Major issues/Ati tray tools

[Tim2005]

Sorry if this isnt the right place for my topic. I posted all over th
web today hopping someone will find an answer

Well heres my proble


I tryed everything I can think of but nothing works

I use ati tray tools. And I enable triple buffering for d3d games
Like bf2. (I use the profile options)

I get great fps. But after I play for a while or if I change maps m
fps drops from 80ish to 50ish and lower. Sometimes 30 ish. I turn of
triple buffering then the problem goes away so I know its tripl
buffering for d3d thats doing this. Why does it kill my fps lik
this? Is there any way to fix it?

It works very well for the first map but then it just drops. I have n
idea what it could be. Is there any options in TWEAKS that I coul
change to fix this

Does anyone else have this issue

my computer / if it matter

x800xt
3.4g
2g ra

Really would like help. I have one game on my computer right now an
its bf2 which I spend more time trying to figure this out the
playing the game. I have been looking around the web for weeks for
answer but nothin

If there is no way to fix this, can I get rid of screen tearin
without vsync

 

[Tony DiMarzio]

_Use vsync_. I don't know why people have such a thing against it. The only
time I ever turn V-Sync off is for benchmarking. Otherwise, syncing frame
swaps to monitor refresh results in a tear-free gaming experience. If your
monitor refresh is high enough (85hz or greater) you won't notice any frame
rate limiting.

 

[Tim2005]

if what you are saying is right.. then please explain thi


With vsync off I get 60-85 fps + (very smooth game play) but a lot o
screen tearin

with it on I get 20-42 to 85 fps mostly 42 and lower...it shutters
lo

 

[Tony DiMarzio]

I can't explain that. Something else must be wrong. Enabling Vsync should
not affect frame rates the way you've described. I could see a slight (5%...
maybe...) performance degradation, but not what you are describing.

 

[Tim2005]

dont wont to sound mean or anything but I do not think you understan
vsync.

fast answe

caps your fps to refresh rate .. so lets say you have a refresh rat
of 85.. and then your playing a game like bf2.. with vsync on ther
is a limit to which and what your fps can become.

dont know the exact numbers but its something like 2 15 42 85 fps et
et

so if you cant pull out 85 fps then you get 42 fps when you woul
without vsync get 67 fps... see what i mean

42 fps is fine but when I cant pull 42 even if its 41 fps i would ge
the next option vsync can give me which becomes very lagg

 

[First of One]

Not quite. Your instantaneous framerate, even within one second, actually
fluctates quite a bit. On one monitor refresh cycle the video card may have
a buffer swap. On the next refresh cycle the video card may miss it. So it's
quite possible to get 60-70 fps when the refresh rate is 85 Hz.

Triple-buffering increases framebuffer usage by 50%. At 1280x1024x32, 15.7
MB would be needed for the framebuffer. With 4x FSAA that swells to 63 MB.
On a 256 MB card, that's quite a significant chunk. There's a far greater
possibility the card will have to resort to AGP-texturing, especially in
games with large textures.

One way of alleviating this is of course to run a higher refresh rate. A
good 19" CRT should have no problems doing 100-120 Hz at 1024x768.

 

[Tony DiMarzio]

dont wont to sound mean or anything but I do not think you understand
vsync..

I appreciate your prefixing this statement with "don't want to sound mean or
anything". However, I do understand vsync... and very well at that. Vsync
(Vertical Synchronization), simply put, synchronizes frame-buffer swaps to
the current _vertical_ refresh rate of your monitor. The net effects of this
are:

1. Prevention of page or screen tearing (a visual artifact that occurs when
a single monitor refresh cycle is comprised of 2 or more frame buffer
outputs). Obviously the more "out-of-sync" the frame buffer swaps are with
the vertical refresh of monitor, the worse the "tearing" will be.
2. A degradation in frame-rate performance (assuming the video card can
render more frames per second at any given point than the monitor refresh
rate will allow).

fast answer

"Don't want to sound mean or anything, " but...If you already had the answer
then what was the reason for the original post?

caps your fps to refresh rate .. so lets say you have a refresh rate
of 85.. and then your playing a game like bf2.. with vsync on there
is a limit to which and what your fps can become..

Yes. V-Sync effectively sets a frame-rate ceiling equal to the vertical
refresh of the display device.

dont know the exact numbers but its something like 2 15 42 85 fps etc
etc

A 3D engine does not render at predefined frame-rate markers. In other
words, the engine doesn't say "Well, can't render at 85, so lets fall back
to 42, or cant render at 42 so lets fall back to 15." (at least it
shouldn't). A 3D engine renders the maximum frame rate possible until it
reaches a software imposed or V-Sync imposed limiter.

so if you cant pull out 85 fps then you get 42 fps when you would
without vsync get 67 fps... see what i mean?

42 fps is fine but when I cant pull 42 even if its 41 fps i would get
the next option vsync can give me which becomes very laggy

I can see where you're going with this. Your logic is that when V-Sync is
enabled, your frame-rate must be equal to some whole number that is a factor
of refresh rate. You are partially correct though. Yes, your frame-rate will
always be a factor of your refresh rate. It is mathematically impossible for
it not to be. However, the factors do not have to be whole numbers. They can
and will be fractional. In other words, just because you can't render 42.5
fps (85hz/2) doesn't mean you fall back to 28fps (85hz/3). You could very
well be (85hz/2.001). See what I mean?

 

[Tony DiMarzio]

You beat me to it!

Not quite. Your instantaneous framerate, even within one second, actually
fluctates quite a bit. On one monitor refresh cycle the video card may
have a buffer swap. On the next refresh cycle the video card may miss it.
So it's quite possible to get 60-70 fps when the refresh rate is 85 Hz.

Triple-buffering increases framebuffer usage by 50%. At 1280x1024x32, 15.7
MB would be needed for the framebuffer. With 4x FSAA that swells to 63 MB.
On a 256 MB card, that's quite a significant chunk. There's a far greater
possibility the card will have to resort to AGP-texturing, especially in
games with large textures.

One way of alleviating this is of course to run a higher refresh rate. A
good 19" CRT should have no problems doing 100-120 Hz at 1024x768.

 

[Tim2005]

hmm

I can not agree on that

I read a long topic about vsync and how it works about 2 months ago..

It was very easy to understand. Ill look for it and post back if i
find it. Vsync kills your fps for some people as I have read all over
the web.. So there is no way it is just me

Anyways this is not my question. It was about triple buffering and ati
tray tools so can we stick to the subject? I am gussing no one has any
idea?



I have done some tweaking with ati tray tools and Oc my x800xt so now
the drop fps doesnt matter as much in certain areas..

I would still like to know why it does this

 

[justin.seiferth]

Can someone describe the visual effect of screen tearing and is there a
good tutorial on the effects on memory usage and fps of monitor refresh
and buffering? I guess trial and error is one way of optimizing card
performance but I'd prefer to be knowledgeable enough to get close to
optimum up front.

 

[First of One]

Consider the possibility that triple-buffering under D3D may be broken in
the current ATi drivers. It's definitely a good reason why the option is not
available in the standard driver panels.

 

[Tim2005]

i didnt find the post i was talking about but something like it



http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?s=&threadid=33699972&highlight=triple+buffering


very helpful


I went into the bf2 folders and found a way to work around the force
triple buffering problems.. but still have work to do on it

 

[First of One]

Helpful? The thread regurgitates incorrect information.

BTW, I still run 2x 12 MB Voodoo2 SLI in a secondary rig for older games.
3dfx "pioneered" triple-buffering, yet the option is *only available in
Glide and OpenGL*.

 

[Tim2005]

i was not posting to help you. That info was for myself


I dont know what your issues are?

but triple buffering now works in All my d3d games.
In certain games triple buffering gave me graphic issues etc but
already knew it wouldnt work for ever game i have

Also finding ways around it using ati tray tools tweak options and
also Rage3D Tweak 3.9 options.. so now in bf2 my fps doesnt drop as
much.

I am gussing it has to do with memory being how bf2 uses so much of
it.


its 3 in the morning lol im going to bed