Motherboard with Pata & Sata?

[wei]

I want to buy a new, reasonably fast, full-size ATX (not Mini)
motherboard/CPU combo that has a Pata header in addition to Sata
headers (4 or 6 okay). Integrated video would suit, as would at
least one PCI slot and a PCI Express slot. Don't they make them any
more? I sure can't find any.

Help?

XieXie
Wei

 

[Paul]

I want to buy a new, reasonably fast, full-size ATX (not Mini)
motherboard/CPU combo that has a Pata header in addition to Sata
headers (4 or 6 okay). Integrated video would suit, as would at
least one PCI slot and a PCI Express slot. Don't they make them any
more? I sure can't find any.

Help?

XieXie
Wei

My motherboard is several years old.

The PATA on the motherboard, is done with a separate Jmicron chip.

So it is easy to add PATA if they want to. I haven't had
a problem booting from the Jmicron.

*******

This is an example of a motherboard with an IDE. Z77 chipset.
Asrock does funny stuff, like include legacy ports.

"ASRock Z77 Fatal1ty Professional LGA 1155"
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157299

The PATA is by the RAM slots.

http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/13-157-299-Z03?$S640W$

The Newegg "advanced" search tab, has a field for PATA, but the
number of motherboards with it, is small.

http://www.newegg.com/Intel-Motherboards/SubCategory/ID-280

Paul

 

[wei]

Thanks again, Paul.

It may seem that I was being lazy, but I spent the day scanning for a
board with Pata, and found nothing beyond some resurrected old boards.
I was just trying to salvage a few Pata drives.

My motherboard is several years old.

The PATA on the motherboard, is done with a separate Jmicron chip.

So it is easy to add PATA if they want to. I haven't had
a problem booting from the Jmicron.

*******

This is an example of a motherboard with an IDE. Z77 chipset.
Asrock does funny stuff, like include legacy ports.

"ASRock Z77 Fatal1ty Professional LGA 1155"
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157299

The PATA is by the RAM slots.

http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/13-157-299-Z03?$S640W$

The ASRock Z77 looks to fit. I need to find a CPU for it.

The Newegg "advanced" search tab, has a field for PATA, but the
number of motherboards with it, is small.

http://www.newegg.com/Intel-Motherboards/SubCategory/ID-280

I did not see Newegg's search tab when I was searching.
I don't see where the ASRock Z77 Extreme3 LGA has Pata, but I'll study
it some more. The 'Supported only by CPU with integrated graphic'
might be a problem.

I looked at Newegg's search again and found this board thanks to U,
but I still do not see any Pata.

I'll look more closely at the ASRock Z77.

XieXie

Wei

 

[wei]

My motherboard is several years old.

The PATA on the motherboard, is done with a separate Jmicron chip.

So it is easy to add PATA if they want to. I haven't had
a problem booting from the Jmicron.

*******

This is an example of a motherboard with an IDE. Z77 chipset.
Asrock does funny stuff, like include legacy ports.

"ASRock Z77 Fatal1ty Professional LGA 1155"
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157299

The PATA is by the RAM slots.

Are you sure there is a Pata header there?

http://www.microcenter.com/product/387554/Z77_Extreme4_Socket_LGA_1155_Z77_ATX_Intel_Motherboard

Wei

 

[Paul]

Are you sure there is a Pata header there?

http://www.microcenter.com/product/387554/Z77_Extreme4_Socket_LGA_1155_Z77_ATX_Intel_Motherboard

Wei

The example I picked was this one.

Z77 Fatal1ty Professional LGA 1155

http://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/Fatal1ty Z77 Professional/

It can take a 3770K.

http://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/Fatal1ty Z77 Professional/?cat=CPU

Manual.

ftp://66.226.78.21/manual/Fatal1ty%20Z77%20Professional.pdf

Page.10

"1 x ATA133 IDE connector (supports 2 x IDE devices)"

But no evidence of what chip it uses.

Review mentions IDE, here. I don't immediately
see the chip identified here either.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5842/asrock-fatal1ty-z77-professional-review-ide-and-floppy-on-z77/2

the sad part is, the manual doesn't even seem to have
a board outline drawing. So I don't even know which
chip to start looking at. And pictures of the motherboard
have such poor contrast, I'm unlikely to identify it anyway.

*******

If you aren't booting from the PATA drive, then you might
as well just get a USB3 to PATA dongle.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817198056

That one comes with a power adapter. Usually a 12V adapter,
and the dongle then converts 12V to 5V from there.

http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/17-198-056-Z05?$S640W$

Paul

 

[VanguardLH]

I want to buy a new, reasonably fast, full-size ATX (not Mini)
motherboard/CPU combo that has a Pata header in addition to Sata
headers (4 or 6 okay). Integrated video would suit, as would at
least one PCI slot and a PCI Express slot. Don't they make them any
more? I sure can't find any.

If you choose to get a newer motherboard (for forward longevity) and
want to add IDE/PATA devices (for backward compatibility), get a mobo
that has plenty of PCI slots, like 1 PCI-e for the video card (or 2 if
you might later want to do Crossfire or SLI with 2 video cards if you
don't want to get a less video card to pair up with onboard video
providing the mobo permits that), another for an analog/data/fax modem
(if this is to be a portable computer or you want to fax from it), and
a couple more for later expansion. You could then use a PCI slot to
install an IDE/PATA controller daughtercard.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815104214
(2 IDE channels for up to 4 master/slave IDE drives)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816124066
(add 1 IDE channel for 2 master/slave IDE device & 2 SATA ports)
(lets you support up to 2 IDE drives and also add 2 more SATA ports)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816124054
(add 1 IDE channel for up to 2 IDE drives, 1 int SATA, 1 ext SATA)
(eSATA for ext SATA drive is much faster than USB1-2, equal to USB3)

If you go the IDE controller daughercard route, make sure to use the
correct IDE data cables from the card to your old IDE hard drives.
Above ATA-66 you should be using the 80-wire ribbon cables (40 signal
+ 40 ground) to eliminate crosstalk noise between the parallel wires.
At or under ATA-66, you can use the older 40-wire or newer 80-wire
ribbon cables. Just to be safe, just use the 80-wire ones.

If you don't want to use up a PCI slot or don't have any spare slots,
you can use a converter on the IDE hard drives. It converts between
SATA (on your mobo) to PATA (for your old hard drives).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812186078
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA2C50UH9319
(bidirectional; some only work in one direction for conversion)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812206002
(unidirectional - SATA ctrlr to IDE device)
(vertical dangle board - needs less space behind old IDE hard drive)

Just make sure you have room behind the old IDE hard drives for the
SATA-2-PATA converter that will be hanging off the backend of those
old IDE hard drives.

If you have just 1 old IDE hard drive you want to use in a SATA-only
motherboard, the converter dangle board is cheaper as long as you have
the room behind the old IDE hard drive. At 2 or more old IDE hard
drives, it's even money or cheaper to go with an IDE daughtercard if
you have a spare slot.

Rather than find an old style SATA+IDE hybrid motherboard, get a newer
motherboard (for forward longevity and better features) and retrofit
the old IDE drives (hard drives or optical) by using a controller card
for multiple PATA drives or the converter dangle boards for each one.
The controller card or dangle board route has the benefit that you
don't use up any of your mobo's SATA ports, so later when you start to
add SATA drives then all those ports will be available whether or not
you keep the old IDE devices in your case. Personally I would go the
controller card route that uses up a slot if you have a spare.

Just because you get a newer board that will have a longer future but
without any IDE/PATA support doesn't mean you can't add IDE/PATA
support for old drives you want to migrate from your old computer to
the new one.

 

[wei]

The example I picked was this one.

Z77 Fatal1ty Professional LGA 1155

http://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/Fatal1ty Z77 Professional/

It can take a 3770K.

http://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/Fatal1ty Z77 Professional/?cat=CPU

Manual.

ftp://66.226.78.21/manual/Fatal1ty%20Z77%20Professional.pdf

Page.10

"1 x ATA133 IDE connector (supports 2 x IDE devices)"

I think we are talking about the same mobo. I was looking for the
magic word Pata. Dumb me. I guess I had the right mobo in my Newegg
lookup.

But no evidence of what chip it uses.

Review mentions IDE, here. I don't immediately
see the chip identified here either.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5842/asrock-fatal1ty-z77-professional-review-ide-and-floppy-on-z77/2

the sad part is, the manual doesn't even seem to have
a board outline drawing. So I don't even know which
chip to start looking at. And pictures of the motherboard
have such poor contrast, I'm unlikely to identify it anyway.

That was my problem as well.

*******

If you aren't booting from the PATA drive, then you might
as well just get a USB3 to PATA dongle.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817198056

That one comes with a power adapter. Usually a 12V adapter,
and the dongle then converts 12V to 5V from there.

http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/17-198-056-Z05?$S640W$

Oh but I wanted to boot from the Pata. But I guess the mobo has
enough Sata to allow me to retain the multiple boots. I once tried a
PCI IDE card, and think I still have it if I can find it. But if I
remember right, I could not boot an IDE drive from it.
zai xie xie
Wei

 

[wei]

If you choose to get a newer motherboard (for forward longevity) and
want to add IDE/PATA devices (for backward compatibility), get a mobo
that has plenty of PCI slots, like 1 PCI-e for the video card (or 2 if
you might later want to do Crossfire or SLI with 2 video cards if you
don't want to get a less video card to pair up with onboard video
providing the mobo permits that), another for an analog/data/fax modem
(if this is to be a portable computer or you want to fax from it), and
a couple more for later expansion. You could then use a PCI slot to
install an IDE/PATA controller daughtercard.

Can one boot from that?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815104214
(2 IDE channels for up to 4 master/slave IDE drives)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816124066
(add 1 IDE channel for 2 master/slave IDE device & 2 SATA ports)
(lets you support up to 2 IDE drives and also add 2 more SATA ports)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816124054
(add 1 IDE channel for up to 2 IDE drives, 1 int SATA, 1 ext SATA)
(eSATA for ext SATA drive is much faster than USB1-2, equal to USB3)

If you go the IDE controller daughercard route, make sure to use the
correct IDE data cables from the card to your old IDE hard drives.
Above ATA-66 you should be using the 80-wire ribbon cables (40 signal
+ 40 ground) to eliminate crosstalk noise between the parallel wires.
At or under ATA-66, you can use the older 40-wire or newer 80-wire
ribbon cables. Just to be safe, just use the 80-wire ones.

If you don't want to use up a PCI slot or don't have any spare slots,
you can use a converter on the IDE hard drives. It converts between
SATA (on your mobo) to PATA (for your old hard drives).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812186078
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA2C50UH9319
(bidirectional; some only work in one direction for conversion)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812206002
(unidirectional - SATA ctrlr to IDE device)
(vertical dangle board - needs less space behind old IDE hard drive)

Just make sure you have room behind the old IDE hard drives for the
SATA-2-PATA converter that will be hanging off the backend of those
old IDE hard drives.

If you have just 1 old IDE hard drive you want to use in a SATA-only
motherboard, the converter dangle board is cheaper as long as you have
the room behind the old IDE hard drive. At 2 or more old IDE hard
drives, it's even money or cheaper to go with an IDE daughtercard if
you have a spare slot.

Rather than find an old style SATA+IDE hybrid motherboard, get a newer
motherboard (for forward longevity and better features) and retrofit
the old IDE drives (hard drives or optical) by using a controller card
for multiple PATA drives or the converter dangle boards for each one.
The controller card or dangle board route has the benefit that you
don't use up any of your mobo's SATA ports, so later when you start to
add SATA drives then all those ports will be available whether or not
you keep the old IDE devices in your case. Personally I would go the
controller card route that uses up a slot if you have a spare.

Just because you get a newer board that will have a longer future but
without any IDE/PATA support doesn't mean you can't add IDE/PATA
support for old drives you want to migrate from your old computer to
the new one.

Thanks for the ideas.

Wei

 

[Paul]

Oh but I wanted to boot from the Pata. But I guess the mobo has
enough Sata to allow me to retain the multiple boots. I once tried a
PCI IDE card, and think I still have it if I can find it. But if I
remember right, I could not boot an IDE drive from it.
zai xie xie
Wei

You can, if the PCI card has a BIOS chip on it.

Normally, there are two chips. The IDE chip and
a BIOS chip. The BIOS chip contains boot code,
so the motherboard knows how to boot from a
connected drive.

The problem with PCI cards today, is the chips
used on them, aren't always the best ones. Which is
why I did not find one of those for you. I've been
disappointed with the reviews of some of these cards
in the past.

You can boot from USB3, on motheboards where the
USB3 comes from the Southbridge. Some Intel chipsets
do that. AMD has a few chipsets as well. But before
they showed up, the previous generation (using a separate
USB3 chip), you couldn't boot from the USB3 port, only
from the USB2 port.

At one time, you could also buy IDE to SATA adapters.
But those are no longer sold in any quantity. And if
you did find one, it might not have a good chip on it.

This is the one I wanted to buy, but there were none
in my country. And I didn't want to pay brokerage
fees, to buy it outside the country. At the time,
it would have doubled the price.

http://web.archive.org/web/20080828054528/http://www.siig.com/ViewProduct.aspx?pn=SC-SA0112-S1

You plug the adapter into the back of an IDE drive.
Then, run a SATA data cable, over to your motherboard.

http://images10.newegg.com/NeweggImage/productimage/12-191-071-01.jpg

( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812191071 )

This is a modern equivalent. I don't know if I like the
design of this mechanically. The SATA side is OK, but the
IDE side, I'd rather do the power separately with
a cable (for strain relief).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812226024

When you read the customer reviews for those, you check
whether they support ATAPI (optical disc drives), as a poor
chip only does hard drives. I like the adapter to do both,
if possible. And that Siig one, could do both. (Siig doesn't
make the chip - Siig just places a sticker over it, so you
can't see the real part number.) Some of the companies
that made good adapter chips, they stopped making them
(when adapter sales dropped). And this left only poor
chips to make remaining adapters with. That's why you
have to be even more careful to read the reviews now.

It's very similar to OTA set top boxes in my country.
At the peak, there were around forty different models.
In a very short time, only three models remained, and
the chipsets the others were based on, went out of
production. The same thing has happened with IDE to SATA
chips.

Paul

 

[wei]

You can, if the PCI card has a BIOS chip on it.

Normally, there are two chips. The IDE chip and
a BIOS chip. The BIOS chip contains boot code,
so the motherboard knows how to boot from a
connected drive.

The problem with PCI cards today, is the chips
used on them, aren't always the best ones. Which is
why I did not find one of those for you. I've been
disappointed with the reviews of some of these cards
in the past.

You can boot from USB3, on motheboards where the
USB3 comes from the Southbridge. Some Intel chipsets
do that. AMD has a few chipsets as well. But before
they showed up, the previous generation (using a separate
USB3 chip), you couldn't boot from the USB3 port, only
from the USB2 port.

Yeah I went that route when I made my external storage drive bootable
by installing XP on it.
xie xie
Wei

 

[VanguardLH]

Can one boot from that?

The hardware (computer & IDE card) will let you boot from a drive
attached to the IDE card if the card has its own BIOS functions. I
can't remember seeing one without the required BIOS for over a couple
decades but then I'm not in the hardware build business to have
experience with them all plus when I do get one of these then I
probably bias my research to those that can be used for booting from
their attached drives.

As for the OS, you'll need to install a driver for it to recognize and
later manage that device. That is usually done by hitting F6 (for
Windows) during the OS *installation* to it that you will be later
supplying the card's driver when prompted during the installation.
You never identified *your* choice of OS.