waste is a huge issue, involving million of tons of goods, most of
which use energy dense manufacturing techniques, substantial materials,
weight, volume, and shipping histories, (all of which are resource
demanding) and use of processes which involve toxic materials during
manufacture or left behind in the devices themselves when they are
discarded.

The questions that we should each be asking when we consider replacement
of a printer (and with adaptation of these questions, with many other
electronics) are:

1) Is the improvement in speed, quality or convenience enough to justify
the costs (financial, environmental, etc) and the likely increased cost
in the use of the item/printer over an older version? (with printers in
specific, the cost of ink or toner is likely higher than with older
models, due to use of smaller cartridges, added technology to block
refilling, poorer yields, or patent protection which can prevent the
introduction of 3rd party consumables).

We intend to use our Canon BCI-6 based printers until they are now
longer serviceable. I still use a "D" size HP plotter I bought in the
mid 1990s. I plan to use our current printers until they can no longer
be repaired or if a repair isn't justified economically.

The printers we have are more than adequate to fill our needs. The
newer printers my be faster or have somewhat better quality but not
nearly enough to justify the expense. In my younger days I would need
the latest technology but as I get older I look at whether the purchase
is necessary and if it isn't then I don't buy.
2) If the item is not working at its peak, can it be repaired or cleaned
to make it work as it did when new, and would this be enough to make it
a keeper for a while longer?

I plan to repair our printers when needed if it is possible to do so.
With what we save on ink with them I can justify paying to repair them.
3) Keep in mind that some newer products require upgrades in OS software
or other hardware to operate or use advanced features, which may mean
additional costs, and more e-waste for little benefit.

The newer products don't offer me anything I need to have. They do
offer more hassle in using compatible inks which is a BIG negative to me.
4) Can the older model be used by someone else your know (family member,
school, etc) or in a different function that is desirable or needed or
can it be sold to someone who doesn't need as good a product as you do?

I have passed on older printers to family members and friends as I have
done with electronic items and components, in general.
5) Do you have a freecycle list (freecycle.org for a full list, they are
all over the world now) or similar service in your area where you can
offer the item for free to someone out there to repair, use for parts,
etc. Or is there a program that takes these as donations where they are
refurbished and redistributed?

We put many things on Freecycle. I recently picked up a Canon S520
listed there that just needed a reset of the waste ink counter to run
perfectly fine.
6) Do you have a recycling service locally which can refurbish parts or
dismantle and recycle the components? Some governments have now gone to
a taxation system which charges on new units and uses the money to offer
"free" end of life services to pay for recycling. Some charities run
drives collecting older e-waste and determine what can be refurbished or
used or sold, and the rest is taken apart and properly recycled and
disposed of.

I don't know of any recyclers for electronics in our area.
7) Does any retailer in your area offer a trade in or recycling program
or does any manufacturer offer such a service. These services may cost
a fee for shipping and often do require a lot of shipping, which is
energy dense, so I place this option lower on the list. More local
options usually are better.

There is an organization here that recycles cell phones.
8) If there is absolutely no service for recycling, check with local
solid waste providers about toxic materials disposal that may be related
to the product.

9) If you wish to sell, trade, offer or discard a product containing a
hard drive, rather than removing and destroying the drive for security
reasons, consider downloading and using a free program that can
overwrite the drive many times to make any data non-readable even by
forensic data recovery services/programs. Many refurbishing services
(charitable, free or for profit) are finding the lack of working hard
drives has become a major barrier to them being able to clean up and
redistribute computers they receive.

Many of my used computer parts see service in family and friend's
computers. I also sell used equipment on ebay and we also have a used
computer parts store here locally that buys these items.
 
A

andmalc

3) Keep in mind that some newer products require upgrades in OS software
or other hardware to operate or use advanced features, which may mean
additional costs, and more e-waste for little benefit.

Many older (aprox. pre-2004) HP All-in-Ones will print but lose the
other features like scanning under the new Mac Leopard release. If
you have Leopard and one of these, and are thinking you need to buy a
new, supported model, consider contacting your local Linux user group
to offer it to a member. This is because Linux has better support for
older hardware, and HP funds support for all its printers on this
operating system.

Here is a list of user groups: http://www.linux.org/groups/
 
M

measekite

Michael said:
We intend to use our Canon BCI-6 based printers until they are now
longer serviceable. I still use a "D" size HP plotter I bought in the
mid 1990s. I plan to use our current printers until they can no
longer be repaired or if a repair isn't justified economically.

The printers we have are more than adequate to fill our needs. The
newer printers my be faster or have somewhat better quality but not
nearly enough to justify the expense.
There is very little expense. A few bucks more than a set of carts.
 
T

Taliesyn

measekite said:
There is very little expense. A few bucks more than a set of carts.

In other words, cartridges are so expensive they cost almost as much as
a whole new printer. Funny, I don't recall ink for a Mt. Blanc pen
costing as much as the pen! Ink should cost no more than 5% the cost of
a new printer. If it costs about 60%, and it generally does, then we're
being ripped off.

-Taliesyn
 
T

Tony

Michael Johnson said:
Arthur Entlich wrote: snip

I don't know of any recyclers for electronics in our area.

HP runs a recycling scheme which I believe is worldwide. It is organised
through their resellers in most countries. In some parts of the world it is
free and in some there is a nominal charge. They will take back printers, PC's,
monitors etc. subject to good packaging and no monitors with broken glass. They
will take any manufacturers product also.
Anybody who is trying to get rid of old technology should try the HP reseller
near them, some may only help if you buy from them, others may be happy to help
anybody I really don't know. I just know how this scheme works in my geography.
They guarantee that everything that can be recovered from the e-waste is
recycled with very little waste.
Tony

snip
 
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M

Michael Johnson

Taliesyn said:
In other words, cartridges are so expensive they cost almost as much as
a whole new printer. Funny, I don't recall ink for a Mt. Blanc pen
costing as much as the pen! Ink should cost no more than 5% the cost of
a new printer. If it costs about 60%, and it generally does, then we're
being ripped off.

As usual he misses the point. The expense I referred to is the cost of
the new printer but, more importantly, the cost of the chipped
cartridges they use. Then again, do we expect any better from him? I
don't and neither should anyone else.
 
T

Taliesyn

Michael said:
As usual he misses the point. The expense I referred to is the cost of
the new printer but, more importantly, the cost of the chipped
cartridges they use. Then again, do we expect any better from him? I
don't and neither should anyone else.


Fortunately he's terribly bad at what he does so no one believes him.
Not even his conscience, Frank. ;-)

As for chipped cartridges... not all that much difference between them
and the old unchipped variety. Either one is about 60% cost of a new
printer.

-Taliesyn
 
M

Michael Johnson

Taliesyn said:
Fortunately he's terribly bad at what he does so no one believes him.
Not even his conscience, Frank. ;-)

As for chipped cartridges... not all that much difference between them
and the old unchipped variety. Either one is about 60% cost of a new
printer.

I thought the chipped CLI-8 cartridges are about $2-$3 more expensive
than the BCI-6 cartridges. Since we have several Canon printers in the
house I opt for buying prefilled cartridges for $1.59 each from
Neximage. Getting $100 worth of cartridges from them lasts us for
nearly a year of heavy printer use. That same amount of money wouldn't
get us two sets of OEM cartridges.
 
M

Michael Johnson

Tony said:
HP runs a recycling scheme which I believe is worldwide. It is organised
through their resellers in most countries. In some parts of the world it is
free and in some there is a nominal charge. They will take back printers, PC's,
monitors etc. subject to good packaging and no monitors with broken glass. They
will take any manufacturers product also.
Anybody who is trying to get rid of old technology should try the HP reseller
near them, some may only help if you buy from them, others may be happy to help
anybody I really don't know. I just know how this scheme works in my geography.
They guarantee that everything that can be recovered from the e-waste is
recycled with very little waste.

Now that I think about it, I haven't thrown a printer away in a very
long time. Our landfill here has separate bins for electronic components.
 
M

measekite

Michael said:
I thought the chipped CLI-8 cartridges are about $2-$3 more expensive
than the BCI-6 cartridges. Since we have several Canon printers in
the house I opt for buying prefilled cartridges for $1.59 each from
Neximage.

And then $75.00 for a printhead and then the labor to reprint the fading
snapshots. And oh how about the poorer quality?
Getting $100 worth of cartridges from them lasts us for nearly a year
of heavy printer use. That same amount of money wouldn't get us two
sets of OEM cartridges.
and longer lasting higher quality prints and no replacement printhead.
 
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T

Taliesyn

measekite said:
And then $75.00 for a printhead and then the labor to reprint the fading
snapshots. And oh how about the poorer quality?

I've had no complaints, only compliments. No poorer quality in side by
side prints, and no more fading than OEM. As for "snapshots"... well,
"snapshots" are fine for you, Measekite. I take digital photographs.
and longer lasting higher quality prints and no replacement printhead.

That is not true and no one believes you. The printhead is specified by
Canon itself as a "user replaceable part". It has a limited life span
regardless of the ink you use. Of course if you run it hot - many photos
in succession at the highest quality level without a rest, you easily
risk burning it out. But you, who prints maybe one set of cartridges per
year, your printhead doesn't have to ever worry about doing any real
work that could hurt it. You admitted in a post you were "cheap", so we
know you use it sparingly ;-)

-Taliesyn
 
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M

Michael Johnson

Taliesyn said:
I've had no complaints, only compliments. No poorer quality in side by
side prints, and no more fading than OEM. As for "snapshots"... well,
"snapshots" are fine for you, Measekite. I take digital photographs.

Print heads for our printers run around $50. Les than ONE SET of OEM
cartridges. There is nothing mousekite can say that justifies the high
purchase price of OEM ink. It figures he would use the term "snapshot".
It is right in line with the knowledge he has regarding the use of
compatible ink (i.e., zero).
That is not true and no one believes you. The printhead is specified by
Canon itself as a "user replaceable part". It has a limited life span
regardless of the ink you use. Of course if you run it hot - many photos
in succession at the highest quality level without a rest, you easily
risk burning it out. But you, who prints maybe one set of cartridges per
year, your printhead doesn't have to ever worry about doing any real
work that could hurt it. You admitted in a post you were "cheap", so we
know you use it sparingly ;-)

He keeps spewing the same old lying crap time and time again. He must
still live with his mother because that would be the only person on the
planet that would put up with his ignorant ass and she probably does it
out of pity.

Just for the record we have never had a fading issue with ANY print we
have made using compatible ink. The same goes for print heads. I'm
glad he uses OEM ink for two reasons. First one is I like to see
annoying idiots throw away their money with the hope he won't be able to
afford internet access. Second, it is idiots like him that allow me to
buy printers dirt cheap by giving Canon plenty of OEM ink related
profits and therefore subsidizing printer prices.
 

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