Does expensive SCSI/SAS adapters have firmware?

[Man-wai Chang]

Just curious...

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[Arno]

All SCSI/SAS adapter have firmware. It is not
possible to build them purely in hardware.

Arno

 

[Yousuf Khan]

All SCSI/SAS adapter have firmware. It is not
possible to build them purely in hardware.

Arno

I think he means replaceable firmware, like with SSD's.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Joe Kotroczo]

I think he means replaceable firmware, like with SSD's.

All firmware is replaceable. It's implied in the definition of firmware.
Whether you need a soldering iron to replace the firmware is a question
of implementation.

You'll find that the more expensive the controller, the easier it will
be to update the controller BIOS/firmware.

 

[bbbl67]

All firmware is replaceable. It's implied in the definition of firmware.
Whether you need a soldering iron to replace the firmware is a question
of implementation.

You'll find that the more expensive the controller, the easier it will
be to update the controller BIOS/firmware.

Well, obviously he's referring to stuff that's replaceable by software
rather than by soldering iron.

Yousuf Khan

 

[bbbl67]

Just curious...

As I recall, going back to my Sun Microsystems days, there were
firmware upgrades available for enterprise SCSI disks. It wasn't
something that a system administrator could apply themselves, they
needed to send Sun technicians in to do it.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Arno]

Well, obviously he's referring to stuff that's replaceable by software
rather than by soldering iron.

Yousuf Khan

Basically all modern firmware is replaceable by software. It does
not make sense to add an extra interface. Sometimes you find
unpopulated JTAG headers, but they are for debugging.

Whether the manufacturer actually provides updates and a tool
to replace the firmware is a different question, as is the
quality of the updates. I have made bad experience with an
Adaptec SATA controller update, where they removed a feature that
was critical for me (SMART queries). Support just brushed me off.
Essentially the controller was an expensive paperweight afterwards as
flashing it back was not possible. This was not a cheap controller.

Arno

 

[Arno]

As I recall, going back to my Sun Microsystems days, there were
firmware upgrades available for enterprise SCSI disks. It wasn't
something that a system administrator could apply themselves, they
needed to send Sun technicians in to do it.

Yousuf Khan

Sounds more like "they needed to charge SUN rates" to me.

Arno

 

[Yousuf Khan]

Whether the manufacturer actually provides updates and a tool
to replace the firmware is a different question, as is the
quality of the updates. I have made bad experience with an
Adaptec SATA controller update, where they removed a feature that
was critical for me (SMART queries). Support just brushed me off.
Essentially the controller was an expensive paperweight afterwards as
flashing it back was not possible. This was not a cheap controller.

Yeah, I've gone through that sort of thing before too. I won't upgrade
unless there's a good reason.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Yousuf Khan]

Sounds more like "they needed to charge SUN rates" to me.

Probably, but we already had a service contract with them, so it was
fine by me.

Yousuf Khan

 

[Arno]

Probably, but we already had a service contract with them, so it was
fine by me.

Yousuf Khan

So more "we need to charge (internally) the folks that sell service
contracts so we can keep our number of technicians high". ;-)

Arno