Linux VS MS

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Citydesk

is it important for you to watch fight between MS and Linux? if it is,
why? competition increases the quality, softly said. I have used MS
for years, and still goes. Now one of my computers (i call it test PC)
I have been trying other OS. Dreamlinux, Knoppix, Ubuntu... etc...
Most stable linux disturb I have ever used is that ubuntu festy! you
will simply realize if you take a time and try. Many DELL PCs now come
to you with installed ubuntu.
 
I have a dual boot between Vista/Ubuntu Studio (I upgraded from Feisty).
I'm brand new to Linux - and never thought I'd ever be doing it. So I can't
compare Ubuntu to earlier versions, and first let me say I'm fascinated with
Linux and I'm liking it, but I can also share some facts that I've
discovered about Linux that the Linux cats don't shout too much about:
- What time is it now? 3:42 am ok. well,....when things work, it's great.
But there are maaaany hardware compatability issues...Just spend a week on
the forums as I have. I've downloaded a new driver just released for my
Epson RX580 (I'm lucky that a driver is available). I've installed the
driver but there are unknown configuration issues that are keeping Ubuntu
from recognizing the printer. I've searched all over the net for 2 days -
no answers as yet. No support - and I'm getting few, if any, forum
responses, but Not because no one wants to help. It's more probable that no
one knows the answers. I'm wondering if that is more the reality than
people are willing to admit about the Linux community. It's all open source,
but that also means it's a work in progress. Money does have a way of
forcing people to make deadlines and find solutions. Think about that when
it comes to software and driver fixes.
- Synaptic keypads go wild on Both my laptops - I can barely fill out a form
with either of my laptops, or do a short forum post for that matter. My
cursor jumps to other areas; things get clicked that I didn't click. It's a
quick path to intense frustration. Again, I've read many posts, and posted
myself several times...no clear answers...It's possible that no one knows
the answers there either.
- One Linuxarion shared his experience with me of not having a driver for
some hardware and the only driver he finally found was made by a guy in
Germany, but there was no support or instructions - he had to compile and
configure the driver himself with no manual.

I could go on,....the next subject would be wireless issues, but I have to
sleep. As much as I like fooling around with Linux, I am losing sleep over
it. There is a real sense of accomplishment, however, when you do solve an
issue on Linux. It teaches you a lot about your computer, and when it's set,
it feels really satisfying. But I'm not sure I'll have the time to set
everything right the way I want it. This could take months.

Hopefully I'll have more satisfaction tomorrow; booting into Vista these
days sometimes feels like a wonderful fantasy in comparison. The graphics
are lovely and all my critical applications work,...Frank B.
 
Frank Bright said:
I have a dual boot between Vista/Ubuntu Studio (I upgraded from Feisty).
I'm brand new to Linux - and never thought I'd ever be doing it. So I
can't compare Ubuntu to earlier versions, and first let me say I'm
fascinated with Linux and I'm liking it, but I can also share some facts
that I've discovered about Linux that the Linux cats don't shout too much
about:
- What time is it now? 3:42 am ok. well,....when things work, it's great.
But there are maaaany hardware compatability issues...Just spend a week on
the forums as I have. I've downloaded a new driver just released for my
Epson RX580 (I'm lucky that a driver is available). I've installed the
driver but there are unknown configuration issues that are keeping Ubuntu
from recognizing the printer. I've searched all over the net for 2 days -
no answers as yet. No support - and I'm getting few, if any, forum
responses, but Not because no one wants to help. It's more probable that
no one knows the answers. I'm wondering if that is more the reality than
people are willing to admit about the Linux community. It's all open
source, but that also means it's a work in progress. Money does have a way
of forcing people to make deadlines and find solutions. Think about that
when it comes to software and driver fixes.
- Synaptic keypads go wild on Both my laptops - I can barely fill out a
form with either of my laptops, or do a short forum post for that matter.
My cursor jumps to other areas; things get clicked that I didn't click.
It's a quick path to intense frustration. Again, I've read many posts, and
posted myself several times...no clear answers...It's possible that no one
knows the answers there either.
- One Linuxarion shared his experience with me of not having a driver for
some hardware and the only driver he finally found was made by a guy in
Germany, but there was no support or instructions - he had to compile and
configure the driver himself with no manual.

I could go on,....the next subject would be wireless issues, but I have to
sleep. As much as I like fooling around with Linux, I am losing sleep over
it. There is a real sense of accomplishment, however, when you do solve an
issue on Linux. It teaches you a lot about your computer, and when it's
set, it feels really satisfying. But I'm not sure I'll have the time to
set everything right the way I want it. This could take months.

Hopefully I'll have more satisfaction tomorrow; booting into Vista these
days sometimes feels like a wonderful fantasy in comparison. The graphics
are lovely and all my critical applications work,...Frank B.


Haha, hoho hehe, ROFLMAO! I feel your pain! ...And joy too... IMHO, Linux is
NOT ready for mainstream users. ...That is to say, the general user. I feel
it VERY irresponsible to be luring, (Or attempting to), the clueless to it.
That is not to say they, (Clueless), are unintelligent by any means, just
not tech savvy enough to use it completely. Sure, the Distros come bundled
with tons of usable software, that even the "clueless" can work with, but it
stops there.

I put off testing Linux for a LONG time because I heard from so many
that it takes too much "grey matter" and TIME to bother with. Finally, I
heard some good things about it, and that it had improved greatly. Ok, cool,
I give'er a try. Why not? I'm all for anything alternative I can install on
some of my computers so I don't have to pay lots of $$'s for, and of course
the alleged security etc. So here we go, I got a copy of Suse, (Highly
recommended by my tech brother), and proceeded to install. The installation
went better than expected, which I was glad for. I had nightmares of
horrific install probs, but it went well, so cool. I input what information
was asked of me, during install, but I had to guess at a few items, and the
"help" files were written in such a way that I felt they assumed I already
knew all about Linux and how to use it. Sadly later on, I was to find that
this is the norm for help.

I was impressed how easy it found and connected to my network, and the
internet, but that was the only easy part. When it came to connecting to
shared printers, I had a horrific time getting that done. Again, the help
assumed I already knew all about Linux, it's commands, and procedures. But,
I am not one to give up very easily and figured it out and have my printer
on a Hawking server working and one shared on another XP computer working.
Wooo Hooo! I prevailed! Wow! What a sense of accomplishment! However, during
the whole ordeal, and many cuss words, I couldn't help but think about how
much easier it is to set up print sharing on a windows machine, and how much
of a horrific nightmare task it would be for the general user on Linux.

Alrighty then, I was set up enough to goof off with it. I liked the KDE
desktop better so stayed with it. Stuff was quite similar to windows in the
way the interface works, so that wasn't at all hard to get used to. Hey, I
like this! I set up Gaim for chatting because I liked it better. Uh Oh, no
sound in Gaim? Ok Started checking help files, turns out I needed another
little file or two. Hmmm should be easy enough. THEN I started to read the
"how to." I gotta wa? Compile wa? Open a wa terminal? WTF Shouldn't I just
be able to download it and click on it and have it install it's self? NOPE
Not only will it not do it it's self, but the how to was, AGAIN, written as
if I knew all about Linux and it's commands. Ok, again I prevailed and got
the sound going. Woo Hoo! Another sense of accomplishment!

So played with Open Office and a bunch of other things, and was fun. Ok so I
wanted to get the latest greatest ver of Firefox, cuz hmmm, can't view video
on my fave news web sites, maybe I need to update, and get addons. Ok they
have been around a long time, and belong to the Church of Linux, should be a
snap to install. NOT! It too was not a simple download, click and install. I
had to jump through several hoops, and finally by trial and error and
logical thinking, got it done. But nope, no video on certain web sites.
Dang! no plug-in to view sites using media player! WTF again! Ok, maybe
there is a work around, but I have grown tired of the fight for now.

During all this, I found that I had a video driver problem, and get funny
graphics on the top of window bars. Ok not bad, and certainly livable, but
I'm a perfectionist, and it bothers me. Searched and searched, read and
read, and have grown tired of that too, as I have found nothing to fix it.

Ok, I'll refrain form writing ALL the problems I have encountered as this
has grown too long as it is. Although I really like the OS, I simply cannot
see the general user having a good, or even better, (As stated by the Linux
preachers), experience than windows. As with MANY, (Most?) users, I want to
turn my computer on and use it. I want an upgrade of a browser, or any
software to install it's self with out having to learn how to compile, learn
an OS language and it's commands, just to use it in a general fashion. Have
had similar driver problems on some of my windows machines, and after, oh,
maybe 30 - 40 min max of searching, no problem, got the driver, problem
fixed.

I too boot back into XP or Vista, and breath a sigh of relief. I watch for
Linux to continue to get better, but it just ain't ready for mainstream...
Yet... I'll continue to play with it, and have some fun at times when I
don't want to install anything, but as far as it becoming my mainstay?
NEVER! Not right now as it is anyway...

Oh, and just so you can't say I have only tried one, and give it all a bad
rap, yes I have tried Fedora, Red Hat, Knoppix, etc.

Cheers
 
Me said:
Haha, hoho hehe, ROFLMAO! I feel your pain! ...And joy too... IMHO, Linux
is NOT ready for mainstream users. ...That is to say, the general user. I
feel it VERY irresponsible to be luring, (Or attempting to), the clueless
to it. That is not to say they, (Clueless), are unintelligent by any
means, just not tech savvy enough to use it completely. Sure, the Distros
come bundled with tons of usable software, that even the "clueless" can
work with, but it stops there.

I put off testing Linux for a LONG time because I heard from so many
that it takes too much "grey matter" and TIME to bother with. Finally, I
heard some good things about it, and that it had improved greatly. Ok,
cool, I give'er a try. Why not? I'm all for anything alternative I can
install on some of my computers so I don't have to pay lots of $$'s for,
and of course the alleged security etc. So here we go, I got a copy of
Suse, (Highly recommended by my tech brother), and proceeded to install.
The installation went better than expected, which I was glad for. I had
nightmares of horrific install probs, but it went well, so cool. I input
what information was asked of me, during install, but I had to guess at a
few items, and the "help" files were written in such a way that I felt
they assumed I already knew all about Linux and how to use it. Sadly later
on, I was to find that this is the norm for help.

I was impressed how easy it found and connected to my network, and the
internet, but that was the only easy part. When it came to connecting to
shared printers, I had a horrific time getting that done. Again, the help
assumed I already knew all about Linux, it's commands, and procedures.
But, I am not one to give up very easily and figured it out and have my
printer on a Hawking server working and one shared on another XP computer
working. Wooo Hooo! I prevailed! Wow! What a sense of accomplishment!
However, during the whole ordeal, and many cuss words, I couldn't help but
think about how much easier it is to set up print sharing on a windows
machine, and how much of a horrific nightmare task it would be for the
general user on Linux.

Alrighty then, I was set up enough to goof off with it. I liked the KDE
desktop better so stayed with it. Stuff was quite similar to windows in
the way the interface works, so that wasn't at all hard to get used to.
Hey, I like this! I set up Gaim for chatting because I liked it better. Uh
Oh, no sound in Gaim? Ok Started checking help files, turns out I needed
another little file or two. Hmmm should be easy enough. THEN I started to
read the "how to." I gotta wa? Compile wa? Open a wa terminal? WTF
Shouldn't I just be able to download it and click on it and have it
install it's self? NOPE Not only will it not do it it's self, but the how
to was, AGAIN, written as if I knew all about Linux and it's commands. Ok,
again I prevailed and got the sound going. Woo Hoo! Another sense of
accomplishment!

So played with Open Office and a bunch of other things, and was fun. Ok so
I wanted to get the latest greatest ver of Firefox, cuz hmmm, can't view
video on my fave news web sites, maybe I need to update, and get addons.
Ok they have been around a long time, and belong to the Church of Linux,
should be a snap to install. NOT! It too was not a simple download, click
and install. I had to jump through several hoops, and finally by trial and
error and logical thinking, got it done. But nope, no video on certain web
sites. Dang! no plug-in to view sites using media player! WTF again! Ok,
maybe there is a work around, but I have grown tired of the fight for now.

During all this, I found that I had a video driver problem, and get funny
graphics on the top of window bars. Ok not bad, and certainly livable, but
I'm a perfectionist, and it bothers me. Searched and searched, read and
read, and have grown tired of that too, as I have found nothing to fix it.

Ok, I'll refrain form writing ALL the problems I have encountered as this
has grown too long as it is. Although I really like the OS, I simply
cannot see the general user having a good, or even better, (As stated by
the Linux preachers), experience than windows. As with MANY, (Most?)
users, I want to turn my computer on and use it. I want an upgrade of a
browser, or any software to install it's self with out having to learn how
to compile, learn an OS language and it's commands, just to use it in a
general fashion. Have had similar driver problems on some of my windows
machines, and after, oh, maybe 30 - 40 min max of searching, no problem,
got the driver, problem fixed.

I too boot back into XP or Vista, and breath a sigh of relief. I watch for
Linux to continue to get better, but it just ain't ready for mainstream...
Yet... I'll continue to play with it, and have some fun at times when I
don't want to install anything, but as far as it becoming my mainstay?
NEVER! Not right now as it is anyway...

Oh, and just so you can't say I have only tried one, and give it all a bad
rap, yes I have tried Fedora, Red Hat, Knoppix, etc.

Cheers

I am a Linux user and would have to agree its not really ready. I used to be
all on the Linux band wagon but I have to say that there are still some very
basic but major problems. Many lay in display drivers and Media capabilities
The biggest problem is not hardware compatibility that is actually better
then Windows but mostly because they never take stuff out of the kernel.
As I pointed out display is buggy especially in Fedora and Ubuntu I have
noticed and could rarely get dual head. In openSUSE I could get things
working so if I were to recommend a Linux I would say go with SUSE.
 
I can't say that I disagree.
But for a business use computer, with a tech guy setting it up, and users
not allowed to install all their little toys, Linux isn't all that bad.
For web access, email & running business software, it seems to work fine.
For the typical home user, who is always downloading programs & wanting to
change things, Linux is probably not a good idea (unless they have their
geek glasses & pocket protectors handy).
 
Nicholas said:
I am a Linux user and would have to agree its not really ready. I used to
be all on the Linux band wagon but I have to say that there are still some
very basic but major problems. Many lay in display drivers and Media
capabilities The biggest problem is not hardware compatibility that is
actually better then Windows but mostly because they never take stuff out
of the kernel. As I pointed out display is buggy especially in Fedora and
Ubuntu I have noticed and could rarely get dual head. In openSUSE I could
get things working so if I were to recommend a Linux I would say go with
SUSE.

Hmm that's funny. I've run both single and dual head with no problems.
Currently running a single 8800 GTX with two displays attached, my second
display is a Plasma TV for my multimedia needs.

Anything and everything multimedia I do from my Ubuntu (7.04) system without
a problem. Windows on the other hand dropped off a cliff as far as
multimedia concerned as nVidia's driver no longer has the ability to do
full screen video overlay on a secondary display.

--
Stephan
2003 Yamaha R6

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Hi


When a company makes a piece of hardware they are lazy and they don't want
to write drivers for it now they are forced because otherwise no one will
use it so they invest money to write a windows driver thinking that people
will use it! Now there is a growing minority that is beginning to use Linux
now being that it is an entirely different OS so it needs new drivers! Now
for networking in the big world there is nothing better then Linux and Unix
because the interfaces are all the same and the company's that make it
produce Linux binaries!


This being said instead of blaming Linux for not having drivers from 3rd
partys blaim the companys! Anything that is done on Linux driver dev is all
charity!

James
 
James Matthews said:
Hi


When a company makes a piece of hardware they are lazy and they don't want
to write drivers for it now they are forced because otherwise no one will
use it so they invest money to write a windows driver thinking that people
will use it! Now there is a growing minority that is beginning to use
Linux now being that it is an entirely different OS so it needs new
drivers! Now for networking in the big world there is nothing better then
Linux and Unix because the interfaces are all the same and the company's
that make it produce Linux binaries!


This being said instead of blaming Linux for not having drivers from 3rd
partys blaim the companys! Anything that is done on Linux driver dev is
all charity!

James

Well, don't get me wrong, I didn't mean to insinuate that Linux is the party
at fault for a driver problem. I know full well where the blame goes. My
point was to share some of my FIRST experience with the OS, (About a year
ago), and thus show my personal view that it isn't ready for the general
user. I can agree that in a business environment, where the IT guys can take
care of the problems, it will do well. A couple servers at my work have it
installed. (Print server and internet server. Hehe, but not the mainframe) I
also stated that I like it, and I will continue to test, monitor it's
progress, and try out different flavors. Once I see that it is mature enough
for the general user, and he/she can use it without having to learn how to
compile, type cryptic commands just to start and stop a service or install a
program, etc, etc, etc, and drivers become more plentiful, I then may join
the Church of Linux, and sing it's praises. BUT NOT inappropriately in
someone else's unrelated news group, disrupting and annoying people as some
do, and some even worse with their snotty, talking down to you, rude, self
important remarks. It's OK that one likes Linux, and likes it better than
Windows, but quit trying to SHOVE it down people's throats. (i.e.) "The fix
for your problem is to install Ubuntu, cuz it's better. Windows SUCKS.
"Hugh? what the heck did that have to do with my Windows question?" (Sorry
just had to add my other observation, and disgust)


Cheers

<Snip>
 
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