Mystery problem with new hard drive

[N]

My old hard drive died a few days ago and I got a new Seagate Ultra ATA
120 GB drive. Processor is a Duron 1.2GHz. I left the jumper on Cable
Select and the BIOS did recognize it as an 120 GB HD. I followed all
the instructions in the hard drive manual -- I booted to the CD that
came with it, which partitioned and formatted the drive, then copied
Windows 98 system files to the boot record. It told me to replace
their CD with the Win98 setup CD and reboot, which I did. After Win98
Setup loaded, it told me:

Setup cannot install Windows 98 on your computer.
An error was detected while trying to read or write to your hard disk.

- This happens every time I try it.
- Installing MS-DOS gave the same error.
- Installing Windows XP got me a little further, but it ran into
problems copying files.
- When I run fdisk, it asks me whether I want to enable extended drive
support and then says "Error reading fixed drive" and quits.
- I exchanged the hard drive for an identical one and got exactly all
the same problems.
- I ran all the diagnostic tools on the Seagate hard drive and there
were absolutely no problems.
- I tried changing around the jumpers -- setting it to Master instead
of Cable Select, limiting drive capacity -- but it doesn't change
anything.
- I even tried running Memtest86, memtest86.com, since someone with the
same symptoms said their memory was faulty, but mine has no errors at
all.
- I have done pretty exhaustive searches on the Internet. Only a few
people seem to have ever had this problem, and everything that ended up
working for them, I've already tried.

Any ideas? I need to be able to use my computer ASAP.

 

[CJT]

My old hard drive died a few days ago and I got a new Seagate Ultra ATA
120 GB drive. Processor is a Duron 1.2GHz. I left the jumper on Cable
Select and the BIOS did recognize it as an 120 GB HD. I followed all
the instructions in the hard drive manual -- I booted to the CD that
came with it, which partitioned and formatted the drive, then copied
Windows 98 system files to the boot record. It told me to replace
their CD with the Win98 setup CD and reboot, which I did. After Win98
Setup loaded, it told me:

Setup cannot install Windows 98 on your computer.
An error was detected while trying to read or write to your hard disk.

- This happens every time I try it.
- Installing MS-DOS gave the same error.
- Installing Windows XP got me a little further, but it ran into
problems copying files.
- When I run fdisk, it asks me whether I want to enable extended drive
support and then says "Error reading fixed drive" and quits.
- I exchanged the hard drive for an identical one and got exactly all
the same problems.
- I ran all the diagnostic tools on the Seagate hard drive and there
were absolutely no problems.
- I tried changing around the jumpers -- setting it to Master instead
of Cable Select, limiting drive capacity -- but it doesn't change
anything.
- I even tried running Memtest86, memtest86.com, since someone with the
same symptoms said their memory was faulty, but mine has no errors at
all.
- I have done pretty exhaustive searches on the Internet. Only a few
people seem to have ever had this problem, and everything that ended up
working for them, I've already tried.

Any ideas? I need to be able to use my computer ASAP.

I wonder whether the motherboard BIOS has some limitations on the size
of drive it can handle.

 

[Rod Speed]

My old hard drive died a few days ago and I got a new Seagate Ultra
ATA 120 GB drive. Processor is a Duron 1.2GHz. I left the jumper on
Cable Select and the BIOS did recognize it as an 120 GB HD. I
followed all the instructions in the hard drive manual -- I booted to
the CD that came with it, which partitioned and formatted the drive,
then copied Windows 98 system files to the boot record. It told me
to replace their CD with the Win98 setup CD and reboot, which I did.
After Win98 Setup loaded, it told me:

Setup cannot install Windows 98 on your computer.
An error was detected while trying to read or write to your hard disk.

- This happens every time I try it.
- Installing MS-DOS gave the same error.
- Installing Windows XP got me a little further, but it ran into
problems copying files.
- When I run fdisk, it asks me whether I want to enable extended drive
support and then says "Error reading fixed drive" and quits.
- I exchanged the hard drive for an identical one and got exactly all
the same problems.
- I ran all the diagnostic tools on the Seagate hard drive and there
were absolutely no problems.
- I tried changing around the jumpers -- setting it to Master instead
of Cable Select, limiting drive capacity -- but it doesn't change
anything.
- I even tried running Memtest86, memtest86.com, since someone with
the same symptoms said their memory was faulty, but mine has no
errors at all.
- I have done pretty exhaustive searches on the Internet. Only a few
people seem to have ever had this problem, and everything that ended
up working for them, I've already tried.

Any ideas? I need to be able to use my computer ASAP.

I'd wipe the drive with clearhdd and then try installing XP from
scratch after booting the XP CD. Likely you've got a bios overlay
installed on the hard drive and that is what is stuffing up the installs.
http://www.samsung.com/Products/HardDiskDrive/utilities/clearhdd.htm

 

[Timothy Daniels]

My old hard drive died a few days ago and I got a new
Seagate Ultra ATA 120 GB drive. Processor is a Duron
1.2GHz. I left the jumper on Cable Select and the BIOS
did recognize it as an 120 GB HD. I followed all the
instructions in the hard drive manual -- I booted to the CD
that came with it, which partitioned and formatted the drive,
then copied Windows 98 system files to the boot record.
It told me to replace their CD with the Win98 setup CD
and reboot, which I did. After Win98 Setup loaded, it told me:

Setup cannot install Windows 98 on your computer.
An error was detected while trying to read or write to your
hard disk.

- This happens every time I try it.
- Installing MS-DOS gave the same error.
- Installing Windows XP got me a little further, but it ran into
problems copying files.

Did you format the new drive with NTFS?

*TimDaniels*

 

[N]

CJT -- Like I said before, the BIOS recognized the drive as 120 GB; I
set the jumpers to limit the drive capacity to 33 GB and nothing
changed; my old (dead) drive was 60 GB and it worked for a few years.

Rod Speed -- I tried clearhdd and it gave me:

1th Cylinder of Total 1024, 1th Head of Total 255
Error Occured, Error Code 04
if you know detail error message, see Bolrand C++ 2.0 ref lib book page
61

I tried installing XP again and I remembered what happens: The first
part of the installation works fine; I format a FAT32 partition and it
copies a bunch of files to the hard drive. It says it will reboot in
15 seconds and then setup will continue. When it reboots, no boot
record is found on the hard drive so it boots to the XP setup CD again
and the entire installation process starts from the beginning.

 

[Rod Speed]

CJT -- Like I said before, the BIOS recognized the drive as 120 GB;
I set the jumpers to limit the drive capacity to 33 GB and nothing
changed; my old (dead) drive was 60 GB and it worked for a few years.

Rod Speed -- I tried clearhdd and it gave me:

1th Cylinder of Total 1024, 1th Head of Total 255
Error Occured, Error Code 04
if you know detail error message, see
Bolrand C++ 2.0 ref lib book page 61

OK, then you dont have the correct drive type entry in the bios.

It should be set to AUTO. You've got it set to something else.

Wipe it with clearhdd again after setting it to AUTO and it should go fine.

I tried installing XP again and I remembered what happens: The first
part of the installation works fine; I format a FAT32 partition and it
copies a bunch of files to the hard drive. It says it will reboot in
15 seconds and then setup will continue. When it reboots, no boot
record is found on the hard drive so it boots to the XP setup CD
again and the entire installation process starts from the beginning.

That's consistent with the wrong drive type in the bios too.

 

[N]

Nope, I'm sure the CMOD setting for the primary master (the only hard
drive) in the BIOS is set to AUTO.

 

[Impmon]

Any ideas? I need to be able to use my computer ASAP.

What format was used? FAT32 or NTFS or what?

 

[N]

Each time I tried installing something new, I repartitioned and
reformatted the drive, but I'm pretty sure it was always FAT32. When
installing XP, I'm sure it was FAT32.

I tried a Western Digital 160 GB hard drive and the exact same problems
occurred, so it seems pretty clear that the problem is not the hard
drive. But then, what is it? I talked to somebody else and they said
it was likely a problem with the hard drive controller on the
motherboard (possibly linked to bad capacitors). But then would I have
been able to write to the drive in the beginning of the OS setups?

 

[CJT]

CJT -- Like I said before, the BIOS recognized the drive as 120 GB; I
set the jumpers to limit the drive capacity to 33 GB and nothing
changed; my old (dead) drive was 60 GB and it worked for a few years.

Rod Speed -- I tried clearhdd and it gave me:

1th Cylinder of Total 1024, 1th Head of Total 255
Error Occured, Error Code 04
if you know detail error message, see Bolrand C++ 2.0 ref lib book page
61

I tried installing XP again and I remembered what happens: The first
part of the installation works fine; I format a FAT32 partition and it
copies a bunch of files to the hard drive. It says it will reboot in
15 seconds and then setup will continue. When it reboots, no boot
record is found on the hard drive so it boots to the XP setup CD again
and the entire installation process starts from the beginning.

Remove the cable and check for bent pins on the drive connector.

 

[N]

Yeah, I already did that...it was a brand new cable that came with the
hard drive anyway.

 

[CJT]

Each time I tried installing something new, I repartitioned and
reformatted the drive, but I'm pretty sure it was always FAT32. When
installing XP, I'm sure it was FAT32.

I tried a Western Digital 160 GB hard drive and the exact same problems
occurred, so it seems pretty clear that the problem is not the hard
drive. But then, what is it? I talked to somebody else and they said
it was likely a problem with the hard drive controller on the
motherboard (possibly linked to bad capacitors). But then would I have
been able to write to the drive in the beginning of the OS setups?

Oops, that shoots my idea, unless there's a bent pin on the motherboard
connector.

It does sound like a hardware problem to me, too. My first suspicion
would be the cabling, but it could also be something on the motherboard
(e.g. controller or caps). Capacitors will often bulge or leak brownish
goo when they go bad.

 

[Rod Speed]

Nope, I'm sure the CMOD setting for the primary master
(the only hard drive) in the BIOS is set to AUTO.

You can get some odd effects like that when its booted with an AUTO
setting with an MBR whats got bad physical geometry details in it.

clearhdd should have wiped the MBR even tho it later failed at the
end of the first track. Try rebooting now with no MBR and see if
clearhdd still fails to wipe the drive with no MBR present.

 

[CJT]

Yeah, I already did that...it was a brand new cable that came with the
hard drive anyway.

Hmmm... maybe it's time to try a different cable?

 

[Rod Speed]

I tried a Western Digital 160 GB hard drive and the exact same
problems occurred, so it seems pretty clear that the problem is
not the hard drive. But then, what is it? I talked to somebody
else and they said it was likely a problem with the hard drive
controller on the motherboard (possibly linked to bad capacitors).

Yeah, it could certainly be a bad controller. The original drive may
not have died, it was the controller that died, not the hard drive.

But then would I have been able to write to
the drive in the beginning of the OS setups?

Its likely just some ops are failing, clearly clearhdd
did manage to write to most of the first track fine too.

 

[Impmon]

I tried a Western Digital 160 GB hard drive and the exact same problems
occurred, so it seems pretty clear that the problem is not the hard
drive. But then, what is it? I talked to somebody else and they said
it was likely a problem with the hard drive controller on the
motherboard (possibly linked to bad capacitors). But then would I have
been able to write to the drive in the beginning of the OS setups?

Could be a slightly bugged BIOS then. Can you check for your mobo's
make and model and then check the web site for updated BIOS?
Sometimes all it takes is an updated BIOS to fix a lot of "odd"
problems.

 

[N]

CJT -- All the capacitors look fine, but I've also heard that that
doesn't necessarily mean anything. I've now tried 3 different cables
-- my old one, the one that came with the Western Digital HD, and the
one that came with the Seagate HD.

Rod Speed -- The old hard drive began making squeaking and clicking
noises and responding jerkily and intermittently, and one time the BIOS
didn't recognize it, so I figured I'd better stop using it if I have
any hope of getting any data off of it. It seems to me like the hard
drive is pretty dead, though it could have been caused by the
controller.

The new WD drive was untouched by hard drive manufacturer software or
otherwise -- I simply booted Win98 in DOS mode off of a floppy and ran
fdisk, which said "error reading fixed disk" like before. I don't see
how it could have a BIOS overlay.

Impmon -- Motherboard is an ECS K7S5A, which, from cursory searching,
seems to be notorious for having capacitor problems. My BIOS is dated
4/29/02 and the last available update is 10/28/02. Could it really
make much of a difference?
http://www.ecsusa.com/downloads/k7s5a.html

I'll try updating the BIOS, and I'm going to try the new HD in another
system to see if it works. But it's looking more and more to me like
I'm going to have to buy a new motherboard.

 

[Rod Speed]

N <[email protected]> wrote

CJT -- All the capacitors look fine, but I've also
heard that that doesn't necessarily mean anything.

They usually do look bad if they have gone bad.

I've now tried 3 different cables -- my old one,
the one that came with the Western Digital HD,
and the one that came with the Seagate HD.

Rod Speed -- The old hard drive began making squeaking
and clicking noises and responding jerkily and intermittently,
and one time the BIOS didn't recognize it, so I figured I'd better
stop using it if I have any hope of getting any data off of it.

Reasonable approach.

It seems to me like the hard drive is pretty dead,
though it could have been caused by the controller.

Yes, and the proof that is to see how it goes in a completely
different system, not even reusing the ribbon cable.

The new WD drive was untouched by hard drive manufacturer software
or otherwise -- I simply booted Win98 in DOS mode off of a floppy and
ran fdisk, which said "error reading fixed disk" like before.

Thats quite different to what you said previously.

I don't see how it could have a BIOS overlay.

It obviously could depending on what was on that CD that
came with the drive. That sounded like the usual hard drive
manufacturer CD that can indeed install a bios overlay in error.

Impmon -- Motherboard is an ECS K7S5A, which, from cursory
searching, seems to be notorious for having capacitor problems.

Not really, most of them did see a problem with bad caps.

My BIOS is dated 4/29/02 and the last available update
is 10/28/02. Could it really make much of a difference?
http://www.ecsusa.com/downloads/k7s5a.html

There's only one way to find out, try the
latest and see if you get the same result.

I'll try updating the BIOS,

Yes, certainly worth trying.

and I'm going to try the new HD in another system to see if it works.

Worth trying, but unlikely that it wont work
fine given that its the second new drive now.

But it's looking more and more to me like
I'm going to have to buy a new motherboard.

Yeah, thats certainly most likely now. It aint
just bad caps that need a new motherboard.

 

[CJT]

CJT -- All the capacitors look fine, but I've also heard that that
doesn't necessarily mean anything.

That's theoretically true, but in my experience there's enough design
tolerance in most boards that the capacitors have to be _really_ bad
for them to cause a repeatable problem, and by that time they're
normally at least bulging (or worse -- I've seen a couple that had
exploded). Less severe deterioration will normally only cause
intermittent problems (which are even more frustrating than what you
have).

I've now tried 3 different cables

-- my old one, the one that came with the Western Digital HD, and the
one that came with the Seagate HD.

Rod Speed -- The old hard drive began making squeaking and clicking
noises and responding jerkily and intermittently, and one time the BIOS
didn't recognize it, so I figured I'd better stop using it if I have
any hope of getting any data off of it. It seems to me like the hard
drive is pretty dead, though it could have been caused by the
controller.

The new WD drive was untouched by hard drive manufacturer software or
otherwise -- I simply booted Win98 in DOS mode off of a floppy and ran
fdisk, which said "error reading fixed disk" like before. I don't see
how it could have a BIOS overlay.

Impmon -- Motherboard is an ECS K7S5A, which, from cursory searching,
seems to be notorious for having capacitor problems.

no worse than others of its era, in my experience -- many manufacturers
bought their capacitors from the affected supplier (and not just
computers -- TVs, etc., too)

My BIOS is dated

4/29/02 and the last available update is 10/28/02. Could it really
make much of a difference?
http://www.ecsusa.com/downloads/k7s5a.html

yes, it could

during that era, a common reason for BIOS upgrades was to fix the
handling of newly available bigger disks

I'll try updating the BIOS, and I'm going to try the new HD in another
system to see if it works. But it's looking more and more to me like
I'm going to have to buy a new motherboard.

You should be able to find a used, working K7S5A pretty easily -- it was
a very popular board

 

[N]

Rod Speed -- You misunderstood; the new Seagate hard drive was treated
by the Seagate software, but the new Western Digital drive never saw
anything but fdisk.


I updated the BIOS, and amazingly enough, everything now seems to work.
Fdisk didn't give me an error message, and Windows 98 is now
installed. I just wish I had tried it before.

Thanks everyone for all the help!!