S
student
ms not responsible even when the app is an ms app?
A
ANONYMOUS
Tom said:
Perhaps that is what "preliminary" means
D
Dave B.
From Webster's online;
Main Entry: 1pre·lim·i·nary
Pronunciation: pri-'li-m&-"ner-E
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -nar·ies
Etymology: French préliminaires, plural, from Medieval Latin praeliminaris,
adjective, preliminary, from Latin prae- pre- + limin-, limen threshold
: something that precedes or is introductory or preparatory: as a : a
preliminary scholastic examination b plural, British : FRONT MATTER c : a
preliminary heat or trial (as of a race) d : a minor match preceding the
main event (as of a boxing card)
--
Main Entry: 1pre·lim·i·nary
Pronunciation: pri-'li-m&-"ner-E
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -nar·ies
Etymology: French préliminaires, plural, from Medieval Latin praeliminaris,
adjective, preliminary, from Latin prae- pre- + limin-, limen threshold
: something that precedes or is introductory or preparatory: as a : a
preliminary scholastic examination b plural, British : FRONT MATTER c : a
preliminary heat or trial (as of a race) d : a minor match preceding the
main event (as of a boxing card)
--
H
HEMI-Powered
Unknown added these comments in the current discussion du jour
....
Let's just say that I've been around MS more than long enough,
all the way back to the original PC that didn't even have DOS,
that came in with the XT, to understand them pretty well. I don't
mean to be vindictively critical, but surely you will admit they
have less than a stellar record of their own releases, they have
a rep for hiding key parts of their various APIs even from those
who buy their development packages all the way back to the SDK,
reverse engineering of several versions of the major components
of MS Office have been found to contain fairly large percentages
of commands and API calls that seem not to be documented, and MS
like all commercial companies reserves the rights to control its
copyrighted software and give "guidance" to developers.
I didn't say, BTW, that all problems are MS, I am not at all that
naive and not at all an anti-MS bigot to believe that. Rogue and
misbehaving applications, especially systems utilities of all
kinds, are rampant throughout the 25 years since the first PC,
they suffer from their own bugs, side-effects bugs, and the rush
to bring new versions to market no matter what. This super
competitiveness all the way around makes for not only strange
bedfellows but interlocking dependencies that can make full
diagnosis of major or even minor systems issue deceptively
difficult.
I hung up my programmer clothes circa 1995 or so, thus I am more
than a little out-of-date for direct knowledge of whence I speak,
but in monitoring this and many other NGs, I see no real signs of
improvement, if anything, I think the situation is deteriorating.
I'm sorry if you feel I am not being objective, let's just say
that I am a pragmatist and always suspicious of extravagent
claims from ANY developer on either side of problems. Thanks for
listening.
....
Let's just say that I've been around MS more than long enough,
all the way back to the original PC that didn't even have DOS,
that came in with the XT, to understand them pretty well. I don't
mean to be vindictively critical, but surely you will admit they
have less than a stellar record of their own releases, they have
a rep for hiding key parts of their various APIs even from those
who buy their development packages all the way back to the SDK,
reverse engineering of several versions of the major components
of MS Office have been found to contain fairly large percentages
of commands and API calls that seem not to be documented, and MS
like all commercial companies reserves the rights to control its
copyrighted software and give "guidance" to developers.
I didn't say, BTW, that all problems are MS, I am not at all that
naive and not at all an anti-MS bigot to believe that. Rogue and
misbehaving applications, especially systems utilities of all
kinds, are rampant throughout the 25 years since the first PC,
they suffer from their own bugs, side-effects bugs, and the rush
to bring new versions to market no matter what. This super
competitiveness all the way around makes for not only strange
bedfellows but interlocking dependencies that can make full
diagnosis of major or even minor systems issue deceptively
difficult.
I hung up my programmer clothes circa 1995 or so, thus I am more
than a little out-of-date for direct knowledge of whence I speak,
but in monitoring this and many other NGs, I see no real signs of
improvement, if anything, I think the situation is deteriorating.
I'm sorry if you feel I am not being objective, let's just say
that I am a pragmatist and always suspicious of extravagent
claims from ANY developer on either side of problems. Thanks for
listening.
H
HEMI-Powered
Tom Willett added these comments in the current discussion du
jour ...
not anything. Too much possibility of bad PR if the date is missed
for any reason good, bad, or indifferent. I cannot fault MS for
being vague about SP3, especially since they would much rather sell
a Vista upgrade or a new PC with Vista installed than encourage
it's installed base to stay on XP any longer than necessary. But,
they will do an SP because it saves THEM manpower and money they'd
rather put towards the next better mousetrap.
jour ...
Nobody pre-announces without caveats, not software, not hardware,
not anything. Too much possibility of bad PR if the date is missed
for any reason good, bad, or indifferent. I cannot fault MS for
being vague about SP3, especially since they would much rather sell
a Vista upgrade or a new PC with Vista installed than encourage
it's installed base to stay on XP any longer than necessary. But,
they will do an SP because it saves THEM manpower and money they'd
rather put towards the next better mousetrap.
H
HEMI-Powered
Ken Blake, MVP added these comments in the current discussion du
jour ...
Certainly cannot fault you or MS for this statement, which I highly
agree with. If I may be allowed yet another car analogy, we do NOT
announce future products unless and until there is a sales and
marketing reason, e.g., at a major car show such as NAIAS where
almost all the major new products for the fall season are shown for
the first time.
jour ...
Certainly cannot fault you or MS for this statement, which I highly
agree with. If I may be allowed yet another car analogy, we do NOT
announce future products unless and until there is a sales and
marketing reason, e.g., at a major car show such as NAIAS where
almost all the major new products for the fall season are shown for
the first time.
U
Unknown
If indeed you were a programmer particularly a micro-programmer then you
should have enough experience to recognize the complexity of an operating
system plus all the micro-code that operates the hardware. If you were in
development you would know that regardless of the amount of testing some
bugs will show up after release. How can you possibly be so critical of a
few bugs? Compare today's PC's with those of just a few years ago. Be
objective not emotional.
should have enough experience to recognize the complexity of an operating
system plus all the micro-code that operates the hardware. If you were in
development you would know that regardless of the amount of testing some
bugs will show up after release. How can you possibly be so critical of a
few bugs? Compare today's PC's with those of just a few years ago. Be
objective not emotional.
U
Unknown
Also, ask yourself "why is the situation deteriorating". The advancement of
PC's has been absolutely phenomenal. Look what they do today compared to two
years ago. Advancement???? Windows 95, 98, NT, XP, now Windows Vista.
PC's has been absolutely phenomenal. Look what they do today compared to two
years ago. Advancement???? Windows 95, 98, NT, XP, now Windows Vista.
K
Ken Blake, MVP
No, they have made *no* changes because they have announced no dates.
Words like "preliminary" and "currently plan" indicate that these are
rough estimates, not promises.
If they announce a firm release date and then miss it, or change it,
that's a failure to keep their promises. Changing an estimate is not.
Just like almost everyone else does, they use words like that when the
date is far enough in the future that they are unsure of it. When they
are closer to a release date and feel assured of making it, *then*
they will announce a date.
H
HEMI-Powered
Unknown added these comments in the current discussion du jour
....
Sorry, can't follow the quotes. Are you talking to me or someone
else? If me, then see my other post just a minute ago. While I
never did O/S or systems software, I was always an applications
programmer, I DO understand the complexity of even a 2-bit O/S such
as Apple's old Dos 3.1 on the ][, so yes, by the time we got to Win
3.1, 95/98, XP, and now Vista, there is no longer any hope of a
free ride. And, I hope that sounds reasonably objective and
realistic, and NOT either emotional or at all MS-bashing.
....
Sorry, can't follow the quotes. Are you talking to me or someone
else? If me, then see my other post just a minute ago. While I
never did O/S or systems software, I was always an applications
programmer, I DO understand the complexity of even a 2-bit O/S such
as Apple's old Dos 3.1 on the ][, so yes, by the time we got to Win
3.1, 95/98, XP, and now Vista, there is no longer any hope of a
free ride. And, I hope that sounds reasonably objective and
realistic, and NOT either emotional or at all MS-bashing.
H
HEMI-Powered
Unknown added these comments in the current discussion du jour
....
This time I have the quotes straight. What I meant was that each
successive release of Windows in the exact sequence you mention has
been virtually an order of magnitude more complexity and lines of
code, no matter of what type. So, again, I am hardly bashing MS or
anyone, simply observing that /I/ feel that the situation is
"deteriotating" in that Vista cannot help but be a problematical
O/S until at least SP1, until at least all the HW manufacturers
fully come on board with drivers, and all the major SW developers
do the same. That's not being negative, it is being practical. As
I'm sure you're aware, my watchword is that I will NOT beta test
anyone's new anything with my Visa card. If others want to, that's
fine by me. OK, friends?
....
This time I have the quotes straight. What I meant was that each
successive release of Windows in the exact sequence you mention has
been virtually an order of magnitude more complexity and lines of
code, no matter of what type. So, again, I am hardly bashing MS or
anyone, simply observing that /I/ feel that the situation is
"deteriotating" in that Vista cannot help but be a problematical
O/S until at least SP1, until at least all the HW manufacturers
fully come on board with drivers, and all the major SW developers
do the same. That's not being negative, it is being practical. As
I'm sure you're aware, my watchword is that I will NOT beta test
anyone's new anything with my Visa card. If others want to, that's
fine by me. OK, friends?
S
student
It would depend on the "few" bugs wouldn't it? like a report that
doesn't get printed because garbage was coming out of the printer
for that person on the lan printer? especially the report was for
the supervisor.....
ms support say reload the driver which was already done; ms support
say that there is a virus; user say text only files can get printed
just word docs produce garbage. ms suport say call you back later
& is never here from again.
A few bugs? I do hope windows isn't ever used on planes or control
equipment in hospitals. The os isn't ready to do the things that
ms claims if bugs & unreliability are acceptable.
I now shudder that I heard in the news that it is intended to
have windows running some stuff in cars.......the "accidents"
happened, be reasonable, there are million lines of code in
windows, whats a few bugs...
doesn't get printed because garbage was coming out of the printer
for that person on the lan printer? especially the report was for
the supervisor.....
ms support say reload the driver which was already done; ms support
say that there is a virus; user say text only files can get printed
just word docs produce garbage. ms suport say call you back later
& is never here from again.
A few bugs? I do hope windows isn't ever used on planes or control
equipment in hospitals. The os isn't ready to do the things that
ms claims if bugs & unreliability are acceptable.
I now shudder that I heard in the news that it is intended to
have windows running some stuff in cars.......the "accidents"
happened, be reasonable, there are million lines of code in
windows, whats a few bugs...
T
Tom Willett
I'll rephrase it. They made changes to their web site showing different
tentative release periods.
| On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:00:05 -0500, "Tom Willett"
|
| >
| > | > | "SP3 for Windows XP Professional is currently planned for 1H CY2008.
| > | This date is preliminary."
| > |
| > | http://www.microsoft.com/windows/lifecycle/servicepacks.mspx
| >
| > BTW, this is the third change MS has made to the date for SP3.
|
|
| No, they have made *no* changes because they have announced no dates.
| Words like "preliminary" and "currently plan" indicate that these are
| rough estimates, not promises.
|
| If they announce a firm release date and then miss it, or change it,
| that's a failure to keep their promises. Changing an estimate is not.
|
|
| > And, they
| > always say it's preliminary ;-)
|
|
| Just like almost everyone else does, they use words like that when the
| date is far enough in the future that they are unsure of it. When they
| are closer to a release date and feel assured of making it, *then*
| they will announce a date.
|
|
| --
| Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User
| Please Reply to the Newsgroup
tentative release periods.
| On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:00:05 -0500, "Tom Willett"
|
| >
| > | > | "SP3 for Windows XP Professional is currently planned for 1H CY2008.
| > | This date is preliminary."
| > |
| > | http://www.microsoft.com/windows/lifecycle/servicepacks.mspx
| >
| > BTW, this is the third change MS has made to the date for SP3.
|
|
| No, they have made *no* changes because they have announced no dates.
| Words like "preliminary" and "currently plan" indicate that these are
| rough estimates, not promises.
|
| If they announce a firm release date and then miss it, or change it,
| that's a failure to keep their promises. Changing an estimate is not.
|
|
| > And, they
| > always say it's preliminary ;-)
|
|
| Just like almost everyone else does, they use words like that when the
| date is far enough in the future that they are unsure of it. When they
| are closer to a release date and feel assured of making it, *then*
| they will announce a date.
|
|
| --
| Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User
| Please Reply to the Newsgroup
B
ben
HEMI-Powered said:
My PC is about 3 years old now with autoupdate on and have never had any
problems due to autoupdate.
H
HEMI-Powered
ben added these comments in the current discussion du jour ...
experience personally, whilst managing PC support people for 15
years, knowing many technies AND listening to extreme tails of
woe from people who literally went to bed with a fully functional
PC and woke up to toast. So, please do what you think best and
allow others, like myself, who take a more cautious approach. I
do NOT let ANY SW or ANY device, including such simple things as
my cell phone from auto-updating ANYthing. You know my two
mottons on this: "don't try to fix things that aren't broken" and
"never give Murphy an even break.
I'll leave you with one super example of this. Countless people
on these several support NGs as well as graphics app NGs such as
Corel moan, groan and complain about blindly downloading the
latest nVidia card drivers and completely destroying their
systems, sometimes to the point of needing a nuke and reinstall
of the whole shebang. nVidia, in this extreme example, is
INfamous for releasing bugging, very unreliable driver updates,
which is why I stopped buying their video cards 2 PCs ago and
went with ATI.
Good luck, I think you're going to need it - eventually.
Ben, I do not dispute the personal testimony of people, but MY
experience personally, whilst managing PC support people for 15
years, knowing many technies AND listening to extreme tails of
woe from people who literally went to bed with a fully functional
PC and woke up to toast. So, please do what you think best and
allow others, like myself, who take a more cautious approach. I
do NOT let ANY SW or ANY device, including such simple things as
my cell phone from auto-updating ANYthing. You know my two
mottons on this: "don't try to fix things that aren't broken" and
"never give Murphy an even break.
I'll leave you with one super example of this. Countless people
on these several support NGs as well as graphics app NGs such as
Corel moan, groan and complain about blindly downloading the
latest nVidia card drivers and completely destroying their
systems, sometimes to the point of needing a nuke and reinstall
of the whole shebang. nVidia, in this extreme example, is
INfamous for releasing bugging, very unreliable driver updates,
which is why I stopped buying their video cards 2 PCs ago and
went with ATI.
Good luck, I think you're going to need it - eventually.
H
HEMI-Powered
Tom Willett added these comments in the current discussion du
jour ...
Tom, please keep this in mind. First, there is NO reason on God's
Green Earth to be lusting after SP3, no matter WHAT it has in it.
Quite the contrary, you should be wary and cautious to the point
of being frightened of the prospect if you intend to be an early
adopter. I am NOT saying that MS EVER intentionally screws up,
but they DO occasionally mess up a critical update or some other
update. Hopefully, by the time an SP is put together, they've
ascertained whatever the problem is and fixed it, or they may
have simply ignored it if the number of bad reports is small.
As to multiple dates on the web site, so what?! I'm not whacking
on you, Tom, or anyone, but I just do not see the burning need to
know a firm date. It isn't like you're going to drop dead of
cancer the next day if you don't download it and immediately
install it. Do what you think best, of course. As for me, and
many others, we will wait and lurk and let OTHER people beta test
for MS or ANY developer, and we are equally cautious and wary
about beta testing new software, e.g., Vista, on our Visa cards.
And, one more time, NO company selling ANY product soft or hard
EVER pre-announces far out UNLESS it is somehow advantageous to
THEM for PR or marketing reasons. Think about this one for a
minute: making XP work better ain't in MS's best interest, they
want you to buy a Vista upgrade. BUT, they DO have their OWN
interests in mind as I've said before, and if bundling all this
stuff into an SP saves them support time and money, they will do
it.
Good luck on whatever you decide to do.
jour ...
Tom, please keep this in mind. First, there is NO reason on God's
Green Earth to be lusting after SP3, no matter WHAT it has in it.
Quite the contrary, you should be wary and cautious to the point
of being frightened of the prospect if you intend to be an early
adopter. I am NOT saying that MS EVER intentionally screws up,
but they DO occasionally mess up a critical update or some other
update. Hopefully, by the time an SP is put together, they've
ascertained whatever the problem is and fixed it, or they may
have simply ignored it if the number of bad reports is small.
As to multiple dates on the web site, so what?! I'm not whacking
on you, Tom, or anyone, but I just do not see the burning need to
know a firm date. It isn't like you're going to drop dead of
cancer the next day if you don't download it and immediately
install it. Do what you think best, of course. As for me, and
many others, we will wait and lurk and let OTHER people beta test
for MS or ANY developer, and we are equally cautious and wary
about beta testing new software, e.g., Vista, on our Visa cards.
And, one more time, NO company selling ANY product soft or hard
EVER pre-announces far out UNLESS it is somehow advantageous to
THEM for PR or marketing reasons. Think about this one for a
minute: making XP work better ain't in MS's best interest, they
want you to buy a Vista upgrade. BUT, they DO have their OWN
interests in mind as I've said before, and if bundling all this
stuff into an SP saves them support time and money, they will do
it.
Good luck on whatever you decide to do.
T
Tom Willett
I don't disagree with you. I am not pushing for SP3, nor do I have a desire
to be concerned about it until it's actually released.
I was only pointing out that the release period can change, as they have
done 2 or 3 times. It's all tentative.
Tom
| Tom Willett added these comments in the current discussion du
| jour ...
|
| > I'll rephrase it. They made changes to their web site showing
| > different tentative release periods.
|
| Tom, please keep this in mind. First, there is NO reason on God's
| Green Earth to be lusting after SP3, no matter WHAT it has in it.
| Quite the contrary, you should be wary and cautious to the point
| of being frightened of the prospect if you intend to be an early
| adopter. I am NOT saying that MS EVER intentionally screws up,
| but they DO occasionally mess up a critical update or some other
| update. Hopefully, by the time an SP is put together, they've
| ascertained whatever the problem is and fixed it, or they may
| have simply ignored it if the number of bad reports is small.
|
| As to multiple dates on the web site, so what?! I'm not whacking
| on you, Tom, or anyone, but I just do not see the burning need to
| know a firm date. It isn't like you're going to drop dead of
| cancer the next day if you don't download it and immediately
| install it. Do what you think best, of course. As for me, and
| many others, we will wait and lurk and let OTHER people beta test
| for MS or ANY developer, and we are equally cautious and wary
| about beta testing new software, e.g., Vista, on our Visa cards.
|
| And, one more time, NO company selling ANY product soft or hard
| EVER pre-announces far out UNLESS it is somehow advantageous to
| THEM for PR or marketing reasons. Think about this one for a
| minute: making XP work better ain't in MS's best interest, they
| want you to buy a Vista upgrade. BUT, they DO have their OWN
| interests in mind as I've said before, and if bundling all this
| stuff into an SP saves them support time and money, they will do
| it.
|
| Good luck on whatever you decide to do.
|
| > message | >| On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:00:05 -0500, "Tom Willett"
| >|
| >| >
| >| > | >| > | "SP3 for Windows XP Professional is currently planned for
| >| > | 1H CY2008. This date is preliminary."
| >| > |
| >| > | http://www.microsoft.com/windows/lifecycle/servicepacks.ms
| >| > | px
| >| >
| >| > BTW, this is the third change MS has made to the date for
| >| > SP3.
| >|
| >|
| >| No, they have made *no* changes because they have announced
| >| no dates. Words like "preliminary" and "currently plan"
| >| indicate that these are rough estimates, not promises.
| >|
| >| If they announce a firm release date and then miss it, or
| >| change it, that's a failure to keep their promises. Changing
| >| an estimate is not.
| >|
| >|
| >| > And, they
| >| > always say it's preliminary ;-)
| >|
| >|
| >| Just like almost everyone else does, they use words like that
| >| when the date is far enough in the future that they are
| >| unsure of it. When they are closer to a release date and feel
| >| assured of making it, *then* they will announce a date.
| >|
| >|
| >| --
| >| Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User
| >| Please Reply to the Newsgroup
| >
| >
| >
|
|
|
| --
| HP, aka Jerry
to be concerned about it until it's actually released.
I was only pointing out that the release period can change, as they have
done 2 or 3 times. It's all tentative.
Tom
| Tom Willett added these comments in the current discussion du
| jour ...
|
| > I'll rephrase it. They made changes to their web site showing
| > different tentative release periods.
|
| Tom, please keep this in mind. First, there is NO reason on God's
| Green Earth to be lusting after SP3, no matter WHAT it has in it.
| Quite the contrary, you should be wary and cautious to the point
| of being frightened of the prospect if you intend to be an early
| adopter. I am NOT saying that MS EVER intentionally screws up,
| but they DO occasionally mess up a critical update or some other
| update. Hopefully, by the time an SP is put together, they've
| ascertained whatever the problem is and fixed it, or they may
| have simply ignored it if the number of bad reports is small.
|
| As to multiple dates on the web site, so what?! I'm not whacking
| on you, Tom, or anyone, but I just do not see the burning need to
| know a firm date. It isn't like you're going to drop dead of
| cancer the next day if you don't download it and immediately
| install it. Do what you think best, of course. As for me, and
| many others, we will wait and lurk and let OTHER people beta test
| for MS or ANY developer, and we are equally cautious and wary
| about beta testing new software, e.g., Vista, on our Visa cards.
|
| And, one more time, NO company selling ANY product soft or hard
| EVER pre-announces far out UNLESS it is somehow advantageous to
| THEM for PR or marketing reasons. Think about this one for a
| minute: making XP work better ain't in MS's best interest, they
| want you to buy a Vista upgrade. BUT, they DO have their OWN
| interests in mind as I've said before, and if bundling all this
| stuff into an SP saves them support time and money, they will do
| it.
|
| Good luck on whatever you decide to do.
|
| > message | >| On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:00:05 -0500, "Tom Willett"
| >|
| >| >
| >| > | >| > | "SP3 for Windows XP Professional is currently planned for
| >| > | 1H CY2008. This date is preliminary."
| >| > |
| >| > | http://www.microsoft.com/windows/lifecycle/servicepacks.ms
| >| > | px
| >| >
| >| > BTW, this is the third change MS has made to the date for
| >| > SP3.
| >|
| >|
| >| No, they have made *no* changes because they have announced
| >| no dates. Words like "preliminary" and "currently plan"
| >| indicate that these are rough estimates, not promises.
| >|
| >| If they announce a firm release date and then miss it, or
| >| change it, that's a failure to keep their promises. Changing
| >| an estimate is not.
| >|
| >|
| >| > And, they
| >| > always say it's preliminary ;-)
| >|
| >|
| >| Just like almost everyone else does, they use words like that
| >| when the date is far enough in the future that they are
| >| unsure of it. When they are closer to a release date and feel
| >| assured of making it, *then* they will announce a date.
| >|
| >|
| >| --
| >| Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User
| >| Please Reply to the Newsgroup
| >
| >
| >
|
|
|
| --
| HP, aka Jerry
H
HEMI-Powered
Tom Willett added these comments in the current discussion du
jour ...
OK, Tom. Forgive me if I sounded stident or obstructionist, it is
just that I see so many people screw themselves into the ground
needlessly with unverified updates. You are correct, the update
date is tentative, and will be until it is announced - by
definition, right? Look what happened to MS when they advertised
last year that Vista would ship at Thanksgiving in time for the
Christmas buying season. It was a major PR disaster for them to
have to admit that THEY thought it was still too unstable to
release, and they delayed it for some months. Don't think they
intend to make that mistake again.
Now, I am certain they DO advise their developer base as well as
both private and public beta testers of the availability of beta
builds of what will become SP3.
And, Tom, I'm still curious. Why are you interested, perhaps to
the point of worrying about it, exactly when MS decides to
release? If your system is running fine now, and you've gotten
all the updates to install correctly, why temp fate? Once again,
these are the opinions of a wary old fool, YMMV.
jour ...
OK, Tom. Forgive me if I sounded stident or obstructionist, it is
just that I see so many people screw themselves into the ground
needlessly with unverified updates. You are correct, the update
date is tentative, and will be until it is announced - by
definition, right? Look what happened to MS when they advertised
last year that Vista would ship at Thanksgiving in time for the
Christmas buying season. It was a major PR disaster for them to
have to admit that THEY thought it was still too unstable to
release, and they delayed it for some months. Don't think they
intend to make that mistake again.
Now, I am certain they DO advise their developer base as well as
both private and public beta testers of the availability of beta
builds of what will become SP3.
And, Tom, I'm still curious. Why are you interested, perhaps to
the point of worrying about it, exactly when MS decides to
release? If your system is running fine now, and you've gotten
all the updates to install correctly, why temp fate? Once again,
these are the opinions of a wary old fool, YMMV.
T
Tom Willett
I am *not* interested in it, and I'm *not* worrying about it. Period. I
was simply pointing out that release dates *change*. I couldn't care less
if they ever release the darn thing ;-)
Tom
|
| And, Tom, I'm still curious. Why are you interested, perhaps to
| the point of worrying about it, exactly when MS decides to
| release? If your system is running fine now, and you've gotten
| all the updates to install correctly, why temp fate? Once again,
| these are the opinions of a wary old fool, YMMV.
|
| > | >| Tom Willett added these comments in the current discussion du
| >| jour ...
| >|
| >| > I'll rephrase it. They made changes to their web site
| >| > showing different tentative release periods.
| >|
| >| Tom, please keep this in mind. First, there is NO reason on
| >| God's Green Earth to be lusting after SP3, no matter WHAT it
| >| has in it. Quite the contrary, you should be wary and
| >| cautious to the point of being frightened of the prospect if
| >| you intend to be an early adopter. I am NOT saying that MS
| >| EVER intentionally screws up, but they DO occasionally mess
| >| up a critical update or some other update. Hopefully, by the
| >| time an SP is put together, they've ascertained whatever the
| >| problem is and fixed it, or they may have simply ignored it
| >| if the number of bad reports is small.
| >|
| >| As to multiple dates on the web site, so what?! I'm not
| >| whacking on you, Tom, or anyone, but I just do not see the
| >| burning need to know a firm date. It isn't like you're going
| >| to drop dead of cancer the next day if you don't download it
| >| and immediately install it. Do what you think best, of
| >| course. As for me, and many others, we will wait and lurk and
| >| let OTHER people beta test for MS or ANY developer, and we
| >| are equally cautious and wary about beta testing new
| >| software, e.g., Vista, on our Visa cards.
| >|
| >| And, one more time, NO company selling ANY product soft or
| >| hard EVER pre-announces far out UNLESS it is somehow
| >| advantageous to THEM for PR or marketing reasons. Think about
| >| this one for a minute: making XP work better ain't in MS's
| >| best interest, they want you to buy a Vista upgrade. BUT,
| >| they DO have their OWN interests in mind as I've said before,
| >| and if bundling all this stuff into an SP saves them support
| >| time and money, they will do it.
| >|
| >| Good luck on whatever you decide to do.
| >|
| >| > in message
| >| > | >| >| On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:00:05 -0500, "Tom Willett"
| >| >|
| >| >| >
| >| >| > | >| >| > | "SP3 for Windows XP Professional is currently planned
| >| >| > | for 1H CY2008. This date is preliminary."
| >| >| > |
| >| >| > | http://www.microsoft.com/windows/lifecycle/servicepacks
| >| >| > | .ms px
| >| >| >
| >| >| > BTW, this is the third change MS has made to the date
| >| >| > for SP3.
| >| >|
| >| >|
| >| >| No, they have made *no* changes because they have
| >| >| announced no dates. Words like "preliminary" and
| >| >| "currently plan" indicate that these are rough estimates,
| >| >| not promises.
| >| >|
| >| >| If they announce a firm release date and then miss it, or
| >| >| change it, that's a failure to keep their promises.
| >| >| Changing an estimate is not.
| >| >|
| >| >|
| >| >| > And, they
| >| >| > always say it's preliminary ;-)
| >| >|
| >| >|
| >| >| Just like almost everyone else does, they use words like
| >| >| that when the date is far enough in the future that they
| >| >| are unsure of it. When they are closer to a release date
| >| >| and feel assured of making it, *then* they will announce a
| >| >| date.
| >| >|
| >| >|
| >| >| --
| >| >| Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User
| >| >| Please Reply to the Newsgroup
| >| >
| >| >
| >| >
| >|
| >|
| >|
| >| --
| >| HP, aka Jerry
| >
| >
| >
|
|
|
| --
| HP, aka Jerry
was simply pointing out that release dates *change*. I couldn't care less
if they ever release the darn thing ;-)
Tom
|
| And, Tom, I'm still curious. Why are you interested, perhaps to
| the point of worrying about it, exactly when MS decides to
| release? If your system is running fine now, and you've gotten
| all the updates to install correctly, why temp fate? Once again,
| these are the opinions of a wary old fool, YMMV.
|
| > | >| Tom Willett added these comments in the current discussion du
| >| jour ...
| >|
| >| > I'll rephrase it. They made changes to their web site
| >| > showing different tentative release periods.
| >|
| >| Tom, please keep this in mind. First, there is NO reason on
| >| God's Green Earth to be lusting after SP3, no matter WHAT it
| >| has in it. Quite the contrary, you should be wary and
| >| cautious to the point of being frightened of the prospect if
| >| you intend to be an early adopter. I am NOT saying that MS
| >| EVER intentionally screws up, but they DO occasionally mess
| >| up a critical update or some other update. Hopefully, by the
| >| time an SP is put together, they've ascertained whatever the
| >| problem is and fixed it, or they may have simply ignored it
| >| if the number of bad reports is small.
| >|
| >| As to multiple dates on the web site, so what?! I'm not
| >| whacking on you, Tom, or anyone, but I just do not see the
| >| burning need to know a firm date. It isn't like you're going
| >| to drop dead of cancer the next day if you don't download it
| >| and immediately install it. Do what you think best, of
| >| course. As for me, and many others, we will wait and lurk and
| >| let OTHER people beta test for MS or ANY developer, and we
| >| are equally cautious and wary about beta testing new
| >| software, e.g., Vista, on our Visa cards.
| >|
| >| And, one more time, NO company selling ANY product soft or
| >| hard EVER pre-announces far out UNLESS it is somehow
| >| advantageous to THEM for PR or marketing reasons. Think about
| >| this one for a minute: making XP work better ain't in MS's
| >| best interest, they want you to buy a Vista upgrade. BUT,
| >| they DO have their OWN interests in mind as I've said before,
| >| and if bundling all this stuff into an SP saves them support
| >| time and money, they will do it.
| >|
| >| Good luck on whatever you decide to do.
| >|
| >| > in message
| >| > | >| >| On Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:00:05 -0500, "Tom Willett"
| >| >|
| >| >| >
| >| >| > | >| >| > | "SP3 for Windows XP Professional is currently planned
| >| >| > | for 1H CY2008. This date is preliminary."
| >| >| > |
| >| >| > | http://www.microsoft.com/windows/lifecycle/servicepacks
| >| >| > | .ms px
| >| >| >
| >| >| > BTW, this is the third change MS has made to the date
| >| >| > for SP3.
| >| >|
| >| >|
| >| >| No, they have made *no* changes because they have
| >| >| announced no dates. Words like "preliminary" and
| >| >| "currently plan" indicate that these are rough estimates,
| >| >| not promises.
| >| >|
| >| >| If they announce a firm release date and then miss it, or
| >| >| change it, that's a failure to keep their promises.
| >| >| Changing an estimate is not.
| >| >|
| >| >|
| >| >| > And, they
| >| >| > always say it's preliminary ;-)
| >| >|
| >| >|
| >| >| Just like almost everyone else does, they use words like
| >| >| that when the date is far enough in the future that they
| >| >| are unsure of it. When they are closer to a release date
| >| >| and feel assured of making it, *then* they will announce a
| >| >| date.
| >| >|
| >| >|
| >| >| --
| >| >| Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User
| >| >| Please Reply to the Newsgroup
| >| >
| >| >
| >| >
| >|
| >|
| >|
| >| --
| >| HP, aka Jerry
| >
| >
| >
|
|
|
| --
| HP, aka Jerry
U
Unknown
Totally understand. Bear in mind however that each release of a new
operating system does so much more than the previous release.
operating system does so much more than the previous release.