Sony, Toshiba join forces for next-generation DVD standard

[Radeon350]

Sony, Toshiba join forces for next-generation DVD standard

Two groups led by Toshiba Corp. and Sony Corp. that have been at odds
over the standard for next-generation DVDs have reached an agreement
and are in the final stages of deciding on a third standard, it has
been learned.

The two sides are reportedly aiming to come to an agreement on the new
high-capacity standard this month. If a single standard is adopted, it
will avoid incompatibility such as that which occurred between VHS and
Beta video players and tapes.

Japanese firms have been aiming to launch a next-generation DVD
standard at the end of this year. Toshiba Corp. and NEC Corp. have been
promoting the low-cost HD DVD format. Sony Corp. and Matsushita
Electronic Industrial Co. (Panasonic), on the other hand, have favored
the higher-capacity Blu-ray Disc standard. The two standards are
incompatible, and both sides have been at odds over them for the past
three years.

In the entertainment industry, Warner Bros. and Universal have remained
in the HD DVD camp, while others such as Walt Disney and 20th Century
Fox have supported Blu-ray. Under such opposition, digital content such
as movies would be viewable only with the corresponding player, and
this conflict has threatened to hinder software sales.

In a bid to reach a compromise, Sony Corp. and Toshiba Corp., which
have led the two opposing groups, have come together and are reportedly
in the final stages of reaching an agreement. They are reportedly
looking to produce a "third standard" that incorporates the benefits of
both formats. (Mainichi Shimbun, Japan, April 21, 2005)

http://mdn.mainichi.co.jp/news/20050421p2a00m0bu010000c.html
_______________________________________________________________________________


(Unless this is a mistranslation, it appears that THE DEAL has been cut
..... and a lot sooner than expected)




here's another similar report from yesterday:

___________________________________________________
http://www.reuters.com/audi/newsArticle.jhtml?type=technologyNews&storyID=8242617

Report: Sony, Toshiba Discuss Single DVD Standard
Wed Apr 20, 2005 04:11 PM ET

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Sony Corp. (6758.T: Quote, Profile, Research) and
Toshiba Corp. (6502.T: Quote, Profile, Research) are working on an
agreement that could come as early as this month to jointly develop a
new unified standard for next-generation DVDs, The Nihon Keizai Shimbun
reported in its Thursday online edition.

The report said Sony and Toshiba stepped up closed-door negotiations
around February to find a resolution to the standoff between their
competing products. As the leaders of the two camps supporting rival
standards, Sony and Toshiba have waged a three-year battle that
involves nearly 200 companies worldwide.

After reaching a basic agreement that a unified standard would be
desirable, they are now looking to develop a hybrid standard that takes
advantage of each standard's strengths, the Nikkei said.

Sony is said to have proposed using Blu-ray's disc structure and HD DVD
software technology. Toshiba has presented the idea of using HD DVD's
disc structure, which is closer to that of current DVDs, and employing
Sony's multi-layer data-recording technology, the report said.

Although the companies have yet to forge a detailed agreement, the
talks are expected to produce a workable solution since both companies
are likely to be eager to avoid a repeat of the VHS-Beta videocassette
war.

The Nikkei report said Sony and Toshiba have already begun briefing
Walt Disney Co. (DIS.N: Quote, Profile, Research) and AOL Time Warner
Inc. (TWX.N: Quote, Profile, Research) , as well as Hollywood movie
studios, for approval of a unified standard and to pave the way for the
signing of an official agreement between the rival camps.
___________________________________________________

 

[Matthew L. Martin]

Sony, Toshiba join forces for next-generation DVD standard

It's Deja-vu all over again.

 

[RichA]

Sony, Toshiba join forces for next-generation DVD standard

Two groups led by Toshiba Corp. and Sony Corp. that have been at odds
over the standard for next-generation DVDs have reached an agreement
and are in the final stages of deciding on a third standard, it has
been learned.

The two sides are reportedly aiming to come to an agreement on the new
high-capacity standard this month. If a single standard is adopted, it
will avoid incompatibility such as that which occurred between VHS and
Beta video players and tapes.

Japanese firms have been aiming to launch a next-generation DVD
standard at the end of this year. Toshiba Corp. and NEC Corp. have been
promoting the low-cost HD DVD format. Sony Corp. and Matsushita
Electronic Industrial Co. (Panasonic), on the other hand, have favored
the higher-capacity Blu-ray Disc standard. The two standards are
incompatible, and both sides have been at odds over them for the past
three years.

In the entertainment industry, Warner Bros. and Universal have remained
in the HD DVD camp, while others such as Walt Disney and 20th Century
Fox have supported Blu-ray.

Figures these two greedy studios would be supporting Blu-Ray.
I remember they were the LAST studios on-board with DVD when it
arrived. They let Warner and MGM, etc, do all the ground work.
That piece of s--- Michael Eisner may be gone from Disney, but
his greedy spirit lives on.
-Rich

 

[Alpha]

http://apnews.excite.com/article/20050422/D89KF3RG0.html

 

[Rod Speed]

Or the original news article just got it wrong. Wota surprise.

 

[SlimJim]

I'll believe in the unity when I see results. Personally, I think this will
be decided just like everything else--they both will release their product
and only one will emerge the winner through stores and studios. Just like
divix/dvd, HDcable&Directv/voom, vhs/beta, etc. And sadly, just like
everything else, some will choose the right one others will have an
expensive coaster or something for target practice. When they come out,
choose wisely!

 

[Black Locust]

I'll believe in the unity when I see results. Personally, I think this will
be decided just like everything else--they both will release their product
and only one will emerge the winner through stores and studios. Just like
divix/dvd, HDcable&Directv/voom, vhs/beta, etc. And sadly, just like
everything else, some will choose the right one others will have an
expensive coaster or something for target practice. When they come out,
choose wisely!

Or better yet, everyone will just stick with regular DVD and save
themselves a buttload of cash in the process! Either way, anyone who
jumps onboard either one of these formats right off the bat is a ****ing
dumbass(this is of course assuming they don't combine the 2 discs
afterall...) because, like you said, there's no way of telling which
format will be victorious. It's better just to wait it out for a few
years and stick with regular DVD for the time being(which is more than
good enough IMO and is HARDLY long in the tooth yet). Just ask anyone
who invested in Betamax instead of VHS. A lot of them STILL feel burned
over their loss...

 

[Lawrence D¹Oliveiro]

It's better just to wait it out for a few
years and stick with regular DVD for the time being(which is more than
good enough IMO and is HARDLY long in the tooth yet).

Its capacity is falling behind, though.

Consider that when the first CD-ROMs came out in 1985, typical hard
drive capacities were 20-40MB, so CDs were *huge*. It wasn't until the
early 1990s--nearly a decade later--that hard disks of the size of a
CD-ROM became commonplace.

Then DVDs came out in 1996, and typical hard drives were equalling their
capacity by about a year later.

Now these new Blu-Ray/HD-DVD discs are already only a fraction of the
size of typical hard drives--and they haven't even come out yet!

Makes you wonder about optical storage, doesn't it?

 

[Quantum Leaper]

Or better yet, everyone will just stick with regular DVD and save
themselves a buttload of cash in the process! Either way, anyone who
jumps onboard either one of these formats right off the bat is a
****ing dumbass(this is of course assuming they don't combine the 2
discs afterall...) because, like you said, there's no way of telling
which format will be victorious. It's better just to wait it out for

I'm not going to get a new drive until they either make a drive the plays
BOTH formats, there is a clear winner or they pick which format that the
industry is going to support. I hope one of those will happen fairly
fast. I do give Blue-Ray the edge, since Sony is going to put it in the
PS3. Microsoft and Nintendo haven't said what type of drive they are going
to put in their system but most likely will not be a plain DVD drive.

 

[Rod Speed]

Its capacity is falling behind, though.

Doesnt matter a damn compared with picking the format that wont fly.

What matters is how many DVDs are needed for say TV
program seasons etc. Its still quite acceptible/practical.

Consider that when the first CD-ROMs came out in 1985,
typical hard drive capacities were 20-40MB, so CDs were
*huge*. It wasn't until the early 1990s--nearly a decade later
--that hard disks of the size of a CD-ROM became commonplace.

Irrelevant to what makes sense with DVD format today.

Then DVDs came out in 1996, and typical hard drives
were equalling their capacity by about a year later.

Now these new Blu-Ray/HD-DVD discs are already only a fraction of
the size of typical hard drives--and they haven't even come out yet!

Makes you wonder about optical storage, doesn't it?

Nope.

 

[Glenn Dowdy]

Or better yet, everyone will just stick with regular DVD and save
themselves a buttload of cash in the process! Either way, anyone who
jumps onboard either one of these formats right off the bat is a ****ing
dumbass(this is of course assuming they don't combine the 2 discs
afterall...)

Both groups are pretty far down the R&D path with the single technologies;
how long of a delay do you think we'll see if they try to combine them?

Glenn D.

 

[RichA]

Or better yet, everyone will just stick with regular DVD and save
themselves a buttload of cash in the process! Either way, anyone who
jumps onboard either one of these formats right off the bat is a ****ing
dumbass(this is of course assuming they don't combine the 2 discs
afterall...) because, like you said, there's no way of telling which
format will be victorious. It's better just to wait it out for a few
years and stick with regular DVD for the time being(which is more than
good enough IMO and is HARDLY long in the tooth yet). Just ask anyone
who invested in Betamax instead of VHS. A lot of them STILL feel burned
over their loss...

20 years later? Morons.
-Rich

 

[Black Locust]

Its capacity is falling behind, though.

For DVD-Rom/PC purposes perhaps, but for movies and tv series(which is
what DVDs are primarily used for), I think they're still more than
sufficient. I mean, the capacity of your standard audio CD has long
since fallen behind todays standards, yet it's still hanging in there
with no replacement format in sight. Makes you wonder how much life is
left in the current DVD standard? I think a lot more than 'some' people
are predicting.

 

[Black Locust]

Both groups are pretty far down the R&D path with the single technologies;
how long of a delay do you think we'll see if they try to combine them?

Could be just a couple months or even possibly a year or so. I honestly
hope they do delay the launch because I have no interest in them right
now and all they'll do at this point is add a lot of confusion to the
already overcrowded DVD market. I don't even have an HDTV yet. And until
I do, I'll be ignoring these discs...

 

[Steve K.]

I mean, the capacity of your standard audio CD has long
since fallen behind todays standards, yet it's still hanging in there
with no replacement format in sight.

There are two. DVD-Audio and SACD. They have been around quite awhile
now. One of the reasons (among many) why they have not taken off is
because everyone's attention in on low quality digital downloads that
have DRM. It's amazing how these record companies are obsessed about
protecting these low quality files when their higher quality tracks on
CD's are wide open. Just craziness.

 

[Rod Speed]

For DVD-Rom/PC purposes perhaps, but for movies
and tv series (which is what DVDs are primarily used
for), I think they're still more than sufficient.

Yeah, me too. Sure, a single physical disk would be better for say
TV program seasons and for movie series, but its no big deal really.

I mean, the capacity of your standard audio
CD has long since fallen behind todays standards,

Nope, not with the change to mp3 on the CD.

And any decent DVD player will play music off DVDs too.

yet it's still hanging in there with no replacement format in sight.

Yes there is, mp3 and DVD.

Makes you wonder how much life is left in the current DVD standard?
I think a lot more than 'some' people are predicting.

Yeah, while ever movies fit on them, its likely to have a long life.

Likely at least as long as CDs have had.

 

[Lawrence D'Oliveiro]

It's amazing how these record companies are obsessed about
protecting these low quality files when their higher quality tracks on
CD's are wide open. Just craziness.

Read "historical reasons". At the time the CD audio format was being
developed, "digital" was a new and wonderful thing. It had to be a
simple format because you couldn't build consumer appliances with
full-fledged computers in them, to do decompression, DRM or anything
like that. The idea of using CDs for computer data came later, which is
why CD-ROMs hold less data than audio CDs (the normal audio CD error
correction isn't quite good enough for computer data, so additional
error correction needs to be included).

For DVDs, it's quite the other way around. The DVD format is primarily a
computer data format, and DVD-Video, DVD-Audio and all the other DVD
applications simply build on this computer data format--put any such
disc into your PC and you'll see a UDF filesystem with files on it.

With Blu-Ray and HD-DVD, I assume they're doing the same thing as with
DVD: the discs are designed first and foremost to hold a computer
filesystem, and all applications are built out of files stored in the
filesystem.

 

[Black Locust]

There are two. DVD-Audio and SACD. They have been around quite awhile
now.

I said replacement format. These 2 tragic failures couldn't even
replace each other. Go check the CD your section at your local Best Buy
some time. I think you'll be surprised by the number of customers in
there digging through them. For what's now a technically "obsolete"
format that's fighting rampant piracy in the form of MP3 downloads, it's
still doing pretty well.

 

[Black Locust]

Nope, not with the change to mp3 on the CD.

And any decent DVD player will play music off DVDs too.

You mean DVD-A? Those things were dead before they even got a chance to
take off.

Yes there is, mp3 and DVD.

MP3 isn't a replacement format for CD. All an MP3 is, is a compressed
version of the raw data tracks on a CD. Without CDs, MP3s cannot even
exist. You can't make MP3s to distribute on the internet until someone
gets their hands on the original CD copy of the recording

Yeah, while ever movies fit on them, its likely to have a long life.

Likely at least as long as CDs have had.

Agreed. Hell, if Laser Discs can last for 20 years with just a little
niche status, DVDs can certainly hold on for at least another 10 years
considering they're now the mainstream format of choice. When even
Grandma has a DVD player, that solidifies it's long life IMO. As proven
by the fact that even now, VHS is STILL not entirely dead, 30 YEARS(!!)
after it's introduction. When a format penetrates as many households as
VHS did and now DVD has done as well, it proves very difficult for the
technology to simply just die overnight.

 

[Rod Speed]

You mean DVD-A?
Nope.

Those things were dead before they even got a chance to take off.

Sure, but any decent DVD player will play mp3 off data DVDs now.

MP3 isn't a replacement format for CD.

Sure is on that capacity question you brought up.

All an MP3 is, is a compressed version
of the raw data tracks on a CD.

Irrelevant on that capacity question you brought up.

Without CDs, MP3s cannot even exist.

Wrong. They can be created from scratch if you want.

You can't make MP3s to distribute on the internet until someone
gets their hands on the original CD copy of the recording

Only if its come from CD in the first place.

And music can be distributed in mp3 format too.

Agreed. Hell, if Laser Discs can last for 20 years with just a little
niche status, DVDs can certainly hold on for at least another 10 years
considering they're now the mainstream format of choice. When even
Grandma has a DVD player, that solidifies it's long life IMO. As proven
by the fact that even now, VHS is STILL not entirely dead, 30 YEARS(!!)
after it's introduction. When a format penetrates as many households as
VHS did and now DVD has done as well, it proves very difficult for the
technology to simply just die overnight.

Yeah, taint gunna happen.