U
Unknown
I most certainly would like to read your lawyers answer. Please contact him
and post his answer here.
and post his answer here.
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D
DJS0302
I find this unconscionable. I contest this based on the fact that I
I like to compare owning a copy of Windows with owning a book. Both are
intellectual properties. It's illegal for me to make copies of either one and
sell them. The only difference is I don't have to buy multiple copies of the
same book for each room in my house.
purchased a copy of the software which is mine. M$ owns the code, and I
may not reverse engineer it, but I should dang well be able to use my
copy of the software as I please in the privacy of my own home for
non-commercial purposes. It's called fair use rights.
I like to compare owning a copy of Windows with owning a book. Both are
intellectual properties. It's illegal for me to make copies of either one and
sell them. The only difference is I don't have to buy multiple copies of the
same book for each room in my house.
J
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
As far a software is concerned, Microsoft is not selling software.
Also Microsoft is not renting software.
Although the detractors often attempt to spread this misinformation to
the ignorant.
Microsoft sells a license to use the software under terms agreed to by
both parties.
If you choose to ignore the other options I suppose you will feel
there is no choice.
The people that use Linux for one will disagree with you when you say
there is no choice.
Many of them are quite happy with the operating system.
Many people use Open Office and are quite pleased.
There are no options for those who choose not to see.
You are not forced to buy it at all.
Whether to buy or not is a CHOICE each buyer needs to make.
Also Microsoft is not renting software.
Although the detractors often attempt to spread this misinformation to
the ignorant.
Microsoft sells a license to use the software under terms agreed to by
both parties.
If you choose to ignore the other options I suppose you will feel
there is no choice.
The people that use Linux for one will disagree with you when you say
there is no choice.
Many of them are quite happy with the operating system.
Many people use Open Office and are quite pleased.
There are no options for those who choose not to see.
You are not forced to buy it at all.
Whether to buy or not is a CHOICE each buyer needs to make.
J
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
Yes, it would be interesrting to see what your lawyer (the one
successfully specializing in software licensing) has to say.
successfully specializing in software licensing) has to say.
J
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
Your example is not really not all that bad.
Do you remove the book from one room before you take it to another
room?
Or do you copy the book so multiple users in various locations can
read it at the same time?
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
I like to compare owning a
copy of Windows with owning a book. Both are
Do you remove the book from one room before you take it to another
room?
Or do you copy the book so multiple users in various locations can
read it at the same time?
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
I like to compare owning a
copy of Windows with owning a book. Both are
J
Jone Doe
DJS0302 said:I like to compare owning a copy of Windows with owning a book. Both are
intellectual properties. It's illegal for me to make copies of either one and
sell them. The only difference is I don't have to buy multiple copies of the
same book for each room in my house.
Doesn't hold up again. If you want to have a separate copy of a book in
each room of your house, how many books must you buy?
G
Greg R
Hey Bruce.
There are places still in the U.S. the keep their doors unlocked. I
stopped using norton because of thier activation.
Others,
As far a choices. You cant walk into walmart or sears and buy a Linux
system preinstalled with a modem. (Or a least not in my area)
Linux will not run all windows program either.
Red hat does have an activation but is not required.
Greg R
There are places still in the U.S. the keep their doors unlocked. I
stopped using norton because of thier activation.
Others,
As far a choices. You cant walk into walmart or sears and buy a Linux
system preinstalled with a modem. (Or a least not in my area)
Linux will not run all windows program either.
Red hat does have an activation but is not required.
Greg R
G
Greg R
Finally a reasonable post,
I never thought of that like that. A lot better the kurttrails post
even.
I never thought of that like that. A lot better the kurttrails post
even.
J
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
But you can order a Lindows computer from Wal-Mart:
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product_listing.gsp?cat=96356&path=0:3944:3951:41937:96356
Yes, it has a modem.
So even at Wal-Mart there are CHOICES.
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product_listing.gsp?cat=96356&path=0:3944:3951:41937:96356
Yes, it has a modem.
So even at Wal-Mart there are CHOICES.
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
Greg R said:As far a choices. You cant walk into walmart or sears and buy a Linux
system preinstalled with a modem. (Or a least not in my area)
Linux will not run all windows program either.
Red hat does have an activation but is not required.
Greg R
J
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
How does a book compare to Windows?
A book can not be used in more than one location at a time.
A book can not be copied so multiple users in different locations can
use at the same time.
Since you think this example is reasonable and comparable, you also
think the similar restrictions in the EULA are reasonable.
Remember...it was you that said "Finally a reasonable post..."
A book can not be used in more than one location at a time.
A book can not be copied so multiple users in different locations can
use at the same time.
Since you think this example is reasonable and comparable, you also
think the similar restrictions in the EULA are reasonable.
Remember...it was you that said "Finally a reasonable post..."
D
David Candy
You can copy one chapter of a book.
J
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
for reviews and such there are provisions to copy sections of books
for limited purposes.
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
You can copy one chapter of a book.
--
----------------------------------------------------------
'Not happy John! Defending our democracy',
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/29/1088392635123.html
for limited purposes.
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
You can copy one chapter of a book.
--
----------------------------------------------------------
'Not happy John! Defending our democracy',
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/29/1088392635123.html
Jupiter Jones said:How does a book compare to Windows?
A book can not be used in more than one location at a time.
A book can not be copied so multiple users in different locations can
use at the same time.
Since you think this example is reasonable and comparable, you also
think the similar restrictions in the EULA are reasonable.
Remember...it was you that said "Finally a reasonable post..."
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
Greg R said:Finally a reasonable post,
I never thought of that like that. A lot better the kurttrails post
even.
D
David Candy
I wonder if there is a time limit. Copy a chapter a day and don't put the chapters with each other.
--
----------------------------------------------------------
'Not happy John! Defending our democracy',
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/29/1088392635123.html
--
----------------------------------------------------------
'Not happy John! Defending our democracy',
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/29/1088392635123.html
Jupiter Jones said:for reviews and such there are provisions to copy sections of books
for limited purposes.
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
You can copy one chapter of a book.
--
----------------------------------------------------------
'Not happy John! Defending our democracy',
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/29/1088392635123.html
Jupiter Jones said:How does a book compare to Windows?
A book can not be used in more than one location at a time.
A book can not be copied so multiple users in different locations can
use at the same time.
Since you think this example is reasonable and comparable, you also
think the similar restrictions in the EULA are reasonable.
Remember...it was you that said "Finally a reasonable post..."
J
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
I am not familiar with copyright law but I think it also stipulates
the purpose of the copies.
I think the length is a % of the total.
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
I wonder if there is a time limit. Copy a chapter a day and don't put
the chapters with each other.
--
----------------------------------------------------------
'Not happy John! Defending our democracy',
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/29/1088392635123.html
the purpose of the copies.
I think the length is a % of the total.
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
I wonder if there is a time limit. Copy a chapter a day and don't put
the chapters with each other.
--
----------------------------------------------------------
'Not happy John! Defending our democracy',
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/29/1088392635123.html
Jupiter Jones said:for reviews and such there are provisions to copy sections of books
for limited purposes.
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
You can copy one chapter of a book.
--
----------------------------------------------------------
'Not happy John! Defending our democracy',
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/29/1088392635123.html
Jupiter Jones said:How does a book compare to Windows?
A book can not be used in more than one location at a time.
A book can not be copied so multiple users in different locations can
use at the same time.
Since you think this example is reasonable and comparable, you also
think the similar restrictions in the EULA are reasonable.
Remember...it was you that said "Finally a reasonable post..."
D
David Candy
Chapter for books, 10% for articles. And it's for review. But if you are reading a book is one not reviewing it? This is far more interesting than OEM software.
--
----------------------------------------------------------
'Not happy John! Defending our democracy',
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/29/1088392635123.html
--
----------------------------------------------------------
'Not happy John! Defending our democracy',
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/06/29/1088392635123.html
Jupiter Jones said:I am not familiar with copyright law but I think it also stipulates
the purpose of the copies.
I think the length is a % of the total.
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
I wonder if there is a time limit. Copy a chapter a day and don't put
the chapters with each other.
D
DJS0302
our example is not really not all that bad.
It's a lot easier to carry a book from room to room than it is to carry my
computer from room. Even worse would be if I had more than one computer and I
had to uninstall Windows from one machine and then install on different machine
every time I went from say the bedroom to the den.
I think it all comes down to degrees. Copying software or printed material to
sell for profit is wrong but I'm sure we've all copied stuff from books for our
own personal use even though they clearly state that no part of this
publication may be reproduced etc. , and I'm sure most of us have loaned a
friend a copy of a computer game to install on their computer even though most
EULA say you can't. However, if I had more than one computer and wanted to
install a particular piece of software on each one I wouldn't go out and buy a
copy for each computer. That's just wasteful.
Do you remove the book from one room before you take it to another
room?
Or do you copy the book so multiple users in various locations can
read it at the same time?
It's a lot easier to carry a book from room to room than it is to carry my
computer from room. Even worse would be if I had more than one computer and I
had to uninstall Windows from one machine and then install on different machine
every time I went from say the bedroom to the den.
I think it all comes down to degrees. Copying software or printed material to
sell for profit is wrong but I'm sure we've all copied stuff from books for our
own personal use even though they clearly state that no part of this
publication may be reproduced etc. , and I'm sure most of us have loaned a
friend a copy of a computer game to install on their computer even though most
EULA say you can't. However, if I had more than one computer and wanted to
install a particular piece of software on each one I wouldn't go out and buy a
copy for each computer. That's just wasteful.
J
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
No, it is not wistful unless you also equate wasteful with honest.
What does the specific EULA state?
Does it allow multiple installations?
Some do and some don't.
If not and you do it is theft and not waste.
Degrees is often just another excuse to justify theft.
Thieves use that excuse often.
Why is there a need to install a piece of software illegally on a
computer?
Or is it mostly a desire and being cheap?
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
It's a lot easier to carry a
book from room to room than it is to carry my
What does the specific EULA state?
Does it allow multiple installations?
Some do and some don't.
If not and you do it is theft and not waste.
Degrees is often just another excuse to justify theft.
Thieves use that excuse often.
Why is there a need to install a piece of software illegally on a
computer?
Or is it mostly a desire and being cheap?
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
It's a lot easier to carry a
book from room to room than it is to carry my
G
Greg R
Jupiter,
It has not be proven illegal. It is against the eula.
However, we don't know if the eula is legal either.
Greg R
..On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 18:18:46 -0600, "Jupiter Jones [MVP]"
It has not be proven illegal. It is against the eula.
However, we don't know if the eula is legal either.
Greg R
..On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 18:18:46 -0600, "Jupiter Jones [MVP]"
W
Woody
Greg don't even bother , as jj just said MS's eula is law and even
questioning it makes you a thief in their eyes .
questioning it makes you a thief in their eyes .
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