Which CPU ....dammit ! ? :-)

[David Maynard]

There's the problem, manufacturers are constantly looking for the best
way to make money, so reputation can be traded if they feel that is
the best way to go.

What I'm driving at here is that you are arguing both sides of the
street. You argue on the one hand that you need a cpu with built-in
overheat protection, and then on the other hand that leaving computers
on full time is not problematic. If the latter were true, the former
wouldn't be.

No, the latter is true precisely because of the former.

 

[Mxsmanic]

What I'm driving at here is that you are arguing both sides of the
street. You argue on the one hand that you need a cpu with built-in
overheat protection, and then on the other hand that leaving computers
on full time is not problematic.

It's not problematic if you use quality parts and fail-safe design
(such as overtemp protection).

Perhaps I've just had better luck at buying fans than
you have, I've never had an AMD chip fried by a dead fan. Even my
smoking users have had better luck than that.

The important point is that an AMD processor fries if the fan fails,
but an Intel processor does not.

 

[Chris Hill]

It's not problematic if you use quality parts and fail-safe design
(such as overtemp protection).


The important point is that an AMD processor fries if the fan fails,
but an Intel processor does not.

No. The important point is that neither fries if you know what you're
doing. If this was such a big deal, no manufacturer would use amd for
fear of lawsuits.

 

[Mxsmanic]

No. The important point is that neither fries if you know what you're
doing. If this was such a big deal, no manufacturer would use amd for
fear of lawsuits.

Manufacturers use whatever is cheapest; the threat of a lawsuit is too
small to influence their decisions.

 

[Chris Hill]

Manufacturers use whatever is cheapest; the threat of a lawsuit is too
small to influence their decisions.

I don't buy it. Bad marks in places like Consumer Reports would also
result, and that'd sting even worse.

 

[No One]

\AMD dual core. Runs cooler. If I had all the time in the world, I
would wait until they upgrade later in the year to use ddr2.

They are finally moving to DDR2? About time. I've been running DDR2 on
my P4 for almost a year. I've thought about moving to the 64 bit AMD,
but the lack of DDR2 support has held me back.

 

[No One]

I prefer 32-bit to 64-bit currently. It will be a long time before
64-bit applications significantly outnumber 32-bit applications.

My god I've heard this before. First it was 8 to 16 bit. Then it was
16 to 32. Now 32 to 64.

 

[David Maynard]

No. The important point is that neither fries if you know what you're
doing. If this was such a big deal, no manufacturer would use amd for
fear of lawsuits.

You're trying to argue an impossibility. The fact of the matter is that no
matter how much you think you "know what you're doing" or what precautions
you take, like sitting in front of the thing 24/7 diligently listening for
fan failure, there is a non zero possibility of the AMD system failing
under conditions the Intel, because of it's internal thermal shutdown, won't.

You can argue it's so small a possibility that *you* don't care but that
doesn't mean it isn't important to someone else and, regardless of how
'rare', it's still catastrophic to the person it happens to.

In some ways it's like the insurance people buy with the hopes of never
having to use. Is that foolish as well? Might seem so, unless that 'rare',
non zero probability, moment happens.

 

[Chris Hill]

You're trying to argue an impossibility. The fact of the matter is that no
matter how much you think you "know what you're doing" or what precautions
you take, like sitting in front of the thing 24/7 diligently listening for
fan failure, there is a non zero possibility of the AMD system failing
under conditions the Intel, because of it's internal thermal shutdown, won't.

Well, fact is, I don't see many fan failures that don't pre-announce
themselves. If a computer dying is catastrphic somebody needs to get
their financial house in order.

 

[David Maynard]

Well, fact is, I don't see many fan failures that don't pre-announce
themselves.

You said "many" because you can't guarantee none will and that's a non zero
possibility.

If a computer dying is catastrphic somebody needs to get
their financial house in order.

Save up to buy a new one when it fails?

 

[Chris Hill]

Save up to buy a new one when it fails?

Or spend enough on a fan and a mainboard with overheat protection.

 

[David Maynard]

Or spend enough on a fan and a mainboard with overheat protection.

Safer to do both and use a CPU with internal thermal shutdown.

 

[Mxsmanic]

I don't buy it. Bad marks in places like Consumer Reports would also
result, and that'd sting even worse.

It would never get that far. For most people, if the computer fails,
they get it fixed or replaced. And most people use a computer
relatively lightly. And very few ever register complaints in any
durable way that would find its way into statistics.

There are zillions of vendors selling systems with cheap fans, and
they continue to prosper. They managed to sell three systems to me
before I finally got tired of buying junk and decided to build my own
from scratch.

 

[Mxsmanic]

Well, fact is, I don't see many fan failures that don't pre-announce
themselves.

Fans with sleeve bearings may fail silently and suddenly. They just
stop. You don't know until the machine overheats. It happened to me
several times.

And in the case of AMD, with no internal shutdown, the processor is
damaged by the time the problem becomes obvious (usually because the
processor stops working).

If a computer dying is catastrphic somebody needs to get
their financial house in order.

Sometimes a dying computer is a catastrophe. That's one situation
where you'd use Intel rather than AMD, just to minimize the chances of
a computer dying.

 

[Mxsmanic]

Or spend enough on a fan and a mainboard with overheat protection.

Or just buy an Intel boxed processor.

 

[Mxsmanic]

My god I've heard this before. First it was 8 to 16 bit. Then it was
16 to 32. Now 32 to 64.

Yes, and it has been true each time. Remember Win32s?

 

[No One]

No One writes:




Yes, and it has been true each time. Remember Win32s?

Remember it? I still have to maintain code for it from time to time.

 

[RJK]

This is all very interesting to add my tuppence worth ...a year or so
ago I slapped in a fan controller into a 5 1/4" bay, for several obvious
reasons - trouble is that it has become faulty ! The display cycles through
cpu / hd and another fan somewhere and displays, 0's for one of the fans'
rpm reading , (I did pop the side off and check that fans were all alive and
spinning !). ...which brings me back to my original question AMD or Intel

....it's no good as someone mentioned earlier in this thread, asking what
it'll be used for. EVERYTHING is the answer, and as fast as possible please
....without bankrupting me !

I want it to convert a good quality DivX5 movie into *.vobs, and auther it
for burning in 60 seconds flat, ...well I can dream if I want to !!!
....whilst writing notes for the idiots' system box that has just been
completely reinstalled and internet hardened, while drinking coffe with one
hand and burning a cd-r or dvd-r with the other, ....and at the same time
drooling over parts at Aria's web-site

....looking at the performance and cost comparisons of both, and after a
ponder on:-
http://www23.tomshardware.com/cpu.html?modelx=33&model1=202&model2=237&chart=63
http://www.aria.co.uk is where I always buy / service is second to none and
prices very hard to beat / with no con. on delivery like lots of sites
I think I may plump for a AMD x64 3800+
....but it's such a humungous amount of money for a cpu innit ?!!!! I wish
that I'd bought an MSI / Nforce dual channel controller for by trusty old
XP2600+ Barton that's currently stranded on a PC-Chips board ! ...why oh
why did I do that !

......a new guts is coming up soon I think !

regards, Richard