[PL] PL2005 Ware Issues

O

omega

Susan Bugher said:
Just checking to make sure I understand. Some Liteware apps have greyed
out commands. I believe you're saying that FA doesn't - that you can
only tell if a command is usable by clicking on it? At which point if
the command is unusable you see an ad for the PRO version?
Click to expand...

http://www.redshift.com/~omega/clips/var/FAdemo/fa-popup.png

[From the Main Menu]
File > Import Messages...
File > Import/Export RC
Edit > Global Search
[...]

I dislike greyed menus, but this is even more offensive. In Free Agent,
you don't know that all of those commands are fake - hidden traps - until
you actually click them. Then for result you get slammed with FA's popup
"Buy-or-FOAD" message.
 
O

omega

Reading my first reply to this, it occurs to me I could have written
a better reply. So here is my new, improved variation. <g>

Susan Bugher said:
[Free Agent}

that you can only tell if a command is usable by clicking on it?
At which point if the command is unusable you see an ad for the
PRO version?

Is that the way it works?
Click to expand...

Yes.
 
O

omega

Bjorn Simonsen said:
omega wrote in <[email protected]>:
[Free Agent]
Definitely crippleware.
Click to expand...
What concerns me is the mode of interaction with the user, the interface.
It is filled with so many false commands.
Click to expand...

<http://google.com/groups?&[email protected]>
Click to expand...

: In other words, I don't know how "extensive" those NAG
: screens are... I mean - how often will they pop up and how easy are
: they triggered or how easy can they be avoided? My immediate
: impression was they would pop up when you tried to do simple and
: "obvious" stuff, like message sorting...stuff that is hard to remember
: to steer clear off. I mean some features you are familiar with and use
: every day with other programs (like sort order, as in changing the
: file sort order in a file manager, message sort order in e-mail client
: and so on), and thus it harder to steer clear off than say features
: you hardly ever use

FA is a mine field. You don't have any sense of what is a real command and
what is a booby trap. Click on the wrong command -- yes, for perfectly natural
functions, such as trying to sort messages, or hitting undo in the message
editor -- and wham, SOL, and up comes the FOAD popup.
 
S

Susan Bugher

omega said:
Susan Bugher <[email protected]>:

[Free Agent}
that you can only tell if a command is usable by clicking on it?
At which point if the command is unusable you see an ad for the
PRO version?

Is that the way it works?
Click to expand...

Yes.
Click to expand...

The prosecution seems to have a good case. The Ware ballot is for
*controversial* apps. Are there any Free Agent advocates who wish to
offer a rebuttal?

If not, ISTM I should remove Free Agent from the PL2005 Nominations list.

Susan
 
B

Bjorn Simonsen

omega wrote in said:
FA is a mine field. You don't have any sense of what is a real command and
what is a booby trap. Click on the wrong command -- yes, for perfectly natural
functions, such as trying to sort messages, or hitting undo in the message
editor -- and wham, SOL, and up comes the FOAD popup.
Click to expand...

Thank you Karen for verifying this. The issues noted does not leave
much doubt IHMO.

All the best
Bjorn Simonsen
 
B

Bjorn Simonsen

Susan Bugher wrote in said:
Thank you Bjorn. Somehow I missed that post last year. :(
Click to expand...

What? Are you saying you don't read and remember everything
ever posted here? :)

All the best,
Bjorn Simonsen
 
S

Susan Bugher

Bjorn said:
What? Are you saying you don't read and remember everything
ever posted here? :)
Click to expand...

of *course* I read and remember it all!

The dang server must have dropped your post. . . ;)

Susan
 
B

Bjorn Simonsen

Susan Bugher wrote in said:
Have you got a better one? I'm open to suggestions. . . :)
Click to expand...

:) Maybe the honest version?
"Because of a interface problem I could not read your message.
The faulty interface probably lies somewhere between the chair
and the keyboard."

Or say:
"I did see your message, and intended to read it, but you know
how it is, whenever you set out to do something, something else
must be done first."

/^^^\
( @ @ )
---m---U---m---
"All I can do is hang in there
and take one day at a time!"

All the best,
Bjorn Simonsen
 
S

Susan Bugher

Bjorn said:
:) Maybe the honest version?
"Because of a interface problem I could not read your message.
The faulty interface probably lies somewhere between the chair
and the keyboard."

Or say:
"I did see your message, and intended to read it, but you know
how it is, whenever you set out to do something, something else
must be done first."

/^^^\
( @ @ )
---m---U---m---
"All I can do is hang in there
and take one day at a time!"
Click to expand...

Thank you for the additional excuses, I especially like the "faulty
interface" one.

FWIW - I was replying to the spirit of the post. . . :)

Actually. . .

"the server dropped it" was the *honest* version. I checked my Treepad
file before I posted - it did not have your 2003 post about FA (did have
one from Karen) - I'm sure that at the *least* I would have saved your
post if I'd seen it - and Jo's program description really didn't show up
on my server.

Jo knew that. . . and I knew that he knew. . .

etc. etc. etc. ;)

"Go to father" she said when I asked her to wed and she knew that I knew
that her father was dead and she knew that I knew what she *meant* when
she said "Go to father".

Susan
 
S

Susan Bugher

Bjorn said:
Me too :)
Click to expand...

ah so. . . I'll pay more attention in the future. . .

and check quotations. . .

“Go to father,” she said, When he asked her to wed,
And she knew that he knew that her father was dead,
And she knew that he knew what a life he had led,
So she knew that he knew what she meant as she said,
“Go to father.” (Thomas P. Schnapp)

Susan
 
O

omega

Bjorn Simonsen said:
Agree about v.2, but see comment about previous version 1.93 in
Click to expand...

Regarding v1.93 FA. See: <[email protected]>.
The anti-freeware essence of both is the same. It's merely that the
offense is climbing in degree. Both versions are corrupt to the bone.

Bjorn, also see: <[email protected]> ;) You
could go back and look at FA again if you wanted -- by toggling your
Agent into the cripple mode. Commenting out your registration key nr
in your active ini does a reasonable effect for providing the test run.
(Tho' that method is not 100%; a main thing is that your pay feature
of folders you had already created -- they don't vanish.)

When you launch and look at messages, what's the first thing you're
going to do if offline, or second thing if online? Same as with me,
I bet, Bjorn, since we're both message collectors. You're going to
tap the column headers to toggle between All and Unread, or between
Thread and Date, or similar. You can guess the result. Whamo. The
Buy-or-Foad message, that is implanted everywhere.

I went back once again through the v193 tonight. There is one detail
I noticed this time, and it applies to both v193 and v20. The menus
that have disabled commands, there is a small advance sign. There is
a tiny dot on all thos menus that are not functional, and instead
existing for promotional purposes. So, to an extent, you could start
looking for dots when you view what choices you have. Then, sometimes
you will need to fold out menus a couple of levels, before arriving
at the dots that signify where things are crippled.

As to commands executed in other ways than menus, well, no dots. Such
as the clicking on columns for sorting - no tiny dot there for some
kind of advance warning about the FOAD message that will suddenly
leap up. Or then, think about the keystroke commands... Most Agent
users, that's our primary form of interaction with it.

Hitting Ctrl-Z, for instance, while typing in the message editor window,
and, yep, you know what happens. That damn FOAD thing jumps up. So you
have to stop what you were typing. To click it and make it go away.

And try to remember to never hit Ctrl-Z again, along with the other
hundred actions that cause it to leap up and hassle you.

in <[email protected]> in
the "[PL] PL2005 INTERNET" thread.
Click to expand...

The message from the Agent beta testers member? ;) Anyway, something
that should be clear: If folks want to recommend FA in ACF, that's
a whole different matter. (Although I incidentally haven't noticed
it get recommended in quite a long time. Not with freeware choices
such as the Mozilla offshoots, and Dialog, and Xnews, etc.)

Where FA has no placement is on Pricelessware. It's one thing to have
our PL standards a little lower than nonags, and maybe webattack. But
it's entirely another to become some kind of indiscriminate download.com.
Open up floodgates towards the whole obscenity of demo ware.

Although the commercial interests would sure like that one. If they
could put in demo ware products for PL voting, which would be
automatically eligible. Requiring not much more that a /popular/
vote from a dozen or so nyms. As enough to give their demo products
not just the free promotions...but a Pricelessware badge to boot.
 

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