SandForce-based SSDs

Discussion in 'Storage Devices' started by Man-wai Chang, Apr 6, 2012.

  1. Are they really that bad?

    --
    @~@ You have the right to remain silence.
    / v \ Simplicity is Beauty! May the Force and farces be with you!
    /( _ )\ (Fedora 15 i686) Linux 3.3.1
    ^ ^ 01:55:01 up 2 days 6:12 0 users load average: 0.00 0.01 0.05
    ä¸å€Ÿè²¸! ä¸è©é¨™! ä¸æ´äº¤! ä¸æ‰“交! ä¸æ‰“劫! ä¸è‡ªæ®º! è«‹è€ƒæ…®ç¶œæ´ (CSSA):
    http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_pubsvc/page_socsecu/sub_addressesa
     
    Man-wai Chang, Apr 6, 2012
    #1
    1. Advertisements

  2. Man-wai Chang

    Arno Guest

    Man-wai Chang <> wrote:

    > Are they really that bad?


    Aehm, no? What are information you referring to?

    Arno
    --
    Arno Wagner, Dr. sc. techn., Dipl. Inform., CISSP -- Email:
    GnuPG: ID: 1E25338F FP: 0C30 5782 9D93 F785 E79C 0296 797F 6B50 1E25 338F
    ----
    Cuddly UI's are the manifestation of wishful thinking. -- Dylan Evans
     
    Arno, Apr 7, 2012
    #2
    1. Advertisements

  3. Man-wai Chang

    Yousuf Khan Guest

    On 06/04/2012 1:56 PM, Man-wai Chang wrote:
    >
    > Are they really that bad?
    >


    Apparently, since they are the most popular brand of SSD chipset on the
    planet, there is just more units to complain about. Some of their
    problems get fixed with firmware upgrades. I just bought a Corsair Force
    3 SSD, which has the Sandforce controller, and I did have some problems
    with it.

    When I started out, I was using the drives in AHCI mode, because I had
    heard that these are the only drivers which have all of the support for
    SSD-specific commands. Everything seemed fine, until occasionally I
    would get a weird random lockup during normal operations. I would be
    doing something normal in Windows and then all of a sudden a sudden and
    unexpected freeze would occur in the system. I could move the mouse, but
    I couldn't click on anything and every program would just sit there
    unable to do anything until this freeze-up passed, which usually took
    about 10 seconds only. But I'd get maybe a couple or more in a day. It
    was getting annoying. Then I went on the Corsair forum, and found out
    that this is one of the most common complaints about the Corsair SSD's.
    I tried everything to see if I could fix it like turning off
    write-caching or turning off the TRIM support. Nothing helped. Then on a
    lark I tried it under IDE mode, and the freezes went away! I said, well
    this isn't good, because there's no way IDE mode supports the SSD TRIM
    command. Surprisingly, when I ran the command to turn on TRIM support,
    it worked under the IDE driver too! So it looks like running the thing
    in IDE mode is the best option: it has full support for TRIM, and it
    doesn't lockup like AHCI does, and it is only slightly slower than AHCI.
    My Windows Experience Index for the disk went down from 7.6 to 7.1 (and
    that's out of 7.9 in both cases), which is a very minuscule difference,
    not something that can be felt in human terms. I'll give up the slight
    performance for greater stability.

    Yousuf Khan
     
    Yousuf Khan, Apr 7, 2012
    #3
  4. Man-wai Chang

    Arno Guest

    Yousuf Khan <> wrote:
    > On 06/04/2012 1:56 PM, Man-wai Chang wrote:
    >>
    >> Are they really that bad?
    >>


    > Apparently, since they are the most popular brand of SSD chipset on the
    > planet, there is just more units to complain about. Some of their
    > problems get fixed with firmware upgrades. I just bought a Corsair Force
    > 3 SSD, which has the Sandforce controller, and I did have some problems
    > with it.


    > When I started out, I was using the drives in AHCI mode, because I had
    > heard that these are the only drivers which have all of the support for
    > SSD-specific commands. Everything seemed fine, until occasionally I
    > would get a weird random lockup during normal operations. I would be
    > doing something normal in Windows and then all of a sudden a sudden and
    > unexpected freeze would occur in the system. I could move the mouse, but
    > I couldn't click on anything and every program would just sit there
    > unable to do anything until this freeze-up passed, which usually took
    > about 10 seconds only. But I'd get maybe a couple or more in a day. It
    > was getting annoying. Then I went on the Corsair forum, and found out
    > that this is one of the most common complaints about the Corsair SSD's.
    > I tried everything to see if I could fix it like turning off
    > write-caching or turning off the TRIM support. Nothing helped. Then on a
    > lark I tried it under IDE mode, and the freezes went away! I said, well
    > this isn't good, because there's no way IDE mode supports the SSD TRIM
    > command. Surprisingly, when I ran the command to turn on TRIM support,
    > it worked under the IDE driver too! So it looks like running the thing
    > in IDE mode is the best option: it has full support for TRIM, and it
    > doesn't lockup like AHCI does, and it is only slightly slower than AHCI.
    > My Windows Experience Index for the disk went down from 7.6 to 7.1 (and
    > that's out of 7.9 in both cases), which is a very minuscule difference,
    > not something that can be felt in human terms. I'll give up the slight
    > performance for greater stability.


    > Yousuf Khan


    Interesting. I have two OCZ's (128GB Vertwex 2 and 256GB Vertex 3)
    and never noticed any problem. Of course these are not the
    cheapest models and both were bought when they had been
    on the market for a while. For new products, it is not a
    surprise that problems crop up. That even happens with HDDs
    occasionally and they are (or should be) well-understood
    technology. My advice would be to buy main-stream (larger numbers)
    SSD models that have been on the market at least half a year.
    You can research that particular model before. This will
    not give you useful failure probability data (vocal minority
    problem) but will show you the potential failure modes
    and incompatibilities. Overall, my take is that SSDs are about
    as reliable as HDDs.

    Arno
    --
    Arno Wagner, Dr. sc. techn., Dipl. Inform., CISSP -- Email:
    GnuPG: ID: 1E25338F FP: 0C30 5782 9D93 F785 E79C 0296 797F 6B50 1E25 338F
    ----
    Cuddly UI's are the manifestation of wishful thinking. -- Dylan Evans
     
    Arno, Apr 7, 2012
    #4
  5. > technology. My advice would be to buy main-stream (larger numbers)
    > SSD models that have been on the market at least half a year.
    > You can research that particular model before. This will
    > not give you useful failure probability data (vocal minority
    > problem) but will show you the potential failure modes
    > and incompatibilities. Overall, my take is that SSDs are about
    > as reliable as HDDs.


    I read that SandForce chipset would try to use compression when storing
    data. Could you disable that feature?

    --
    @~@ You have the right to remain silence.
    / v \ Simplicity is Beauty! May the Force and farces be with you!
    /( _ )\ (Fedora 15 i686) Linux 3.3.1
    ^ ^ 03:11:02 up 7:33 0 users load average: 0.00 0.01 0.05
    ä¸å€Ÿè²¸! ä¸è©é¨™! ä¸æ´äº¤! ä¸æ‰“交! ä¸æ‰“劫! ä¸è‡ªæ®º! è«‹è€ƒæ…®ç¶œæ´ (CSSA):
    http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_pubsvc/page_socsecu/sub_addressesa
     
    Man-wai Chang, Apr 7, 2012
    #5
  6. > command. Surprisingly, when I ran the command to turn on TRIM support,
    > it worked under the IDE driver too! So it looks like running the thing
    > in IDE mode is the best option: it has full support for TRIM, and it
    > doesn't lockup like AHCI does, and it is only slightly slower than AHCI.


    But when you downgrade one port of the SATA chipset to IDE, it would
    affect the speed of all other storage devices.... :)

    --
    @~@ You have the right to remain silence.
    / v \ Simplicity is Beauty! May the Force and farces be with you!
    /( _ )\ (Fedora 15 i686) Linux 3.3.1
    ^ ^ 03:16:02 up 7:38 0 users load average: 0.00 0.01 0.05
    ä¸å€Ÿè²¸! ä¸è©é¨™! ä¸æ´äº¤! ä¸æ‰“交! ä¸æ‰“劫! ä¸è‡ªæ®º! è«‹è€ƒæ…®ç¶œæ´ (CSSA):
    http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_pubsvc/page_socsecu/sub_addressesa
     
    Man-wai Chang, Apr 7, 2012
    #6
  7. Man-wai Chang

    Yousuf Khan Guest

    On 07/04/2012 12:05 PM, Arno wrote:
    > Interesting. I have two OCZ's (128GB Vertwex 2 and 256GB Vertex 3)
    > and never noticed any problem. Of course these are not the
    > cheapest models and both were bought when they had been
    > on the market for a while. For new products, it is not a
    > surprise that problems crop up. That even happens with HDDs
    > occasionally and they are (or should be) well-understood
    > technology. My advice would be to buy main-stream (larger numbers)
    > SSD models that have been on the market at least half a year.
    > You can research that particular model before. This will
    > not give you useful failure probability data (vocal minority
    > problem) but will show you the potential failure modes
    > and incompatibilities. Overall, my take is that SSDs are about
    > as reliable as HDDs.


    The model I bought was introduced in early 2011, so it's been around 1
    year already. The price cuts did make it attractive though. When doing
    research, you're mainly looking at reviews, benchmarks, and optimization
    advice. You rarely see problems crop up in reviews (perhaps they get the
    cherry-picked units). You only notice the problems after you actually
    get them yourself, and then do a search on the forums for this same
    problem. The unit I have had already been flashed to the latest
    firmware, and so it didn't seem like there should be any problems still,
    but there was. Fortunately, I was able to discover the
    solution/workaround myself.

    Yousuf Khan
     
    Yousuf Khan, Apr 7, 2012
    #7
  8. Man-wai Chang

    Yousuf Khan Guest

    On 07/04/2012 3:18 PM, Man-wai Chang wrote:
    >> command. Surprisingly, when I ran the command to turn on TRIM support,
    >> it worked under the IDE driver too! So it looks like running the thing
    >> in IDE mode is the best option: it has full support for TRIM, and it
    >> doesn't lockup like AHCI does, and it is only slightly slower than AHCI.

    >
    > But when you downgrade one port of the SATA chipset to IDE, it would
    > affect the speed of all other storage devices.... :)


    I've done extensive benchmarking on all of my drives, I never noticed
    any difference in speed on the mechanical drives when used in AHCI or
    IDE modes. And there was only a minor degradation of the speed on the
    SSD. Although I had switched over the AHCI mode over a year ago, even
    before I bought the SSD, it did not have any features I considered
    necessary yet, but might be in the future. Such as NCQ and hot-plugging.
    Neither of them came in particularly useful to me, so I don't miss them
    now that I've disabled them by switching back to the IDE drivers. NCQ
    doesn't work on SSD's anyways, they only matter to hard disks. TRIM
    doesn't matter to hard disks, they only work on NCQ.

    Yousuf Khan
     
    Yousuf Khan, Apr 7, 2012
    #8
  9. Man-wai Chang

    Yousuf Khan Guest

    On 07/04/2012 3:16 PM, Man-wai Chang wrote:
    >> technology. My advice would be to buy main-stream (larger numbers)
    >> SSD models that have been on the market at least half a year.
    >> You can research that particular model before. This will
    >> not give you useful failure probability data (vocal minority
    >> problem) but will show you the potential failure modes
    >> and incompatibilities. Overall, my take is that SSDs are about
    >> as reliable as HDDs.

    >
    > I read that SandForce chipset would try to use compression when storing
    > data. Could you disable that feature?


    Nope, it's built-in to the chipset and beyond the control of the OS. It
    actually helps when you have compressible data, and it doesn't hurt when
    you don't. This shows the relative difference in speeds between
    compressible and non-compressible data:

    http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/storage/display/corsair-force-gt_3.html

    You get close to a 2 fold increase with compressible data in every case.
    With compressible data, you can get up close to the full SATA 3 speed
    limits on these drives (around 500 MB/s), in some cases.

    Yousuf Khan
     
    Yousuf Khan, Apr 7, 2012
    #9
  10. Man-wai Chang

    Arno Guest

    Yousuf Khan <> wrote:
    > On 07/04/2012 12:05 PM, Arno wrote:
    >> Interesting. I have two OCZ's (128GB Vertwex 2 and 256GB Vertex 3)
    >> and never noticed any problem. Of course these are not the
    >> cheapest models and both were bought when they had been
    >> on the market for a while. For new products, it is not a
    >> surprise that problems crop up. That even happens with HDDs
    >> occasionally and they are (or should be) well-understood
    >> technology. My advice would be to buy main-stream (larger numbers)
    >> SSD models that have been on the market at least half a year.
    >> You can research that particular model before. This will
    >> not give you useful failure probability data (vocal minority
    >> problem) but will show you the potential failure modes
    >> and incompatibilities. Overall, my take is that SSDs are about
    >> as reliable as HDDs.


    > The model I bought was introduced in early 2011, so it's been around 1
    > year already. The price cuts did make it attractive though. When doing
    > research, you're mainly looking at reviews, benchmarks, and optimization
    > advice. You rarely see problems crop up in reviews (perhaps they get the
    > cherry-picked units). You only notice the problems after you actually
    > get them yourself, and then do a search on the forums for this same
    > problem. The unit I have had already been flashed to the latest
    > firmware, and so it didn't seem like there should be any problems still,
    > but there was. Fortunately, I was able to discover the
    > solution/workaround myself.


    Hmm. Bad luck indeed. But good that you could fix this problem
    yourself.

    Arno
    --
    Arno Wagner, Dr. sc. techn., Dipl. Inform., CISSP -- Email:
    GnuPG: ID: 1E25338F FP: 0C30 5782 9D93 F785 E79C 0296 797F 6B50 1E25 338F
    ----
    Cuddly UI's are the manifestation of wishful thinking. -- Dylan Evans
     
    Arno, Apr 8, 2012
    #10
  11. Man-wai Chang

    Yousuf Khan Guest

    On 07/04/2012 11:14 PM, Arno wrote:
    >> The model I bought was introduced in early 2011, so it's been around 1
    >> year already. The price cuts did make it attractive though. When doing
    >> research, you're mainly looking at reviews, benchmarks, and optimization
    >> advice. You rarely see problems crop up in reviews (perhaps they get the
    >> cherry-picked units). You only notice the problems after you actually
    >> get them yourself, and then do a search on the forums for this same
    >> problem. The unit I have had already been flashed to the latest
    >> firmware, and so it didn't seem like there should be any problems still,
    >> but there was. Fortunately, I was able to discover the
    >> solution/workaround myself.

    >
    > Hmm. Bad luck indeed. But good that you could fix this problem
    > yourself.



    I tend to get the strangest problems almost all of the time on my
    systems. But I also find a lot of solutions to them, which helps out
    other people later.

    Yousuf Khan
     
    Yousuf Khan, Apr 8, 2012
    #11
  12. > Nope, it's built-in to the chipset and beyond the control of the OS. It
    > actually helps when you have compressible data, and it doesn't hurt when
    > you don't. This shows the relative difference in speeds between
    > compressible and non-compressible data:


    Would the CPU be involved when compressing data?

    > You get close to a 2 fold increase with compressible data in every case.
    > With compressible data, you can get up close to the full SATA 3 speed
    > limits on these drives (around 500 MB/s), in some cases.


    Compression make it harder to recover data!!! :)

    --
    @~@ You have the right to remain silence.
    / v \ Simplicity is Beauty! May the Force and farces be with you!
    /( _ )\ (Fedora 15 i686) Linux 3.3.1
    ^ ^ 21:13:01 up 1 day 1:35 0 users load average: 0.00 0.01 0.05
    ä¸å€Ÿè²¸! ä¸è©é¨™! ä¸æ´äº¤! ä¸æ‰“交! ä¸æ‰“劫! ä¸è‡ªæ®º! è«‹è€ƒæ…®ç¶œæ´ (CSSA):
    http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_pubsvc/page_socsecu/sub_addressesa
     
    Man-wai Chang, Apr 8, 2012
    #12
  13. > I've done extensive benchmarking on all of my drives, I never noticed
    > any difference in speed on the mechanical drives when used in AHCI or
    > IDE modes. And there was only a minor degradation of the speed on the


    The speed decrease in the SATA wires are undeniable, even though an
    average mortal would not sense the differences.

    Maybe SSDs really should be mounted on its own SATA chipset in the
    motherboard, rather than blending in with other 100% RELIABLE
    traditional hard disks and DVD/BluRay drives... :)

    --
    @~@ You have the right to remain silence.
    / v \ Simplicity is Beauty! May the Force and farces be with you!
    /( _ )\ (Fedora 15 i686) Linux 3.3.1
    ^ ^ 02:32:01 up 1 day 6:54 0 users load average: 0.06 0.05 0.05
    ä¸å€Ÿè²¸! ä¸è©é¨™! ä¸æ´äº¤! ä¸æ‰“交! ä¸æ‰“劫! ä¸è‡ªæ®º! è«‹è€ƒæ…®ç¶œæ´ (CSSA):
    http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_pubsvc/page_socsecu/sub_addressesa
     
    Man-wai Chang, Apr 8, 2012
    #13
  14. Man-wai Chang

    bbbl67 Guest

    On Apr 8, 2:37 pm, Man-wai Chang <> wrote:
    > The speed decrease in the SATA wires are undeniable, even though an
    > average mortal would not sense the differences.


    The differences that I notice is all that I care about. I noticed a
    huge difference when going from HDD to SSD, but didn't notice a
    difference going from AHCI to IDE. I'm sure it'll make a difference to
    my bragging rights, but it really doesn't make a difference to overall
    daily life. Booting times haven't changed, and application loading
    times haven't either.
     
    bbbl67, Apr 8, 2012
    #14
  15. Man-wai Chang

    Rod Speed Guest

    Yousuf Khan wrote
    > Arno wrote


    >> Interesting. I have two OCZ's (128GB Vertwex 2 and 256GB Vertex 3)
    >> and never noticed any problem. Of course these are not the
    >> cheapest models and both were bought when they had been
    >> on the market for a while. For new products, it is not a
    >> surprise that problems crop up. That even happens with HDDs
    >> occasionally and they are (or should be) well-understood
    >> technology. My advice would be to buy main-stream (larger numbers)
    >> SSD models that have been on the market at least half a year.
    >> You can research that particular model before. This will
    >> not give you useful failure probability data (vocal minority
    >> problem) but will show you the potential failure modes
    >> and incompatibilities. Overall, my take is that SSDs are about
    >> as reliable as HDDs.


    > The model I bought was introduced in early 2011, so it's been around 1 year already. The price cuts did make it
    > attractive though. When doing research, you're mainly looking at reviews, benchmarks, and optimization advice. You
    > rarely see problems crop up in reviews (perhaps they get the cherry-picked units).


    I think its more that they are careful to not put the boot in too agressively
    otherwise they wont get anything more to review from that operation etc.

    Even our consumer operation that deliberately buys stuff at retail in
    an attempt to avoid that problem, often doesnt manage to detect
    the duds that do later show up once lots are bought by consumers.

    > You only notice the problems after you actually get them yourself, and then do a search on the forums for this same
    > problem.


    And presumably most of those that end up with a problem never bother
    to say anything about it on any forum.

    > The unit I have had already been flashed to the latest firmware, and so it didn't seem like there should be any
    > problems still, but there was.


    And that shows how unsatisfactory it is to try to work out the duds before you buy.

    > Fortunately, I was able to discover the solution/workaround myself.
     
    Rod Speed, Apr 8, 2012
    #15
  16. Man-wai Chang

    Arno Guest

    Man-wai Chang <> wrote:
    >> Nope, it's built-in to the chipset and beyond the control of the OS. It
    >> actually helps when you have compressible data, and it doesn't hurt when
    >> you don't. This shows the relative difference in speeds between
    >> compressible and non-compressible data:


    > Would the CPU be involved when compressing data?


    No.

    >> You get close to a 2 fold increase with compressible data in every case.
    >> With compressible data, you can get up close to the full SATA 3 speed
    >> limits on these drives (around 500 MB/s), in some cases.


    > Compression make it harder to recover data!!! :)


    Indeed. But as you need to unsolder SMD chips for that,
    and deal with wear-leveling and defect-management, it is
    already pretty hard.

    Arno
    --
    Arno Wagner, Dr. sc. techn., Dipl. Inform., CISSP -- Email:
    GnuPG: ID: 1E25338F FP: 0C30 5782 9D93 F785 E79C 0296 797F 6B50 1E25 338F
    ----
    Cuddly UI's are the manifestation of wishful thinking. -- Dylan Evans
     
    Arno, Apr 9, 2012
    #16
  17. Man-wai Chang

    Yousuf Khan Guest

    On 08/04/2012 9:16 AM, Man-wai Chang wrote:
    >> Nope, it's built-in to the chipset and beyond the control of the OS. It
    >> actually helps when you have compressible data, and it doesn't hurt when
    >> you don't. This shows the relative difference in speeds between
    >> compressible and non-compressible data:

    >
    > Would the CPU be involved when compressing data?


    No, entirely done within the SSD's controller.

    >> You get close to a 2 fold increase with compressible data in every case.
    >> With compressible data, you can get up close to the full SATA 3 speed
    >> limits on these drives (around 500 MB/s), in some cases.

    >
    > Compression make it harder to recover data!!! :)


    Forget about all of your hard-earned hard disk knowledge, it doesn't
    apply here anymore! :)

    You'll never be able to recover any data that's been deleted from an
    SSD. Unlike with a hard disk, once you delete a file (and subsequently
    remove it from the Recycle Bin too, if that's enabled), the empty area
    actually is fully erased. It's like you've done a secure shred of your
    empty spaces everytime!

    One thing that surprised me about SSD's when I learned about it is that
    you can't simply overwrite data on the sectors like with an HDD, you
    must first erase it, and then write to it. The reason is based on how
    flash memory works. You can only write ones to a flash memory block, you
    can't write zeros! So what they do is send an erase/reset command to the
    block, which zeros all of the bits out. You then go in and write a new
    set of ones to the proper bit locations, leaving other bit locations
    untouched at zero. This is why they brought the TRIM command in. Because
    you have to spend so much time resetting blocks, they now maintain a
    pool of already erased blocks on the drive. That way when it's time to
    rewrite a block, you actually end up writing to a totally different
    block which replaces the old block, and the old block gets erased in the
    background with TRIM. Then that old block gets put into the reserved
    pool ready to be used another time.

    Yousuf Khan
     
    Yousuf Khan, Apr 9, 2012
    #17
  18. Man-wai Chang

    Yousuf Khan Guest

    On 10/04/2012 2:12 AM, David Brown wrote:
    > On 09/04/12 23:13, Yousuf Khan wrote:
    >> Forget about all of your hard-earned hard disk knowledge, it doesn't
    >> apply here anymore! :)
    >>
    >> You'll never be able to recover any data that's been deleted from an
    >> SSD. Unlike with a hard disk, once you delete a file (and subsequently
    >> remove it from the Recycle Bin too, if that's enabled), the empty area
    >> actually is fully erased. It's like you've done a secure shred of your
    >> empty spaces everytime!

    >
    > That's not entirely true - it depends on the garbage collection
    > algorithms, and what else is in the same erase block.
    >
    > It's true that your erased data /might/ be zapped quickly - but it might
    > lie around for ever afterwards, even if it has been "shredded", "wiped",
    > "securely deleted", or otherwise "deleted".


    I don't see it likely to lie around forever. If any deleted data lies
    around for longer than a minute, I'd be surprised. They usually need
    these blocks to go to the reserved pool as soon as possible so that they
    always have a source of empty blocks to which they can write to. The
    garbage collection won't kick in during moments of activity, for sure,
    but I also don't see any sort of continuous fully-loaded disk activity
    lasting more than a minute on an SSD. It's possible that disk activity
    can last very long on an HDD, but an SSD is so fast it will not last
    that long.

    Hell, you can do a full secure erase of the SSD in less than a second --
    the entire SSD.

    > It is certainly true that it is difficult to get erased data off the SSD
    > - you need to remove the chips and read them individually, and figure
    > out how all the re-location and indirection works. Even if you have
    > access to the re-location algorithms and data structures, it would still
    > be a hard task to reconstruct things.


    And you'd pretty much have to pull the power plug off the SSD on a
    running system in less than a minute after some fully-loaded disk
    activity operation so that the garbage collection hasn't had a chance to
    finish.

    > So if you are paranoid about hiding your old data, you can't do it with
    > an SSD except by a full disk secure erase. And on the other hand, if you
    > /want/ to recover lost data, you probably can't do it.


    I don't think so, everything marked for deletion pretty much is deleted
    on an SSD, since all you have to do is send the block reset command,
    which just drops everything to zero on the block.

    Yousuf Khan
     
    Yousuf Khan, Apr 10, 2012
    #18
  19. Man-wai Chang

    Yousuf Khan Guest

    On 10/04/2012 8:05 AM, a1pcfixer wrote:
    > Yousuf,
    >
    >> It's possible that disk activity
    >> can last very long on an HDD, but an SSD is so fast it will not last
    >> that long.

    >
    > What's your take on these SSD's in a PC running 24/7/365, as compared
    > to one running std HDD's? Longevity? Reliability?


    Initially, I was a little hesitant after hearing about their downsides.
    Now that I know a bit more about them, all of the fears about them dying
    quickly seem to be overblown, they have the art of wear-leveling down
    pat. If anything, an SSD is the perfect device to be running 24/7, as
    there are no moving parts, and the temperature never goes up or down
    with activity.

    Another thing to consider is that even after an SSD has died, it doesn't
    become unusable, you can still read from it, it just becomes read-only.
    So you can still get all of your left over data off of it, as long as
    the controller is still intact. The controller has the same amount of
    vulnerability as the controller on a hard disk.

    > With your large assortment of SSD's, any preferences you might
    > have/suggestions for newbies to SSD's?


    A large assortment of one! However, after reading the forums, it looks
    like there are two major controller chipsets available for SSD's: (1)
    the Marvell, and (2) the Sandforce. There is also the Intel controller,
    only for Intel SSD's. #2 is by far the more popular, but it uses up a
    bit more memory within its reserve pool, approximately 7% usually. So
    with a Marvell controller, you'll typically see sizes like
    32/64/128/256GB. But with a Sandforce, you'll typically see sizes like
    30/60/120/240GB. The general consensus is that the additional reserved
    pool on the Sandforce is good for reliability and write performance,
    since there are more reserved sectors for balancing the wear-level with,
    but capacity sucks.

    Yousuf Khan
     
    Yousuf Khan, Apr 10, 2012
    #19
  20. > can't write zeros! So what they do is send an erase/reset command to the
    > block, which zeros all of the bits out. You then go in and write a new
    > set of ones to the proper bit locations, leaving other bit locations
    > untouched at zero. This is why they brought the TRIM command in.


    Thanks. Didn't know about this.


    --
    @~@ You have the right to remain silence.
    / v \ Simplicity is Beauty! May the Force and farces be with you!
    /( _ )\ (Fedora 15 i686) Linux 3.3.1
    ^ ^ 16:06:01 up 3 days 7:04 0 users load average: 0.01 0.05 0.05
    ä¸å€Ÿè²¸! ä¸è©é¨™! ä¸æ´äº¤! ä¸æ‰“交! ä¸æ‰“劫! ä¸è‡ªæ®º! è«‹è€ƒæ…®ç¶œæ´ (CSSA):
    http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_pubsvc/page_socsecu/sub_addressesa
     
    Man-wai Chang, Apr 11, 2012
    #20
    1. Advertisements

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. trs80

    Finding RAID controller for SSDs?

    trs80, Feb 11, 2010, in forum: Storage Devices
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    338
  2. Krypsis

    Re: PATA/EIDE SSDs?

    Krypsis, Nov 18, 2011, in forum: Storage Devices
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    333
    Krypsis
    Nov 18, 2011
  3. Mike Tomlinson

    Re: PATA/EIDE SSDs?

    Mike Tomlinson, Nov 19, 2011, in forum: Storage Devices
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    354
    Mike Tomlinson
    Nov 19, 2011
  4. Arno

    Re: PATA/EIDE SSDs?

    Arno, Nov 19, 2011, in forum: Storage Devices
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    335
  5. Tom Del Rosso
    Replies:
    25
    Views:
    1,613
    Yousuf Khan
    Jun 2, 2012
Loading...

Share This Page