Windows 7: best firewall and best antivirus and best anti-spamsoftware is/are?

R

RayLopez99

My research shows:

For Windows 7:

Best AV and best firewall: just use the default built-in Windows
Microsoft Security Essentials for both. Second place: seems to be
Kaspersky's Win 7 suite offering. Avoid Norton, even though they seem
to have improved in speed over past years. Everybody seems to do
"burst" updating now--every 10 minutes--for antivirus signature files,
which is annoying but that seems to be the industry practice now.

Best 'anti-spam' (I use Webroot for Windows XP, and it seems
excellent): for Windows 7: unknown.

Anybody else?

We're talking Windows 7 here, not Vista, not XP. Thanks.

RL
 
T

TVeblen

My research shows:

For Windows 7:

Best AV and best firewall: just use the default built-in Windows
Microsoft Security Essentials for both. Second place: seems to be
Kaspersky's Win 7 suite offering. Avoid Norton, even though they seem
to have improved in speed over past years. Everybody seems to do
"burst" updating now--every 10 minutes--for antivirus signature files,
which is annoying but that seems to be the industry practice now.

Best 'anti-spam' (I use Webroot for Windows XP, and it seems
excellent): for Windows 7: unknown.

Anybody else?

We're talking Windows 7 here, not Vista, not XP. Thanks.

RL

Keep in mind that MS Security Essentials is not built in to the Home
version of W7. But it is a free download, nonetheless. Some recent
articles suggest that the newest version coming out is actually quite
effective.

From my travels I have heard raves about Kaspersky, AVG, and Avast.
Most AVs have settings options for updates, so you can pick your level
of "annoyance". I run AVG Free on W7. It's good, it's Free.

I've never used an anti-spam prog. Never had a problem in that area.
 
B

Bug Dout

RayLopez99 said:
Best 'anti-spam' (I use Webroot for Windows XP, and it seems
excellent): for Windows 7: unknown.

By "anti-spam" I assume you mean something to screen email spam. This is
OS-independent. You could not do much better than to use gmail. If you
want a local anti-spam client add-on, look at one of the Bayesian
filters, I've always like SpamBayes
http://spambayes.sourceforge.net/. You train it with examples of good
and bad emails. SpamBayes uses 2 folders for spam, not just one: a Junk
folder, and a Suspect folder. I like this a lot: email that the filter
thinks is certainly spam goes into Junk, email that may be spam goes
into Suspect. This way you don't have to check through all the spam
crap for good emails, since SpamBayes puts the uncertain ones into
Suspect.
 
R

RayLopez99

By "anti-spam" I assume you mean something to screen email spam. This is
OS-independent. You could not do much better than to use gmail. I

No, actually I meant a program to block intrusive porn sites that want
to hijack your browser and/or plant some spyware. So I guess an
antivirus program should cover that?

RL
 
M

Mike Easter

RayLopez99 said:

Spam without qualifier generally means email spam. Usenet spam is the
other spam that is sometimes referred without qualifier and it was the
first spam historically.

Webroot is a software developer with a number of products, antispyware,
AV and a suite. They don't make an antispam product.
No, actually I meant a program to block intrusive porn sites that want
to hijack your browser and/or plant some spyware. So I guess an
antivirus program should cover that?

Many AVs are just AV, not spyware and such.

Malware term covers viruses, worms, trojans, spyware, rootkits and so forth.

The vulnerability of a browser and its operating system are related to
over-privileged code.

You are wandering pretty far off the topic of these group which is
computer hardware issues and you should get your basics concerning what
is spam and what is antivirus and other antimalware such as spyware and
adware straightened out somewhere.
 
R

RayLopez99

You are wandering pretty far off the topic of these group which is
computer hardware issues and you should get your basics concerning what
is spam and what is antivirus and other antimalware such as spyware and
adware straightened out somewhere.

Well thanks Mike Easter for NOT answering my question, LOL. But I
have a good handle on the definitions next time I do ask this
question. Anybody else?

BTW my Linux system is acting as a doorstop at the moment...but I can
confirm that for a Pentium I, Damn Small Linux does work for surfing
the net, and through a router...impressed, though I personally would
not use such an underpowered system.

RL
 
M

Mike Easter

RayLopez99 said:
Mike Easter

s/these/this/

.... off the topic of this group
BTW my Linux system is acting as a doorstop at the moment...

Also off this group's purpose/interest.
but I can
confirm that for a Pentium I, Damn Small Linux does work for surfing
the net, and through a router...impressed, though I personally would
not use such an underpowered system.

For your level of inexperience, getting Puppy to work would have been
more fulfilling, and that conversation would do better in a linux group
which is not a trolling place, ie not c.o.l.a.
 
B

Bug Dout

RayLopez99 said:
No, actually I meant a program to block intrusive porn sites that want
to hijack your browser and/or plant some spyware. So I guess an
antivirus program should cover that?
Oh. For that, I use OpenDNS. Register for the free version, it allows
you to block known dodgy websites.
 
R

RayLopez99

Oh.  For that, I use OpenDNS. Register for the free version, it allows
you to block known dodgy websites.

That's got adware on it (the free version). Perhaps the paid version
is better. But using OpenDNS for DNS routing--does that not slow down
your internet connection? Another layer of overhead, no? Don't all
packets have to go through your ISP's DNS routers, then, they would
have to go through OpenDNS's DNS routers, no? Another layer of
overhead.

I use Webroot, which has a small database on your hard drive to block
known phishing/bad porn sites.

RL
 
B

Bug Dout

That's got adware on it (the free version).

Eh? Maybe when you set it up on their website. After that, like every
Domain Name Server, it resolves names silently. No adware.
But using OpenDNS for DNS routing--does that not slow down
your internet connection? Another layer of overhead, no? Don't all
packets have to go through your ISP's DNS routers, then, they would
have to go through OpenDNS's DNS routers, no? Another layer of
overhead.

No. You replace the ISP's DNS with OpenDNS in your OS's settings. Or
Google's DNS. A lot safer anyway. If you have a laptop, and just use
whatever DNS the ISP says to use, what if the wireless provider at some
place is using a man-in-the-middle attack via their DNS? Far better to
use a known, and fixed, DNS on your computers.
 
R

RayLopez99

No. You replace the ISP's DNS with OpenDNS in your OS's settings.  Or
Google's DNS. A lot safer anyway.  If you have a laptop, and just use
whatever DNS the ISP says to use, what if the wireless provider at some
place is using a man-in-the-middle attack via their DNS?  Far better to
use a known, and fixed, DNS on your computers.

Thanks. I'm probably not going to do this, but if it's easy to
describe (at a high level) how to "replace the ISP's DNS with OpenDNS
in your OS's settings" please tell me. I set up my DSL router using
software provided by my ISP a couple of years ago, threw away the
install CD, and have no idea how to change any OS settings, and under
what Control Panel that would be in WIndows. Curious as to how to do
this.

RL
 
R

Robin Bignall

Thanks. I'm probably not going to do this, but if it's easy to
describe (at a high level) how to "replace the ISP's DNS with OpenDNS
in your OS's settings" please tell me. I set up my DSL router using
software provided by my ISP a couple of years ago, threw away the
install CD, and have no idea how to change any OS settings, and under
what Control Panel that would be in WIndows. Curious as to how to do
this.
In XP it's control panel/network connections. Right click on 'local
area connection. Click on 'properties'. Select 'Internet protocol
TCP/IP' by clicking on it. Select 'properties'. You'll see the DNS at
the bottom of the screen and you can set them to the OpenDNS numbers.
OK your way out. I can't remember if I had to set my router
separately, but if you do, somebody here will tell you how to do that
if you supply the make and model.
 
R

RayLopez99

In XP it's control panel/network connections. Right click on 'local
area connection. Click on 'properties'.  Select 'Internet protocol
TCP/IP' by clicking on it. Select 'properties'.  You'll see the DNS at
the bottom of the screen and you can set them to the OpenDNS numbers.
OK your way out.  I can't remember if I had to set my router
separately, but if you do, somebody here will tell you how to do that
if you supply the make and model.

Ok, thanks. A claim was made at the OpenDNS site, or perhaps it was a
review of OpenDNS, that using OpenDNS numbers might "slightly"
increase your data throughput when surfing the net, though for most
people it would be insignificant. Here in Athens, Greece, where OTE
is the national carrier for telephony, I get a lot of timeouts, where
the modem is not transmitting or receiving any data for 30 seconds to
5 minutes, especially in the late afternoon (though, as I said in
another thread, existing open connections like Skype, seem to work, at
a degraded level, pretty good). I assumed this was a hardware problem
on the ISP end, or a bandwidth maxed out problem, and that there was
nothing I could do about it, since I'm wedded to OTE. Is it possible
that by switching to OpenDNS numbers, somehow I can bypass the OTE
servers and prevent these timeouts? It sounds too good to be true,
but if anybody has an opinion I'd like to hear it.

RL
 
B

Bug Dout

RayLopez99 said:
Is it possible
that by switching to OpenDNS numbers, somehow I can bypass the OTE
servers and prevent these timeouts? It sounds too good to be true,
but if anybody has an opinion I'd like to hear it.

Try it and let us know, changing your DNS provider is not a one-way
street. If your timeouts are caused by a slow DNS, then you'll see an
improvement, otherwise no.
 
R

RayLopez99

Try it and let us know, changing your DNS provider is not a one-way
street. If your timeouts are caused by a slow DNS, then you'll see an
improvement, otherwise no.

But that's what's confusing me. I'm under the impression that your
DNS provider is a bottleneck--everything flows through them?! If the
entire network is slow in your home country, switching to another DNS
provider will not help, will it? Granted there must be differences
between ISP providers, in any country, otherwise nobody would switch.
But my presumption is that this country I'm in has lousy
infrastructure, from what I've seen of everything else they do. And
switching here is not easy--besides the contracts you have to sign,
that lock you in, just getting a repairman to show up is a problem. It
took me about 6 months to get a phone line in the building I'm in--and
only after pestering and heavily tipping the repairman (and letting
him know ahead of time I was an American (= rich in his mind)--he
showed up, on a Sunday, and hooked me up).

RL

RL
 
B

Bug Dout

RayLopez99 said:
But that's what's confusing me. I'm under the impression that your
DNS provider is a bottleneck--everything flows through them?! If the
entire network is slow in your home country, switching to another DNS
provider will not help, will it?

When you click on a URL in your browser, this general sequence
happens:

* The URL (a text string) is sent to a Domain Name Service (DNS) to be
resolved to an Internet Protocol (IP) number, assuming the URL/IP wasn't
accessed and cached before.

* Once resolved, any other arguments in the URL are sent to the server
at the IP number, along with *your* IP number.

* The web server at the IP number takes the arguments (if any) and
generates a web page which is sent back to your IP number and web
browser for display.

One can see lots of possibilities for delay here. So the only way a
different DNS server could speed things up is in resolving the text URL
to an IP number. If you are using a very slow DNS server you may notice
a speedup switching to a proper DNS server, otherwise, you won't notice
any speedup. But like I said, it's worth a try. Just write down your
current two DNS IP numbers (primary and secondary) in case you need to
switch back. And also, using a known, safe DNS service instead of
whatever the Internet provider says to use is safer IMO.
 
R

RayLopez99

When you click on a URL in your browser, this general sequence
happens:

* The URL (a text string) is sent to a Domain Name Service (DNS) to be
resolved to an Internet Protocol (IP) number, assuming the URL/IP wasn't
accessed and cached before.

Right, so far so good.

* Once resolved, any other arguments in the URL are sent to the server
at the IP number, along with *your* IP number.
OK.


* The web server at the IP number takes the arguments (if any) and
generates a web page which is sent back to your IP number and web
browser for display.

OK, so that's a subtle point that escaped me. In this last step, your
PC is talking directly to the "web server at the IP number", not the
servers at the ISP. A direct point to point communication. I somehow
had assumed that the communication was to the ISP, which would forward
the packets to your PC--hence the bottleneck argument.

One can see lots of possibilities for delay here. So the only way a
different DNS server could speed things up is in resolving the text URL
to an IP number.  If you are using a very slow DNS server you may notice
a speedup switching to a proper DNS server, otherwise, you won't notice
any speedup.  But like I said, it's worth a try.  Just write down your
current two DNS IP numbers (primary and secondary) in case you need to
switch back.  And also, using a known, safe DNS service instead of
whatever the Internet provider says to use is safer IMO.

Switching is not easy in this country--nothing is--moving 100 miles
east to west or north to south takes about a day--and they just built
a modern, US-style interstate highway. The local roads will get you,
where everything slows to about 20 mph. Used to be longer with the
old roads. But I do see, now that you explained the sequence, how
possibly you might get improved performance--through the initial URL
lookup step. But now that I've thought this through, I think the real
delay is in the infrastructure, which every ISP uses (it's the same
for all). However, another poster said that these ISP's will
'bandwidth limit' their customers, meaning somehow each connection
from ISP to customer is throttled depending on overall load and time
of day, to not allow too much data to pass through it. I know they
can do that with servers, and with connections/threads/processes, so
it's possible. Maybe the smaller ISPs, which have a reputation as
being faster than the national carrier ISP here, are better in that
regard since they have more bandwidth allotted to their customers.

This slow DSL connection here is very frustrating but I notice when
traveling overseas, for example to Thailand, others had this same
"timeout for 30 to 180 seconds" problem, so I'm not sure switching
carriers is the solution--I think it might just be bad infrastructure
related. Mexico was also bad--near the border not Mexico City.

RL
 
B

Bug Dout

RayLopez99 said:
OK, so that's a subtle point that escaped me. In this last step, your
PC is talking directly to the "web server at the IP number", not the
servers at the ISP. A direct point to point communication. I somehow
had assumed that the communication was to the ISP, which would forward
the packets to your PC--hence the bottleneck argument.

Well no, it's not direct typically. Going from your web browser, your
URL request is handed to one intermediate router after another until it
reaches the target web server. A similar thing happens on the way back,
not necessarily the exact reverse route.

So the total delay from the moment you click on a web page URL, to when
the new page is displayed, is a function of:

* DNS resolution speed
* transmission speed to target web server
* web server speed
* transmission speed back to your computer
* your computer+browser speed

That's why I recommend you try the switch of DNS numbers. It won't
hurt, and you can always switch back. If your long delays are by chance
coming from a very slow DNS server, you'll see an improvement. Frankly
unlikely but the cost to try is low.
 
R

RayLopez99

    At a high level, your PC is comminicating directly with the target web
server, but at a lower level, the packets go through the ISP's routers
(which lay people erroneously call "servers") which act as an interface
with the sea of routers which form the Internet.  This sea of routers is
what transports your IP packets which, in turn, carry the HTTP packets.
Anywhere along the path to the target web server, or along the path
back from the target web server can exist a bottleneck.  The Internet is
designed to avoid forming bottlenecks (that's the essence of the Internet),
but it's not perfect - especially if the feds want to put in an "interface"
to peer at packets passing between regions or countries.

*TimDaniels*

Very interesting, and thanks to Bug Dout. You are referring to some
variant of the OSI model: Application/Presentation/Session/Network/Mac/
Physical, with an emphasis on Network.

So now my argument comes back full circle. Given the possibility that
DNS resolution speed is a potential bottleneck, but given that most
people say it's not, it stands to reason that the Network layer (layer
3) is not the bottleneck here in GR, but rather it's the physical
layer (layer 1) because they have not rolled out high speed trunks
like optical fiber yet. It's doubtful that it's the MAC (Data Link)
since I trust they have relatively state of the art servers and
hardware at the nodes. From what I've read Greece seems to lag Europe
in connectivity.

Suggestive is this Wikipedia passage: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
Internet_in_Greece#Controversy_between_OTE_and_new_ISPs) "OTE has
been assigned the manipulation and maintenance of the local loop.
Although not backed by evidence, accusations have been leveled at OTE
of its having stalled and even barred the disengagement of the local
loop from its own switching centre when an existing customer chose an
alternative provider. OTE has also been accused of lowering the
quality of the local loop when handing the line over to an alternative
provider. Because of these allegations, the Greek Independent
Authority of Communications (EETT) has issued a ruling (known as the
RUO 2007) that states that OTE must complete any needed work for the
preparation of the loop within a fixed number of days.
However, OTE has claimed that the overwhelming demand for alternative
ISPs has burdened them far beyond their capacity, blaming itself OTE
for its own operational problems. Court convictions and bankruptcies
like Telepassport and Altecnet, also proved that the alternative ISPs
had huge debts to the OTE group for LLU and support services.
OTE has also been criticized for artificially limiting the number of
packet throughput of ADSL lines, thus making VoIP services over its
broadband network unusable and unreliable."

Which undercuts perhaps my argument it's Layer 1 not 3.

So there you have it: somehow OTE is:

1) slow, in every sense of the word
2) 'artificially limiting the number of packet throughput of ADSL
lines'
3) sabotaging the efforts by customers to switch ISP providers (so
it's said).

Which raises the question how they would limit the packet throughput
(done through hardware or sofftware or probably both?), and for
academic purposes which layer in the OSI model this is.

RL
 

Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments. After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.

Ask a Question

Top