SQL Server -vs- MySQL

C

Cor Ligthert [MVP]

Peter,
Cor - you are a complete embarassment. Mr Ryan was not using that as an
exact quote. Instead of playing childish games, why don't you respond to
his points? You accuse him of much and he makes a compelling argument -
why
you don't disprove him on the merit of what he said.

Proof, try to read this thread complete and keep track of the times they are
written. I have misreaded "one" of those messages (And sent almost direct
after that a correction which is completely ignored in the reply). In all
those I ask for proof what they tell. The only thing that I get back is that
*they* have warned me more times.

They don't allow me to tell to somebody who has a very exact question about
by instance the program language vb.net that there is a special newsgroup
for that.

The facts they are telling I have never done so I ask everytime for proof
than I can give a reaction on that.
I would suggest that Mr Ryan or Mr Bouma or Jon Skeet or Sahil Malik or
Herfried Wagner or Armin or any of the other MVPS that you start your
flames >with put up a web site to counter yours "Cor Lightert Greatest
Hits"

That is the same I am asking, with 60% of the guys you mention I am normally
way emailing with (with some more than the others), we do not always agree
with each other, however that does not mean that we don't respect each
other.

By the way, show those flames I started. I would real find you a guy if you
would proof what you write and show that it is flaming.
Then they could post all of the retarded answers you have posted over time
on it.
"How do I connect to an embedded database" and you reply "I think in the
say
way as a not embedded database." You are a MVP but you don't know what a
RTM build of Visual Studio .NET is.

Proof than I can give you reply now this is only making me black this kind
of things are easil to find on MSDN and they only interest me when I need
them.
I ask myself if you do the same in your classroom..

By the way as you quote me, do it than right, the answer was "I assume", as
you don't know it, assume means means in Dutch ('Veronderstellen'). A kind
of obviously expresly misquoting I have seen by more people in these
newsgroups and yes that is something I hate.
"I assume in the same way as to a not embedded access database."

In that there was nothing wrong written.
They could post all of that terrible code that hurts my eyes when I see it
that you post.

I have the same with those terrible empty studentic phrases from you that
everybody can read in a book. What I would not have written here if you had
not forced me to do so.
The honesty is that the only intelligent comments you make are ones that
you plagerise from the other people here. You should thank Mr Bouma and Mr
Ryan >and the other real MVPS for were it not for them, >

I assume that you with this suggest that I am not an MVP or do you want to
say that MVPS is something else by instacne a special boyclub.
you would have no code or comments to steal and would have to come up with
your own ideas. And we all have seen many too many of those.

Accusing somebody from stealing without proof is a crime in our country, I
will not go direct to the police, so proof your accusing.
And we all have seen many too many of those.

I assume you mean with that the not by me known MVPS boyclub.

I hope that as you write above is not a reflection in the way students in
our country are educating. There is not one proven fact in it.

Cor
 
F

Frans Bouma [C# MVP]

_R said:
I knew what to expect, Cor. I give posters here credit for some
perspective and I think the replies have borne that out. Much less
partial than I'd expect from rabid anti-MSers on some other groups. I
hate having to listen to rants about "MicroShaft", "MicroCrap" or
whatever clever names they come up with. <g>

Thanks to all for the info. With a few new keywords I found the
following comparison:

http://www.paragoncorporation.com/ITConsumerGuide.aspx?ArticleID=1

Apparently the reviewers think that PostgreSQL is more powerful than
MySQL. I'd still like to use MSDE or 2005 Express, but I suppose one
of the questions is cross-platform compatibility.

One of the big questions of the past years has been why MySql was
opted over PostgreSQL that often. Ok, in hte past years, PostgreSQL
wasn't up to speed, but the last couple of released are pretty slick
and quite frankly, featurewise they kick MySql in every corner.

FB

--
 
W

W.G. Ryan - MVP

Peter - comments inline
Peter Van Den Goess said:
Mr Ryan - may I politely contribute that you no longer continue this
thread.
You should as well consider blocking the posts from Mr Lightweight, I mean
Lightert.
- I've been in these newsgroups for a while and I've seen Cor behave like
this more times I care to mention. However until this particular post, i've
never had a problem with him. I suspect as I've tried to point out, that
his heart is in the right place, sometimes his comments are taken negatively
b/c of the language issue. I don't think blocking people is really
necessary. I think my original comments were totally appropriate and in no
way an insult to Cor - but I think I got sick of the way he blows up at
people any time he thinks he's being criticized.. Regardless though - I
should have just taken it to the private newsgroups. For this I'm wrong.

He is a fool and that fact is known by most everyone in here.
I've for years seen him start fights with people and almost always, he
starts them the worst when hes the most wrong.
In this newsgroup the only people I've seen him get into it with are Frans,
Sahil and Jon Skeet. However in the VB.NET newsgroup - well, that's a
different story. I don't know that I'd say that he's a fool - I think a lot
of his answers that seem foolish are due to language issues, and like i said
in my first post, his English is better than my Dutch - so i'm not going to
criticize him there. But I will criticize him for the way he blows up at
people any time he thinks he's being criticized.
But I have not seen you ever
get in a fight in here and you only make yourself look bad by responding
to
him.
-Read my blog - i've run my big mouth there more times than I'm proud of.
As far as the ng's go - I've been pretty good (until now) about staying out
of flame wars - probably should have just ridiculed him some more in the
blogosphere instead of doing it here.
When someone starts trouble with Mr Bouma or Sahil Malik, I know you
are quick to jump in it.
--Actually, Frans and Sahil both are much wittier than I'll ever be -
however I know Frans and Sahil pretty well and they are both 100% cool
people. I don't like seeing Cor start with anyone, particularly my friends-
but fortunately every time he says something to Frans, Frans exposes him for
the _____ that he is.
For that you are a good friend to people, but
getting this heated over comments made by a fool only makes you look bad. --Point taken.
Maybe will see fortune and Mr Lightert will go back to the rock he crawled
out from under but if he does not , do not make yourself look bad by
responding to him.
--Ok, point taken.

Peter - if you don't mind me asking - Do you see anything wrong with the
original comments I made to Cor? My point afterward is that he made a lot
of baseless accusations and none of them had anything to do with what I
wrote. I'll admit that after Cor started banging his spoon off of his high
chair , that i got a little too angry at him. But the point still stands,
he's the only one in here playing newsgroup cop and whether it's his intent
or not, it's not uncommon for people to take offense to what he says. We'd
all be a lot better off without a newsgroup cop. And in the same respect,
I do probably just need to stick him in my blocked list and be done with it.
I should have just ignored him and i was wrong to get into a flame war in
developer newsgroup.
 
W

W.G. Ryan - MVP

G

Guest

Peter, while everything you mention is valid, it seems to me that there is
obviously something wrong with the OP. Some of it is lack of language
skills, but his visceral reaction to everyone indicates some serious mental
issues. This whole thing should just go away and he should just be ignored.
 
S

Sahil Malik

I have to say Cor, I agree with Frans and everyone else over here.

Let me be absolutely unambigious and state my opinion "You are a disgrace to
this newsgroup".

One reason for that is your completely incomprehensible english, in an
english newsgroup. Strangely enough, your english seems to get worse as you
are cornered in an argument. You almost seem to use google translate, and it
is impossible to have a sane discussion with anyone who you cannot even
communicate with.

But the bigger reason being, the people who show up in these newsgroups with
well meaning questions, instead of making them feel comfortable and at home,
you instead choose to chastise them - that is plain ridiculous. If you donot
have an answer, then simply move on, and don't reply. If you find a post is
inappropriate, then **just don't reply**.

- Sahil Malik
 
S

Sahil Malik

I like SQL Server or MSDE more than MySQL. Probably for shared hosting
purposes MySQL is a bit cheaper - but IMO thats about the only advantage.
 
P

Peter Van Den Goess

Cor Ligthert said:
Peter,


Proof, try to read this thread complete and keep track of the times they are
written. I have misreaded "one" of those messages (And sent almost direct
after that a correction which is completely ignored in the reply). In all
those I ask for proof what they tell. The only thing that I get back is that
*they* have warned me more times.
Many times I read this thread and see nothing of your point. You are the
one that reacted strongly to what W.G. said while he did not even slightly
insult you. If a problem must be had by you, it should be with Frans Bouma
because Ryan said nothing offensive. But Frans said nothing of offensive
nature either so you should not have a problem with anyone. Yet you show a
lot of antagonism to Ryan when he was simply pointing out in a polite
fashion that your comment had a high possiblity of being misinterpreted as
it had in the past.
They don't allow me to tell to somebody who has a very exact question about
by instance the program language vb.net that there is a special newsgroup
for that.
This in not a point. Your words that you used were specific to this and had
to do nothing with VB.NET.
The facts they are telling I have never done so I ask everytime for proof
than I can give a reaction on that.
Are you saying seriously that you have never recommended that someone post
elsewhere and never has the OP gotten mad? I have seen it two times that I
know of. If I take the time to go through searching to post those links,
will you admit it? I say this only that I will show the links when you said
it and the OP got mad. Will you admit the mistake then?
That is the same I am asking, with 60% of the guys you mention I am normally
way emailing with (with some more than the others), we do not always agree
with each other, however that does not mean that we don't respect each
other.
But you are the one that showed disrespect to Ryan. I have seen you once
with Jon Skeet when you were totally wrong and he proved it, and all you
post is "Ok God". You don't acknowledge that you were wrong. This is a
long time for Sahil not to post but he will surely agree with this.
By the way, show those flames I started. I would real find you a guy if you
would proof what you write and show that it is flaming.
Why do I need to take my time extensively to prove what we know to be true?
I will do it if you will publicly apologise to the parties involved but you
never apologised that I have seen, not in public if you have. But I do not
see how you can even ask this while being serious. Look at what Ryan said
to you. He did not insult you at all. He did not in any way attack you.
Here is paragraph of your fist response which is a flame:

-----Let me tell that I am sick of moderators as you and Frans which like in
these newsgroups to flame people just because what they think that they are
writing, however not about the fact, but only doing that with a lot of
bullshit what is nowhere written by the person they accuse.---

My English is not good as it should be, but right off you tell Ryan that you
are sick of people like him, accuse him of flame, use profanity. The rest
of your post is hostile equally.
Proof than I can give you reply now this is only making me black this kind
of things are easil to find on MSDN and they only interest me when I need
them.
I ask myself if you do the same in your classroom..
If I do same what in classroom, what do you ask me?
By the way as you quote me, do it than right, the answer was "I assume", as
you don't know it, assume means means in Dutch ('Veronderstellen'). A kind
of obviously expresly misquoting I have seen by more people in these
newsgroups and yes that is something I hate.
"I assume in the same way as to a not embedded access database."
We are in English newsgroup and you did not say Veronderstellen. My point
is but that you are quick to answer questions and not care if they are
helfpul or not. I bring this up only becuase you claim always that all you
try to do is help people. How does such an answer be helpful or give
assistance?
In that there was nothing wrong written.
So connecting to embedded microsoft Access or SqlCE is same as Access or Sql
Server? Have either of them you ever done? If so, then how can you still
say your answer is a correct one? But the point I make is that this is
typical of how you answer questions - you do not quietly remain when you do
not know an answer. You can take minutes to research such questions and yet
you do not do so. Which is not of importance if you were more nice to
people. But when you answer with many junk answers and then hinder others
as well, that is what I find unacceptable as do apparently many others in
here.
I have the same with those terrible empty studentic phrases from you that
everybody can read in a book. What I would not have written here if you had
not forced me to do so.
What is studentic? My English is not good but I find not an answer for it.
But for what phrases that I make that you can find in a book?
I assume that you with this suggest that I am not an MVP or do you want to
say that MVPS is something else by instacne a special boyclub.
I say it in your native language - U bent een impostor- Many times I have
seen you when new awards are given, complain about the people that got them.
One time, Herfried told you that if you wanted to be MVP, that you should
use real email address and add a last name. You said you tried not to be
MVP but then you start using real email and last name. And more and more, I
see you answer questions only after other people did, you copy their answers
for you used to answer them differently. Then recently on your web site you
put them and pretend that you came up with such on your own. If it were not
for Sahil Malik you would not be MVP because your answers are almost always
his answers. Actually only when you are right are they someone elses, when
they are your own you are not correct. MVP is not a boyclub. Many females
are in MVP so how could I say such a thing?
Accusing somebody from stealing without proof is a crime in our country, I
will not go direct to the police, so proof your accusing.
This is why I say you are a fool. Material that is not owned, such as that
in dialogs like this, are not property, here or anywhere else. You will not
go direct to police because I committed not a crime. The English phrase I
believe is "figure of speech" which is what that was. I am hoping that you
are not so stupid as to think otherwise and this is just attempt by you to
be of humor in some way. But again, as judged by the comments you make on
technology, it would find it not surprising if you actually believed
something this foolish.
I assume you mean with that the not by me known MVPS boyclub.
--Again, MVPS has many women in the ranks so how could I think it boysclub?
When I say 'too many' I say that I have seen what your code looks like often
when you have not copied Sahil's work, and it is too much for anyone.
I hope that as you write above is not a reflection in the way students in
our country are educating. There is not one proven fact in it.
All is fact Cor. Where is one thing that I posted that is not true?
Should I have to spend my valuable time researching over and over your
exploits just so I can say what is known to be true already? You show your
dishonorable nature by lying about things that everyone here sees. Go to
VB.NEt newsgroup and post, "Me and other person are having dispute. He says
I am rude, that I have started many flames and that the quality of my
answers is often not good." Post it there and see what happens. I say that
if Sahil Malik, Frans Bouma, W.G. Ryan and everyone else mentioned did this,
they would not get the 'Yes' answers like you would. Show me one post or
even tell me of one time that W.G. Ryan, Sahil Malik, Frans Bouma, Jon Skeet
in this newsgroup got in flame with someone. Just even tell of one time
other than with you. Why does not one person come to your defense here ?
Why do so many people, and in MVPS, find you so offensive? I see not one
other battle between W.G. Ryan in here and anyone else. I see not one battle
between Sahil Malik and anyone else. I see not one battle between Frans
Bouma and anyone else. But over the years, I see many with you. So are you
in dispute that Jon Skeet and you did not have a dispute? Or Herfried and
Armin and you? Are those according to you part of 'not one proven fact'?
When I said that W.G. Ryan did not attack you and that you attacked him, is
that 'not one proven fact'? When I said that you play childish games, you
dispute that? I have already pointed out what I said. And if you are so
bold - I do offer to post proof. Many like Jon, Herfried and the rest
probably do not want to get in public dispute with you again but they do not
dispute what was said. If you are inclined to publicly apologise to the
people that you have wronged, I will go through and waste me time gathering
proof of what we all know is to already be true. Or maybe you are being
honest and you just forget how many flame battles have started with you.
Also I ask, you one last thing. You mention over and over about students.
Are you not yourself a student? I thought I had heard that you live at
home with your Uw Ouders. By this I assumed that were still a student and
without job. Was a mistake made by me in this assumption? And if you are
not student, why do you obsess over students so much? And why you not post
to dutch newsgroup since you bring my country in to it? My English is not
good as you can probably see but Frans is speaks Dutch too and we can
communicate better there where you can't hide behind language problems.
 
P

Peter Van Den Goess

Mr Malik - first off I give you thanks for confirming my point. Cor now
wants everyone to go through and prove with google the points made. But is
it not true that you, Frans Bouma, W.G. Ryan, or any other MVPs don't tell
people to go somewhere else to post unless they ask you? Is it not true
that you, Frans Bouma, W.G. Ryan and other MVPS in this newsgroup do not get
in Flame wars but Cor often does? Is it not also true that the quality of
answer by Cor indicates that he is not trying to be helpful many times, that
instead he gives advice that is wrong and shows that he knows not what he is
talking about. How can you answer question on Visual Studio 2005 features
and yet not know about RTM versions.

I said to Cor that he is not a real mvp like the others - he is not good
mannered, he is not knowledgeable like others, and I say this again and
again, if it were not for your code and the code of others, he would not
have anything to post but totally things that are incorrect. Do you
remember the question of showing only some columns in DataView. You came up
with answer of using dataset.merge which is excellent answer. Yet Cor never
answered that before you said it and used to always post something
different. Then you post it and he takes your idea and posts on his web
site, your same approach. I say this only as one example. Yes, we all are
free to use others peoples ideas, but he gives you no credit. he posts on
his own cite as though they are his own.

Without you and Frans and W.G. , Jon Skeet, and many other MVPS, and many
other people like Marina and David Browne, this newsgroup would not be good
as it is. But without Cor, it would only be better.The same of the VB.NET
newsgroup. He has terrible idea and terrible code. Also I see that in your
new book, many people say it is work of divinity. I have just read the
reviews on Amazon and your ratings are very good - I would expect nothing
less from you and I look forward to reading your work. And when I use
examples from it, I assure you that I will always credit you for it unlike
other Dutch person here.
 
S

Sahil Malik [MVP]

Thank you Peter. Honestly there are so many people we meet in here that it
is tough to remember the names without faces. I am sorry if I don't remember
our personal one on one interaction, but I am inclined to say that you are
right.

I haven't kept a personal recollection of the specific instances, but I do
in general agree with what you say - I have seen Cor "plagiarize" without
giving credit rather blatantly. In fact, so shamelessly at times that he
pretends to 'teach' the original poster, which is quite irritating IMO. Now,
the reason I choose not to mention that reason specifically is because, what
I, Frans, Bill Ryan, and others on this newsgroup know is NOT original
either. Frankly I have learnt from all you excellent people in here, and I
am regurgitating what I learnt from you, and certain awesome people at
Microsoft - in other words "I didn't invent ADO.NET". Even the folks who
"ASK" questions, frequently ask awesome questions - and make me and others
in here scratch our heads and think "How the heck would you do that". We
gain tremendous practical experience - thanks to your experience and
questions. I cannot possibly thank enough, the people enough who come in
here and ask questions.

AND there are plenty of folks in here who are pretty darned smart but not
MVPs. Just a few days back I remember I learnt something from Marina - about
CommandBuilder and DataAdapter. Dang!! That's 1 smart lady.

However, I do try and give credit to the original source. Since you mention
my book, let me copy paste the first paragraph of the acknowledgements
section of my book ---

BEGIN QUOTE
.........................
"No man is an island, neither are his thoughts. I am merely the medium who
wrote what I heard, read and learnt from various other well accomplished
individuals in my field or otherwise.
I would first like to thank the countless peers such as Bill Vaughn, Bill
Ryan, Miha, Herfried Wagner, Jon Skeet, Carl Franklin, and countless other
names of superb individuals who spend their time and effort disseminating
what they know. They truly believe that a candle lighting another candle,
only creates more light. It is from their endless, tireless discussions, and
countless, never ending community interaction that helped me collect what I
present in this book. None of these ideas are mine, I certainly didn't
invent ADO.NET, I merely learnt it from all these fine people."

.........................
END QUOTE

And thank you for your kind words about the book. I have indeed worked
extremely hard on it. Also, a big thanks to all the people in here, and most
of all the countless Microsoft Employees that helped me out. I'm just the
medium who put all that together. It is all of *YOU* that taught me all
that.

Hey speakin' of which, I'm soon releasing a multimedia series on ADO.NET too
;-) (Probably in November). That's comin' out REAL well. :). I am hoping to
be able to release some parts of it for free - if the publisher agrees.

Oh and I agree, I was sitting next to Mattias Sjogern (sorry if I butchered
your name), Miha, Jon Skeet and Frans at one occassion a few days back. I
was a bit overwhelmed to even introduce myself to Jon. Honestly, I have deep
respect for all these guys - especially Jon. Jon's answers are truly
incisive, sharp, to the point, and man does he show up a lot. Hats off !!
Someone please go tell him, he has a big flaming fan here who feels too
small to shake hands with him at the summit (blush blush).

- Sahil Malik [MVP]
ADO.NET 2.0 book -
http://codebetter.com/blogs/sahil.malik/archive/2005/05/13/63199.aspx
 
P

Peter Van Den Goess

Sahil - your post is why I and I feel other have many regards to you. I
have seen most of you acknowledge and credit for instance, David Sceppa and
Bill Vaughn many times. I have seen many of you say when you do not know.
I have seen humility from you. What I have not seen is humility from Cor.
Even now, in the middle, he refuses admission that he has done anything
wrong. I have statements in blogs by some of you that in English is called
Rant, but in newsgroup I have not seen ever where you have not helped
people. My problem with Cor is that he in my opinion does hit and run. He
will say antagonisticly things, and then if people get offense, then he says
it was not his intent and only English deficiency. Even now, he says the
example I used, about embedded database, that he was not incorrect. I said
mainly that his answer was not helpful. If he says something like "There's
another newsgroup" (and as others have said, it's a figure of speech not a
direct qoute), then he won't try to answer their question. Then he tells
things like when W.G. Ryan tried to answer the question about MDI Forms,
that he hurts the newsgroup because Cor can't search with such things in it.

I am not a MVP because I am not qualified to be one. Mainly my English is
not good enough for English language group. Maybe in a Dutch group. But I
am in wonder as how Cor got it because he is so much different from the rest
of MVPs. He for years has complained whenever he got not the nomination.
He has started fight after fight (which he of course denies now) with MVPS
and others alike.

I agree that many people in this group and other MSDN newsgroups are amazing
and make the group great even though they may not be MVP now. MVP is
acknowledgement for good word, but in between when you start and you get a
nomination, there may be a long time. Some like you and W.G. Ryan and Frans
seem to get it fast, others like Cor take years. I am just saddened that
people like him have the same title - that's why I said that you and the
others were "Real" MVPS because you do your own work, even as you say though
that it's always learned at some point from others. You help others. You
write books or make products. Cor does nothing that I can see but take
others work, and package it as his own, then promote himself. I have been
through his site and he credits no authors or magazine writers or anything.
But you, W.G. Ryan, etc, always mention other people's books, articles, web
sites. That's why you are real MVP and Cor is not. And that's why you have
successful books and Cor never will. As also, I know my English is bad in
many regards and this is English newsgroup - but you have different native
language too and you communicate very good - Cor should take your lead
instead of fighting you. Hopefully soon I willl have a favorable review of
your book as well ;-) on Amazon.

Peter.
 
C

Cor Ligthert [MVP]

Peter,

I hopefully am right (almost sure because some facts) and is somebody faking
your name.

It is than for me for sure an insider in the dotNet newsgroups.

I was really perplex to get a message from you like that because of the fact
that you are normally so polite and careful in your writing.

I should have looked at the used name, a Dutchman would never write his name
like that. (The used Dutch in the rest of the messages shows in my opinon
even more that somebody is faking you)

You can forget that row about studentic, I normally find your messages very
good and to the point and very polite, therefore I was perplex and tried to
answer in a kind of same way.

Sorry

Cor
 
S

Sagar Gupta

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Provides software outsourcing,outsource to india, Offshore software
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Email: (e-mail address removed)
Web: http://www.asiawebmedia.com
 
F

Frans Bouma [C# MVP]

Peter said:
Mr Malik - first off I give you thanks for confirming my point. Cor
now wants everyone to go through and prove with google the points
made. But is it not true that you, Frans Bouma, W.G. Ryan, or any
other MVPs don't tell people to go somewhere else to post unless they
ask you? Is it not true that you, Frans Bouma, W.G. Ryan and other
MVPS in this newsgroup do not get in Flame wars but Cor often does?
Is it not also true that the quality of answer by Cor indicates that
he is not trying to be helpful many times, that instead he gives
advice that is wrong and shows that he knows not what he is talking
about. How can you answer question on Visual Studio 2005 features
and yet not know about RTM versions.

I said to Cor that he is not a real mvp like the others - he is not
good mannered, he is not knowledgeable like others, and I say this
again and again, if it were not for your code and the code of others,
he would not have anything to post but totally things that are
incorrect. Do you remember the question of showing only some
columns in DataView. You came up with answer of using dataset.merge
which is excellent answer. Yet Cor never answered that before you
said it and used to always post something different. Then you post
it and he takes your idea and posts on his web site, your same
approach. I say this only as one example. Yes, we all are free to
use others peoples ideas, but he gives you no credit. he posts on
his own cite as though they are his own.

Without you and Frans and W.G. , Jon Skeet, and many other MVPS, and
many other people like Marina and David Browne, this newsgroup would
not be good as it is. But without Cor, it would only be better.The
same of the VB.NET newsgroup. He has terrible idea and terrible
code. Also I see that in your new book, many people say it is work
of divinity. I have just read the reviews on Amazon and your ratings
are very good - I would expect nothing less from you and I look
forward to reading your work. And when I use examples from it, I
assure you that I will always credit you for it unlike other Dutch
message news:OH1vv#[email protected]...


Let me say that the MVP title is an award for community efforts. This
means that MVPs have done a lot for the community, which can mean they
simply do a lot for the community and for example their development
skills are on average with everyone else here.

It's a misconception that an MVP should know everything. I don't know
everything, and neither do the rest of the MVPs here or in other
newsgroups, we didn't receive the MVP award because we know everything,
but because MS acknowledged our efforts for the community.

I must say that I'm not with the people here who want Cor to leave,
for the sole reason that I'm against any kind of ban/blocking
mechanism/rule for any newsgroup as Usenet is somewhat of an anarchy,
here there isn't a group of people who decides who can come here and
who can't, and I think that if you critize person A about the fact A
told person B to take a hike to another newsgroup because the post was
offtopic and decide that A therefore has to leave, you're doing the
same thing A did, which IMHO is not the way to go.

I do agree with the remarks about behaving like a professional though.
Posting in here with 'MVP' behind your name comes with consequences:
people will see you're an MVP and have expectations about the quality
and professionality of the answer, even if the MVP title is an award
for community efforts. After all: if you're doing a lot for the
community, you KNOW how to behave inside a community, at least that
should be expected from a person who got an award for community efforts.

In the past 15, 16 years I'm roaming newsgroups now, I've always
wondered why some people had the urge to tell other people what they
should do on usenet and which newsgroup they should visit instead. Of
course, a remark of that kind can be made to help, to point the visitor
to a newsgroup where he/she can get an even BETTER answer, though
usenet isn't new and IMHO a person who isn't a newsgroup newbie SHOULD
know that telling another person to post in another newsgroup is RUDE
and inpolite. And because it's rude and inpolite, it reflects on the
title that's behind the name, 'MVP'.

FB

--
 
F

Frans Bouma [C# MVP]

Cor said:
Peter,

I hopefully am right (almost sure because some facts) and is somebody
faking your name.

It is than for me for sure an insider in the dotNet newsgroups.

I was really perplex to get a message from you like that because of
the fact that you are normally so polite and careful in your writing.

I should have looked at the used name, a Dutchman would never write
his name like that. (The used Dutch in the rest of the messages shows
in my opinon even more that somebody is faking you)

You can forget that row about studentic, I normally find your
messages very good and to the point and very polite, therefore I was
perplex and tried to answer in a kind of same way.

Sorry

good catch. This 'peter' uses 2 s-es, which is odd indeed, plus he
uses this postinghost: 123-pool1.ras02.atl01.dial.cogentco.com
206.148.148.123, while peter normally uses cox.net (even 2 days ago).

Nevertheless, you should stop pointing others to post somewhere else,
even if you don't mean that in a way to control a newsgroup, but just
to be helpful. It's rude to the poster, please do understand that, and
because you post with the 'MVP' title, it gives us all a bad name.

Just cut the 'this isn't the right newsgroup' crap, focus on answering
questions, that's time way better spend.

FB
 
C

Cor Ligthert [MVP]

Hi,

I am sure now that the Peter Van Den Goess is not the Peter van der Goes,
with whom I have such pleasant expiriences.

I excuse me therefore again for even the slight part that I was not sure
about that in my previous message and will when I see them, read again his
as well often me educating messages..

I have made my excuses/apologizes as well by Peter van der Goes in a
seperate email.

Cor
 
C

Cor Ligthert [MVP]

Frans,
good catch. This 'peter' uses 2 s-es, which is odd indeed, plus he
uses this postinghost: 123-pool1.ras02.atl01.dial.cogentco.com
206.148.148.123, while peter normally uses cox.net (even 2 days ago).

Nevertheless, you should stop pointing others to post somewhere else,

For the 100th and more time, I never did and will never do that. It is in my
opinion rude and has not any sence because I am no order to moderate these
newsgroup as I have as well told you more than100th times.

The only real discussions I have had in very past with Herfried and Armin
were about this. I did that together with an English guy. After a while we
saw that it was because of the way Herfried and Armin were translating a
German word in English that could be used in more ways.

It was as well not the intention from Herfried and Armin and they changed
that style.
even if you don't mean that in a way to control a newsgroup, but just
to be helpful. It's rude to the poster, please do understand that, and
because you post with the 'MVP' title, it gives us all a bad name.

In this we disagree as I wrote as well 100 or more times. My information is
that it is that it is a good behaviour from somebody regular active in
newsgroup, to help people who are obvious new, to tell them that there are
better places (Without redirecting them in a disgusting way I sometimes see
done in not dotNet newsgroups).

However I become sick of getting almost every month a flame or other kind of
message from you and Bill telling me that, you both have no order to
moderate these newsgroups.

When I will see a more official message like that, than I will not do it
anymore. However, because that I have seen it done more by John Enkhanger
and as well at least one from David Sceppa, have I much doubt in your both
in my idea personal opinions.

http://groups.google.com/group/microsoft.public.dotnet.framework.adonet/msg/37afec9d09c40599

Even the style from David is more direct as I do it, sick as I am from all
those messages/flames I get than from some C# MVP's.

(By the way, I have seen that you made on about 7 october almost exact the
same message as my starting message in this thread in the newsgroup C#, it
is a message on which I would have given a reaction about VBNet because it
is not right, however I did not)

Cor
 
F

Frans Bouma [C# MVP]

Erm, no offence but I was again politely asking you not to do something
and I gave a reason why. You then find it necessary to get into details
about whatever previous discussion we had.

That's totally irrelevant. I asked you a couple of times now to not
post any 'this is the wrong newsgroup' postings again. Politely. I gave
a reason (a couple actually, but related) why. I can assure you, it IS
rude to the poster to tell a person with a question to go somewhere
else.

You can now see this as a flame or something else, I don't care. I
asked you a couple of times, politely, not to post that kind of
postings again.

This is the last time I ask you that politely. If you think you don't
have to stop posting these kind of postings and should continue posting
newsgroup postings like 'this isn't the right newsgroup', it's on your
responsibility.

FB

For the 100th and more time, I never did and will never do that. It
is in my opinion rude and has not any sence because I am no order to
moderate these newsgroup as I have as well told you more than100th
times.

The only real discussions I have had in very past with Herfried and
Armin were about this. I did that together with an English guy. After
a while we saw that it was because of the way Herfried and Armin were
translating a German word in English that could be used in more ways.

It was as well not the intention from Herfried and Armin and they
changed that style.


In this we disagree as I wrote as well 100 or more times. My
information is that it is that it is a good behaviour from somebody
regular active in newsgroup, to help people who are obvious new, to
tell them that there are better places (Without redirecting them in a
disgusting way I sometimes see done in not dotNet newsgroups).

However I become sick of getting almost every month a flame or other
kind of message from you and Bill telling me that, you both have no
order to moderate these newsgroups.

When I will see a more official message like that, than I will not do
it anymore. However, because that I have seen it done more by John
Enkhanger and as well at least one from David Sceppa, have I much
doubt in your both in my idea personal opinions.

http://groups.google.com/group/microsoft.public.dotnet.framework.adone
t/msg/37afec9d09c40599

Even the style from David is more direct as I do it, sick as I am
from all those messages/flames I get than from some C# MVP's.

(By the way, I have seen that you made on about 7 october almost
exact the same message as my starting message in this thread in the
newsgroup C#, it is a message on which I would have given a reaction
about VBNet because it is not right, however I did not)


--
 
F

Frans Bouma [C# MVP]

Cor said:
For the 100th and more time, I never did and will never do that. It
is in my opinion rude and has not any sence because I am no order to
moderate these newsgroup as I have as well told you more than100th
times.

Oh and btw, if you claim you never did that, re-read this entire
thread and re-read your posting about porsches, to which I replied with
my question to stop that behavior.

Claim all you want, I just asked you something politely, for crying
out loud.

FB
 

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