Problems sharing files between Vista and Windows 98

[Mark Bourne]

I am having problems sharing files between Windows Vista Business and
Windows 98, in both directions. Apologies for the length of this post -
I have tried to describe exactly what I've done.

Windows Vista Business is an OEM version which was pre-installed.
Windows 98 is first edition (not SE), OEM version, although I have
reinstalled it several times.

The Windows 98 PC is called "BournePC"
The Windows Vista laptop is called "mbourne"
Both have the workgroup set to "WORKGROUP"
Both have a user called "Mark", which I am logged in to while trying to
get this working. On Vista, "Mark" is a standard user (ie. not an
administrator).

The two machines can ping each other, so there is no problem with the
network connection.

On the Windows 98 machine, I have:
- Installed the Active Directory Client Extension for Windows 98 as per
KB288358
- Deleted setup files from C:\Program Files\Microsoft\DSClient9xSetup\ -
I got the impression these were just setup files, and were not needed
any more after running the installer from that directory
- Enabled NTLM2 by creating and setting the registry value
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\LSA\LMCompatibility=3
as per KB239869
- Made no other registry modifications - I think the remaining edits
described in KB239869 are to further tighten the security
* The instructions in KB239869 didn't seem particularly clear, so maybe
I have not got the registry edits quite right??
- Restarted the machine

On the Windows Vista machine, I have:
- in Network and Sharing Center:
The network is set up as a private network
Network discovery : On
File Sharing : On
Public folder sharing : Off
Printer sharing : Off
Password protected shating : On
Media sharing : Off
- in Windows Firewall Settings, Exceptions tab, checked "File and
Printer Sharing" - I think this is supposed to be automatically checked
when File Sharing is enabled, but for some reason it wasn't


Trying to connect to Windows 98 from Windows Vista
==================================================

From Windows 98 (BournePC):
- created a folder C:\WINDOWS\Profiles\Mark\My Documents\TestShare\
- shared this folder:
Share Name : TESTSHARE
Access Type : Full
Full Access Password : testpass
- created a file in this folder called TestFile.txt

From Windows Vista:
- from Explorer, selected Tools > Map Network Drive
- entered folder as \\bournepc\TESTSHARE
- clicked "Connect using a different user name" (user name is actually
the same, but password is different)
- entered user name "Mark" and password "testpass". I don't think the
username matters to Windows 98, but I entered it anyway.
- clicked Finish
- I am promted for the password (again!?) User name is already entered
as Mark, so typed password "testpass"
- Logon is unsuccessful, and I am prompted for the password again. This
keeps happening. I can not connect to the share.

I get the same if I type \\bournepc\TESTSHARE\ into Explorer's address bar

If I type \\bournepc\ into Explorer's address bar, I can see a list of
shares, but the password is refused if I try connecting to any of them.


Trying to connect to Windows Vista from Windows 98
==================================================

From Windows Vista:
- created a folder C:\Users\Mark\Documents\TestShare\
- created a file in this folder called TestFile.txt
- right-click the folder and select Share...
- Mark was already listed, and I did't want to give anyone else access,
so I just clicked Share and entered the admin password.
* Why do I need to enter the admin password to share a folder which I own??
* Why does it take so long (several minutes) to share a folder
containing a single file of 28 bytes??
- clicked Done

For some reason, the entire Users folder seems to have been shared - it
is listed in Computer Management > System Tools > Shared Folders >
Shares, and if I type \\localhost in Exploer's address bar, it is listed
there and fully browsable - it's not even just the route to the folder I
shared which is browsable!

From Windows 98:
- from Explorer, clicked Map Drive (I have it on the toolbar)
- entered \\mbourne\Users for the path, since that is what seems to have
been shared
- clicked OK
- entered the username for the "Mark" account on the Vista machine
* This password is 9 characters - could that be a problem??
- got an error:

The following error occurred while trying to connect
Z: to \\mbourne\Users
This device does not exist on the network

- tried again, this time entering \\mbourne\TestShare (the folder I
wanted to share) for the path, this had the same result

If I type \\bournepc\ into Explorer's address bar, I get the following
message:

You must supply a password to make this connection:
Resource: \\MBOURNE\IPC$
Password: (box to enter password)

I enter the password for the "Mark" account on the Vista machine, and
get a message saying:

\\MBOURNE is not accessible
This device does not exist on the network

So...
- I seem to be unable to access shares in either direction
- When setting up the share from Vista, strange things seem to happen
with regard to which folder gets shared. Perhaps I am doing something
wrong here...


Does anyone have any suggestions? In case you've forgotten during the
length of this post, I have installed the Active Directory Client
Extension on the Windows 98 machine, and (I think) enabled NTLM2 (the
usual first problem!).


Thanks,
Mark.

 

[Guest]

Mark, one thing you have wrong is "Public folder" setting.
It has to be set to ON.

It is the NEW name for the old "Shared Docs" folder.

 

[Mark Bourne]

I didn't think Public Folder Sharing needed to be on unless I was trying
to share by dropping files in C:\Users\Public\? I am trying to share
folders from arbitrary locations (well, within
C:\Users\Mark\Documents\). Someone else is using the 98 machine at the
moment, but when I get a chance I'll try enabling Public Folder Sharing
in case it does make a difference to normal file sharing.

I never used XP much (my last laptop was Windows 2000), so am not
familiar with the Shared Docs folder from that or how to use it.
Presumably if I copy files there, they won't by synced with the copy in
the original location, and if I move them they will no longer be
accessible from the original location? I want to share files without
having to move them. I was under the impression that Vista could to
XP-style sharing (Public folder) or 2000-style sharing (set any folder
up as a shared folder), the latter being what I am trying to do.

Thanks,
Mark.

 

[George B]

Mark,

I have been having similar problems, trying to get W98SE and Vista to
communicate together. Here is what I have concluded:

Vista can access W98's files, but only when no password is attached to the
shared folder. Apparently, Vista has not implemented the W98 option of
separate passwords for each shared folder.

W98 can see Vista's shared files and folders, but has great difficulty in
accessing them. I have opened a 34-byte file from Vista on W98, but it took
45 seconds to do it. I have tried larger files, but did not have the
patience to see whether it would complete eventually. For all practical
purposes, it doesn't work. Since I was able to get 34 bytes, it doesn't
seem to be a security issue or firewall issue - just Vista itself.

 

[Mark Bourne]

Mark,

I have been having similar problems, trying to get W98SE and Vista to
communicate together. Here is what I have concluded:

Vista can access W98's files, but only when no password is attached to the
shared folder. Apparently, Vista has not implemented the W98 option of
separate passwords for each shared folder.

You seem to be right on that one. If I set a blank password for the
share on W98, I can access it from Vista. Strange that Vista asks for a
password when connecting to a password-protected W98 share if it doesn't
actually send the password to W98 though... maybe I've got something
wrong with the NTLM2 set-up on W98 so it just doesn't authenticate the
password properly?

I found previously, when accessing W98 shares from 2000, that if I
accessed one password-protected W98 share I couldn't simultaneously
access another with a different password. I had to disconnect from one,
then connect to the other entering the other password, but it was
possible to use passwords.

Maybe I've got something wrong with the NTLM2 setup on the 98 machine.
Does anyone have any idea what? Do I need to set some of the other
registry keys mentioned in KB239869, apart from
HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\LSA\LMCompatibility=3 ?

Could you possibly tell me what keys and values you have under
HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\LSA\ on your 98 machine?

W98 can see Vista's shared files and folders, but has great difficulty in
accessing them. I have opened a 34-byte file from Vista on W98, but it took
45 seconds to do it. I have tried larger files, but did not have the
patience to see whether it would complete eventually. For all practical
purposes, it doesn't work. Since I was able to get 34 bytes, it doesn't
seem to be a security issue or firewall issue - just Vista itself.

I can't even see Vista's shared folders from the 98 machine, let alone
try accessing files from them. Again, maybe I've done something wrong
with NTLM2?

 

[Mark Bourne]

Enabling public folder sharing doesn't seem to help. I still can't
access Vista shares from the 98 machine. I can't even get a listing of
available shares by going to \\mbourne\ - asks for a password, then says
"This device does not exist on the network".

Interestingly, if I enter the wrong password or log onto 98 as a user
which doesn't exist on Vista, I get "No permission to access resource"
instead, so it seems that the password is actually being verified, but
something else is failing to work properly when user and password are
correct.

Also, if I enter the correct password (and get "this device does not
exist..."), next time I try accessing the share I am asked for the
password again. However, if I enter an incorrect password (and get "no
permission..."), it seems to send this incorrect password without
prompting on each subsequent attempt and I have to restart to enter the
correct password!

Following George's post, I have found that I can access 98 shares from
Vista, provided no password is set on the share, which seems strange. If
the 98 share has a password set, I can not access it from Vista (refuses
the password). I would prefer to be able to use password-protected
shares though!

Could these problems possibly be caused by having NTLM2 incorrectly set
up on the 98 machine?

Thanks,
Mark.

 

[George B]

Responses interspersed:

You seem to be right on that one. If I set a blank password for the
share on W98, I can access it from Vista. Strange that Vista asks for a
password when connecting to a password-protected W98 share if it doesn't
actually send the password to W98 though... maybe I've got something
wrong with the NTLM2 set-up on W98 so it just doesn't authenticate the
password properly?

I found previously, when accessing W98 shares from 2000, that if I
accessed one password-protected W98 share I couldn't simultaneously
access another with a different password. I had to disconnect from one,
then connect to the other entering the other password, but it was
possible to use passwords.

Maybe I've got something wrong with the NTLM2 setup on the 98 machine.
Does anyone have any idea what? Do I need to set some of the other
registry keys mentioned in KB239869, apart from
HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\LSA\LMCompatibility=3 ?

Could you possibly tell me what keys and values you have under
HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\LSA\ on your 98 machine?

I don't have much under the LSA key. Here is the export:
REGEDIT4

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\Lsa]

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\Lsa\SSO]

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\Lsa\SSO\Passport1.4]
"SSOURL"="http://www.passport.com"

I can't even see Vista's shared folders from the 98 machine, let alone
try accessing files from them. Again, maybe I've done something wrong
with NTLM2?

My guess is that it has nothing to do with NTLM2, but possibly with the
permissions on the Vista machine. My experience was the same as yours at
first. I tried a number of registry changes on Vista, including
LmCompatibilityLevel=1, noLmHash=0, and RestrictNullSessAccess=0, but these
had no effect. I tried changing permissions -- eventually I granted access
to Everyone, Guest, and AnonymousLogon, and enabled sharing of the Public
folder. Somewhere along the way W98 could see the Vista files, but I don't
know which of those changes were required. I did get it this far with both
password enabling (same users and passwords on both machines) and password
disabled (simple file sharing).