Smartcool versus Thermoflow Case Fan

L

letterzone

I have assembled a PC with a Pentium IV, 3 GHz, HT processor. Its
performance is good; but since the system does not have the rear 92mm
case fan yet, the processor becomes overheated when it is used at 100
percent capacity. I wish to buy an efficient, low-noise,
temperature-controlled case fan. The room temperature here ranges from
15 degrees centigrade in winter to 32 degrees centigrade in summer.
After a long research over the Web, I found these two fans close to my
requirements:

1. Antec 92mm Smartcool Case Fan
temperature control range: 20 to 50 degrees centigrade
RPM: 1450 to 2070
noise: 23.49 to 31.23 dBA
air flow: 28 to 40 CFM

2. Vantec 92mm Thermoflow Case Fan
temperature control range: 25 to 50 degrees centigrade
RPM: 1860 to 3100
noise: 29 to 40 dBA
air flow: 34.5 to 58.5 CFM

On one hand, I want my system to be quiet; on the other hand, I want it
to be properly cooled in every season. I am confused which of the above
two fans I should order because the first one seems to be quieter,
whereas the second one appears to be more effective. I shall highly
appreciate any suggestions to help me out of this seemingly trivial but
reasonable confusion.

Thanks,
Gyan
 
K

kony

I have assembled a PC with a Pentium IV, 3 GHz, HT processor. Its
performance is good; but since the system does not have the rear 92mm
case fan yet, the processor becomes overheated when it is used at 100
percent capacity.

It would be wise to not run a system before you have it
finished. Cooling is not an optional part, odds are your
system lifespan is already degraded some by running hot.
Probably not enough to matter within it's usable lifespan,
but possibly... we can't see the rest of the case or temps
of other parts that don't have a thermal reporting function.
I wish to buy an efficient, low-noise,
temperature-controlled case fan.

Don't bother with a temp controlled fan.
Even when specific parts change a lot in their temp due to
load, the air temp in the case will only vary a dozen
degrees or so (unless the case airflow was horrendous, in
which case the solution is not thermally controlled fan but
to increase the case air intake passage area).

With only about a dozen degrees or less change in chassis
ambient air, there is not enough of a difference in air temp
to get an appropriate (useful) level of control from a
thermally controlled fan. If the fan had a control line
plugged into the motherboard's CPU (heatsink fan) designated
pin header, it would then gain more resolution per CPU temp,
but it should not, the necessary fan speed to change with
CPU temp is only that on the CPU.

The room temperature here ranges from
15 degrees centigrade in winter to 32 degrees centigrade in summer.

You need some insulation, a heater, and air conditioning.
Except if you're in a log cabin in the woods, there is no
need to have such inhospitable temp changes in this day and
age. Further, a 3Ghz P4 is not a very good CPU to use in 32
degree ambient, unless you replace the heatsink with a
quality aftermarket model. Again this will result in not
much change occuring in chassis fan RPM.

Essentially what getting the thermally controlled chassis
fan will do is make it harder to target the RPM you want,
not easier. It won't adjust enough from ambient temp
changes but the fact that it is adjustable at all means
you'll have to consult spec sheets to determine what it's
nominal RPM will be in the actual use, so it is much harder
to buy a low-noise model with any assurance it will provide
enough airflow, unless you over-spec the RPM and then use a
further method of speed reduction to tweak it once installed
and while temp measurements are taken during the 32C summer
ambient temp scenario.

After a long research over the Web, I found these two fans close to my
requirements:

1. Antec 92mm Smartcool Case Fan
temperature control range: 20 to 50 degrees centigrade
RPM: 1450 to 2070
noise: 23.49 to 31.23 dBA
air flow: 28 to 40 CFM

Not fast enough, with a 92mm fan you will need more than
2070 RPM to keep that CPU cool at full load in 32C room
ambient temp.


2. Vantec 92mm Thermoflow Case Fan
temperature control range: 25 to 50 degrees centigrade
RPM: 1860 to 3100
noise: 29 to 40 dBA
air flow: 34.5 to 58.5 CFM

This is closer to the right max RPM, and possibly about as
good as it gets for thermal control based only on case
exhaust air temp. However, it would ideally be at 3100 RPM
if the air temp had risen to 42C, 10C rise over ambient.
Keep in mind that this is all relative- the more passive
intake the case has, the more air will be exhausted with "X"
RPM of the exhaust fan. That is the key to maximizing
cooling effectiveness, seeing the fans as only 1/2 (or less)
of the case airflow design.

This fan suffers the same problems as most though, that it's
response to temp isn't great. 25C change in temp only
results in 1240 change in RPM. The ideal fan would run at
slightly lower than 1000 RPM at 25C, and be ramping up to at
least 4000 RPM at 60C if not 50C. Blame it partly on
cheap fan design- if it had 2 or more thermal sensors in
parallel, there would be a much better response to temp
changes. You could try to modify a fan to do this, choosing
sensors at roughly 2 x the resistance per C of the
originally spec'd part but that is beyond the scope of what
most would consider reasonable.


On one hand, I want my system to be quiet; on the other hand, I want it
to be properly cooled in every season.

Everyone has their own idea of how quiet, "quiet" is. Even
so, in a 32C room the rear fan will have to spin fast enough
most people would not call it quiet. Ideally you would
lower the room temp or use a 120 x 38 mm rear exhaust fan,
even changing the case (different case or modify that one to
accomodate the larger sized fan) towards that end.

In 15C wintertime use, it will be very easy to keep the
system cool enough, even the 1860 RPM of the Vantec is more
than needed, it could be ran lower than 1000 RPM and be
sufficient (again, providing the case intake area is good).
However, it is expected that below the 25C spec'd for the
Vantec, it would run slower than 1860 RPM... how much slower
I cannot say, it depends on the topology and component
values used in it's thermal feedback control which would
have to be dissected, reverse engineered OR actually tested
for reliable figures.


I am confused which of the above
two fans I should order because the first one seems to be quieter,
whereas the second one appears to be more effective. I shall highly
appreciate any suggestions to help me out of this seemingly trivial but
reasonable confusion.


The first one is not fast enough at max speed for the 32C
environment... not a good choice at all. The second one is
closer, but even it may be too slow. To put it another way,
who doesn't want a quiet system? Everyone does, but at 32C,
concessions have to be made if you dont' want parts to have
a decreased lifespan from running hot.

How about two fans? If you could fit two of the Antec fans
on the rear of the case, that might work well. It might be
louder than necessary in the off-season, non-summer use and
have a little extra margin in summer so a 22-47 ohm 2W
resistor could be placed in series on each fan's power lead.
 
G

Gyan

Thank you for your response, including the valuable comments and
suggestions.

The case I am using is properly ventilated, just according to the
specifications of Intel for the motherboard I am using (945 GNTL). Even
then, in the presence of the 80mm SMPS fan and absence of the 92mm rear
case fan, the system is cooled best when the side cover is removed.

In this age, which is technically advanced beyond imagination, it is a
pity that we still do not have properly-designed temperature-controlled
case fans. But it is unacceptable for me to use a case fan that runs at
the same RPM regardless of the temperature of the air inside the case.
So, as you suggest, I shall order the Vantec 92mm Thermoflow, though
some reviews say that this fan has the temperature sensor on the
exhaust side and it was designed as a CPU-heatsink cooler. I hope this
fan along with the 80mm SMPS fan will provide enough cooling for my
system even in the hottest part of the year, considering that the case
I am using has the specified design.

I don't have the option of using two 92mm rear case fans. If, even
after using the new case fan, I find that the system needs more airflow
in extreme conditions, I shall try to fix the problem by replacing the
80mm air duct on the side panel with an 80mm air-intake fan.

Gyan
 
K

kony

Thank you for your response, including the valuable comments and
suggestions.

The case I am using is properly ventilated, just according to the
specifications of Intel for the motherboard I am using (945 GNTL). Even
then, in the presence of the 80mm SMPS fan and absence of the 92mm rear
case fan, the system is cooled best when the side cover is removed.

That it doubtful, more likely you mean only the parts with a
temperature readout, read lower, but that doesn't account
for all the other parts meant to be cooling by a case that
draws in air through one end and out the other. If there is
much difference with the side cover off, your case is not
properly ventilated.

In this age, which is technically advanced beyond imagination, it is a
pity that we still do not have properly-designed temperature-controlled
case fans. But it is unacceptable for me to use a case fan that runs at
the same RPM regardless of the temperature of the air inside the case.

Then you're arbitrarily declaring it unacceptible without
having ever tried it. The problem is the environment, not
the fan. This assumes there is a user present, making it
too warm and too cool in opposing seasons. If there were no
user, the fan RPM could simply be raised as the slight noise
increase is not an issue then. However, ultimately it would
be better to have 3K RPM of the latter fan constantly than
to have parts overheating. One 92mm exhaust fan is not much
for a system in a 35C environment.


So, as you suggest, I shall order the Vantec 92mm Thermoflow, though
some reviews say that this fan has the temperature sensor on the
exhaust side and it was designed as a CPU-heatsink cooler. I hope this
fan along with the 80mm SMPS fan will provide enough cooling for my
system even in the hottest part of the year, considering that the case
I am using has the specified design.


It has nothing to do with "specified design". It is
primarily a matter of unimpeded intake and exhaust area. If
your case has a side intake near the CPU, it definitely will
not be sufficient because it robs the front /bottom quarter
of the system of airflow and possibly the video card too.

I don't have the option of using two 92mm rear case fans. If, even
after using the new case fan, I find that the system needs more airflow
in extreme conditions, I shall try to fix the problem by replacing the
80mm air duct on the side panel with an 80mm air-intake fan.

You don't have a good case for this system. Consider
changing it. Different environments and noise level
reduction do often require careful case selection, not just
a case with a side hole and duct.

CPU is not the problem, a better heatsink easily reduces CPU
temp regardless of the side duct. The problem is the rest
of the system and that the side duct reduces airflow through
it. It becomes more problematic the higher the ambient and
the more the noise is lowered with fan speed reduction of
mid to smaller sided single fans. Adding a side panel
pusher fan can make the problem even worse.
 
L

Last Boy Scout

I have assembled a PC with a Pentium IV, 3 GHz, HT processor. Its
performance is good; but since the system does not have the rear 92mm
case fan yet, the processor becomes overheated when it is used at 100
percent capacity. I wish to buy an efficient, low-noise,
temperature-controlled case fan. The room temperature here ranges from
15 degrees centigrade in winter to 32 degrees centigrade in summer.
After a long research over the Web, I found these two fans close to my
requirements:

1. Antec 92mm Smartcool Case Fan
temperature control range: 20 to 50 degrees centigrade
RPM: 1450 to 2070
noise: 23.49 to 31.23 dBA
air flow: 28 to 40 CFM

2. Vantec 92mm Thermoflow Case Fan
temperature control range: 25 to 50 degrees centigrade
RPM: 1860 to 3100
noise: 29 to 40 dBA
air flow: 34.5 to 58.5 CFM

On one hand, I want my system to be quiet; on the other hand, I want it
to be properly cooled in every season. I am confused which of the above
two fans I should order because the first one seems to be quieter,
whereas the second one appears to be more effective. I shall highly
appreciate any suggestions to help me out of this seemingly trivial but
reasonable confusion.

Thanks,
Gyan
Maybe you need a case with a better cooling air flow pattern. A lot of
Pent IV cases have fans that blow air from the outside directly on the
processor. Air inside a case can be 90 Degrees or hotter, so the
outside the case is usually cooler. You have to think of the total package.
 
K

kony

Maybe you need a case with a better cooling air flow pattern. A lot of
Pent IV cases have fans that blow air from the outside directly on the
processor. Air inside a case can be 90 Degrees or hotter, so the
outside the case is usually cooler. You have to think of the total package.


That's exactly what should be avoided.

The goal is not to try to get all the case airflow across
the CPU- if that is necessary it is only a sign an
insufficient heatsink was used. The more difficult the
environment, the more important the airflow be correct.
Correct is still, as always, in the lower front (or barely
the sides of the front bezel), cooling the drives,
southbridge, and video card all before making it to the CPU
and northbridge.

If you put an intake and possible a fan in a short loop the
flow in the rest of the case will change for the worse.
 
G

Gyan

OK, you are right: I don't have a good case for this system. I studied
the cases passed by Intel for this configuration and found that these
days most companies are producing cases with 120mm rear fan and option
for 92mm or 120mm front fan. A 120mm fan produces about twice the
air-flow rate than does a 92mm fan at about the same level of noise
generation. So, I have decided to replace my current chassis with a
good quality one which can accommodate a 120mm Vantec Thermoflow as a
rear fan, which has option for a front fan, and which has filters on
every air passage.

Thanks,
Gyan
 
K

kony

OK, you are right: I don't have a good case for this system. I studied
the cases passed by Intel for this configuration and found that these
days most companies are producing cases with 120mm rear fan and option
for 92mm or 120mm front fan. A 120mm fan produces about twice the
air-flow rate than does a 92mm fan at about the same level of noise
generation. So, I have decided to replace my current chassis with a
good quality one which can accommodate a 120mm Vantec Thermoflow as a
rear fan, which has option for a front fan, and which has filters on
every air passage.

Thanks,
Gyan


If the Vantec 12cm has the same RPM vs TEMP response as the
92mm version, it may be more than needed with two of them in
the case, excess noise. Remember that although a larger fan
claims same noise at higher flow rate, that is a free-air
rating. Once the fan is actually mounted in a chassis, it's
noise level goes up just as the 92mm fan's noise would
though with higher flow rate the noise level rises more (all
else being equal). That is not an argument not to use a
12cm fan, not at all, only that selection of a little lower
RPM fan is needed for same noise level, though still usually
higher flow rate.

The filters are another issue, it could be very difficult to
make a quiet system out of modern parts to run in 35C
ambient with filters. "Quiet" is relative though, if you
might be satisfied with whatever the resultant noise level
is after choosing the best fan for the job and find it
acceptible to have slight noise increase to accomodate the
filter, it is your call to make. A decent filter usually
cuts aiflow by about 50%, sometimes less if the filter panel
area is MUCH larger than the fan area (not just 12cm size on
a 12cm fan, for exampleJ), or other times much more if one
of those very fine filters with support brackets and an
environment dusty enough that the filter soon has
significant accumulation on it.

Thicker fans are best when using filters. If possible
choose 38mm thick rather than 25mm.
 
X

XModem

You have a whole lot of bullshit there.


If the Vantec 12cm has the same RPM vs TEMP response as the
92mm version, it may be more than needed with two of them in
the case, excess noise. Remember that although a larger fan
claims same noise at higher flow rate, that is a free-air
rating. Once the fan is actually mounted in a chassis, it's
noise level goes up just as the 92mm fan's noise would
though with higher flow rate the noise level rises more (all
else being equal). That is not an argument not to use a
12cm fan, not at all, only that selection of a little lower
RPM fan is needed for same noise level, though still usually
higher flow rate.

The filters are another issue, it could be very difficult to
make a quiet system out of modern parts to run in 35C
ambient with filters. "Quiet" is relative though, if you
might be satisfied with whatever the resultant noise level
is after choosing the best fan for the job and find it
acceptible to have slight noise increase to accomodate the
filter, it is your call to make. A decent filter usually
cuts aiflow by about 50%, sometimes less if the filter panel
area is MUCH larger than the fan area (not just 12cm size on
a 12cm fan, for exampleJ), or other times much more if one
of those very fine filters with support brackets and an
environment dusty enough that the filter soon has
significant accumulation on it.

Thicker fans are best when using filters. If possible
choose 38mm thick rather than 25mm.
 

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