WinXP NTFS

[gus]

I live in an american community in rural Mexico, and a bunch of us use
WinXP.
Power reliability is not good here, and we have outages, which not
infrequently
corrupt the WinXP NTFS filesystem. Sometimes we can recover using
tools
in the Recovery Console, and sometimes we have to reinstall.

I also use Linux with the Ext3 filesystem, and the problems described
above
do not occur with Linux.

So here's my question - I know winXP is old at this point. Is the file
system
in Windows 7 more resilient and/or easier to recover than that in
WinXP, given
the power outage problems described above? If so, can someone give me
a
link that describes the advances?

(As a footnote, I'm familiar with surge protectors, UPS's, voltage
regulators
and the like. Without going into all the detail, I'll say that these
systems are
practical in some cases here, but not in all cases.)

 

[LVTravel]

I live in an american community in rural Mexico, and a bunch of us use
WinXP.
Power reliability is not good here, and we have outages, which not
infrequently
corrupt the WinXP NTFS filesystem. Sometimes we can recover using
tools
in the Recovery Console, and sometimes we have to reinstall.

I also use Linux with the Ext3 filesystem, and the problems described
above
do not occur with Linux.

So here's my question - I know winXP is old at this point. Is the file
system
in Windows 7 more resilient and/or easier to recover than that in
WinXP, given
the power outage problems described above? If so, can someone give me
a
link that describes the advances?

(As a footnote, I'm familiar with surge protectors, UPS's, voltage
regulators
and the like. Without going into all the detail, I'll say that these
systems are
practical in some cases here, but not in all cases.)

Briefly put, NO as the file system in Win 7 is the same as in Win XP (NTFS.)
There have been minor modifications to the file system but it isn't really
the file system that is failing you. What is failing is the Operating
system is keeping files open and writing to them anytime you are doing
anything on the computer (registry, ini, etc.) When the power goes out
those files may be only half written and not closed properly. When the OS
or bootstrap loader (what starts the OS loading into memory) can't find a
valid complete file it fails.

Not that familiar with Linux and what it keeps open when it is running but I
would suspect that it doesn't keep as many files open at the same time as
Windows does and that is why it hasn't failed yet with a power outage.
Heck, I have even had DOS crashed many years ago when I was writing to a
drive when power went out. DOS didn't ever keep a file open for longer than
it took to write the file.

The only other thing you can do, other than the UPS is to have complete full
image backups of the hard drive done onto a removable drive at regular
intervals. That way the image can be reinstalled to the hard drive with
minimal interruption of service.

 

[Mark Adams]

I live in an american community in rural Mexico, and a bunch of us use
WinXP.
Power reliability is not good here, and we have outages, which not
infrequently
corrupt the WinXP NTFS filesystem. Sometimes we can recover using
tools
in the Recovery Console, and sometimes we have to reinstall.

I also use Linux with the Ext3 filesystem, and the problems described
above
do not occur with Linux.

So here's my question - I know winXP is old at this point. Is the file
system
in Windows 7 more resilient and/or easier to recover than that in
WinXP, given
the power outage problems described above? If so, can someone give me
a
link that describes the advances?

(As a footnote, I'm familiar with surge protectors, UPS's, voltage
regulators
and the like. Without going into all the detail, I'll say that these
systems are
practical in some cases here, but not in all cases.)
.

Why not make images of your systems to external hard drives, and when the
power goes out and corrupts the install; restore from the last good image.
Every household should have at least one external drive and imaging software
for just such purposes.

 

[Bernd]

-------- Original-Nachricht --------


There have been minor modifications to the file system but it

isn't really the file system that is failing you. What is failing is
the Operating system is keeping files open and writing to them anytime
you are doing anything on the computer (registry, ini, etc.) When the
power goes out those files may be only half written and not closed
properly.

So it could make sense to disable write caching to the disk:

http://www.ehow.com/how_5051640_disable-loss-corruption-windows-xp.html

Bernd

 

[Paul]

I live in an american community in rural Mexico, and a bunch of us use
WinXP.
Power reliability is not good here, and we have outages, which not
infrequently
corrupt the WinXP NTFS filesystem. Sometimes we can recover using
tools
in the Recovery Console, and sometimes we have to reinstall.

I also use Linux with the Ext3 filesystem, and the problems described
above
do not occur with Linux.

So here's my question - I know winXP is old at this point. Is the file
system
in Windows 7 more resilient and/or easier to recover than that in
WinXP, given
the power outage problems described above? If so, can someone give me
a
link that describes the advances?

(As a footnote, I'm familiar with surge protectors, UPS's, voltage
regulators
and the like. Without going into all the detail, I'll say that these
systems are
practical in some cases here, but not in all cases.)

EXT3 is journaled. NTFS is journaled. FAT32 is not. FAT32 has
more of an exposure when it comes to unclean shutdowns. The best
you could do for FAT32, is chkdsk after an unclean shutdown,
so that faults in the file system don't accumulate over time.

*******

And there are solutions that can help with respect to power. They
make motor-generator sets with minimum bearing life of ten years
of continuous operation. The M-G provides isolation between the
grid and the load. Nice pure sinewave power comes out of the generator
side. The UPS is there to give you two minutes to complete a shutdown,
after the M-G loses speed. For short transients on the grid, the M-G
has sufficient inertia to continue supplying power to the computer,
and the UPS wouldn't even trip for that.

AC_power --- M-G --- UPS --- Computer

http://www.electricpowergenerator.com/motor-generator-sets.html

http://www.pscpower.com/Whitepapers/Introduction to Motor Generators.pdf

*******

An easier solution would be to purchase a laptop, and always
run it from battery. Own multiple battery packs, and charge
them on stand alone chargers. If lightning strikes, only
the stand alone charger gets damaged. The laptop, being
completely isolated, is unharmed.

Using wireless network connections for the computer, would help
prevent an I/O cable from providing a path for lightning.

So there are solutions you can use to armor your computer.

Paul

 

[LVTravel]

-------- Original-Nachricht --------


There have been minor modifications to the file system but it

So it could make sense to disable write caching to the disk:

http://www.ehow.com/how_5051640_disable-loss-corruption-windows-xp.html

Bernd

Even that would not totally eliminate the issue. And it would probably make
the OS unbearably slow.

 

[gus]

Just to confirm ..... we are using NTFS not FAT32 Gus

 

[Bernd]

Even that would not totally eliminate the issue. And it would probably
make the OS unbearably slow.

1. Better than nothing
2. Slow: Just test it

Bernd

 

[Paul]

Wow...

*many* years ago I used to repair motor-generator battery chargers
(among other things)
They went out of production in 1959 and when I started my job in 1975
there were still tons of them left.

When I said "tons of them" in this case it's not simply a figure of speech!

I have not seen one in years.

They are not power efficient
and they are expensive...
but indeed they do work well

In school, we did a few labs on them, and they're a hoot to
play with. Ours were intended as test beds (not the same form
factor as yours), to demonstrate "synchronizing to the grid".
They bolted them to the concrete floor for safety. Some
students in another one of the lab periods, managed to
ruin one, by disconnecting the field winding while it
was running. I wish I'd been there to see that. I
like a train wreck, as long as I'm not standing too
close

I'm sure there are still industrial ones around for sale.
I can see web pages for them.

Paul

 

[LVTravel]

In school, we did a few labs on them, and they're a hoot to
play with. Ours were intended as test beds (not the same form
factor as yours), to demonstrate "synchronizing to the grid".
They bolted them to the concrete floor for safety. Some
students in another one of the lab periods, managed to
ruin one, by disconnecting the field winding while it
was running. I wish I'd been there to see that. I
like a train wreck, as long as I'm not standing too
close

I'm sure there are still industrial ones around for sale.
I can see web pages for them.

Paul

Many years ago (I was there from '70-'72) had a motor/generator located in a
closet that ran our AN/UYK-4 (Univac 1500 military) computer on the USS
Puget Sound (AD-38.) Now mothballed in Philadelphia. Most computers on
military vessels had, and possibly still do, have motor/generators to even
out the power supply to the mainframe computers. Never saw on hooked to any
of the mainframes I used, other than on the ships, from 1967 to 1974. They
were IBM systems like the 1401, 7080, 360, System 3 and the like and one
Memorex mainframe computer (yes they even made them back then.)