REQ: Help to protect computer from kids....

[SB]

Hi,

My friend's kids continually do something to infect his pc with all sorts of
malware / spyware / etc. It looks like the majority of the stuff comes
through Hotmail & MSN messenger.

What's the best way to protect the pc from this? I've installed McAfee
Internet suite for him & it's updated automatically.

Are there any settings through windows that can be used to restrict the
possibility of damage but still allow messenger to be used? Can this be
done through profiles, etc?

What about additional software? Any tips? Especially interested in things
the kids cant override.

Any help or guidance would be greatly appreciated...

Steve

 

[Gaz]

Hi,

My friend's kids continually do something to infect his pc with all sorts
of
malware / spyware / etc. It looks like the majority of the stuff comes
through Hotmail & MSN messenger.

What's the best way to protect the pc from this? I've installed McAfee
Internet suite for him & it's updated automatically.

Are there any settings through windows that can be used to restrict the
possibility of damage but still allow messenger to be used? Can this be
done through profiles, etc?

What about additional software? Any tips? Especially interested in
things
the kids cant override.

Any help or guidance would be greatly appreciated...

Steve

A very simple programme which will *help*, but is not a general solution for
your problem, install and update spyware blaster, it prevents the PC from
visiting many of the sites that contain spyware.

A better solution would be to use software that uses 'blacklists' of sites,
plenty of them about, they list tens of thousands of sites and block
entrance. An alternative way would be to use similar software that uses
'whitelists' ie, your children can only go to the sites specified in the
list.

This software is very powerful:
http://www.codework.com/bcontrol/product.html

It is essentially for networks rather then single computers, but it does
work on single computers.

Gaz

 

[SB]

snip

A very simple programme which will *help*, but is not a general solution
for your problem, install and update spyware blaster, it prevents the PC
from visiting many of the sites that contain spyware.

A better solution would be to use software that uses 'blacklists' of
sites, plenty of them about, they list tens of thousands of sites and
block entrance. An alternative way would be to use similar software that
uses 'whitelists' ie, your children can only go to the sites specified in
the list.

This software is very powerful:
http://www.codework.com/bcontrol/product.html

It is essentially for networks rather then single computers, but it does
work on single computers.

Gaz

Hi Gaz,
Cheers for all of this - I'm downloading away as I type so I should be able
to give this a go later today.
Thanks again for the speedy help
Steve

 

[Duane Arnold]

Hi,

My friend's kids continually do something to infect his pc with all sorts of
malware / spyware / etc. It looks like the majority of the stuff comes
through Hotmail & MSN messenger.

What's the best way to protect the pc from this? I've installed McAfee
Internet suite for him & it's updated automatically.

Are there any settings through windows that can be used to restrict the
possibility of damage but still allow messenger to be used? Can this be
done through profiles, etc?

What about additional software? Any tips? Especially interested in things
the kids cant override.

Any help or guidance would be greatly appreciated...

Simple, you should have your friend go to a used computer store or pawn
shop and get the kids their own computer and keep them off of his or her
computer.

Duane

 

[rjdriver]

Hi,

My friend's kids continually do something to infect his pc with all sorts
of malware / spyware / etc. It looks like the majority of the stuff comes
through Hotmail & MSN messenger.

What's the best way to protect the pc from this? I've installed McAfee
Internet suite for him & it's updated automatically.

Are there any settings through windows that can be used to restrict the
possibility of damage but still allow messenger to be used? Can this be
done through profiles, etc?

What about additional software? Any tips? Especially interested in
things the kids cant override.

Any help or guidance would be greatly appreciated...

Steve

Anti-spyware and anti-virus programs are absolutely essential these days,
especially where kids are using the computer, but they may not protect your
friend from infected or malware containing files that the kids share using
using the file transfer features of many IM and e-mail programs. They are
probably trading ring tones or MP3s (legal and illegal).

Hotmail should have a way to not allow attachments to be sent, or a way
to have them scanned before opening. I haven't used instant messaging in a
while, but these apps may have built in controls that disallow file
transfers, while still allowing the basic messaging functions. He should
look for these features and activate them if they are there. But kids are
clever these days. If the control over these can't be password protected,
they will probably find it themselves and reactivate the features. And of
course, they will be upset when they discover they can no longer do this,
but your friend needs to take control of the system one way or another,
before he gets hit with something that starts destroying HIS files.

I would tell him to download ALL of the apps below. They are all free,
and remain free (not time limited trials). After installing, update to the
latest definitions and scan. Then update and scan weekly after that.
Spybot and Spyware Blaster work in the background to prevent access to or
downloads from known bad sites/files. AVG can be set to automatically scan
e-mail/attachments, but I'm not sure if it works with Web based e-mail like
Hotmail.

AVG Anit-Virus http://free.grisoft.com/doc/1
Spybot http://www.safer-networking.org/en/index.html
Spyware Blaster http://www.javacoolsoftware.com/spywareblaster.html
A Squared Anti-Trojan and Malware
http://www.emsisoft.com/en/software/personal/
Ad Aware http://www.lavasoftusa.com/software/adaware/

More powerful programs or removal tools may be need to get his system
completely clean of things like Cool Web Search, VX2, and other very nasty
self replicating malware, but the above 5 are a good start.



Bob

 

[kurt wismer]

Hi,

My friend's kids continually do something to infect his pc with all sorts of
malware / spyware / etc. It looks like the majority of the stuff comes
through Hotmail & MSN messenger.

What's the best way to protect the pc from this?

don't allow the kids to use the pc unsupervised... anything you install
to protect the machine they can and probably will disable...

 

[Virus Guy]

The best solution for a computer for kids is to set it up like a dumb
terminal you see at airport or hotel kiosks. Very restricted ability
to do anything. I'm not aware of any step-by-step instructions to do
this - maybe there are such configuration programs on the net
somewhere.

 

[Offbreed]

Hi,

My friend's kids continually do something to infect his pc with all sorts of
malware / spyware / etc. It looks like the majority of the stuff comes
through Hotmail & MSN messenger.

What's the best way to protect the pc from this? I've installed McAfee
Internet suite for him & it's updated automatically.

Get them their own computer, and break their fingers if they touch his.

Make a clean image of their hard drive, and reinstall daily. Make them
do the work.

 

[Todd H.]

Hi,

My friend's kids continually do something to infect his pc with all sorts of
malware / spyware / etc. It looks like the majority of the stuff comes
through Hotmail & MSN messenger.

What's the best way to protect the pc from this?

Pick it up and replace it with a Mac. By and large they don't have
these problems, and have a security policy system that requires an
admin password before modifying important system files.

I'm not being flip-I'm totally serious. For $500 you can get an mac
mini. Depending on what your time is worth, this may be a lot cheaper
than all the contortions you need to do to lock down a windows box,
maintain it in that mode, and still leave it usable for your kid.

Best Regards,

 

[SB]

Get them their own computer, and break their fingers if they touch his.

Make a clean image of their hard drive, and reinstall daily. Make them do
the work.

hehe - the computer basically is for their use. its just that they moan to
their father every time they break it. I'm not convinced they know they are
doing something dodgy tho.

top tips in here so i think i should be on to a good one from this.

Thanks

 

[SB]

don't allow the kids to use the pc unsupervised... anything you install to
protect the machine they can and probably will disable...

--

i may put a site logger on too just to let my friend check what they are up
to. the kids should be old enough to be responsible on the pc so I was
hoping to find something just to help them know when they are accepting the
wrong things, etc

 

[SB]

Anti-spyware and anti-virus programs are absolutely essential these
days, especially where kids are using the computer, but they may not
protect your friend from infected or malware containing files that the
kids share using using the file transfer features of many IM and e-mail
programs. They are probably trading ring tones or MP3s (legal and
illegal).

Hotmail should have a way to not allow attachments to be sent, or a way
to have them scanned before opening. I haven't used instant messaging in
a while, but these apps may have built in controls that disallow file
transfers, while still allowing the basic messaging functions. He should
look for these features and activate them if they are there. But kids are
clever these days. If the control over these can't be password protected,
they will probably find it themselves and reactivate the features. And of
course, they will be upset when they discover they can no longer do this,
but your friend needs to take control of the system one way or another,
before he gets hit with something that starts destroying HIS files.

I would tell him to download ALL of the apps below. They are all free,
and remain free (not time limited trials). After installing, update to
the latest definitions and scan. Then update and scan weekly after that.
Spybot and Spyware Blaster work in the background to prevent access to or
downloads from known bad sites/files. AVG can be set to automatically scan
e-mail/attachments, but I'm not sure if it works with Web based e-mail
like Hotmail.

AVG Anit-Virus http://free.grisoft.com/doc/1
Spybot http://www.safer-networking.org/en/index.html
Spyware Blaster http://www.javacoolsoftware.com/spywareblaster.html
A Squared Anti-Trojan and Malware
http://www.emsisoft.com/en/software/personal/
Ad Aware http://www.lavasoftusa.com/software/adaware/

More powerful programs or removal tools may be need to get his system
completely clean of things like Cool Web Search, VX2, and other very nasty
self replicating malware, but the above 5 are a good start.

Bob

Hi Bob, thanks for the list, I had adaware (current tool of choice to fix
the pc each time the kids break it). Spyware blaster looks a top option and
this is the 2nd reco for it. That ones def going on. I'll d/l the others
tonight too.

Thanks

 

[kurt wismer]

The best solution for a computer for kids is to set it up like a dumb
terminal you see at airport or hotel kiosks. Very restricted ability
to do anything. I'm not aware of any step-by-step instructions to do
this - maybe there are such configuration programs on the net
somewhere.

that's a brilliant idea... something they may want to look into is the
free vmware player (http://www.vmware.com/products/player/) combined
with the browser appliance virtual machine
(http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/vm/browserapp.html) to implement the kiosk
for their kids... another option might be one of the many livecd
distributions available...

 

[Dave Cohen]

Pick it up and replace it with a Mac. By and large they don't have
these problems, and have a security policy system that requires an
admin password before modifying important system files.

I'm not being flip-I'm totally serious. For $500 you can get an mac
mini. Depending on what your time is worth, this may be a lot cheaper
than all the contortions you need to do to lock down a windows box,
maintain it in that mode, and still leave it usable for your kid.

Best Regards,

Assuming you have a decent sized hd, a good solution would be to get
bootitng from terabyteunlimited.com. Partition the hd, create an os
partition for the kids and one or more for adults. You can password protect
the boot process and make image backup of whatever. Keep an image of the
kid's partition on a separate partition and you can restore kid's partition
in 15 minutes or so. You'll need to spend a little time familiarizing
yourself with the package, but it's very powerful, works well and there's an
excellent support group.
Dave Cohen

 

[Befunge Sudoku]

Get them their own computer, and break their fingers if they touch his.

Make a clean image of their hard drive, and reinstall daily. Make them
do the work.

Know any imaging packages that'll let you rewrite all the
executable stuff but leave data files alone?

 

[Offbreed]

Know any imaging packages that'll let you rewrite all the
executable stuff but leave data files alone?

Nope. I'm still back with W98SE <G>, where there was less trouble with
activation codes.

Those data files would include settings for various programs, right?
Settings can be part of the problem, and the way malware gets in.

Another part of the problem would be executables you don't know you
have. Replacing the executables you know you have and that do belong
there will not address them at all.

 

[Chas.]

I really like a software product named Prevx. I believe it comes in a
watered-down free version but also a "professional" version. It backs up my
firewall, AV and spyware programs very nicely. I added it to my system
after I discovered a key-logger had been installed somehow.

Basically, it monitors the system for any change to the registry, software,
etc., including the insidious changes that malware may make. The user must
approve any change. I think it can be configured so no changes may be made
to a system with password-protected authorization.

Here is a link: http://www.prevx.com/

No, I am not associated with the company . . . Just a satisfied user.

Chas.

 

[Art]

I really like a software product named Prevx. I believe it comes in a
watered-down free version but also a "professional" version. It backs up my
firewall, AV and spyware programs very nicely. I added it to my system
after I discovered a key-logger had been installed somehow.

Basically, it monitors the system for any change to the registry, software,
etc., including the insidious changes that malware may make. The user must
approve any change. I think it can be configured so no changes may be made
to a system with password-protected authorization.

Here is a link: http://www.prevx.com/

No, I am not associated with the company . . . Just a satisfied user.

I'm glad you view it as a backup rather than a primary anti-malware.
In fact, that goes a long way toward backing up your claim that you're
not associated with the company. I noticed their "It's all you need"
claim on their web site

I once took a look at it, and rather liked it. The idea of all the
feedback and updating is a good one IMO.

Apparently, having to make decisions once in awhile doesn't
bother you, but I do wonder if average users want the responsibility.

My main problem with something like this is the enormous difficulty of
testing its effectiveness. Testing scanners well is difficult enough
but here you have to find out if 100,000 viable malware samples will
be blocked by actually unleashing them on a test system. It may be
that much smaller scale but very well designed and planned tests
can be shown to be sufficient .... maybe testing with just a small
number of samples in each of a relatively small number of categories.
Right now, I don't know of any tests, good ones or bad ones, that
have been done. Do you?

One reason this is in the back of my mind, BTW, is that Kaspersky
will soon be offerring something similar in a module of their new
version 6 av scanner. Presumably, the other modules can be disabled
and only the IDS (or whatever it's called) module can be evaluated
(tested). That's going to be a challenge for testers.

Art
http://home.epix.net/~artnpeg

 

[Chas.]

I was thinking that in the case of kids adding programs, etc., to someone's
only computer, a program like Prevx could be really useful. It could be
configured in a way that a password would be required before making any
change to the system.

I have the "old" Prevx Pro on my own system. After posting here yesterday,
I decided to visit the site myself. Seems like they have modified their
offerings a bit.

You are correct that Prevx can be a pain. If you're going to do it right,
you must approve of any change to your system before it happens, and it can
take 10+ "approvals" before a new piece of software is finally installed.
Of course, you can also disable it or put it in "suspend" mode before adding
something, but then it may not "register" the addition (not sure about
that). Again, it could be configured so that a PW would be required before
disabling or suspending it.

Regarding effectiveness: The company does not present effectiveness data,
so it is certainly possible someone could come up with a work-around.
And -- having been victimized by a virus many years ago -- I would never
trust only one product to "do it all." On my system, I have:

Outpost Firewall
F-Prot for Windows
MS AntiSpyware
Spybot
AdAware SE Personal
Prevx Pro

So far, so good . . .

Chas.

 

[Offbreed]

I was thinking that in the case of kids adding programs, etc., to someone's
only computer, a program like Prevx could be really useful. It could be
configured in a way that a password would be required before making any
change to the system.

Can users install to NT based computers without an admin password?