Vista and XP Network woes

[Dr. Hackenbush]

I have 2 PCs one with XP Home SP2 and all updates patches etc. It connects
to the internet via a cable modem and into the pc via ethernet on a nic pci
card.
I have also installed a second ethernet nic pci card and from this there is
a yellow CAT5 Crossover cable that connects it to my other PC which i have
newly installed Vista Ultimate.
B/band is accessible and working on both machines so that pretty much tells
me the nics and cables are ok

If i go to My Network Places on either PC both machines see each other on
the network, the XP machine can send files to the Vista machine BUT the
Vista machine cant send anyrhing back.
As soon as the XP machines icon is clicked i get an "Access denied message
speak to the administrator of the server." generic type message On the Vista
PC my a/c is an administator a/c with no p/word access all levels etc

On both machines i have not got any passwords, i have made everything that i
possibly can shareable from the root drive C: all folders and sub-folders
and files
On both machines i have made sure that they both have the same workgroup
name, although not necessary.
I have only the one user a/c on each machine which was created on
installation (apart from the default ones Windows creates). I have basically
made everthing where i can, available to anybody on either machine

I have checked everything that i can find on Vista, gone through advanced
settings , permissions etc, all the help files etc but still nothing that
helps.
I have reinstalled the network around a dozen times but still nada, only one
way transfer possible.

I have been on various forums but so far nobody has managed to suggest
anything that i havent already done or checked a gazillion times, been on
the Microsoft site but nothing.

This is my last port of call, next will be to uninstall Vista and put XP
back on both machines.

even apart from this problem i really cant see the attraction of Vista, its
all eye candy, and theres plenty of stuff around to make XP look and fell
like Vista themes skins 3d aero etc.

Its also pretty obvious that Bill Gates is making it harder to keep control
over your own machine, making it much harder to get access to system files
to change things etc.

Anyway Vista rant over, i really hate to give up on this and allow Vista to
beat me but so far it has

Anyone here know anything that might work ?

 

[Mike]

If i go to My Network Places on either PC both machines see each other on
the network, the XP machine can send files to the Vista machine BUT the
Vista machine cant send anyrhing back.
As soon as the XP machines icon is clicked i get an "Access denied message
speak to the administrator of the server." generic type message On the Vista
PC my a/c is an administator a/c with no p/word access all levels etc

Is the XP firewall on?

Mike

 

[Dr. Hackenbush]

Is the XP firewall on?

Mike

Yup already tried that, even turned of anti-virus etc just in case that was
maybe blocking incoming

Thanks

 

[babaloo]

I have the same problem.
It is impossible for many users to reliably connect Vista computers to XP
computers, worse if the XP computers are using a wireless connection.
You may solve the problem for one session but the next time one of the
computers reboots the same problems recur.
My favorite Vista network problem is when I open a file under Vista that is
stored on an XP computer. The Vista computer cannot then find the XP
computer to save the file even though it opened the file from the XP
computer to begin with.
The only solution I have found, if you have to actually get work done and
not fiddle around with Microsoft's problem child, is to get rid of Vista.
If you can arrange to have a dual boot setup you can intermittently fiddle
with Vista and be ready when Microsoft ultimately issues the total rewrite
it will label as Service Pack 1, which may or may not solve Vista's many
problems.
I know that is not the answer you want but it is the answer that is
guaranteed to solve your problem.

 

[Mike]

Yup already tried that, even turned of anti-virus etc just in case that was
maybe blocking incoming

"Access Denied" means just that. It means you got thru to the XP box,
but it actively refused the connection. This is different from "can't
connect" or "can't see the machine/drive" or "nothing happens and it
just times out", etc.

So *something* is blocking you - drive/folder permissions, user
accounts/passwords, firewall - something is saying "no" to your
connection attempt. The fact that it works in the opposite direction
proves that the basic networking is correct.

Have you tried booting the XP box in safe mode with networking? How
about removing all the shares on the XP box and just re-sharing the
drive itself - not individual folders. Give "everyone" full control.

Mike

 

[Dr. Hackenbush]

"Access Denied" means just that. It means you got thru to the XP box,
but it actively refused the connection. This is different from "can't
connect" or "can't see the machine/drive" or "nothing happens and it
just times out", etc.

So *something* is blocking you - drive/folder permissions, user
accounts/passwords, firewall - something is saying "no" to your
connection attempt. The fact that it works in the opposite direction
proves that the basic networking is correct.

Have you tried booting the XP box in safe mode with networking? How
about removing all the shares on the XP box and just re-sharing the
drive itself - not individual folders. Give "everyone" full control.

Mike

Believe me i've gone throught permissions and access control etc till i'm
blue in the face, but i havnt tried in safe mode so shall deffo give that a
bash.

I realise that because certain things are working that basically the network
is sound but this Access message comes up so quick , literally no delay as
the mouse is clicked, its there, it doesnt even seem to be trying to access
anything its just too quick, i'm sure its a Vista problem, nothing else that
is clicked responds this fast

 

[Dr. Hackenbush]

I have the same problem.
It is impossible for many users to reliably connect Vista computers to XP
computers, worse if the XP computers are using a wireless connection.
You may solve the problem for one session but the next time one of the
computers reboots the same problems recur.
My favorite Vista network problem is when I open a file under Vista that
is stored on an XP computer. The Vista computer cannot then find the XP
computer to save the file even though it opened the file from the XP
computer to begin with.
The only solution I have found, if you have to actually get work done and
not fiddle around with Microsoft's problem child, is to get rid of Vista.
If you can arrange to have a dual boot setup you can intermittently fiddle
with Vista and be ready when Microsoft ultimately issues the total rewrite
it will label as Service Pack 1, which may or may not solve Vista's many
problems.
I know that is not the answer you want but it is the answer that is
guaranteed to solve your problem.

i have virtually reached the same conclusion, it would be easier to just do
what i was doing before, use my eternal usb drive and pass files around that
way, just have to switch it back and forth between PC's but it would only
take a second.

Its just the general malaise of Vista that i have read so much of and am now
experiencing myself, as i said in my OP its deffo a case of Style over
Substance.
I havent even bothered to think about trying my M-Audio Sound Card and
Cubase and all my other music recording apps.
From what i'm reading on the music forums i use it sounds like a non starter
from the off.

Better start looking for that XP disk, now where exactly did i put it
......... !?

 

[Mike]

Believe me i've gone throught permissions and access control etc till i'm
blue in the face, but i havnt tried in safe mode so shall deffo give that a
bash.

I've been trying various things here, and I can't get an "Access Denied"
message. The best I can get so far is "This drive is not
available........". I got this by removing the permissions for the
share. I then got the message when clicking on the actual shared
drive, *after* I've clicked on the XP machine name in Network on a Vista
machine.

Still playing............

Mike

 

[Dr. Hackenbush]

I've been trying various things here, and I can't get an "Access Denied"
message. The best I can get so far is "This drive is not
available........". I got this by removing the permissions for the
share. I then got the message when clicking on the actual shared
drive, *after* I've clicked on the XP machine name in Network on a Vista
machine.

Still playing............

Mike

Done Safemode , no change !

 

[Tom Allen]

I have 2 PCs one with XP Home SP2 and all updates patches etc. It
connects to the internet via a cable modem and into the pc via ethernet
on a nic pci card.
I have also installed a second ethernet nic pci card and from this
there is a yellow CAT5 Crossover cable that connects it to my other PC
which i have newly installed Vista Ultimate.
B/band is accessible and working on both machines so that pretty much
tells me the nics and cables are ok

If i go to My Network Places on either PC both machines see each other
on the network, the XP machine can send files to the Vista machine BUT
the Vista machine cant send anyrhing back.
As soon as the XP machines icon is clicked i get an "Access denied
message speak to the administrator of the server." generic type
message On the Vista PC my a/c is an administator a/c with no p/word
access all levels etc

On both machines i have not got any passwords, i have made everything
that i possibly can shareable from the root drive C: all folders and
sub-folders and files
On both machines i have made sure that they both have the same
workgroup name, although not necessary.
I have only the one user a/c on each machine which was created on
installation (apart from the default ones Windows creates). I have
basically made everthing where i can, available to anybody on either
machine

I have checked everything that i can find on Vista, gone through
advanced settings , permissions etc, all the help files etc but still
nothing that helps.
I have reinstalled the network around a dozen times but still nada,
only one way transfer possible.

I have been on various forums but so far nobody has managed to suggest
anything that i havent already done or checked a gazillion times, been
on the Microsoft site but nothing.

This is my last port of call, next will be to uninstall Vista and put
XP back on both machines.

even apart from this problem i really cant see the attraction of
Vista, its all eye candy, and theres plenty of stuff around to make XP
look and fell like Vista themes skins 3d aero etc.

Its also pretty obvious that Bill Gates is making it harder to keep
control over your own machine, making it much harder to get access to
system files to change things etc.

Anyway Vista rant over, i really hate to give up on this and allow
Vista to beat me but so far it has

Anyone here know anything that might work ?

It may be one of your gazillion tries but does the 'no passwords' state
also apply to the Guest account on the XP machine ?

Tom

 

[Dr. Hackenbush]

It may be one of your gazillion tries but does the 'no passwords' state
also apply to the Guest account on the XP machine ?

Tom

pretty sure , but i'll doublecheck.
wherever possible i 've always dispensed with passwords to avoid logging on
etc

 

[Dr. Hackenbush]

It may be one of your gazillion tries but does the 'no passwords' state
also apply to the Guest account on the XP machine ?

Tom

Guest a/c was off so ive turned it on rebooted both machines and now the
vista PC doesnt even see the XP one on the network, b/band still ok on both
..

As to passwords the guest a/c doesnt seem to give me the option of
passwording it anyway, if it does its not in the user a/c section of the
control panel.

 

[Dr. Hackenbush]

Guest a/c was off so ive turned it on rebooted both machines and now the
vista PC doesnt even see the XP one on the network, b/band still ok on
both .

As to passwords the guest a/c doesnt seem to give me the option of
passwording it anyway, if it does its not in the user a/c section of the
control panel.

OK musta been a small blip i rebooted and it see the XP machine but still no
access.

One thing i've noticed is if i try and access a system file on the vista pc
from the XP machine i get the same Access Denied message. Vista says in the
setup files that it doesnt allow access to certain system files to be shared
on a network,, so its as if vista is treating the XP machine as a system
file of sorts

 

[Galen Somerville]

<snip>

I just noticed you are connecting Vista to the network via WinXP computer.

If your cable modem only has one output then go out and buy a cheap NAT
router. Then connect both computers to the router.

What could be easier?

Galen

 

[Dr. Hackenbush]

<snip>

I just noticed you are connecting Vista to the network via WinXP computer.

If your cable modem only has one output then go out and buy a cheap NAT
router. Then connect both computers to the router.

What could be easier?

Galen

this was supposed to be easy, 2 PC's and a crossover cable

 

[Galen Somerville]

this was supposed to be easy, 2 PC's and a crossover cable

Except that you have XP involved even when using Vista to access the
internet.

 

[Greg]

I agree with others who have responded, that Vista networking is absolute
crap. It simply does not do what it should when networked with XP machines,
even when using a simple crossover cable with no wireless, hub or router.
Even when networked with other Vista machines it causes unaccountably stupid
things to happen (or not happen). And when you finally think you have got
something working at last, the next time you reboot or the next time Vista
downloads one of the hundreds of Mbs of "updates" that I have received since
buying my laptop, the same or a worse problem presents itself again.

So far I have encountered with Vista & XP computers networked:

not being able to share printers, USB devices, and hard drives;
weird mouse/fingerpad problems with vista folders
picture data irretrievably corrupted over networks and when copying to/from
USB connections by WPG
folders, computers, printers, etc appearing and disappearing from network at
the whim of Vista

At the moment one of my vista computers can use a printer connected to an XP
machine and the other one can't. No one can tell me why.

It's a pity MS couldn't get this right, as in many ways Vista is far
superior to XP - it's not just 'eye candy' - it really is far more stable
and almost never crashes. But there are just so many minor irritating
'unimprovements' (not just in Vista, but in Word, Publisher, and other MS
Vista products), on top of the major networking and hardware compatibility
problems, that rarely a day goes by that I don't end up seething at the
arrogance and lack of concern of Microsoft for their customers in their
development and release of such unifinished and poorly thought out and
tested products.

If you have the choice and can be bothered doing it, yeah, the only
guaranteed solution to your networking problems would appear to be to go
back to XP. Sad.

 

[Ian Betts]

Computer and Vista are not the problem, it is the user. Networking is just
as easy in Vista as it was in XP. Mine works with ethernet and wireless
connections between laptop and desktop with XP, Vista and Unbuntu links and
it all went like clockwork.

 

[Tom Allen]

Guest a/c was off so ive turned it on rebooted both machines and now
the vista PC doesnt even see the XP one on the network, b/band still
ok on both .

As to passwords the guest a/c doesnt seem to give me the option of
passwording it anyway, if it does its not in the user a/c section of
the control panel.

You have to run 'control userpasswords2' to change it but if you have
never used that I guess it's unlikely that Guest has a password set.
Does anything show in the XP machine's Security event log ('properties'
of the events) at the time you attempt to connect from the Vista machine
?

Tom

 

[Tom Allen]

Computer and Vista are not the problem, it is the user. Networking is
just as easy in Vista as it was in XP. Mine works with ethernet and
wireless connections between laptop and desktop with XP, Vista and
Unbuntu links and it all went like clockwork.

It's not just as easy but that's because it's more secure and more
things have to be just so.
Convenience and security never go together. MS having been berated about
an insecure system have moved from one to the other in this area.

My network just worked as well, Win98 (now gone), WinXp, Vista, router
and Buffalo NAS, but other than obvious hardware differences I have no
idea what it is about my setup and config that it works as compared with
those who have problems.

Tom