P42.80C or 3.00 GHz Northwood -- temp./performance/price/fan quality -- help please

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Greg Conquest

I am building my first PC. It will be used for photography and video
editing and other general uses -- maybe *some* gaming.

I have chosen (tentatively) an ASUS P4P800-E Deluxe (i865PE)
motheroard.

Regarding CPU's, my impression is that the 3.0 GHz Northwood consumes
much more power than the 2.8 GHz version, but I can't find a listing
of the various CPU's and their power consumption.

Can someone help me out regarding these two chips, please?

And also, I don't intend to overclock, and silence is good for me, so
are the included CPU fans on both of these chips equally good? I did
hear that the 2.8 is quieter and better than the 3.0 GHz. True?

Thank you.
Greg Conquest


------ Greg Conquest ------
http://gregconquest.com
 
Greg said:
I am building my first PC. It will be used for photography and video
editing and other general uses -- maybe *some* gaming.

I have chosen (tentatively) an ASUS P4P800-E Deluxe (i865PE)
motheroard.

Regarding CPU's, my impression is that the 3.0 GHz Northwood consumes
much more power than the 2.8 GHz version, but I can't find a listing
of the various CPU's and their power consumption.

Can someone help me out regarding these two chips, please?

And also, I don't intend to overclock, and silence is good for me, so
are the included CPU fans on both of these chips equally good? I did
hear that the 2.8 is quieter and better than the 3.0 GHz. True?

Thank you.
Greg Conquest


------ Greg Conquest ------
http://gregconquest.com
Click to expand...


1. The P4P800-E is a nice i865 board, I run the P4C800-E i875 and it
kicks ass.

2. For Intel processors and power consumption statistics, you can look
at Intel's reference page here:
http://www.intel.com/support/processors/pentium4/sb/CS-007999.htm#Specifications
Click to expand...

The chart you want is at the very bottom, so just PgDown till you get
there :)

2.8C (Northwood) 69.7 W
2.8E (Prescott) 89W
3.0C (Northwood) 81.9W
3.0E (Prescott) 89W

(The freaking 3.2E/3.4E all pull 100W+ but the 3.4C is only 82W for
comparison)

3. If your not overclocking (I don't either) the included intel HSF is
nice, but just FYI, unless they have changed it, the 2.8C will come with
a solid aluminum HSF combo, the 3.0C ships with a copper-centered
aluminum HSF design. I prefer the copper core as it pull heat away
better. Both fans are a touch on the noisy side for my tastes, but I
found that a good case (Antec Sonata) reduced my noise levels, without
having to sacrifice any rpm off the fans. Plus the TruePower380W that
ships with it adjusts its own fan if the heat goes over 45C..

And IIRC, they now have a company (acoustipack?? pak?) someone, that
makes a 'kit' for the Antec Sonata, with sound dampening material, you
can make it even quieter.

4. If your not overclocking, don't waste the money for aftermarket
HSF's, spend it on a decent 92/120mm case fan to help with airflow, the
Intel HSF is more than adequate to keep your CPU cool during heavy load
if your running in spec.
 
Greg said:
I am building my first PC. It will be used for photography and video
editing and other general uses -- maybe *some* gaming.

I have chosen (tentatively) an ASUS P4P800-E Deluxe (i865PE)
motheroard.

Regarding CPU's, my impression is that the 3.0 GHz Northwood consumes
much more power than the 2.8 GHz version, but I can't find a listing
of the various CPU's and their power consumption.
Click to expand...

http://users.erols.com/chare/elec.htm

While you are there, look at the power consumption numbers for AMD
processors.
 
Philip said:
Greg said:
I am building my first PC. It will be used for photography and video
editing and other general uses -- maybe *some* gaming.

I have chosen (tentatively) an ASUS P4P800-E Deluxe (i865PE)
motheroard.

Regarding CPU's, my impression is that the 3.0 GHz Northwood consumes
much more power than the 2.8 GHz version, but I can't find a listing
of the various CPU's and their power consumption.

Can someone help me out regarding these two chips, please?

And also, I don't intend to overclock, and silence is good for me, so
are the included CPU fans on both of these chips equally good? I did
hear that the 2.8 is quieter and better than the 3.0 GHz. True?
Click to expand...
[snip]

4. If your not overclocking, don't waste the money for aftermarket
HSF's, spend it on a decent 92/120mm case fan to help with airflow, the
Intel HSF is more than adequate to keep your CPU cool during heavy load
if your running in spec.
Click to expand...

Okay, we just parted company. I really like to use a pair of thermo 80mm
fans. Two reasons, one being noise and one avoiding a single point of
failure. Just my read on it. I also like the cases with the fan in the
side, even if they are a bit garish.
 
Greg Conquest wrote:
Click to expand...
1. The P4P800-E is a nice i865 board, I run the P4C800-E i875 and it
kicks ass.

2. For Intel processors and power consumption statistics, you can look
at Intel's reference page here:
Click to expand...
The chart you want is at the very bottom, so just PgDown till you get
there :)

2.8C (Northwood) 69.7 W
2.8E (Prescott) 89W
3.0C (Northwood) 81.9W
3.0E (Prescott) 89W
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link and the explantion, Philip. I had seen that page
before. The power consumption gradually increases from the 2.40C to
the 2.60C and the 2.80C, but then there is a big jump to the 3GHZ
chips, and none of them are called 3.0C. I couldn't figure it out.
Anyway, you've confirmed my suspicion about the best Northwood
(800FSB) for me.
(The freaking 3.2E/3.4E all pull 100W+ but the 3.4C is only 82W for
comparison)

3. If your not overclocking (I don't either) the included intel HSF is
nice, but just FYI, unless they have changed it, the 2.8C will come with
a solid aluminum HSF combo, the 3.0C ships with a copper-centered
aluminum HSF design. I prefer the copper core as it pull heat away
better. Both fans are a touch on the noisy side for my tastes, but I
found that a good case (Antec Sonata) reduced my noise levels, without
having to sacrifice any rpm off the fans. Plus the TruePower380W that
ships with it adjusts its own fan if the heat goes over 45C..
Click to expand...

So you're saying both CPU fans are equally noisy, but the 3.0C fan is
more effecient. Hmm . . .
And IIRC, they now have a company (acoustipack?? pak?) someone, that
makes a 'kit' for the Antec Sonata, with sound dampening material, you
can make it even quieter.
Click to expand...

I'll check into this. Antec, CoolerMaster, LianLi, and Windy are the
cases I'm considering. Living in Japan, I don't see the same cases
that are popular stateside.

Thanks again,
Greg Conquest
4. If your not overclocking, don't waste the money for aftermarket
HSF's, spend it on a decent 92/120mm case fan to help with airflow, the
Intel HSF is more than adequate to keep your CPU cool during heavy load
if your running in spec.
Click to expand...



------ Greg Conquest ------
http://gregconquest.com
 
Greg Conquest wrote:

http://users.erols.com/chare/elec.htm

While you are there, look at the power consumption numbers for AMD
processors.
Click to expand...

Thanks JL,

The two chips seem pretty close to me. I was thinking the AMD
equivalents were running hotter than most Pentiums. Which chip would
be close to a P42.80C (800FSB Northwood)? Athlon 64 2800+ (Athlon 64
(Clawhammer, Newcastle -- Athlon 64-2800+ (S754 - 1.8GHz - 512KB))?

The AMD chip is 89W and $180 US
The Intel chip is 69.7 W and $173.

Hmm. The AMD chip does run considerably hotter. I guess this is about
what I expected.

Greg Conquest


------ Greg Conquest ------
http://gregconquest.com
 
My aplogies if this message comes through twice.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Greg Conquest wrote:
Click to expand...
1. The P4P800-E is a nice i865 board, I run the P4C800-E i875 and it
kicks ass.

2. For Intel processors and power consumption statistics, you can look
at Intel's reference page here:
Click to expand...
The chart you want is at the very bottom, so just PgDown till you get
there :)

2.8C (Northwood) 69.7 W
2.8E (Prescott) 89W
3.0C (Northwood) 81.9W
3.0E (Prescott) 89W
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link and the explantion, Philip. I had seen that page
before. The power consumption gradually increases from the 2.40C to
the 2.60C and the 2.80C, but then there is a big jump to the 3GHZ
chips, and none of them are called 3.0C. I couldn't figure it out.
Anyway, you've confirmed my suspicion about the best Northwood
(800FSB) for me.
(The freaking 3.2E/3.4E all pull 100W+ but the 3.4C is only 82W for
comparison)

3. If your not overclocking (I don't either) the included intel HSF is
nice, but just FYI, unless they have changed it, the 2.8C will come with
a solid aluminum HSF combo, the 3.0C ships with a copper-centered
aluminum HSF design. I prefer the copper core as it pull heat away
better. Both fans are a touch on the noisy side for my tastes, but I
found that a good case (Antec Sonata) reduced my noise levels, without
having to sacrifice any rpm off the fans. Plus the TruePower380W that
ships with it adjusts its own fan if the heat goes over 45C..
Click to expand...

So you're saying both CPU fans are equally noisy, but the 3.0C fan is
more effecient. Hmm . . .
And IIRC, they now have a company (acoustipack?? pak?) someone, that
makes a 'kit' for the Antec Sonata, with sound dampening material, you
can make it even quieter.
Click to expand...

I'll check into this. Antec, CoolerMaster, LianLi, and Windy are the
cases I'm considering. Living in Japan, I don't see the same cases
that are popular stateside.

Thanks again,
Greg Conquest
4. If your not overclocking, don't waste the money for aftermarket
HSF's, spend it on a decent 92/120mm case fan to help with airflow, the
Intel HSF is more than adequate to keep your CPU cool during heavy load
if your running in spec.
Click to expand...



------ Greg Conquest ------
http://gregconquest.com
 
Greg said:
So you're saying both CPU fans are equally noisy, but the 3.0C fan is
more effecient. Hmm . . .
Click to expand...

Actually, odds are the same model fan is installed on the 3.0C's
Heatsink, its just that with a copper cored HS, it tends to pull more
heat away, the majority bleeds up the copper core directly under the
fan, before the fan just assisted airflow around the fins on the
aluminum, but the heat was concentrated over the core of the CPU, and
dissipating from there.
I'll check into this. Antec, CoolerMaster, LianLi, and Windy are the
cases I'm considering. Living in Japan, I don't see the same cases
that are popular stateside.
Click to expand...

..ca = Canada :) But I get the drift...

Oh yeah, and thanks for that mode-3 floppy abomination :) hehehe
 
Bill said:
Philip Callan wrote:
[snip]

4. If your not overclocking, don't waste the money for aftermarket
HSF's, spend it on a decent 92/120mm case fan to help with airflow,
the Intel HSF is more than adequate to keep your CPU cool during heavy
load if your running in spec.
Click to expand...


Okay, we just parted company. I really like to use a pair of thermo 80mm
fans. Two reasons, one being noise and one avoiding a single point of
failure. Just my read on it. I also like the cases with the fan in the
side, even if they are a bit garish.
Click to expand...

:)

My Antec has a 120mm in the back, and one in the front as well, plus
PSU, I'm glad my case dampens most of the sound.

I'm not one for the windows myself, and the only machines I tend to put
sidepanels with fan grills on is servers with lots of HD's
 
Greg said:
Thanks JL,

The two chips seem pretty close to me. I was thinking the AMD
equivalents were running hotter than most Pentiums. Which chip would
be close to a P42.80C (800FSB Northwood)? Athlon 64 2800+ (Athlon 64
(Clawhammer, Newcastle -- Athlon 64-2800+ (S754 - 1.8GHz - 512KB))?

The AMD chip is 89W and $180 US
The Intel chip is 69.7 W and $173.

Hmm. The AMD chip does run considerably hotter. I guess this is about
what I expected.
Click to expand...

Brace yourself, JK will now tell you it runs hotter because it costs
more. Or vice-versa. That will make sense to him, wait for it.
 
Bill said:
Brace yourself, JK will now tell you it runs hotter because it costs
more. Or vice-versa. That will make sense to him, wait for it.
Click to expand...

What is most important is not how hot it runs in absolute terms, but how
hot it runs relative to its upper range for operating specifications. Also
keep in mind that a chip that uses less power but has a smaller die
size might be more prone to overheating, as there is less surface
area to dissipate the heat. Also keep in mind performance vs power
consumption. For some games like Doom 3 for example and
scientific applications , it would take at least a 3.6 ghz P4
(which is a huge power consumer) to come close to an Athlon 64 3000+.
 
the stock is still dipping,....................


JK said:
Bill said:
Greg said:
Brace yourself, JK will now tell you it runs hotter because it costs
more. Or vice-versa. That will make sense to him, wait for it.
Click to expand...

What is most important is not how hot it runs in absolute terms, but how
hot it runs relative to its upper range for operating specifications. Also
keep in mind that a chip that uses less power but has a smaller die
size might be more prone to overheating, as there is less surface
area to dissipate the heat. Also keep in mind performance vs power
consumption. For some games like Doom 3 for example and
scientific applications , it would take at least a 3.6 ghz P4
(which is a huge power consumer) to come close to an Athlon 64 3000+.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
What is most important is not how hot it runs in absolute terms, but how
hot it runs relative to its upper range for operating specifications. Also
keep in mind that a chip that uses less power but has a smaller die
size might be more prone to overheating, as there is less surface
area to dissipate the heat. Also keep in mind performance vs power
consumption. For some games like Doom 3 for example and
scientific applications , it would take at least a 3.6 ghz P4
(which is a huge power consumer) to come close to an Athlon 64 3000+.
Click to expand...

Did you ever make it past 3rd grade science?
 
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