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[Bill in Co.]

Why would I "log off"? It has nothing to do with being online (I'm on
dialup). I'm doing it (making the registry changes) *directly* in regedit,
and it takes effect immediately.

Did you log off - like I said? - it will not be apparent unless you do.

There was another setting that got changed when a ran a comparison of the
registry changes on using FreshUI (another "tweak" program):

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\Explorer]
"NoToolbarsOnTaskbar"=dword:00000001

...so, that and then the others I will quote yet again :

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\Explorer]
"NoTaskGrouping"=dword:00000000

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Advanced]
"TaskbarGroupSize"=dword:00000002

...I don't know if adding that first value will alter anything for you,
but
those ARE absolutely all the settings that happened to be changed...

But you HAVE TO LOG OFF STRAIGHT AWAY - and then back on, to have the
registry change effected.

Also, having 'Grouping' set to ON and having 'Grouping' set to it's lowest
value of 2 (i.e any more than 2 notepads get grouped under one taskbar
entry)
does NOT switch off the up /down arrows.

But, as you can see in the screen-shots I posted earlier, you can still
have
14 open IE windows and 54 notepads open and still no scrolling arrows.

But, if you had a particularly 'short' usable area of Taskbar (because,
say,
you had loads of Quick-launch icons) you WOULD get the arrows much sooner.

I have avoided seeing them in about two years since I implemented Taskbar
Grouping in the first place.

==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.

I know how to use regedit pretty well (so I don't need to create a reg
file
to do it), as I've been in there numerous times, so that's no problem.
But
I disagree with using TweakUI, as I like to have specific issues
addressed
with specific registry key changes that *I* make and document, and not
have
it all hidden under the auspices of a program like TweakUI, but that's
just
me. One of the two keys you mentioned earlier was non-existent, so
that part was
a non-issue.

The only thing left was to set the other one (below) to have a value of
2,
as you said below, which I tried, but that didn't and doesn't solve the
problem for me. Bill

If you mean the reg value below - then set it to '2' and NOT to '99'
(Hex63)
- as when I first quoted that value I was thinking you wanted the
opposite
of what I now realize you want.

i.e. To get rid of the 'nasty' up /down arrow 'scroll things'...

You could make a reg file out of the following :

--------------- begin --------------

REGEDIT4

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\ Explorer\Advanced]
"TaskbarGroupSize"=dword:00000002

---------------- end ---------------

...Or, you could execute the following from a 'Command Prompt' :

reg ADD HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Advanced
/v
TaskbarGroupSize /t REG_DWORD /d 2 /f

(The above command should be all on one line but may not appear so due
to
line-wrap. Please ensure that the command begins with 'reg' and ends
with
'/f')
But, in both cases, without the use of TweakUI - you MUST logoff / logon
to
see the change.

(Using the setting in TweakUI.exe 'refreshes' the setting without the
need
for logging off)

In fact, I really would advise you to download TweakUI - it's not a
'cheat'
I use a number of "Tweak" programs to get what I want out of XP - I
would
definitely use the program in this case - simply because of the
'refresh'
issue - or I'd be forever logging off and logging back on....

Just in case you change your mind :
http://download.microsoft.com/downl...a6-b352-839afb2a2679/TweakUiPowertoySetup.exe


*Note - Please exercise care when editing the registry, always create a
backup and / or create a 'System Restore' point first.

==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.




I didn't get it sorted. It never worked for me (that one registry key
you
mentioned that may or may not exist did not exist in my registry), so
no
matter what value I put in the other key, the scroll thing appeared.
The
only thing I didn't try was to create that other key you mentioned.

Tim Meddick wrote:
Bill,
I did not read the lower side of the posts before sending my last
post, just the reply you sent to my erlier post.

But I am glad you got it sorted, and hope my explinations were of some
help... ==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.





Well Bill,
<clipped>

 

[Tim Meddick]

Bill,
What I mean by logging off / logging back on has got nothing to do with network
connections!

Although the same terminology is used to describe the 'logging' on to the network -
what I thought you would have understood is the need (after changing MANY registry
settings) to LOGOFF WINDOWS - or more precisely - logoff your CURRENT USER (there's
usually no need to reboot).

You see, when you change a Windows setting using an appropriate Window's dialogue
box - Windows has code built-in to 'refresh' that setting so you can see the change
straight away.

But, when you change [edit] the registry directly - this often does not happen - so
you have to logoff the CURRENT USER (the "yellow" button above "Shutdown" on the
'Start Menu' ) and then log back on again in order to force Windows to 'refresh' and
so you can see the changes.

You will hear, time and time again, the expression : "You will need to logoff / logon
to see the changes" and they DO NOT mean by that: network connections or internet
(dial-up or broadband) connections.

They mean logoff your current user profile, then log back on again.

==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.

Why would I "log off"? It has nothing to do with being online (I'm on dialup).
I'm doing it (making the registry changes) *directly* in regedit, and it takes
effect immediately.

Did you log off - like I said? - it will not be apparent unless you do.

There was another setting that got changed when a ran a comparison of the
registry changes on using FreshUI (another "tweak" program):

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\Explorer]
"NoToolbarsOnTaskbar"=dword:00000001

...so, that and then the others I will quote yet again :

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\Explorer]
"NoTaskGrouping"=dword:00000000

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Advanced]
"TaskbarGroupSize"=dword:00000002

...I don't know if adding that first value will alter anything for you, but
those ARE absolutely all the settings that happened to be changed...

But you HAVE TO LOG OFF STRAIGHT AWAY - and then back on, to have the
registry change effected.

Also, having 'Grouping' set to ON and having 'Grouping' set to it's lowest
value of 2 (i.e any more than 2 notepads get grouped under one taskbar entry)
does NOT switch off the up /down arrows.

But, as you can see in the screen-shots I posted earlier, you can still have
14 open IE windows and 54 notepads open and still no scrolling arrows.

But, if you had a particularly 'short' usable area of Taskbar (because, say,
you had loads of Quick-launch icons) you WOULD get the arrows much sooner.

I have avoided seeing them in about two years since I implemented Taskbar
Grouping in the first place.

==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.

I know how to use regedit pretty well (so I don't need to create a reg file
to do it), as I've been in there numerous times, so that's no problem. But
I disagree with using TweakUI, as I like to have specific issues addressed
with specific registry key changes that *I* make and document, and not have
it all hidden under the auspices of a program like TweakUI, but that's just
me. One of the two keys you mentioned earlier was non-existent, so that part
was
a non-issue.

The only thing left was to set the other one (below) to have a value of 2,
as you said below, which I tried, but that didn't and doesn't solve the
problem for me. Bill

Tim Meddick wrote:
If you mean the reg value below - then set it to '2' and NOT to '99' (Hex63)
- as when I first quoted that value I was thinking you wanted the opposite
of what I now realize you want.

i.e. To get rid of the 'nasty' up /down arrow 'scroll things'...

You could make a reg file out of the following :

--------------- begin --------------

REGEDIT4

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\
Explorer\Advanced]
"TaskbarGroupSize"=dword:00000002

---------------- end ---------------

...Or, you could execute the following from a 'Command Prompt' :

reg ADD HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Advanced /v
TaskbarGroupSize /t REG_DWORD /d 2 /f

(The above command should be all on one line but may not appear so due to
line-wrap. Please ensure that the command begins with 'reg' and ends with
'/f')
But, in both cases, without the use of TweakUI - you MUST logoff / logon to
see the change.

(Using the setting in TweakUI.exe 'refreshes' the setting without the need
for logging off)

In fact, I really would advise you to download TweakUI - it's not a 'cheat'
I use a number of "Tweak" programs to get what I want out of XP - I would
definitely use the program in this case - simply because of the 'refresh'
issue - or I'd be forever logging off and logging back on....

Just in case you change your mind :
http://download.microsoft.com/downl...a6-b352-839afb2a2679/TweakUiPowertoySetup.exe


*Note - Please exercise care when editing the registry, always create a
backup and / or create a 'System Restore' point first.

==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.




I didn't get it sorted. It never worked for me (that one registry key you
mentioned that may or may not exist did not exist in my registry), so no
matter what value I put in the other key, the scroll thing appeared. The
only thing I didn't try was to create that other key you mentioned.

Tim Meddick wrote:
Bill,
I did not read the lower side of the posts before sending my last
post, just the reply you sent to my erlier post.

But I am glad you got it sorted, and hope my explinations were of some
help... ==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.





Well Bill,
<clipped>

 

[Ken Blake, MVP]

I know how to use regedit pretty well (so I don't need to create a reg file
to do it), as I've been in there numerous times, so that's no problem. But
I disagree with using TweakUI, as I like to have specific issues addressed
with specific registry key changes that *I* make and document, and not have
it all hidden under the auspices of a program like TweakUI, but that's just
me.

Your choice, of course, but I'll just mention--to you and to others
reading this--that essentially TweakUI does the same things you do. It
makes the registry changes for you and you can still document what you
do with it, just as if you used Regedit. And, most important, TweakUI
makes those registry changes more easily and more safely than if you
do them yourself. Even if you are very experienced in using Regedit,
it's still possible that you make a mistake with it.

So my recommendation is always to use TweakUI to make a registry
change if it's possible to do so.

 

[Jose]

Why would I "log off"?  It has nothing to do with being online (I'm on
dialup).  I'm doing it (making the registry changes) *directly* in regedit,
and it takes effect immediately.

Did you log off - like I said? - it will not be apparent unless you do.

There was another setting that got changed when a ran a comparison of the
registry changes on using FreshUI (another "tweak" program):

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\Explo rer]
"NoToolbarsOnTaskbar"=dword:00000001

...so, that and then the others I will quote yet again :

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\Explo rer]
"NoTaskGrouping"=dword:00000000

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Advan ced]
"TaskbarGroupSize"=dword:00000002

...I don't know if adding that first value will alter anything for you,
but
those ARE absolutely all the settings that happened to be changed...

But you HAVE TO LOG OFF STRAIGHT AWAY - and then back on, to have the
registry change effected.

Also, having 'Grouping' set to ON and having 'Grouping' set to it's lowest
value of 2 (i.e any more than 2 notepads get grouped under one taskbar
entry)
does NOT switch off the up /down arrows.

But, as you can see in the screen-shots I posted earlier, you can still
have
14 open IE windows and 54 notepads open and still no scrolling arrows.

But, if you had a particularly 'short' usable area of Taskbar (because,
say,
you had loads of Quick-launch icons) you WOULD get the arrows much sooner.

I have avoided seeing them in about two years since I implemented Taskbar
Grouping in the first place.

Cheers,    Tim Meddick,    Peckham, London.    

I know how to use regedit pretty well (so I don't need to create a reg
file
to do it), as I've been in there numerous times, so that's no problem.
But
I disagree with using TweakUI, as I like to have specific issues
addressed
with specific registry key changes that *I* make and document, and not
have
it all hidden under the auspices of a program like TweakUI, but that's
just
me.   One of the two keys you mentioned earlier was non-existent,so
that part was
a non-issue.
The only thing left was to set the other one (below) to have a value of
2,
as you said below, which I tried, but that didn't and doesn't solve the
problem for me. Bill
Tim Meddick wrote:
If you mean the reg value below - then set it to '2' and NOT to '99'
(Hex63)
- as when I first quoted that value I was thinking you wanted the
opposite
of what I now realize you want.
i.e. To get rid of the 'nasty' up /down arrow 'scroll things'...
You could make a reg file out of the following :
--------------- begin --------------
REGEDIT4
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\
Explorer\Advanced]
"TaskbarGroupSize"=dword:00000002
---------------- end ---------------
...Or, you could execute the following from a 'Command Prompt' :
reg ADD HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Advanced
/v
TaskbarGroupSize /t REG_DWORD /d 2 /f
(The above command should be all on one line but may not appear so due
to
line-wrap. Please ensure that the command begins with 'reg' and ends
with
'/f')
But, in both cases, without the use of TweakUI - you MUST logoff / logon
to
see the change.
(Using the setting in TweakUI.exe 'refreshes' the setting without the
need
for logging off)
In fact, I really would advise you to download TweakUI - it's not a
'cheat'
I use a number of "Tweak" programs to get what I want out of XP - I
would
definitely use the program in this case - simply because of the
'refresh'
issue - or I'd be forever logging off and logging back on....
Just in case you change your mind :
http://download.microsoft.com/download/f/c/a/fca6767b-9ed9-45a6-b352-....
*Note - Please exercise care when editing the registry, always createa
backup and / or create a 'System Restore' point first.
==
Cheers,    Tim Meddick,    Peckham, London.    
I didn't get it sorted.   It never worked for me (that one registry key
you
mentioned that may or may not exist did not exist in my registry), so
no
matter what value I put in the other key, the scroll thing appeared.
The
only thing I didn't try was to create that other key you mentioned.
Tim Meddick wrote:
Bill,
     I did not read the lower side of the posts before sending my last
post, just the reply you sent to my erlier post.
But I am glad you got it sorted, and hope my explinations were of some
help... ==
Cheers,    Tim Meddick,    Peckham, London.    

Well Bill,
             <clipped>

To totally eliminate any possibility of confusion in the situations
of:

Not sure if you need to...
There is a possibility...
Usually not required...
Might be required...
Might have to...
May be required...
May have to...

Just reboot. Then there is no question.

Or, be 100% sure about the change

 

[Bill in Co.]

Bill,
What I mean by logging off / logging back on has got nothing to do
with
network connections!

Although the same terminology is used to describe the 'logging' on to the
network - what I thought you would have understood is the need (after
changing MANY registry settings) to LOGOFF WINDOWS - or more precisely -
logoff your CURRENT USER (there's usually no need to reboot).

You see, when you change a Windows setting using an appropriate Window's
dialogue box - Windows has code built-in to 'refresh' that setting so you
can
see the change straight away.

But, when you change [edit] the registry directly - this often does not
happen - so you have to logoff the CURRENT USER (the "yellow" button above
"Shutdown" on the 'Start Menu' ) and then log back on again in order to
force
Windows to 'refresh' and so you can see the changes.

You will hear, time and time again, the expression : "You will need to
logoff
/ logon to see the changes" and they DO NOT mean by that: network
connections
or internet (dial-up or broadband) connections.

They mean logoff your current user profile, then log back on again.

==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.

OK, but I saw the changes right away anyways. And the solution you
proposed doesn't work over here. After about 8 items on the taskbar, that
stupid scroll thing (OR another, somewhat different arrow block) appears,
instead of simply reducing the width of the taskbar items to as narrow as
possible (granted, you can't read them at that point, but I don't care about
that)

Why would I "log off"? It has nothing to do with being online (I'm on
dialup). I'm doing it (making the registry changes) *directly* in
regedit,
and it takes effect immediately.

Did you log off - like I said? - it will not be apparent unless you do.

There was another setting that got changed when a ran a comparison of
the
registry changes on using FreshUI (another "tweak" program):

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\ Policies\Explorer]
"NoToolbarsOnTaskbar"=dword:00000001

...so, that and then the others I will quote yet again :

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\ Policies\Explorer]
"NoTaskGrouping"=dword:00000000

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\ Explorer\Advanced]
"TaskbarGroupSize"=dword:00000002

...I don't know if adding that first value will alter anything for you,
but
those ARE absolutely all the settings that happened to be changed...

But you HAVE TO LOG OFF STRAIGHT AWAY - and then back on, to have the
registry change effected.

Also, having 'Grouping' set to ON and having 'Grouping' set to it's
lowest
value of 2 (i.e any more than 2 notepads get grouped under one taskbar
entry) does NOT switch off the up /down arrows.

But, as you can see in the screen-shots I posted earlier, you can still
have
14 open IE windows and 54 notepads open and still no scrolling arrows.

But, if you had a particularly 'short' usable area of Taskbar (because,
say,
you had loads of Quick-launch icons) you WOULD get the arrows much
sooner.

I have avoided seeing them in about two years since I implemented
Taskbar
Grouping in the first place.

==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.




I know how to use regedit pretty well (so I don't need to create a reg
file
to do it), as I've been in there numerous times, so that's no problem.
But
I disagree with using TweakUI, as I like to have specific issues
addressed
with specific registry key changes that *I* make and document, and not
have
it all hidden under the auspices of a program like TweakUI, but that's
just
me. One of the two keys you mentioned earlier was non-existent, so
that part was
a non-issue.

The only thing left was to set the other one (below) to have a value of
2,
as you said below, which I tried, but that didn't and doesn't solve the
problem for me. Bill

Tim Meddick wrote:
If you mean the reg value below - then set it to '2' and NOT to '99'
(Hex63) - as when I first quoted that value I was thinking you wanted
the
opposite of what I now realize you want.

i.e. To get rid of the 'nasty' up /down arrow 'scroll things'...

You could make a reg file out of the following :

--------------- begin --------------

REGEDIT4

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\
Explorer\Advanced]
"TaskbarGroupSize"=dword:00000002

---------------- end ---------------

...Or, you could execute the following from a 'Command Prompt' :

reg ADD
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Advanced
/v TaskbarGroupSize /t REG_DWORD /d 2 /f

(The above command should be all on one line but may not appear so due
to
line-wrap. Please ensure that the command begins with 'reg' and ends
with
'/f')
But, in both cases, without the use of TweakUI - you MUST logoff /
logon
to see the change.

(Using the setting in TweakUI.exe 'refreshes' the setting without the
need
for logging off)

In fact, I really would advise you to download TweakUI - it's not a
'cheat' I use a number of "Tweak" programs to get what I want out of
XP -
I would definitely use the program in this case - simply because of
the
'refresh' issue - or I'd be forever logging off and logging back
on....

Just in case you change your mind :
http://download.microsoft.com/downl...a6-b352-839afb2a2679/TweakUiPowertoySetup.exe


*Note - Please exercise care when editing the registry, always create
a
backup and / or create a 'System Restore' point first.

==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.




I didn't get it sorted. It never worked for me (that one registry
key
you mentioned that may or may not exist did not exist in my
registry),
so no matter what value I put in the other key, the scroll thing
appeared. The only thing I didn't try was to create that other key
you
mentioned. Tim Meddick wrote:
Bill,
I did not read the lower side of the posts before sending my
last
post, just the reply you sent to my erlier post.

But I am glad you got it sorted, and hope my explinations were of
some
help... ==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.





Well Bill,
<clipped>

 

[Bill in Co.]

Your choice, of course, but I'll just mention--to you and to others
reading this--that essentially TweakUI does the same things you do. It
makes the registry changes for you and you can still document what you
do with it, just as if you used Regedit. And, most important, TweakUI
makes those registry changes more easily and more safely than if you
do them yourself. Even if you are very experienced in using Regedit,
it's still possible that you make a mistake with it.

So my recommendation is always to use TweakUI to make a registry
change if it's possible to do so.

My past experience with TweakUI is sometimes I forgot it was there in the
background, and it made it difficult for me to keep track of each and every
selective registry change I had made in the registry (many of which were
outside of Tweak UI's capability). So rather than have that mixed bag, I
keep track of each one separately.

 

[Ken Blake, MVP]

My past experience with TweakUI is sometimes I forgot it was there in the
background, and it made it difficult for me to keep track of each and every
selective registry change I had made in the registry

Sorry, I don't understand that sentence. TweakUI doesn't run in the
background.

(many of which were outside of Tweak UI's capability).

There's no question about that. TweakUI can't do everything. That's
why I say to "use TweakUI to make a registry change *if it's possible
to do so*."

 

[Mike Torello]

Sorry, I don't understand that sentence. TweakUI doesn't run in the
background.

I read it to mean that he doesn't always remember how he used it and
what changes he made.

BinCo sometimes uses his own terminology.

 

[Bill in Co.]

Sorry, I don't understand that sentence. TweakUI doesn't run in the
background.

I just meant that it was there, and that using it I had made some registry
changes, and that later I tended to forget what I had done with it, or, for
that matter, that I had even installed it, and used it to make some changes!

There's no question about that. TweakUI can't do everything. That's
why I say to "use TweakUI to make a registry change *if it's possible
to do so*."

I just prefer not having such a mixed bag (some changes made via Tweak, some
not - I'd rather keep track of ALL of them in one central place).

 

[Tim Meddick]

Forgive me, but that really is crazy - TweakUI groups like settings together in
groups and shows you what the current setting is.

But the registry is hundreds and thousands of settings that quite often have
seemingly abstract names and even more abstract values - to remember then all it a
much harder task than to refer to a setting under a relevant heading in the TweakUI
program.

The only reason I attempt to keep a record of registry settings is to advise other
people of obscure ones that there's no other easier way of setting.

But I nearly always also quote a program that can do the job too, if one exists, for
the simple reasons that it is simpler and easier...

==

Cheers, Tim Meddick, Peckham, London.

 

[Bill in Co.]

I don't try to remember them all, Tim. I have them saved with an
appropriate comment in separate folders and/or files on my computer. And
it's not like there are 100 of them to keep track of! And - most of these
changes are NOT covered by TweakUI, anyways.

 

[Ken Blake, MVP]

I just meant that it was there, and that using it I had made some registry
changes, and that later I tended to forget what I had done with it, or, for
that matter, that I had even installed it, and used it to make some changes!

OK.



I just prefer not having such a mixed bag (some changes made via Tweak, some
not - I'd rather keep track of ALL of them in one central place).

But even if you do things in two different ways, you can keep track of
both in the same place. As I said, it's your choice; I'm not trying to
talk you into anything. My advice to everyone else here continues to
be to use TweakUI--the easier and safer way--whenever you can.

 

[Bill in Co.]

But even if you do things in two different ways, you can keep track of
both in the same place.

No, because I store each of them in separate folders/files (including some
..reg files). And if some changes were done in TweakUI, there wouldn't
really be anything to store there, except, perhaps, a note to that effect.

As I said, it's your choice; I'm not trying to
talk you into anything. My advice to everyone else here continues to
be to use TweakUI--the easier and safer way--whenever you can.

I think for most people that's the best advice too.

 

[Ken Blake, MVP]

Ken Blake, MVP wrote:

I think for most people that's the best advice too.

Good, glad we agree.

 

[Mike Torello]

Good, glad we agree.

Be VERY glad: he could have taken this thread to another 40 posts if
that hadn't happened ;->