MVP Certification?

[Guest]

I am entirely self-taught in Access & VBA, and have built up a rather
complicated database over a period of several years. I am also about 18
months from retirement (I hope...) It is clear to me and my employer that my
successor should have a higher level of training than I. Not only is my
database work uneven in quality and efficiency, but new opportunities to
apply Access & VBA are probably around the corner.

The question is, how much training, and how much is too much?

My database is essentially a two-trick pony, since the department's other
data needs are met by large, networked systems. Still, keeping it up is
pretty much a full-time job, due to the extreme complixity of our work, which
is private fund raising for a public university. (You in the UK can reverse
those designations.) My primary professional relationships are not with
technicians but sales types. They are generally techno-neanderthals (a label
they would cheerfully accept), so I am largely on my own regarding the
database. The job calls for a mature personality (though not necessarily an
old coot like me) and some patience.

I see references to an MVP certification, but my impression is that that
requires a lot more background than this job needs. Am I mistaken? Are
there other levels of certification we should consider? Where can I go to
find the training requirements for various levels?

Thanks.

 

[Douglas J Steele]

MVP isn't a certification, it's a reward from Microsoft for contributions to
the community of users. See http://www.microsoft.com/mvp for more details.

Unfortunately, there doesn't currently exist any Access-specific
certification from Microsoft.

 

[Guest]

OK. If you were hiring my successor, what in general would you look for?
Thanks.
--
David Habercom
University of Tennessee

MVP isn't a certification, it's a reward from Microsoft for contributions to
the community of users. See http://www.microsoft.com/mvp for more details.

Unfortunately, there doesn't currently exist any Access-specific
certification from Microsoft.

 

[dbahooker]

ok. what MVP means is that you AGREE with Microsoft on everything--
that is the first thing to keep in mind.

every MVP i've ever met doesnt know the difference between a MDB and an
ADP

i would reccomened getting certified in SQL Server and probably
learning a lot about sharepoint.

 

[Guest]

This is an age old question.

In one sentence, I would recommend having each applicant make a database for
you or view there previous work.

The reason I say this is that I am also self taught and the company I work
for had, previous to me, a person with a MOS
(see http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/officespecialist/default.asp for
more info) in Word, Excel, Access, and Powerpoint. And to make a long story
short she wrote shoddy databases, which when she left I had to fix.

But on the other hand those with the talent for databases AND microsoft
certification is that much more valued.

But this is my opinion and I could be wrong.

Krizhek

OK. If you were hiring my successor, what in general would you look for?
Thanks.

 

[Dirk Goldgar]

ok. what MVP means is that you AGREE with Microsoft on everything--
that is the first thing to keep in mind.

Boy, are *you* out of the loop!

every MVP i've ever met doesnt know the difference between a MDB and
an ADP

Gee, that's funny. I don't know *any* Access MVPs who don't know the
difference. But maybe you've met a lot more than I have.

i would reccomened getting certified in SQL Server and probably
learning a lot about sharepoint.

That wouldn't hurt, but Mr. Habercom's question was about his successor,
not himself.

 

[Graham Mandeno]

I am proud to say I have received the MVP award ten times now.

I am also proud to say that I have NEVER agreed with Microsoft on
everything. In fact, quite the converse - and I would like to think that
Access as a product has benefitted from my disagreement and that of my
fellow MVPs.

I have the highest regard for the independence and expertise of all MVPs,
none of whom work for or are paid by Microsoft, and all of whom share a
common trait of being dedicated to helping other people.

As for getting certified in SQL Server, that is an excellent idea. But how
are your users going to get at the data that is stored in your SQL Server
database? Access is, IMO, the best rapid development tool for database
applications available. It works very well with SQL Server, as with a
number of other database engines.

However, many organisations cannot justify the cost of SQL Server, and it is
fortunate for them that Access applications work equally well with a
reliable low-cost database engine know as Jet.

I'm not sure who you are, or how many MVPs you have "met", but I can tell
you that every Access MVP I know understands the difference between an MDB
and an ADP. Furthermore, they understand the difference between an Access
DB application and the "back-end" where the data is stores, be it Jet, SQL
Server, Oracle, or whatever...

 

[George Nicholson]

every MVP i've ever met doesnt know the difference between a MDB and an

ADP

*Access* MVP's ????? (There's no reason for any other kind of MVP to
know...).

 

[dbahooker]

graham

then why are all you MVP-folk ADP wimps?

thats what i want to know

if it's not required to 'be an ADP wimp' to be an MVP; then it is an
awfully big coincidence.

I just thnk that you guys aren't helping the cause-- you sit around and
talk shit about ADP and DAP-- who the **** do you think that you are?

 

[dbahooker]

and graham; buddy-- remember that MSDE is free; there isn't a single
reason to ever use MDB for ANYTHING

 

[dbahooker]

i just really am curious

why is it that the baby MVPs are scared of writing TSQL?

anyone that tries to tell you that ADP is an inferior solution??
they're obviously too old-fashioned to learn how to use them properly.

ADP kicks MDBs ass and every MVP i've ever talked to-- has this
attitude like 'oh, just dont use ADP' -- 'just dont use DAP'

WHO ARE YOU TO TELL ME WHAT TO USE?

I JUST WANT ADVICE ON HOW TO GET THINGS DONE IN ADP-- EVERY ****ING
TIME YOU COMMIES HEAR THE WORD ADP -- YOU'RE LIKE 'WELL YOU SHOULDN'T
BE USING ADP'

****ING PIECE OF SHIT SILVER SPOON MOTHER ****ER

START RESPECTING ADP

and maybe i'll stop talking trash

 

[George Nicholson]

and maybe i'll stop talking trash

Not likely in any conceivable reality.

(not an MVP, but still knows what a jerk look like)

 

[WabashWillie]

Who are you kidding? You've never talked to an MVP and you know it. Is
your foul language really necessary to make a point or did mommy forget
to change your diaper and you're just mad at the world?

I've never seen a post from any MVP stating that an ADP was an inferior
solution, except perhaps in a specific instance. While I can't remember
names now, there have been one or more Access MVPs who use ADPs almost
exclusively and have posted to that effect.

Nobody's telling you what to use. Although I do suggest that you wash
your mouth out with lye or something else that will help you clean up
your foul mouth.

 

[aaron.kempf]

I haven't seen a single MVP that isn't a ADP hater

If you know an Access MVP that specializes in ADP; i would love to talk
to them. As it is; they're not being heard-- I haven't ever found a
single friggin person in my life that gives a shit about ADP

All i know is that i'm burnt out on writing queries and writing queries
and 'crap; oh-- access got confused'

im sick and tired of working till 10am; troubleshooting locking
problems

im sick and tired of setting up DSNs and refreshing linked tables--

there is a better way and these 'ADP MVPs' that you talk about aren't
doing their god damn job

Tell me one person that knows jack shit about ADP and I'll stop my
bitching

I have never seen a MVP that gave ADP or DAP a fair chance. These
technologies TOTALLY ROCK and I think that it's disgusting that these
people talk down about the technology.

MVPs are the only ones that have the pull to convince Microsoft to take
ADP seriously.

I've got a laundry list of a dozen bugs in ADP and I want a god damn
ACCESS ADP MVP so that I can send these to them.

Because --- to be honest; I've gotten black listed from Microsoft for
complaining about ADP bugs. So I need to find someone to get through
their bullshit and help me to get these bugs fixed.

I'm just sick and tired of companies that I work for; spending millions
of dollars on Microsoft Office-- and Microsoft has the audacity to say
'oh, dont use that it doesnt work correctly'.

'oh, dont use ADP because they dont work correctly'

'oh, dont use DAP since ASP and ASP.net are so much powerful (WRONG DAP
IS AWESOME)'

gag me with a goddamn spoon and give me a refund for every copy of
office i've ever bought

these monkeys-- I just am a little bit pissed off that ACCESS MVPs are
such wimps when it comes to ADP.

SHOW ME A MVP THAT KNOWS ADP AND I'LL SHOW YOU SOMEONE THAT'S MAKING
$200k / YEAR.

SHOW ME A HALF DOZEN MDB MVPs AND I'LL SHOW YOU SOME KIDS MAKING
$12/hour

 

[Guest]

and dbahooker; buddy-- remember that MSDE is throttled at 5 concurrent users;
there's lots of reasons to use MDBs. Ever try taking your MSDE home for the
weekend to work on it? Sure, you can do it, but it's not nearly as easy as
zipping that .mdb file and throwing it on a thumb drive. Ever try storing
user preferences in a local table? Oops, can't do it. Did ya get a copy of
Enterprise Manager with MSDE? Nope, didn't think so. What about general ease
of use? Can you through your MSDE BE database on any old file server? Nope,
didn't think so.

Your assertions that "what MVP means is that you AGREE with Microsoft on
everything" and "every MVP i've ever met doesnt know the difference between a
MDB and an ADP" is just plain hogwash. There's only one word to describe your
contributions to this thread: moronic.


Tom

http://www.access.qbuilt.com/html/expert_contributors.html
__________________________________________

:

and graham; buddy-- remember that MSDE is free; there isn't a single
reason to ever use MDB for ANYTHING

 

[aaron.kempf]

Tom

you're full of crap; it isn't throttled at 5 concurrent users

and 2/3rds of the apps that you use Access for are what, 1, 2, 3 users?

I just haven't ever met a single intelligent person that knows jack
shit about ADP. And it's all because the first MVPs-- back in 2000--
said 'stay away from ADP' when they should have been embracing it.

So just a couple of comments that some lazy MVP made 5 years ago--- now
every MVP in the world is a ADP wimp.

Why??

GROUPTHINK

ADP kicks MDBs' ass kid

 

[Guest]

Aaron,

I guess you haven't read the Microsoft documentation that talks about
performance issues with MSDE after 5 concurrent users. Or you must know more
about it than the people at Microsoft. 2/3rds of the apps. that you use
Access for may be for 1-3 users. For me, 2/3rds of those apps are targeted at
small groups of 15-20 users, since I work for a Fortune 500 company.

One person I know whom I consider knowledgeable enough to speak on the
subject doesn't have a very high opinion of ADP's. Like me, he enjoys a close
working relationship with members of the Access Development team (our
meetings are held on Microsoft's main campus with members of the ADT always
present). This person has never been an MVP, or aspired to become one.
However, he is the past President of our local Access Developer group, the
owner of a very successful small business (varies between 6~10 employees)
that specializes in databases, teaches courses on Access and SQL Server at
local community colleges and at his business, and is a newly published
co-author of a Wrox book on Access. In other words, I think it's safe to say
that his creditentials are a bit more than yours when it comes to databases.

While you may personally think ADP's are the best thing bar none, this is
just your opinion, which you are entitled to have. It's too bad that you feel
the need to resort to obscene language to try to convince others. Convince
others with facts Aaron, not foul language.


Tom Wickerath
Bellevue, WA.
________________________________________________

:

Tom

you're full of crap; it isn't throttled at 5 concurrent users

and 2/3rds of the apps that you use Access for are what, 1, 2, 3 users?

I just haven't ever met a single intelligent person that knows jack
shit about ADP. And it's all because the first MVPs-- back in 2000--
said 'stay away from ADP' when they should have been embracing it.

So just a couple of comments that some lazy MVP made 5 years ago--- now
every MVP in the world is a ADP wimp.

Why??

GROUPTHINK

ADP kicks MDBs' ass kid

 

[dbahooker]

Tom

I just think that it's funny.. oh-- i have 15-20 concurrent users (do
they really have it open all day long??) on an MDB-- what do you think
that is too many users for ADP?

MSDE can use that many connections-- MSDE 2.0-- aka SQL Server 2000
lite-- has a soft governor, not a hard governor.. and performance is
much better on a reliable system.

How many times do you have to reboot fileservers because you have the
wrong locktype?

How many times do you have to reboot desktops just because you have a
LDB file that wont go away?

how many times do you have to run around, refreshing tables? how many
times do you have to setup DSNs?

how many times have you needed to push out a MDB app because you're
server is down?

with ADP it is a much better solution; because you only need to change
shit in one place-- on FILE CONNECTION

and Tom-- just to set the record straight.

I'm sick and ****ing tired of you 'oh, i have a knowledgeable friend
that says that ADP are going away'.

I AM HERE TO TELL YOU THAT NOOOOOOOO-- THEY AREN'T GOING AWAY.

You should be LAUGHING at your little Access MDB wuss.

hahahahahah go and play with your MDB all week little kid

SQL Server is taking over the world; it has taken over the world.

And you MDB/MVP babies are missing the boat.

how many reports do you have that take more than 10 seconds to run??

 

[dbahooker]

http://www.microsoft.com/sql/msde/default.mspx

MSDE is designed for up to 25 concurrent users

the front page of MSDE read it and weep punk
I just know first hand that MS needs to win the ADP war or else they're
sure as hell not going to win the DB backend war.

MDB is the most beautiful app ever written.

But i'm sick and tired of having queries that 'just crap out'

that doesn't happen to me any longer-- ever since I started using ADP
when Access 2000 was still in beta.

-Aaron

 

[Arvin Meyer [MVP]]

http://www.microsoft.com/sql/msde/default.mspx

MSDE is designed for up to 25 concurrent users

You need to read that again, it says websites serving up to 25 concurrent
users. Websites use disconnected data and can handle many more users than
local front-ends like ADPs. I suspect that a well designed website can
probably handle a hundred or more if the server has enough juice.

I've built over a half dozen serious ADP applications. It takes longer.
There are more bugs that require kluge work-arounds. The MSDE can't handle
as many bound front-ends without performance problems. But for all except 1
of my ADPs, I used the full version of SQL-Server, so performance wasn't a
problem.

SNIP

But i'm sick and tired of having queries that 'just crap out'

Must be another problem. I don't have any problems with either Jet or the
full version of SQL-Server. My biggest Jet app has 53 concurrent users, my
biggest SQL-Server app has over 640 users.
--
Arvin Meyer, MCP, MVP
Microsoft Access
Free Access downloads:
http://www.datastrat.com
http://www.mvps.org/access