Video Card????

[rchapman]

Hi. I built my pc about 6 years ago and have the same hardware as when it was
built. I would like to get my framerates faster for the NASCAR 2003 game I
play. When the game come out in 2003 my pc ran it fine, now the game has been
updated etc and my framerate is slower and the screen gets a little glitchy.
I can't afford an all new pc so I was wondering if an updated video card
would really help? Here are my pc specs:
AMD Athlon XP 2400
ASUS A7N8X Delux M/B
512mb memory at 400mhz
Nvidia Gforce 4600ti video card

* I know I can upgrade memory to 1gb at a fairly cheap price too. Not sure
if it would help framerated though. I figured memory comes in more while
running multi tasks. Also, if I do upgrade memory, is it better to replace
512 stick with (1) 1GB stick or just add another 512? I've always heard
matching/pairing is better.

* Also, my video card is an AGP slot. Iv'e heard the PCI Express are better
but I don't think my M/B supports that.

Thanks for any and all replies!

 

[JS]

Your choices are somewhat limited for AGP
cards these days. The 4x series card you have
is several generations old.

So almost any NVIDIA 6 or 7x card will easily outperform
it. Here is a list of cards available at New for pricing
and reference purposes.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...&bop=And&ActiveSearchResult=True&Order=PRICED

Benchmarks:
http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/

 

[RJK]

Hi. I built my pc about 6 years ago and have the same hardware as when it
was
built. I would like to get my framerates faster for the NASCAR 2003 game I
play. When the game come out in 2003 my pc ran it fine, now the game has
been
updated etc and my framerate is slower and the screen gets a little
glitchy.
I can't afford an all new pc so I was wondering if an updated video card
would really help? Here are my pc specs:
AMD Athlon XP 2400
ASUS A7N8X Delux M/B
512mb memory at 400mhz
Nvidia Gforce 4600ti video card

* I know I can upgrade memory to 1gb at a fairly cheap price too. Not sure
if it would help framerated though. I figured memory comes in more while
running multi tasks. Also, if I do upgrade memory, is it better to replace
512 stick with (1) 1GB stick or just add another 512? I've always heard
matching/pairing is better.

* Also, my video card is an AGP slot. Iv'e heard the PCI Express are
better
but I don't think my M/B supports that.

Thanks for any and all replies!

Bearing in mind that money spent on "upgrading" a significantly older PC is
almost always best put towards much newer, if not completely new components,
which seemingly, often, inexorably leads to a whole new system box - for
minimal cost you can significantly increase the specification of some
critical parts for your "old" ASUS A7N8X by hunting on ebay, and hunting for
vendors with "new" old stock.

For a few pounds, I would upgrade cpu, as well as graphics card:-
e.g.
http://support.asus.com/cpusupport/cpusupport.aspx?SLanguage=en-us&model=A7N8X&product=1&os=17
ASUS A7N8X supports up to Athlon XP 3200+(400 MHz FSB)(Model 10)(Barton),
....often on ebay, higher spec. Skt A/462 cpu's are for sale - recently I
bought two XP2600 Bartons (1.91ghz-512kb L2 cache), to replace XP2200 and
XP1800, in two older PC's.
Not many 3200's around lately but, XP2600 / XP2800 / XP3000 (BARTON models
btw), would be a significant cpu improvement, over a XP2400.
re: DRAM/DIMMS...
"I've always heard matching/pairing is better."
....You need to consult A7N8X manual to establish memory module qty, type,
and configuration, in order to activate dual-channel mode on that
motherboard.
e.g. the manual says:-
"To enhance system performance, utilize dual channel feature when installing
additional DIMMS in any of the following sequence: Sockets 1&3, or Sockets
2&3, or Sockets 1, 2 & 3"
....looks like double sided DIMM's are not supported.
....looks like adding another 512mb stick of ddr400 will activate
dual-channel !
....note that fsb on XP2600 is 166nhz(ddr333), so your ddr400 will most
likely be fine (tho, will run at 166mhz).
....you have to up cpu spec. to XP3200 for a 200mhz fsb - ..without trundling
along to www.cpu-world.com, not sure about XP2800/3000 cpus.

Now on to discontinued "AGP" graphics cards, which is where you were
heading.
You will be sourcing a used or new, (discontinued) AGP card, and looking for
one with a GPU core speed faster than your current card
(...scrutiny of PSU specification will also be needed i.e. you could exceed
the capacity of your PSU to sufficently power all your potentially newer
parts !)
http://www.antec.outervision.com/ will help you calculate your PSU spec.
requirements.

....and because I'm getting tired, I refer you to JS, who I notice has just
posted, re: AGP cards !
....will add info. on AGP cards later

regards, Richard

 

[Mike Hall - MVP]

Hi. I built my pc about 6 years ago and have the same hardware as when it
was
built. I would like to get my framerates faster for the NASCAR 2003 game I
play. When the game come out in 2003 my pc ran it fine, now the game has
been
updated etc and my framerate is slower and the screen gets a little
glitchy.
I can't afford an all new pc so I was wondering if an updated video card
would really help? Here are my pc specs:
AMD Athlon XP 2400
ASUS A7N8X Delux M/B
512mb memory at 400mhz
Nvidia Gforce 4600ti video card

* I know I can upgrade memory to 1gb at a fairly cheap price too. Not sure
if it would help framerated though. I figured memory comes in more while
running multi tasks. Also, if I do upgrade memory, is it better to replace
512 stick with (1) 1GB stick or just add another 512? I've always heard
matching/pairing is better.

* Also, my video card is an AGP slot. Iv'e heard the PCI Express are
better
but I don't think my M/B supports that.

Thanks for any and all replies!

Re memory, if you have only two slots, add a 1gb stick. If it plays up a
little, take out the 512mb because 1gb should be enough anyway..

AGP cards are still available, so you should be able to get something better
than what you have now..

 

[RJK]

....just glanced through A7N8X manual - this board supports "1.5v AGP/Pro 8x"
cards !

regards, Richard

 

[RJK]

Here are my pc specs:
...now where was I ?

After considering upgrading cpu, and considering dual-channel memory mode,
and all the while giving kind consideration to PSU ...
AGP card :-

Your current... :-

a.. Controller: NVIDIA GeForce4 Ti 4600
a.. Bus Type AGP
a.. Memory 128MB DDR
a.. Core Clock 300MHz
a.. Memory Clock 650MHz DDR memory
a.. RAMDAC 350MHz
a.. Vertical Refresh See Chart on other side
a.. API Support Direct-X®, Open GL ICD® for Windows
a.. Connectors VGA, DVI, TV In/Out
a.. 1.23 trillion operations/sec.
a.. 136 Million triangles/sec setup
a.. 10.4GB/second memory bandwidth

....card has a core gpu clock speed of 300mhz,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_Nvidia_graphics_processing_units

....even a Nvidia 6200/6200a (core clock 350mhz) might seem faster in some of
its' specs. but, there are so many variables, features, memory
type/size/speed,
you'll have to invest lots of time and research on graphics cards !

....something like a GeForce 5 (5xxx) series or GeForce 6 (6xxx) series would
offer quite an improvement in graphics performance.
e.g. a GeForce 6600 GT with a Core Clock speed of 500mhz looks very nice,
(and hugely expensive), though some of them appear to require an extra 4 pin
molex power connection -
....requiring further PSU consideration !

....a quick rummage on ebay seems to indicate that AGP 8x cards are fast
disappearing, whilst some old / higher spec. ones are fetching ridiculous
prices - which takes us right back around to the argument that any money
spent on on upgrading and oldish PC, is almost always better spent on a
whole new PC ...or at least new PC innards !

regards, Richard

 

[rchapman]

Thanks to all information.

Re memory, if you have only two slots, add a 1gb stick. If it plays up a
little, take out the 512mb because 1gb should be enough anyway..

AGP cards are still available, so you should be able to get something better
than what you have now..

 

[Paul]

Hi. I built my pc about 6 years ago and have the same hardware as when it was
built. I would like to get my framerates faster for the NASCAR 2003 game I
play. When the game come out in 2003 my pc ran it fine, now the game has been
updated etc and my framerate is slower and the screen gets a little glitchy.
I can't afford an all new pc so I was wondering if an updated video card
would really help? Here are my pc specs:
AMD Athlon XP 2400
ASUS A7N8X Delux M/B
512mb memory at 400mhz
Nvidia Gforce 4600ti video card

* I know I can upgrade memory to 1gb at a fairly cheap price too. Not sure
if it would help framerated though. I figured memory comes in more while
running multi tasks. Also, if I do upgrade memory, is it better to replace
512 stick with (1) 1GB stick or just add another 512? I've always heard
matching/pairing is better.

* Also, my video card is an AGP slot. Iv'e heard the PCI Express are better
but I don't think my M/B supports that.

Thanks for any and all replies!

It could be, to some extent, you're processor limited. On my retired
A7N8X motherboard, I was using 3200+, and things were still marginal for me.

A7N8X Deluxe supports dual channel memory operation. Dual channel will
not make a significant difference, but in a situation where every little
bit helps, you can aim for that if you want. If you currently are using
one 512MB stick, place an additional 512MB stick on the other channel.
On Nforce2, the two slots close together are on one channel, the third
slot is on the other channel. So you fill the "lonely" slot first, and
then one of the other slots. Only the quantity of RAM matters - if
one 512MB was double sided, and one 512MB was single sided, Nforce2
claims to run that config dual channel, because Nforce2 is one of the
first true dual channel implementations. The memory controller on
each slot, seems to be independent, so row*column*rank*bank differences
can be tolerated. A single 512MB stick would be your cheapest upgrade,
to go with the existing 512MB stick. (The chipset is picky about
RAM, but you've probably heard that mentioned before.)

If you decide you want to buy 1024MB (1GB) sticks of DDR400 or whatever,
don't buy them from Ebay. There is a lot of "high density" memory for
sale.

(16) 128Mx4 = 1GB high density ("half-detected" on Nforce2, waste of money, Ebay special)
(16) 64Mx8 = 1GB low density (works - buy Crucial, Kingston, or some other branded RAM)

With regard to a video upgrade, it really depends on whether the game is
processor limited, or GPU limited. Either one of those could be the
limiting factor for your game.

If you look at the selection of AGP video cards on Newegg, the
reviews are mixed on what to expect. Driver quality is the
main concern, and "provided CD driver package" versus
"hotfix from the web site" type issues. Some cards got
fairly bad reviews, for one reason or another. It isn't
always "clear sailing" with the newest cards.

(You'll notice here, quite a few people bought the HD 3850 AGP.
Comes with a power adapter cable.)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...&bop=And&ActiveSearchResult=True&Order=PRICED

A HD 3850 uses about 63W here. Probably a bit more than the TI4600.
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/gigabyte-radeonhd3870-3850_5.html#sect0

(The new AGP cards aren't listed here, but the important thing is
the Nvidia Nforce2 is a "Universal 1.5V AGP 3.0 Motherboard",
meaning it can handle a 1.5V I/O card or 0.8V I/O card. It should
work with Rialto or HSI bridged video card designs.)

http://www.playtool.com/pages/agpcompat/agp.html

For cards not mentioned in the Playtool list, they'll have
characteristics similar to these.

ATI Radeon X1950 Pro Universal 1.5V AGP 3.0 Card
NVIDIA GeForce 7800 GS Universal 1.5V AGP 3.0 Card

ATI cards have Rialto on the backside of the card, as the bridge chip.

(In the center of the "pink goo")
http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/14-102-730-S04?$S640W$

Nvidia cards, when you can still find them, have HSI bridge chip
underneath a front mounted, separate heatsink.

(HSI bridge is under the small, separate heatsink.)
http://c1.neweggimages.com/NeweggImage/productimage/14-143-069-05.jpg

Paul

 

[Bob Harris]

I have an ASUS P4S8X, which is a little newer than your motherboard, and
which also uses AGP.

When attempting to replace a failing video card, I discovered that there are
at least three "flavors" of AGP, 3.3 volts, 1.5 volts, and 0.8 volts.
Additionally, there are three standards of AGP, 1.0, 2.0, and 3.0. Further,
there are several speeds of AGP from 1X to 8X. There are also a few
different shapes for the connector on the video card and to the receptacle
on the motherboard. And, of course, voltages, standards, speeds, and plugs
do not map one-to-one.

Some video cards support two standards, but expect the motherboard to know
how to tell the difference. Others might have jumpers to set the type of
AGP. In still other cases, the motherboard might have a jumper to set the
AGP.

Beware: Mixing different voltages can result in destroying the motherboard
and/or the video card, although it is more likely that the motherboard will
simply beep at you.

I had a GForce 5200 card and tried to upgrade to a 6200 card, both rated AGP
8X. No luck, the first was 1.5 volts and the second was 0.8 volts. I
contacted both the motherboard maker and the video card maker, and each said
it was the job of the other to provide for compatibility, such as via a
jumper or BIOS setting. So, I had to settle for another 5200 card.

In my quest for information about AGP I found a website that explains a lot
of things, and even has a compatibility table. Study it carefully, before
purchasing a newer video card:

http://www.playtool.com/pages/agpcompat/agp.html

Finally, I agree with the reply that suggested that investing the money in a
new PC, might be wiser than in a new video card. I doubt that you will be
able to achieve a significant improvement in performance, given your
motherboard, no matter what video card you use. Since you obviously know
how to build a PC, look into bare-bones packages, made from last year's
components, instead of today's cutting edge. These will still be far beyond
your current PC, and will support PCI-Express. Also, you may need something
a year or two old to support XP, instead of Vista, unless you want to buy
Vista (I wouldn't). Remember that things like mouse and keyboard and
monitor transfer easily between PCs. CD/DVD drives also transfer fairly
easily. IDE or ATA hard drives can be an issue on newer motherboards, which
often support only two ATA devices, one of which is the CD/DVD drive.
(However, they support many SATA hard drives, and those are fairly cheap
these days.) Of course, you will need to re-activate XP on the new PC.

 

[RJK]

...a quick rummage on ebay seems to indicate that AGP 8x cards are fast

disappearing, whilst some old / higher spec. ones are fetching ridiculous
prices - which takes us right back around to the argument that any money
spent on on upgrading and oldish PC, is almost always better spent on a
whole new PC ...or at least new PC innards !

regards, Richard- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text

....here's hoping that this little post doesn't repeat like a machine
gun, (...using Google NG's ATM - 'cause Tiscali is completley
strangling NNTP)
....this is all "rchapman's" fault, ...I'm now lusting after a higher
spec. graphics card for my old Conroe865pe

regards, Richard