Anyone else going to switch to Fedora?

[john]

I just saw several hours of detail explanation of how free energy works.
While I am seeking information and learning, you are in the dark
denying reality.

--
Kenny - www.ComputerBoom.com

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

-Arthur C. Clarke
--

 

[Mark Carter]

My 486DX33 with 5 MEGS of
RAM runs linux (no GUI) without breaking a sweat.

I feel a bit of Monty Python one-downsmanship coming on.

About 10 years ago I was doing a maths PhD: numerically modelling
reaction-diffusion systems in FORTRAN. I use a 486 33 (or maybe it was
66), but it had less than 5MB RAM. Admittedly, I wasn't modelling the
weather or trying to produce animation for the cinema. Still, numerical
modelling is numerical modelling, an activity well-known for soaking up
the cycles. So the question is, if I could run numerical computations
on that effort, then exactly WTF are machines doing nowadays?

.... rhetorical question, BTW. Just in case.

An interesting activity is to examine the state of computer technology
in sci-fi films of the 70's+. The ones that stick in my mind are Aliens
and Terminator 2.

In Aliens, there was a curses type console thing going on, which changed
when a person was bumped off. The interesting thing is, that, if it
makes sense to the audience, then one could regard it is a perfectly
good interface. Which shows that there's nothing necessarily wrong with
a curses interface.

Also, I always like the scene in Terminator 2 where Sarah Connor visits
Dyson, the supposed inventor of the Terminator. They go to his house,
and he's fooling around with a computer. He has those massive floppy
disks, which I always found amusing. He goes on to state that a peek at
the chip from the original Terminator gave him ideas that he would never
have even thought of. I feel like saying "guess again, future-boy, you
should make the disks smaller for starters".

 

[Sietse Fliege]

I just saw several hours of detail explanation of how free energy
works. While I am seeking information and learning, you are in the
dark denying reality.

I'll bite. You sure that it's free energy that lightens your bulb?

 

[Al Klein]

On Sun, 9 Apr 2006 00:34:37 +0200, "Sietse Fliege"

[piggybacking]
"seeking information and learning". That's the first time I heard
"looking for ways to be fooled by someone smarter than I am" phrased
that way. Eaten any good 'shrooms lately, john? Or maybe you prefer
licking toads? I have a bridge you may be interested in buying. And
some beachfront property in Blythe, CA, I can let you have pretty
cheap.

 

[john]

get lost!

you are a total waste of time!



--
Kenny - www.ComputerBoom.com

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

-Arthur C. Clarke
--

On Sun, 9 Apr 2006 00:34:37 +0200, "Sietse Fliege"

[piggybacking]
"seeking information and learning". That's the first time I heard
"looking for ways to be fooled by someone smarter than I am" phrased
that way. Eaten any good 'shrooms lately, john? Or maybe you prefer
licking toads? I have a bridge you may be interested in buying. And
some beachfront property in Blythe, CA, I can let you have pretty
cheap.

 

[Al Klein]

get lost!

you are a total waste of time!

John isn't a *total* waste of time. He's amusing once in a while.

 

[Craig]

get lost!

you are a total waste of time!

Don't be that way;

Better entertainment value than watching the tension between Paula and
Simon!

-Craig

 

[john]

instead of posting to him trying to explain fundamental things that he
is sure to refuse, why dont I use that time and energy to post a few
messages
to people with computer problems, and help them?

You should talk to people that have functional ears. Some hear only what
they want to.

--
Kenny - www.ComputerBoom.com

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

-Arthur C. Clarke
--

 

[Brian]

Mike, What would be the better solution for a newbie into Linux for
older PIII laptop? I have Looked at Kabubtu and Puppy both look
interesting. What are the pro and cons? Any direction you could point me
towards would be helpfull.

Thx.
Brian Carter

 

[Mark Carter]

Mike, What would be the better solution for a newbie into Linux for
older PIII laptop? I have Looked at Kabubtu and Puppy both look
interesting. What are the pro and cons? Any direction you could point me
towards would be helpfull.

Thx.
Brian Carter

I'm assuming that by Mike you mean Mark, and by Kabubtu you mean Ubuntu.

I tried Puppy once, and it was fast. However, I couldn't get it to
install on my system. It seems that they're working on it - but this
feature didn't exist the last time I tried it. I'm not particularly keen
on Live CDs, because ultimately there doesn't seem much point to them
(OK, maybe possibly perhaps they're useful as emergency recovery tools,
but I wouldn't want one as my main distro).

Puppy is only 60M in size, so if you want to give it a go and find out
you don't like it, at least it didn't take too long to download. My
thoughts on the visual appeal of Puppy is that it is very icky looking -
a sick Puppy, if you will. Their website seems to have a style to match.
IIRC, their Window Manager is built on FVWM, which many people love. But
I'm not one of them.

Puppy does have the advantage that it's quite speedy. However, I expect
that you'll eventually end up wanting more softw2are than is provided on
the CD.

Which brings us onto Ubuntu. Ubuntu is an excellent distro. Other people
on this board have been evangelising MEPIS. I tried SimplyMEPIS version
3.3.1-1 recently. It installed OK. I tried to install extra development
packages, but came across installation conflicts. For this reason, I
think Ubuntu is better.

Upsides of Ubuntu are that there are a tonne of packages available for
it, and hardware detection is good. Disadvantages of it are that it's
not especially fast, I hadn't quite sussed out how to get a Samba server
working on it (although I'm ready to give it another shot, and have an
idea what I was doing wrong), and I don't like that whole sudo business.

I think Ubuntu is the best distro out there (with Slackware second). If
you're worried about the speed of your laptop, then you may want to
consider Xubuntu:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu
which is Ubuntu but uses the XFCE windows manager, a less bloated
manager than Gnome.

Dapper Drake is on the horizon (due out end of June, I believe), at
which time I'll probably download Kubuntu and give it a spin.

Hope that helps.

 

[Brian]

I'm assuming that by Mike you mean Mark, and by Kabubtu you mean Ubuntu.

I tried Puppy once, and it was fast. However, I couldn't get it to
install on my system. It seems that they're working on it - but this
feature didn't exist the last time I tried it. I'm not particularly keen
on Live CDs, because ultimately there doesn't seem much point to them
(OK, maybe possibly perhaps they're useful as emergency recovery tools,
but I wouldn't want one as my main distro).

Puppy is only 60M in size, so if you want to give it a go and find out
you don't like it, at least it didn't take too long to download. My
thoughts on the visual appeal of Puppy is that it is very icky looking -
a sick Puppy, if you will. Their website seems to have a style to match.
IIRC, their Window Manager is built on FVWM, which many people love. But
I'm not one of them.

Puppy does have the advantage that it's quite speedy. However, I expect
that you'll eventually end up wanting more softw2are than is provided on
the CD.

Which brings us onto Ubuntu. Ubuntu is an excellent distro. Other people
on this board have been evangelising MEPIS. I tried SimplyMEPIS version
3.3.1-1 recently. It installed OK. I tried to install extra development
packages, but came across installation conflicts. For this reason, I
think Ubuntu is better.

Upsides of Ubuntu are that there are a tonne of packages available for
it, and hardware detection is good. Disadvantages of it are that it's
not especially fast, I hadn't quite sussed out how to get a Samba server
working on it (although I'm ready to give it another shot, and have an
idea what I was doing wrong), and I don't like that whole sudo business.

I think Ubuntu is the best distro out there (with Slackware second). If
you're worried about the speed of your laptop, then you may want to
consider Xubuntu:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu
which is Ubuntu but uses the XFCE windows manager, a less bloated
manager than Gnome.

Dapper Drake is on the horizon (due out end of June, I believe), at
which time I'll probably download Kubuntu and give it a spin.

Hope that helps.

Sorry about that Mark. Long day at the office.
Thankyou for information. I'll Take a look at both Xuuntu and Slackware
as well.

Brian

 

[mike]

Dapper Drake is on the horizon (due out end of June, I believe), at
which time I'll probably download Kubuntu and give it a spin.

Hope that helps.

Thanks for your comments, Mark.

I've been following this as Puppy and Ubuntu have bothe worked for me, but
I have one killer problem with linux, and that's broadband internet
connection.

I bought an external 56k modem in my earlier efforts, and that worked (on
other distros that I couldn't get to work in other essential areas, but a
dialup is not quick enough for linux type d/ls, and besides I have to pay
premium rate per call!

I have a USB B/B modem (Voyager 105, prolly what all windoze B/B
subscribers get issued) but the distros all seem to require an ethernet
modem. This is all beyond me, so, the question..

Is there a distro that will get B/B through a USB modem, as I don't think
I'm prepared to follow up on the ethernet route, both for expense of buying
something that may well not work, and all the horror stories I've heard
about setting up network.

There seems to be very little discussion on this, it all seems to be taken
for granted, but for me it's a killer snag.

Yes, I am frightened to ask the regular channels.

Can you help?

mike

 

[Craig]

I'm assuming that by Mike you mean Mark, and by Kabubtu you mean Ubuntu.

That is one for the books Mark!

-Craig
p.s. Mepis & *buntu rule

 

[Mark Carter]

I bought an external 56k modem in my earlier efforts, and that worked (on
other distros that I couldn't get to work in other essential areas, but a
dialup is not quick enough for linux type d/ls, and besides I have to pay
premium rate per call!

You seem to be in the UK. A convenient way of obtaining distros at
modest cost is:
http://www.uselinux.co.uk/
Typically £1.20 per CD, but cheaper for whole distros. They're currently
doing a 35 CD bundle for £20. It includes SuSe, a distro that I think
has merit.

I have a USB B/B modem (Voyager 105, prolly what all windoze B/B
subscribers get issued)

I'm a bit confused. Are you on broadband, or 56k dialup?

but the distros all seem to require an ethernet
modem. This is all beyond me, so, the question..

It's difficult to answer specific USB modem compatability questions,
you'll probably have to Google around. My understanding is that, yes,
USB modems can be a nightmare.

The good news is that it /can/ work:
http://www.lack-of.org.uk/viewarticle.php?article=114

Is there a distro that will get B/B through a USB modem,

Possibly, but I suspect that modem support may be patchy. It may depend
on which modem, and which distro. You'd need to Google.

as I don't think
I'm prepared to follow up on the ethernet route, both for expense of buying
something that may well not work, and all the horror stories I've heard
about setting up network.

That's understandable, especially if you're just interested in exploring.

I would say that an advantage of the ethernet route is that it cuts out
a lot of complications. Instead of requiring drivers for USB or modems,
the problem is reduced to that of obtaining a driver for the NIC you
install. Support for those is excellent across all distros (at least on
desktops). In fact, driver support for NICs is far better on Linux than
on certain other operating systems I could mention .

At home, I have a Netgear DG834 router/modem. I can connect 4 computers
to it via ethernet. They can communicate to each other, and they can
share a connection to the internet; with an added bonus that it comes
with a firewall. If anything, I'd say ethernet was a less painful way of
setting up a modem.

Yes, I am frightened to ask the regular channels.

Ah, yes. The brigade of Winmodems are not modems, RTFM, STFW, asking
questions is a sign of weakness.

A question that is worth answering: is the laptop a spare machine, or is
it your main computer?

Hope that helps.

 

[Mark Carter]

Greatness creates, genius steals. In this case I adapted some lines from
Futurama. The professor might come up with a line like: we are about to
embark on a hazardous quest. And by "we", I mean "you".

That is one for the books Mark!

And I was thinking of adding: you'd think my father would be able to
remember the name of his only son.

 

[jmatt]

I tried Puppy once, and it was fast. However, I couldn't get it to
install on my system. It seems that they're working on it - but this
feature didn't exist the last time I tried it. I'm not particularly keen
on Live CDs, because ultimately there doesn't seem much point to them
(OK, maybe possibly perhaps they're useful as emergency recovery tools,
but I wouldn't want one as my main distro).

I'm in the process of trying Linux, latest Puppy ( 1.0.8 ) installs to
HD very easily & at this point of time, seems to have everything I
need.
http://www.puppyos.com/

Boot Puppy via the CD ( bios has to be set to boot from cd 1st ) then
on the Desktop > Drives > Setup > Install Puppy hard drive & follow the
prompts.
When done , change the bios back to where it was.

 

[mike]

You seem to be in the UK. A convenient way of obtaining distros at
modest cost is:
http://www.uselinux.co.uk/
Typically £1.20 per CD, but cheaper for whole distros. They're
currently doing a 35 CD bundle for £20. It includes SuSe, a distro
that I think has merit.

The problem is that my failure rate is so high, I've spent a fortune on
this sort of thing, but mostly they wouldn't even run; those that did would
fail on sound, graphics, monitor recogntion or something.

Things are much better now, I only tried again when I got BB, but there's a
much higher success rate - maybe linux is catching up )

I'm a bit confused. Are you on broadband, or 56k dialup?

Both; prepaid broadband, and a dialup number, (just in case), but I have to
dialup as a regular type of call on a moderate ripoff (0845****..) type
number

My understanding is that, yes, USB modems can be a nightmare.

The good news is that it /can/ work:
http://www.lack-of.org.uk/viewarticle.php?article=114

Oh, wow, even with such a friendly guide, I wouldn't dare, even though he's
talking about my very modem. But thanks for the reference, it shows that it
*can* be done.

But life's too short, I'm not smart enough, the usual problem - you have to
know all about it *before* you can start.
(At least with windoze you get started and *then* your trouble begin

Possibly, but I suspect that modem support may be patchy. It may
depend on which modem, and which distro. You'd need to Google.

I would say that an advantage of the ethernet route is that it cuts
out a lot of complications. Instead of requiring drivers for USB or
modems, the problem is reduced to that of obtaining a driver for the
NIC you install. Support for those is excellent across all distros (at
least on desktops). In fact, driver support for NICs is far better on
Linux than on certain other operating systems I could mention .


A question that is worth answering: is the laptop a spare machine, or
is it your main computer?

I've got two desktops, main and reserve (I run a community type website).

I'd like to isntall linux on the spare, I've tried a lot of distros, but
gave up until recently Ubuntu (3rd try) looks as if it would work.

Once I'm fluent on the spare, I'd install on the main one

But as I rely on windows to connect to the net, I can't begin to think of
swapping to linux. I have succeeded with an external 56K modem, but these
days that's not really adequate.

Hope that helps.

It did, thanks; I either think about ethernet, or wait a bit longer to see
what happens. I can at least stop worrying for a bit.

Thank you for the comprehensive answer, and the references; on following
some up I found that many USB modems are like winmodems, as (according to
one writer) the USB connection is so capable that it transfers many
functions into the CPU, instead of the modem being stand alone.

That could explain why there's so little support, but not why it's so hard
to find out, on dialup the first thing they said was "get a proper modem",
so I did.

But you've cleared up a great deal, and when I finally have to move
reluctantly from 98SE, if I can crack the connection problem I may have a
chance with linux, and now I know what to look for.

many thanks

mike