Windows Live OneCare

[Kayman]

http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2008/nov08/11-18NoCostSecurityPR.mspx
"...the company also announced today that it will discontinue retail sales
of its Windows Live OneCare subscription service effective June 30, 2009."

Now, this was predictable

 

[Bill Sanderson]

This should be a Good Thing. The antimalware component is unlikely to be
watered down--I suspect it will continuously improve, and it will be free.

 

[Kayman]

This should be a Good Thing. The antimalware component is unlikely to be
watered down--I suspect it will continuously improve, and it will be free.

I think so too, it'll be a promising addition to existing quality AV
freeware applications.
What is most pleasing is that finally the pragmatic view of program
engineers is respected (the additions in WLOC are very lame considering
what's freely available)!

 

[Bill Sanderson]

I'm pleased. The legitimization of registry cleaners alone was a major
misstep, in my book. And, of course, I actually used that registry cleaner
on an xp machine, and it prevented security updates to Office from being
installed until I reversed what it had done...

 

[Kayman]

I'm pleased. The legitimization of registry cleaners alone was a major
misstep, in my book.

Definitely a decision made by the marketing people.
Ed Botts and Dr. Mark Russinovich and other knowledgeable folk e.g. program
engineers would have never agreed to this.

And, of course, I actually used that registry cleaner on an xp machine,

Risky undertaking

and it prevented security updates to Office from being installed until
I reversed what it had done...

At least no lasting damage to the os!

 

[Stephen Boots MVP-Windows Live]

Just to be clear, Bill, the Registry cleaner is not part of the
program that was announced to be ending. The Registry Cleaner is
available in the Safety Center offering, which inherited the "Windows
Live OneCare" naming, but was built by a different part of Microsoft.
Both products share the signatures provided by the Microsoft
Antimalware group.
-steve

 

[Bill Sanderson]

Thanks - that is an important distinction to understand, and I didn't!

I suppose I shouldn't keep repeating this rather ancient experience, but it
does underline the risks of registry cleaners. My experience was reported
to Microsoft at the time--and it is quite possible that steps have been
taken to ensure that it isn't repeated by others--but I've no way to know
whether or not that's the case.
(how's that for a long-winded disclaimer!)
--

 

[robinb]

hmmm does that mean WD will be phased out and Morro in?
robin

 

[robinb]

I am also wondering how fast microsoft will keep up with threats
like the other virus/spyware companies do now with their free and paid
versions, pertaining to this new free product. Once it comes out I will
test it and see
robin

 

[Bill Sanderson]

Do that--I will too. I don't expect Microsoft to be slow with bugs that are
in the wild in significant numbers.

I believe, at this point, that there is one set of definitions, from which
all of Microsoft's antimalware products work--and the latest are those at
the security portal.

I don't expect them to provide a downgraded version for the free product.
Since it is intended to be very careful with resources, I can imagine that
they might push definition updates less frequently than with some other
products---but I'm quite sure they will make new definitions available for
all the products in a similar time frame.

 

[Bill Sanderson]

I don't know what will happen in Windows 7, but I don't think the separation
of products will change for XP and Vista, unless for some reason there are
issues that the current Defender product simply can't be updated to handle,
in which case they might do as OneCare did, and disable it in favor of
integrating the functionality of Defender (and more!) into Morro.

That would be a long term question, though. I'd expect Morrow to partner
with Windows Defender in the near term.

 

[Stephen Boots MVP-Windows Live]

I failed to mention in my reply that I am in full agreement with you
on the danger of Registry Cleaners and disagree with the inclusion of
it in the Safety Scanner.
-steve

 

[Stephen Boots MVP-Windows Live]

Well, I can only relate that it appears that they have gotten much
better at responding as the OneCare/Forefront signatures used to only
be updated once or twice weekly and it isn't uncommon to see updates
multiple times in one day.

I believe that they are quite serious at trying to address the growing
malware problem.
-steve

 

[robinb]

I will hold you to that Steve

robin

 

[Stephen Boots MVP-Windows Live]

I'll hold myself to that, too. <g>
And, I am hopeful that they are successful.
-steve

 

[Bill Sanderson]

I am too. In another group, I saw a discussion which resonated with me:

I just installed a trial version of SBS-2008, Microsoft's Small Business
Server. It includes a trial of Forefront for Exchange--an antivirus aimed
specifically at protecting the server, and the Exchang email server.

I believe this product is descended from one called Antigen, which Microsoft
acquired some years ago. At any rate, it contains a number of competitors
scanning engines and definitions--a commercial version of what David Lippman
has provided as a script for some time now.

For a given scan, you can choose how many of those engines (and their
definitions) will be involved. Definition updates and scan engine updates
are managed automatically.

This seems a bit of a rube goldberg arrangement, when describing it, but
part of the theory behind it is that the various vendors have different
geographic origins, and that viruses are released first in different parts
of the world. So, an antivirus vendor based in Africa might well see a bug
released there first, and have effective coverage of it in their
definitions. If you are a large corporation with an office in some part of
Africa, it might be helpful to you to have that vendors scanner on your
servers.

So--how does this relate to a free antivirus product from Microsoft? First,
I hope (but Microsoft hasn't said) that this product will have a similar
breadth of availability and localization as Windows Defender. Microsoft's
antimalware products all allow the user to choose to send results and
samples of bugs found back to Microsoft.
Having a widely distributed app that collects such data can only add to the
breadth and effectiveness of the underlying research base providing the
definitions and cleaning instructions--and that should be good for everyone.

It will even be good for the other antivirus vendors, because Microsoft
shares samples within the industry.

I like this idea, in case that wasn't obvious!

 

[Alan]

Hi Bill,

Okay, I'm not ashamed to ask: What is Morro...or Morrow (however it's
spelled)? :->

Alan

 

[robinb]

I just hope they make it simple to use, and to understand for the beginner
user. especially the main page that it opens too. It can have an advanced
section for that kind of user but should have a simple section for those who
are clueless on what to do.
Windows Defender's help section is terrible and I have said it many times in
here, because it is not user friendly. It is written for the advanced user
not the beginner user. I even offered Joe to rewrite it so everyone can
understand it.
Many of the other venders make their product more user friendly. Hmm maybe
someone from microsoft will pop their heads in here and read this and
take my advise. Heck I would even beta test it for them and write a more
user friendly help section ;P
robin

I am too. In another group, I saw a discussion which resonated with me:

I just installed a trial version of SBS-2008, Microsoft's Small Business
Server. It includes a trial of Forefront for Exchange--an antivirus aimed
specifically at protecting the server, and the Exchang email server.

I believe this product is descended from one called Antigen, which
Microsoft acquired some years ago. At any rate, it contains a number of
competitors scanning engines and definitions--a commercial version of what
David Lippman has provided as a script for some time now.

For a given scan, you can choose how many of those engines (and their
definitions) will be involved. Definition updates and scan engine updates
are managed automatically.

This seems a bit of a rube goldberg arrangement, when describing it, but
part of the theory behind it is that the various vendors have different
geographic origins, and that viruses are released first in different parts
of the world. So, an antivirus vendor based in Africa might well see a
bug released there first, and have effective coverage of it in their
definitions. If you are a large corporation with an office in some part
of Africa, it might be helpful to you to have that vendors scanner on your
servers.

So--how does this relate to a free antivirus product from Microsoft?
First, I hope (but Microsoft hasn't said) that this product will have a
similar breadth of availability and localization as Windows Defender.
Microsoft's antimalware products all allow the user to choose to send
results and samples of bugs found back to Microsoft.
Having a widely distributed app that collects such data can only add to
the breadth and effectiveness of the underlying research base providing
the definitions and cleaning instructions--and that should be good for
everyone.

It will even be good for the other antivirus vendors, because Microsoft
shares samples within the industry.

I like this idea, in case that wasn't obvious!

 

[Bill Sanderson]

morro (sp?) is the codename for the free basic antivirus application that
will be created as a successor to OneCare, for release sometime in the
second half of 2009.

Microsoft announced that OneCare would be discontinued in that time frame
(but service will continue to all existing subscribers for the duration of
their subscriptions, and they will continue to be able to retrieve their
backed up files, and to make use of the online photo backup which is a part
of the OneCare product.)

OneCare would then be replaced by a "basic" free antivirus application,
available to XP, Vista, and Windows 7 owners.

 

[Bill Sanderson]

I'm hoping that there will be a beta test for morro, and if there is, I'd
sure like to be part of it, and to have others here who are interested be
extended that opportunity.

No idea if or how that might happen, though.

I just hope they make it simple to use, and to understand for the beginner
user. especially the main page that it opens too. It can have an advanced
section for that kind of user but should have a simple section for those
who are clueless on what to do.
Windows Defender's help section is terrible and I have said it many times
in here, because it is not user friendly. It is written for the advanced
user not the beginner user. I even offered Joe to rewrite it so everyone
can understand it.
Many of the other venders make their product more user friendly. Hmm
maybe someone from microsoft will pop their heads in here and read this
and take my advise. Heck I would even beta test it for them and write a
more user friendly help section ;P
robin