Activation comments with other products beside Microsoft

[Greg P Rozelle]

To Testy

You need to read my threads closer . I was talking about other
software that requires activation not oses at first. Yes it got
brought up later in this thread. I have a real good conversation
with Gary Woodruff. He has his beliefs and I have my beliefs.
I just don't want activation to come over to other household products
like a Microwave oven.

I respond to Alex Nichol post he claimed I exaggerated.
So, I showed him proof that I was not.

As far as Changing Oses. You didn't read my other thread, Where I
said-I don't use xp except to tinker and keep it updated.
Another reason is I keep it -is to help people. I am using 98se
edition most of the time.

Greg P Rozelle


Disclaimer
My advice is as-is. It could trash your system.

 

[Ronnie Vernon MVP]

Fairly using software is not theft. Prove that it is, then you can
sit on your moral high ground, but until then I will excercise my
right to free speech, because there is nothing immoral, nor illegal
about helping people to use the products that they have legally
purchased.

Free speech is not a universal right to say what you wish, regardless of the
consequence. The only thing that free speech guarantees you the right to do
is express your opinion. It does not guarantee the right to counsel others
on what may be illegal activity.

--
Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User

Please reply to the newsgroup so all may benefit.
Unsolicited e-mail is not answered.

 

[Ronnie Vernon MVP]

Well a company that is being hurt by theft, wouldn't have cash
reserves that keep growing & growing.

The only

That gets its paying customer to make up for any theft of their
product in the price of it.

XX>Well, welcome to the real world Kurttrail. You need to name me a company
that does not pass on any losses to the end user. I wonder if you or any of
the other people who promote piracy ever feel any guilt about hurting the
end users of software?

While we of the non-pirating nations pay for it through the teeth, and
we get to pay more to treated as the potential thieves!


http://snurl.com/22tv

XX>You will need to get better stats than this, it is really pathetic. Let's
see from that first link:

problem with Windows checking the license for this computer
6 in August
8 in July
15 in June
7 in may
12 in April

And this one even has a KB article with the fix.

It's been a long time since there was a reported

http://snurl.com/27l9

XX>This one mainly has messages that point to an error that is caused by
third party software. The fix for this was published in June, 2002.

When there is a problem, it is usually caused by the

Really? And you have something more than suspicion to prove this?

XX>See above.

LOL! I mooned Gov. Kean of NJ when I was at college, but that was a
couple of decades ago!

XX>I knew you weren't all bad. )

I was talking about dropping my shorts in private, and have some
technology reporting about it! Technoloical controls are still in
it's infancy. They ain't even walking yet. What they will grow up
into doesn't bode well.

XX>WPA isn't about spying on you any more than getting a social security
card is about spying on you. shucks, there are real spyware apps that make
WPA look like a toy.

Your efforts are mis-directed. While you are playing with Microsoft, the
real bad guys are stealing your freedom from right under your nose. You
still have choices, why not just hit the off switch and go get some open
source to play with.

That's what the legal system is for! I'm just trying to help my
fellow law-abiding citizens to be able to use the product they
legally buy as easily as possible, and technologies like PA & DRM do
not add anything to the ease of use of a computer!

XX>Uh, there are some values involved here. You are telling law abiding
citizens that the right thing to do is lie, cheat and violate a contract???

--
Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User

Please reply to the newsgroup so all may benefit.
Unsolicited e-mail is not answered.

 

[kurttrail]

Free speech is not a universal right to say what you wish, regardless
of the consequence. The only thing that free speech guarantees you
the right to do is express your opinion. It does not guarantee the
right to counsel others on what may be illegal activity.

So "Sue me!" I stand by & behind my words. You can not BS me with your
pompous FUD.

I noticed that you didn't try to prove that "fairly using" software is
actually theft, because you can't. Easier to try your to FUD your way
out, huh?

I also noticed that you didn't answer my other post to you, about all
the people eXPeriencing problems PA, despite your fallacious claim,
"It's been a long time since there was a reported problem that was a
result of WPA not working as designed." Easier to answer to try to FUD
your way out of this one, huh?

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.kurttrail.com
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei!"

 

[kurttrail]

Well, welcome to the real world Kurttrail. You need to name me a
company
that does not pass on any losses to the end user.

So why have the technological controls on the people that are actually
paying for the product & for other people theft too?!

I wonder if you or
any of the other people who promote piracy ever feel any guilt about
hurting the end users of software?

LOL! Next you'll be telling everyone I'm a terrorist. That BS doesn't
work for the Partnership for a Drug-Free America, and it ain't gonna
work for you. I promote "fair use" of copyrighted material by those
that have legally purchased the copyrighted material. More FUD, coming
to expect nothing less for you, just like in the old days back in the
Windows XP Preview PA group. Glad to see you haven't changed your
tactics one bit!


It's a general search. And over less than two years there are hundreds
of errors that have been reported in MS Newsgroups. Times that by the
real world, and that extrapolates to thousands upon thousands.

problem with Windows checking the license for this computer
6 in August
8 in July
15 in June
7 in may
12 in April

And this one even has a KB article with the fix.

So? Only one has a KB article? How many people getting screwed by PA
errors is enough for you?

third party software. The fix for this was published in June, 2002.

Doesn't mean these people weren't screwed out of their computers by the
error, and all these were recent, even the one that don't of KB fixes.
So much for your fallacious claim, "It's been a long time since there
was a reported problem that was a result of WPA not working as
designed," unless you believe that PA was design to be screwing people
out of their computers!

I see nothing about that covers that these error were the result of
"someone taking less than ethical advice and trying to lie their way
through an activation." More FUD!

card is about spying on you.

The gov't has the soveriegnty, MS doesn't. My social security card is
tied to me, not to some inanimated object that I own. Surely PA
technology isn't about helping to protect how I privately use computer,
now is it?

shucks, there are real spyware apps that
make WPA look like a toy.

At least your finally comparing PA to Spyware. That's a start.

Your efforts are mis-directed.

Totally subjective.

While you are playing with Microsoft,

MS sold me on their PA-disabled Office suite on their piracy FUD. Now
I'm trying to help those like myself, that fell for the FUD too, and to
help others those that haven't yet fallen for FUD from making the same
mistake that I did.

the real bad guys are stealing your freedom from right under your
nose.

You mean, people like you that are not only are willingly accepting &
paying for technological controls on human behavior, but actively
preaching it's "virtues" to others, right?

You still have choices, why not just hit the off switch and go
get some open source to play with.

LOL! That a 'round about way of telling me to take a flying leap! Do
you really think I'm going anywhere?

Yes, and individuals right to "fairly use" the copyright material that
they legally have purchased.

You are telling law abiding
citizens that the right thing to do is lie, cheat and violate a
contract???

No, I tell them the truth, and I tell them to come to their own
decisions. "Sue me," if you don't like it. This is America, after all,
and anybody can be sued for just about anything. You are nothing but
FUD, and totally transparent too. You should go to work for SCO, as I
hear their looking for people to mindlessly spread FUD!

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.kurttrail.com
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei!"

 

[Alex Nichol]

I am not exaggerating Here are the products that require activation.
I know some are not for the home user.

I must point out I did say 'in relation to the way MS do it'. Which
amounts to maybe 30 seconds on a net connection. Multiply that by your
list and you are nowhere near 'sitting around all day' even if you
install them all the same day.

I don't particularly like activation. But the casual copying had got to
levels that MS had to do *something* about (unless you accept the 'free
for all' that is suggested), and a lot of work went into making the
technique they chose as painless as possible. And I have not been able
to think of any alternative that would not be a good deal worse.

 

[Greg P Rozelle]

To Ronnie Vernon

Free speech is not a universal right to say what you wish, regardless of the
consequence. The only thing that free speech guarantees you the right to do
is express your opinion. It does not guarantee the right to counsel others
on what may be illegal activity.

I don't like Kurttrail Tactics. I will have to strongly disagree with
your interruption of Free Speech. You are allowed to say anything you
want on paper or on a web site. Aclu has sued web sites for removing
people's web pages and won. It not the fault of the publisher--it is
the person who reads it and decides to take action. Now saying fire
in a movie theater when their is not. That is totally different. You
also keep forgetting another thing it is called Freedom of The press
which also applies to the internet. These reasons is why Microsoft has
not gone after Kurttrail for his website.

Greg P Rozelle




Disclaimer
My advice is as-is. It could trash your system.

 

[Greg P Rozelle]

Corrected Post
To Ronnie Vernon

Free speech is not a universal right to say what you wish, regardless of the
consequence. The only thing that free speech guarantees you the right to do
is express your opinion. It does not guarantee the right to counsel others
on what may be illegal activity.

I don't like Kurttrail Tactics. I will have to strongly disagree with
your interpretation of Free Speech. You are allowed to say anything
you want on paper or on a web site. Aclu has sued web sites for
removing people's web pages and won. It not the fault of the
publisher--it is the person who reads it and decides to take action.
Now saying fire in a movie theater when their is not. That is totally
different. You also keep forgetting another thing it is called
Freedom of The Press which also applies to the internet. These reasons
is why Microsoft has not gone after Kurttrail for his website.

Greg P Rozelle

Disclaimer
My advice is as-is. It could trash your system.

 

[Joh N.]

Ronnie Vernon MVP, after spending 3 minutes figuring out which end of the pen to
use, wrote:

Free speech is not a universal right to say what you wish, regardless of the
consequence. The only thing that free speech guarantees you the right to do
is express your opinion. It does not guarantee the right to counsel others
on what may be illegal activity.

Then maybe you'd best get off your ass and tell it to *everyone* else who says
the same or differently about WPA. Bruce C. sure does spout it off as 'legal or
illegal'...where the hell have you been to tell *him*?
By the way idiot...free speech is *EXACTLY* my right to say what I wish, it's
up to *me* to know what the consequence(s) will bring from it...not you, not
the government, not some stink-ass lawyer. Maybe you ought to get out and find
a few veterans and beg them to let you kiss their asses for fighting to keep
those freedoms you seem to so easily toss aside...I'd let you kiss mine, but
your lips have been on Bill G's ass too long and I don't know what you'd end up
spreading to me.

Joh N.

 

[Joh N.]

Alex Nichol, after spending 3 minutes figuring out which end of the pen to use,
wrote:

I don't particularly like activation. But the casual copying had got to
levels that MS had to do *something* about (unless you accept the 'free
for all' that is suggested), and a lot of work went into making the
technique they chose as painless as possible. And I have not been able
to think of any alternative that would not be a good deal worse.

Again, I'll ask...how is it possible, that M$ could even remotely say 'casual
copying' is so abundant that they have to prematurely accuse any potential
customer of being a thief? Did they have an M$ lackey stand in every home of
every box sold while the customer installed it? There's just no way *anyone*
can say 'casual copying' was so rife as M$ makes it out to be.

Joh N.

 

[kurttrail]

Like a broken clock you are right on occasion.

Thanks, Andrew.

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.kurttrail.com
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei!"

 

[sipowtiz_00]

Free speech is not a universal right to say what you wish, regardless of the
consequence. The only thing that free speech guarantees you the right to do
is express your opinion. It does not guarantee the right to counsel others
on what may be illegal activity.

Of course free speech only applies to the Government not to private
firms like M$. Kurt has no rights on what is a M$ newsgroup. He has
the privilege to post but not the right to do so. M$ has the right to
revoke his privilege to post any time it wants. The fact that it
hasn't speaks volumes on M$ and it's culture.

Andrew

 

[sipowtiz_00]

By the way, that's still done today, it's called a "LIBRARY". I don't see
the RIAA trying to close down libraries, even though they have copyrighted
music and movies available for others, because they are following the rules.

Richard you really haven't been paying attention. There are a lot of
authors and musicians who would love to close down libraries or charge
by them by the use of their product. Greed knows no bounds.

Andrew

 

[Richard G. Harper [MVP Win9x]]

Maybe ... but I have yet to hear of a case where a library has been sued or
charged violations of the copyright laws.

 

[kurttrail]

Of course free speech only applies to the Government not to private
firms like M$.

Then don't put the label of "public" on their NG's, if your gonna pick &
choose what you allow people to say.

Kurt has no rights on what is a M$ newsgroup. He has
the privilege to post but not the right to do so. M$ has the right to
revoke his privilege to post any time it wants. The fact that it
hasn't speaks volumes on M$ and it's culture.

Then MS should announce that opinions that are different than MS's
opinions will be removed. Why lie about these NG's being open to the
public?

--
Peace!
Kurt
Self-anointed Moderator
microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea
http://microscum.kurttrail.com
"Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron!
"Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei!"

 

[Greg P Rozelle]

To Andrew
Yes it does apply to private firms when the do stuff in public.
Otherwise people couldn't protest outside private medical clinics.

Greg P Rozelle

(e-mail address removed) Andrew wrote:
Of course free speech only applies to the Government not to private
firms like M$. Kurt has no rights on what is a M$ newsgroup. He has
the privilege to post but not the right to do so. M$ has the right to
revoke his privilege to post any time it wants. The fact that it
hasn't speaks volumes on M$ and it's culture.

Andrew

Disclaimer
My advice is as-is. It could trash your system.

 

[Freddy Smith]

Activation has reduced casual piracy substantially just as it was intended to. No it
will not stop someone bent on pirating but it does stop those that normally would not
pirate but are not aware that what they are doing is against the commitment they made
when they first installed their software. I have only once had Activation take up
more then a few seconds of my time and that was when I had made several changes in
hardware and had to do a phone activation. It went much smoother then I expected
with voice activation taking my list of numbers and providing my activation sequence
back to me. Total time including wait time less then 10 minutes.

So Activation has done exactly what it was intended to do. It came about as the
statistics showed that over 50% of the copies of Win98 and Millennium being installed
were pirated copies and a large percentage of them were of the casual variety. It
has not been nearly so intrusive as many expected. I would expect the trend for
others to use activation to continue. That is unless everyone starts purchasing the
software they use rather then just borrowing their Brother in laws CD for a couple
days.
--
Gary Woodruff
MS MVP Windows Shell/User

"That'll be the day" - John Wayne in The Searchers

I simply dumped Windoze and installed Linux on my puter. MS simply blows.

...fred

 

[Hugh Candlin]

To Hugh.
http://www.aclu.org/
The aclu has went to court of this matter and
has won. It was on their website at one time.

I'll ignore that as useless information.

If your were right Hugh, Than the internet wouldn't have millions
of "web pages with different views"

I am correct.

We also wouldn't have inappropriate books & videos for sale.

Irrelevant to you claim.

I have never heard of Steven King being sued for making a Movie
that caused someone else to do something.

Irrelevant to your claim.

There are illegal things in books & movies even.

There are illegal acts DEPICTED in books and movies.
There is a huge difference between that
and someone actually performing such actions.

Now taking action on what you read or see
that is totally different.

I think you mean what I just said?

Look at the Unauthorized Story of Threes Company NBC
The actors & producers tried to stop it but didn't win.

Irrelevant to your claim.

All you have to have is a "Legal Disclaimer on your web page"
Baloney.

Disclamier & copyright info
No derogatory comment meant against anyone.
"Unautorized Story of Three Company" is Copyrighted.
NBC is a registered trademark
Aclu is copyrighted.

Just one example to prove that you are wrong.

Under Section 871(a) of Title 18, United States Code,
prohibiting threatening the President of the United States,
"true threats" satisfy the statute's threshold of criminal conduct
and put the conduct beyond the protections of the First Amendment;
whether a statement is a "true threat" is determined by (1) the context,
(2) whether the threat is expressly conditional in nature,
and (3) the reaction of the listeners.

Still think that you can say what you want without freedom
from repercussions. Violate the above section and you will
be guaranteed a knock on your door and a ride in a very
large, very black SUV.

I'm no radical. I have never been in trouble with the law.
I responded to your post strictly as an analyst reviewing
your claim to see if it held water. It does not.

Freedom of speech is not unrestricted.

 

[sipowtiz_00]

To Andrew
Yes it does apply to private firms when the do stuff in public.
Otherwise people couldn't protest outside private medical clinics.

You can protest outside my house but you can't come in. You can
protest in the street but you can't enter my property. When you go to
work do you think you can't be fired for what you say? You don't have
the right to free speech unless you are willing to pay the price. Kurt
isn't.

Like Kurt you don't know what you are talking about.

Andrew

 

[sipowtiz_00]

Maybe ... but I have yet to hear of a case where a library has been sued or
charged violations of the copyright laws.

Wait.

I forget who the country artist was who called for a boycott of a
record chain because they were selling used CDs. He felt he was being
cheated out of his royalties. Apparently he never heard of the right
of first sale.

Andrew