VueScan and frame edges

[Roger Halstead]

On occasion I find a batch of film where ViewScan and NikonScan for
that matter, have a problem finding the frame ends.

I typically run 4, 5, and even 6 image strips of negatives and
transparencies.

Whether the crop is set to manual or auto in these batches I find the
image contains the frame end and just a little bit of the previous
frame. Sometimes if more than a little bit.

Some times what works in ViewScan won't in NikonScan and some times
what works in NikonScan won't in ViewScan. That leads me to believe
the software detects the frame edge and not the scanner, but I don't
really know how it detects the frame edge and why in some film batches
it's a problem and not in others.

Any one have any thoughts on the "how and why" this happens? I don't
find any common denominator such as a vertical line that might be
confused with the end of the frame.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

 

[ankh]

On occasion I find a batch of film where ViewScan and NikonScan for
that matter, have a problem finding the frame ends. .....
Any one have any thoughts on the "how and why" this happens? I don't
find any common denominator such as a vertical line that might be
confused with the end of the frame.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

All I can say is "same here" --- just got a half-frame camera (Yashica
Samurai Z) and I've read the advice on how to use Vuescan -- I can measure
the offset to the first frame using the cursor, set that in OK; I can
measure the distance from the beginning of one frame to the next and set
that OK, but only one 35mm-size pair of images is displayed.

What I can't do is -- get more than two half-frames at a time to display in
the preview -- isn't that the "X-images" and "Y-images" option when the
Input is color negative film, displaying the previews for cropping? I get a
multiplicity of little cropping rectangles when I increase those numbers,
but all imposed on the one (full-35mm-size) pair of halfframe images shown.

Nor, after about 12 hours of trying. can I get any strip of this roll to scan automatically.

Mac OSX 10.3.4, Nikon Super Coolscan 4000 ED.

===> thought for Ed Hamrick -- could Vuescan recognize the
spaces between frames? A rectangle of zero density all the way across the
film? Run the strip through the scanner, find the middle of each one, and
identify the edges of the image that way?

--Hank Roberts
--N6VSB

 

[Ed Hamrick]

All I can say is "same here" --- just got a half-frame camera (Yashica
Samurai Z) and I've read the advice on how to use Vuescan -- I can measure
the offset to the first frame using the cursor, set that in OK; I can
measure the distance from the beginning of one frame to the next and set
that OK, but only one 35mm-size pair of images is displayed.

I think you need to use the "Input|Frame spacing" option for half-size
frames. I added this feature to VueScan specifically for half-frame
cameras.

could Vuescan recognize the
spaces between frames? A rectangle of zero density all the way across the
film? Run the strip through the scanner, find the middle of each one, and
identify the edges of the image that way?

I have a large collection of my own negatives that I want to scan
(with a Nikon LS-50), so I have some incentive to get this working
automatically. I hope to do this in the next month or so.

Regards,
Ed Hamrick

 

[Don]

I have a large collection of my own negatives that I want to scan

(with a Nikon LS-50), so I have some incentive to get this working
automatically. I hope to do this in the next month or so.

Due to history and my opinion of VueScan I have to start off with a
disclaimer that the following question has no agenda and should be
taken at face value.

Aren't you concerned with the lack of single-pass multiscanning on the
LS-50?

I myself am a proud father of a brand new baby LS-50 - which I
affectionately call "LD-50" ;o) - and I'm just curious why you chose
it over, presumably, many other scanners which you as a developer have
access to?

Don.

P.S. I realize that - wearing a developer's hat - you may not wish to
publicly elaborate regarding your personal preferences in order to
maintain independence.

 

[Roger Halstead]

I think you need to use the "Input|Frame spacing" option for half-size
frames. I added this feature to VueScan specifically for half-frame
cameras.

I should point out that this is not often a problem but just often
enough to be annoying at times.

I sometimes have a problem with the normal zero or nearly zero off set
to the first frame and it may not treat all frames the same. It may
treat one strip fine and have a problem with the next.

In my case it's the occasional strip of full frame 35 mm images. I
really don't see any difference between the problem strips and the
ones without problems. Perforations, false demarcations that fool the
algorithm? The interesting thing is that NikonScan does the same
thing, but not necessarily with the same images. *Usually* but not
always I can switch from one program to the other and get the strip to
scan. Of course I find the occasional partial image that was either
the end of film or chopped by the processor (nuther reason for
developing my own) and those I can understand being problems.

Then with NikonScan I find it may treat a problem strip differently on
different passes. Just feeding it through.

Some times with either program, just turning the strip around does the
trick. (I trim the ends so they look the same to me)

Some times I think it comes from the LS-5000ED, but then again I don't
know how it treats the demarcations. Nikon says ends must be trimmed
neat and with no open perforations at the end.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

 

[Ed Hamrick]

Aren't you concerned with the lack of single-pass multiscanning on the
LS-50?

No, not at all. The LS-50 has an excellent, low-noise CCD and A/D
converter. The thing I like best about the LS-50 is the LED light
source, which (in my opinion) works extremely well in separating
the dye layers in negative films. It's also quite fast, and I like
the strip film loader (less fiddling with plastic film holders).

Regards,
Ed Hamrick

 

[Don]

No, not at all. The LS-50 has an excellent, low-noise CCD and A/D
converter. The thing I like best about the LS-50 is the LED light
source, which (in my opinion) works extremely well in separating
the dye layers in negative films. It's also quite fast, and I like
the strip film loader (less fiddling with plastic film holders).

Yes, the LED light source is *the* reason why I got the LS-50 in spite
of my irritation with LS-30 (in particular) and Nikon (in general).

Not only the nominal specs as well as sharpness, but much more
importantly the fact that LEDs are a very stable light source which
does not change with time as is the case with other light sources.

However, (so far I have only been scanning Kodachromes) I do notice
some noise in dark areas, basically anything below about 35 on the
histogram. NikonScan (and presumably VueScan) try to minimize this by
boosting auto-exposure as much as possible and, usually, the histogram
doesn't even start until about 15.

But when the image has large dark areas which need brightening up
post-scan, the noise becomes visible in post-processing. To get rid of
it the exposure needs to be boosted so much that it clips the
highlights considerably. Still, on balance, I'm also very happy with
the scanner.

Don.