MVP's - FAQ - A Suggestion

[BobS]

Now I'm addressing this to mainly the MVP's because other than a select few,
they are the most prominent and most active contributors in this and other
related newsgroups. I might add that they're also doing an outstanding job.

Now that you've had time to see the "typical" questions being asked and the
"typical" answer that really does answer the question, would it not be a
wise decision to make up a FAQ (or several) that could be posted every few
days that would answer a majority of the questions?

A typical question followed by a short answer that refers to a MS link (or
other link) where the answers or thread are archived. A quick cut 'n paste
of question and answers from selected posts and references to KB articles
for the typical or not so typical questions that you feel you're constantly
answering.

I would suggest a collaboration amongst the MVP's would most likely yield
"The mother of all FAQ's on Vista". It would be a worthwhile effort
considering that Vista questions will outlast any and all of you. I dare say
burn-out will take it's toll long before this ng turns to dust.....

I'm more than willing to contribute by sorting through the archives and
finding questions/answers that "may" be relevant and pass them along to
whoever for inclusion in one of the FAQ's. I dare say a major portion of
the questions could be answered in this manner and save your mentoring
skills for the more technical and tougher questions - you know, the ones
they pay you the big bucks for to answer.......

A thought for you MVP's or anyone else that may have some time to devote to
this.

Bob S.

 

[Richard Urban]

The problem is that it can get quite large and we have to be aware of out
friends who are still on dial-up. Bringing this in to their computers will
be a task, and some people pay by the minute for connect time.

I tried doing this a few years ago. I believe others have also tried doing
this. There wasn't a very good reception.

If there is enough support for this I would be glad to maintain it, with
input from those who can help.


--


Regards,

Richard Urban MVP
Microsoft Windows Shell/User

 

[John Inzer]

Now I'm addressing this to mainly the MVP's because other than a
select few, they are the most prominent and most active contributors
in this and other related newsgroups. I might add that they're also
doing an outstanding job.
Now that you've had time to see the "typical" questions being asked
and the "typical" answer that really does answer the question, would
it not be a wise decision to make up a FAQ (or several) that could be
posted every few days that would answer a majority of the questions?

A typical question followed by a short answer that refers to a MS
link (or other link) where the answers or thread are archived. A
quick cut 'n paste of question and answers from selected posts and
references to KB articles for the typical or not so typical questions
that you feel you're constantly answering.

I would suggest a collaboration amongst the MVP's would most likely
yield "The mother of all FAQ's on Vista". It would be a worthwhile
effort considering that Vista questions will outlast any and all of
you. I dare say burn-out will take it's toll long before this ng
turns to dust.....
I'm more than willing to contribute by sorting through the archives
and finding questions/answers that "may" be relevant and pass them
along to whoever for inclusion in one of the FAQ's. I dare say a
major portion of the questions could be answered in this manner and
save your mentoring skills for the more technical and tougher
questions - you know, the ones they pay you the big bucks for to
answer.......
A thought for you MVP's or anyone else that may have some time to
devote to this.

Bob S.

================================

Vista Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ's):
http://vistasupport.mvps.org/vista_faq.htm

JB's Windows Vista Support FAQ
http://www.jimmah.com/vista/

Vista Frequently Asked Questions
http://www.vistahelp.ca/faq/faq.htm

Movie Maker - PhotoStory
http://www.papajohn.org/
(Choose Vista in the Left Pane)

Windows Vista Developer FAQ
http://tinyurl.com/ypsmgs

--
John Inzer
MS Picture It! -
Digital Image MVP

Digital Image
Highlights and FAQs
http://tinyurl.com/aczzp

Notice
This is not tech support
I am a volunteer

Solutions that work for
me may not work for you

Proceed at your own risk

 

[Dustin Harper]

I'm in. I can help out in any way I can.

 

[Richard Urban]

There is another major problem.

Look at all the posts here. Many/most MVP's do. A person will post the exact
same question that was posted only ten minutes previously and 5 posts down
from his/hers. All they want to do is get a personal answer, thinking that
their version of the same problem is somehow unique.

Actually, I am being kind. They really don't even read what has been written
previously - though it may be on the first page of posts when using the CDO
(web) interface.

The news groups are not setup where a post can be left continually in the
top/first position where these people are likely to see it.

--


Regards,

Richard Urban MVP
Microsoft Windows Shell/User

 

[Dustin Harper]

Very, very true. Even if a FAQ was posted daily, it could be on the same
page two posts up, and it wouldn't be read.

Maybe a suggestion for Microsoft in the next edition of Windows Mail (or
even an RFC for USENET): an option to have a FAQ available to read while
subscribing to the group.

Or on the MS site where a lot of people are reading these groups.

--
Dustin Harper
(e-mail address removed)
http://www.vistarip.com

--

 

[Adam Albright]

Now I'm addressing this to mainly the MVP's because other than a select few,
they are the most prominent and most active contributors in this and other
related newsgroups. I might add that they're also doing an outstanding job.

Having been one of the principle authors of one of the largest HTML
FAQ's on the Web over a decade ago that generated in excess of a
million hits I speak from experience. Trying to get a comprehensive
FAQ up and running is a thankless job. If done right takes many months
just to get started, will cause endless squables between contributors
deciding on the "right" answers, such squable likely will spill over
into the newsgroups, even the right way to phrase questions will get
hotly debated if you go beyond just scratching the surface with just a
handful of trivial questions and answers.

My project had hundreds of Q-A's and you know the kind of detailed
answers I give. ;-). To be of any use it also will require constant
updating and verification that the information is both accurate and
current. That too will cause endless strive. For something that's a
moving target like a just released operating system that comes in
multiple versions and had near endless combinations of hardware
supported, you better know up front what a HUGE project (if done
right) you embarking on.

After all that, the same endless flood of newbies will go right on
asking the same questions for the thousandth time right in the
newsgroup. Then there will the net cops that tirelessly tell people to
"go read the FAQ" just like some MVP recently kept nagging here "your
posting to the wrong group" and stuff like that, so expect the noise
level here to increase, not decrease.

Not trying to throw nothing but cold water on the idea, just letting
you know what you're in for. No, sorry, I'm not interested in
contributing, too much on my plate right now, but you made a major
mistake hinting you are only interested in hearing from MVP and a "few
others" that post here a lot. You have effectively slammed the door in
the face of people that may have jumped at the chance to be part of a
large community project and you never know what substational help may
come from, that now, unless you do an immediate about face and open
the door WIDE and encourage anyone interested to respond will instead
feel insulted. I guess public relations isn't your strong suit.

 

[Kerry Brown]

Not trying to throw nothing but cold water on the idea, just letting
you know what you're in for. No, sorry, I'm not interested in
contributing, too much on my plate right now, but you made a major
mistake hinting you are only interested in hearing from MVP and a "few
others" that post here a lot. You have effectively slammed the door in
the face of people that may have jumped at the chance to be part of a
large community project and you never know what substational help may
come from, that now, unless you do an immediate about face and open
the door WIDE and encourage anyone interested to respond will instead
feel insulted. I guess public relations isn't your strong suit.

We agree on something!

There are many people besides MVPs who make valuable contributions. Casting
as wide a net as possible is always a good idea. Even though I like to think
I'm not biased I know that it is impossible. We all have bias' That's why I
put the fact that I'm an MVP in my sig, so that people will know where my
possible bias' may be. Only including MVPs or even having a majority of
contributors be MVPs will end up with a biased FAQ. It's human nature.

I also agree totally that it is an almost impossible task for something as
large as Vista. You would need too many people to do it. With more than a
few people it will get bogged down internally exactly as you point out.

It may be possible to run the newsgroup posts through some kind of analysis
and come with the top 20 questions or something like that and just answer
those questions. That wouldn't be too much to maintain and post every couple
of days.

 

[Adam Albright]

We agree on something!

Cool! ;-)

 

[Richard Urban]

Yes. Some very good tips and hints have been posted by people not associated
with Microsoft in any way, except that they use Windows Vista.

--


Regards,

Richard Urban MVP
Microsoft Windows Shell/User

 

[Bob Eyster]

Or they could setup a NG called Windows.vista.installation_FAQ

 

[BobS]

Vista Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ's):
http://vistasupport.mvps.org/vista_faq.htm

JB's Windows Vista Support FAQ
http://www.jimmah.com/vista/

Vista Frequently Asked Questions
http://www.vistahelp.ca/faq/faq.htm

Movie Maker - PhotoStory
http://www.papajohn.org/
(Choose Vista in the Left Pane)

Windows Vista Developer FAQ
http://tinyurl.com/ypsmgs

--
John Inzer
MS Picture It! -
Digital Image MVP

Digital Image
Highlights and FAQs
http://tinyurl.com/aczzp

Notice
This is not tech support
I am a volunteer

Solutions that work for
me may not work for you

Proceed at your own risk

 

[BobS]

John,

Great start and I just made a post below yours and renamed it Vista FAQ and
pasted your post into it. No hopefully, others can add the links to it and
it will grow.

 

[BobS]

Adam,

I did not slam the door on anyone, but face it - a FAQ should be written by
knowledgeable individuals. Not dissing anyone here but if the FAQ doesn't
have credibility - what good would it be? This being a peer-to-peer
newsgroup, I take most replies with the grain of salt as I'm sure others do
also but after awhile, you learn who knows what they're talking about and
who's guessing - hence the "select few" I mentioned.

Sometimes, problems are of our own making and primarily a misunderstanding
of how things work - now. Did you ever purchase a Vista reference book I
mentioned to you? Makes it a bit easier to understand some of the "why"
behind the changes.

The negative things about trying to build a FAQ may be absolutely right -
but maybe not too. There are many FAQ's out there that really are good as
I'm learning, just getting them compiled into a list as John has already
started and pointing others to them is the challenge I see.

It should take some load off the MVP's so they can concentrate on the
tougher issues. And no one has to keep responding to an individuals post to
tell them to read the FAQ - that's silly. Post it often enough so it stays
visible and keep it focused on Vista.

For those MVP's and select few reading a question and know that the FAQ
points to an answer - then simply ignore the post and move on. People will
soon learn to use it. No argument that some will not but you're also not
obligated to make a response.

And Adam, I was hoping that you would be one of the individuals to jump in
and volunteer some help. You have excellent questions - just short on
solutions sometimes.

Bob S.



snipe...........

 

[Adam Albright]

Adam,

I did not slam the door on anyone, but face it - a FAQ should be written by
knowledgeable individuals. Not dissing anyone here but if the FAQ doesn't
have credibility - what good would it be? This being a peer-to-peer
newsgroup, I take most replies with the grain of salt as I'm sure others do
also but after awhile, you learn who knows what they're talking about and
who's guessing - hence the "select few" I mentioned.

Don't take it personal, but in my opinion that's a DUMB approach. The
point being you have no idea who may be lurking in any newsgroup. For
every poster you see posting there are dozens, even hundreds more that
simply read newsgroups and rarely if ever post. Why turn these
potential resources off with the kind of statements you made? If
people have the time to help and the expertise, I know I for one
wouldn't feel welcome seeing that kind of sweeping statement in effect
slamming the door in their face. That's the point I was making. Its
almost racist in nature. Don't bother to apply unless, oh I saw you
post a lot in this newsgroup or oh, this guy is a MVP, so he must know
what he's talking about kind of fuzzy logic. Again, it implies YOU
know who's the authority and set yourself up as king of the newsgroup
to hand pick people you view as "expert" to produce some FAQ, again a
foolish and self limiting approach to take if you want to undertake
such a massive project.

I'm sure you didn't intend it that way, but I know from experience it
will be how some people interpret your words and immediately get
turned off and in effect you likely will if you haven't already turned
away the REAL experts.

I know from experience. I thought I knew a lot about HTML, and with a
few friends we started the project I mentioned over a decade ago. The
reality was we knew NOTHING compared to what others knew and quickly
learned that painful lesson and were grateful to others that joined
the project after it was started. One gentlemen I forget his name
lived in Brazil, and while his native language wasn't English, his
contributions were exceptional.

Reasonble to assume there are people lurking here right now or by
chance may just be passing by who's expereince with operarting systems
and Windows in particular would make all the rest of us look like
babbling idiots, including me. So, you don't want to doom the project
before it even starts, if some of these indviduals may be interested
in participating.

You also need to broaden your scope as to what is and isn't expertise.
A couple of the links you made reference to while marginally useful,
perhaps to newbies, aren't what I would call authorative on the topics
they represent, not even close. The point here is you need to be
careful who gets the "authorative" label or again the end result is
simply perpetuating misinformation which is epidemic in blogs, forums,
newsgroups and web sites.

Sometimes, problems are of our own making and primarily a misunderstanding
of how things work - now. Did you ever purchase a Vista reference book I
mentioned to you?

No, because none of the books out now are that authorative. Most in
fact if anything are a rehash of the build in help system which itself
often just glosses over important topics.

Makes it a bit easier to understand some of the "why"
behind the changes.

The negative things about trying to build a FAQ may be absolutely right -
but maybe not too. There are many FAQ's out there that really are good as
I'm learning, just getting them compiled into a list as John has already
started and pointing others to them is the challenge I see.

My point as cruel as in may sound which isn't intentional is you
aren't in a postion to know what is "good information" or not. It
seems you're just another newbie yourself and are still learning the
basics. The biggest challenge always is to GET people to visit some
FAQ. The reality is no matter how good it may end up being you may
lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

It should take some load off the MVP's so they can concentrate on the
tougher issues.

I doubt the majority of MVP's are interesting in doing that since the
vast majority of MVP posts I've seen are of the simple cut and paste
variety providing the same answers over and over. Call me cynical, but
it seems too many MVP's post simply to earn browny points with
Microsoft. To remain in the program they need to "answer" x number of
questions over a time period.

And no one has to keep responding to an individuals post to
tell them to read the FAQ - that's silly.

Nobody has to, but trust me, that is exactly what will happen.
Newsgroups tend to draw control freaks and ego strokers. There at
least a couple regular posters here already that go out of their way
to try to redirect questions to other newsgroups, because they think
"they're in charge" or are providing a service by doing that. Having a
FAQ will only increase that kind of stupidity.

Post it often enough so it stays
visible and keep it focused on Vista.

Are you a control freak too?

For those MVP's and select few reading a question and know that the FAQ
points to an answer - then simply ignore the post and move on.

Yep, it sounds like you're another control freak ;-)

People soon learn to use it.

Well if so, it will be a first. How long you been posting to
newsgroups to make such a foolish assumption?

No argument that some will not but you're also not
obligated to make a response.

Bingo, now you're learning! Of course nobody is obligated to respond,
yet there are always people in EVERY newsgroup that take it upon
themselves to try to steer it how they see fit regardless if it ends
up being helpful or not. I'm sure people reading what I'm saying now
will conclude that about me. ;-)

And Adam, I was hoping that you would be one of the individuals to jump in
and volunteer some help. You have excellent questions - just short on
solutions sometimes.

Don't have the time now. Nobody has all the solutions, which is why I
sometimes ask tough questions. Its called life. <wink>

 

[John Barnett MVP]

Adam, I can honestly say that I don't happen to be one of the 'cut and
paste' brigade. NG replies, in my case, are 'individual' replies not
something taken from a 'stock' list of selected answers.

Both my websites http://xphelpandsupport.mvps.org and
http://vistasupport.mvps.org contain many FAQ's and, in the case of Vista,
many more answers to frequently asked questions will be added over time.

As the many thousands of people who have personally emailed me for support
can testify, if the answer wasn't available on my website, i was always
prepared to recieve email requests and they were answered on an individual
basis.

Unfortunately, there comes a time when one gets so bogged down with
'personal' requests that more hours are spend responding to peoples support
queries than are actually spend doing the day job. I've juggled both the day
job and answering personal support requests, as well as contributing to
newsgroups for the last seven years. It has only been within the last two
months that i have had to call a halt to people directly emailing me with
support questions. That decision was relucatantly arrived at, but it was
simply an issue of economics - continue spending many hours each day
replying to support emails and end up bankrupt or concentrate on the job
that pays the bills. paying the bills, unfortunately, got the upper hand

--
John Barnett MVP
Associate Expert
Windows - Shell/User

Web: http://xphelpandsupport.mvps.org
Web: http://vistasupport.mvps.org

The information in this mail/post is supplied "as is". No warranty of any
kind, either expressed or implied, is made in relation to the accuracy,
reliability or content of this mail/post. The Author shall not be liable for
any direct, indirect, incidental or consequential damages arising out of the
use of, or inability to use, information or opinions expressed in this
mail/post..

 

[Adam Albright]

Adam, I can honestly say that I don't happen to be one of the 'cut and
paste' brigade. NG replies, in my case, are 'individual' replies not
something taken from a 'stock' list of selected answers.

Didn't say all MVP's were. The good ones don't. I consider you one of
the good ones. Understand all too well how you can get bogged down,
been there too. Now that I'm semi retired I can stop and smell the
roses more. I just got back from riding my bike. Not bad for a "old"
guy living in the Chicago area. Still snow on the ground, but it is
pushing 60 degrees today, bad case of cabin fever so had to get out
and was surprised how many people of all ages were out and about with
me.

 

[BobS]

snipe of a long post.......


Adam,

As I said - you're good at asking questions but short on solutions. Lighten
up fella, it was a only a suggestion. You don't like it - that's fine with
me.

You need to get away from that computer once in awhile, I think you got
Vista fever.....

Bob S.

 

[Adam Albright]

snipe of a long post.......


Adam,

As I said - you're good at asking questions but short on solutions.

And you keep confirming you're a clueless newbie. Lot of that here.

 

[BobS]

Hey Adam - go back and read that long senseless diatribe you made telling us
how none of the books are *that* authorative - as if you've even read more
than the front cover. Read your own posts if you want to read what a newbie
sounds like. Apparently you were born to complain and love the attention -
you certainly have a knack for p*ssing people off.

You won't buy or read a reference book, all the FAQ's are useless according
to you and there's no sense in doing one because you blew it one time and
therefore it can't be done. You sir, are incapable of learning from your
own mistakes and are a defeatist. You best lighten up a bit before you go
over the edge.

B*tch and moan is about all you've done here and tell everyone how terrible
Vista is - but yet - you're still using it. You obviously don't have the
common sense you were born with and are definitely unwilling to learn
something new. Perhaps MicrosoftBob is more your in line with your
capabilities - newbie.

And just to refresh your memory, you're the one that started the personal
attacks and I certainly will not take any cr*p from the likes of you.

Bob S.