D
Daze N. Knights
Yes, I believe that is from family members only.
Tom said:
is this real ? MS giving free Vista and Office for viewing webcasts ??
D
Daze N. Knights
I want as little to do with the IRS as possible, too. I think that is a
*very* widely-shared feeling.
I'm wondering why you would claim (to the IRS, I assume you mean) that
your vacation had a greater value than the "estimated retail value"
given on the form (that, again I assume you mean, was reported to the
IRS)? Doing that would only cost you more taxes, so I think I must be
misunderstanding you here . . .
*very* widely-shared feeling.
I'm wondering why you would claim (to the IRS, I assume you mean) that
your vacation had a greater value than the "estimated retail value"
given on the form (that, again I assume you mean, was reported to the
IRS)? Doing that would only cost you more taxes, so I think I must be
misunderstanding you here . . .
D
DCR
Whatever, it is called -- gift, prize, stuff, etc. -- it IS taxable, as acknowledged on the web
site. (Where it also says that only if you receive both Office and Vista, they will report to the
IRS.) Calling a turd gold does not make it gold.
As to sales tax, at least here in NY, you have to explain any extra "income". And just this past
year a new line was added for sales tax due on items purchased out of state, "prizes", or anything
else that is subject to unpaid sales tax. Also, we here in NY, file one form for both city and state
and also report the amount of federal taxable income on that form.
In other words -- been there, done that
| I'm calling it a "gift," because Microsoft is calling it a "gift." What
| else the IRS might call it, I don't know, but it's kind of hard to
| imagine describing it as anything other than what the giver of the
| product describes it as. I'm not employed by MS, so I can't describe it
| as income derived from employment. Nor am I self-employed as a webcast
| viewer
|
| As to the sales tax business. If you were given a free vacation, *who*
| asked for and collected sales taxes from you? It wasn't the IRS, because
| they don't deal with sales taxes. Sales taxes, whether state or local,
| are normally requested and collected by the seller of the goods at the
| time of purchase. Did the giver of your free vacation assign their own
| value to the vacation and charge you sales taxes on it, or what? I can't
| imagine how that would work: Getting charged for, and having to pay,
| sales taxes on something that hasn't been purchased.
|
|
|
| DCR wrote:
| > | I don't see how paying sales taxes apply to gifts. For my gifts from MS,
| > | I will not have to pay state or local sales taxes, because I didn't
| > | purchase the items and MS didn't sell them to me.
| >
| > Not really a "gift" -- you viewed presentations in order to receive the item.
| > I did not purchase my vacation, nor did anyone sell it to me, but I DID have to pay state
income,
| > local income AND state sales and local sales tax.
| > Just my experience though.
| >
| >
site. (Where it also says that only if you receive both Office and Vista, they will report to the
IRS.) Calling a turd gold does not make it gold.
As to sales tax, at least here in NY, you have to explain any extra "income". And just this past
year a new line was added for sales tax due on items purchased out of state, "prizes", or anything
else that is subject to unpaid sales tax. Also, we here in NY, file one form for both city and state
and also report the amount of federal taxable income on that form.
In other words -- been there, done that
| I'm calling it a "gift," because Microsoft is calling it a "gift." What
| else the IRS might call it, I don't know, but it's kind of hard to
| imagine describing it as anything other than what the giver of the
| product describes it as. I'm not employed by MS, so I can't describe it
| as income derived from employment. Nor am I self-employed as a webcast
| viewer
|
| As to the sales tax business. If you were given a free vacation, *who*
| asked for and collected sales taxes from you? It wasn't the IRS, because
| they don't deal with sales taxes. Sales taxes, whether state or local,
| are normally requested and collected by the seller of the goods at the
| time of purchase. Did the giver of your free vacation assign their own
| value to the vacation and charge you sales taxes on it, or what? I can't
| imagine how that would work: Getting charged for, and having to pay,
| sales taxes on something that hasn't been purchased.
|
|
|
| DCR wrote:
| > | I don't see how paying sales taxes apply to gifts. For my gifts from MS,
| > | I will not have to pay state or local sales taxes, because I didn't
| > | purchase the items and MS didn't sell them to me.
| >
| > Not really a "gift" -- you viewed presentations in order to receive the item.
| > I did not purchase my vacation, nor did anyone sell it to me, but I DID have to pay state
income,
| > local income AND state sales and local sales tax.
| > Just my experience though.
| >
| >
D
DCR
Sorry, I meant to say that the "estimated retail value" was much, much M O R E ...
|I want as little to do with the IRS as possible, too. I think that is a
| *very* widely-shared feeling.
|
| I'm wondering why you would claim (to the IRS, I assume you mean) that
| your vacation had a greater value than the "estimated retail value"
| given on the form (that, again I assume you mean, was reported to the
| IRS)? Doing that would only cost you more taxes, so I think I must be
| misunderstanding you here . . .
|
| DCR wrote:
| > Quantas also mailed me a copy of the IRS reporting form (I don't remember the form number) so I
know
| > it WAS reported to the IRS.
| > The "estimated retail value" on the form was much, much less than I claimed, but so far at least
the
| > IRS seems to have accepted my estimate
| > $798 seems trivial in comparison, but I, for one, want as little to do with the IRS as possible.
| >
| >
| > | > | Naturally. So I, for one, would certainly want to handle it in a way
| > | that would be deemed satisfactory to the IRS *if* I happened to be (God
| > | forbid) audited.
| > |
| > | DCR wrote:
| > | > I would think that since it MUST and WILL be reported to the IRS, red flags would be raised,
| > whether
| > | > or not one is being considered for an audit, and it could even trigger an audit.
| > | >
| > | > | > | > | Well, of course one can claim less than retail. One can also not report
| > | > | the gifts at all. The question is what could one expect to be
| > | > | satisfactory to the IRS if one should be chosen for an audit?
| > | > |
| > | > | Roscoe wrote:
| > | > | >
| > | > | > | > | > | >>
| > | > | >>
| > | > | >> DCR wrote:
| > | > | >>> As to declaring the value of your "gift"...
| > | > | >>>
| > | > | >>> Two years ago I won a very nice trip to Australia, my tax preparer
| > | > | >>> said I would have to declare the "fair market value" as extra income.
| > | > | >>> If I could find an equal or better equivalent of the same trip I
| > | > | >>> could use that amount for tax purposes. The provider of the trip was
| > | > | >>> required by law to report to the IRS my winnings, so there was no way
| > | > | >>> to avoid taxes, but I did find a legitimate equivalent at a lower price.
| > | > | >>
| > | > | >> So, if one can find Vista Business and/or Office Pro advertised on
| > | > | >> sale somewhere for less than MS's declared value of them, one can save
| > | > | >> the ad for one's records and declare the sale price as the value for
| > | > | >> income tax purposes . . . ? And I wonder if one needs to factor in
| > | > | >> whatever sales taxes and/or shipping costs would have been involved in
| > | > | >> getting the products from the advertiser if one had obtained the
| > | > | >> products that way?
| > | > | >
| > | > | > Of course, this assumes that anyone will ever actually receive the
| > | > | > software.
| > | > | >
| > | > | > I see no reason why you couldn't claim lesser than retail. Nobody pays
| > | > | > retail anymore, for anything... (except the government which pays
| > | > | > exponentially over retail).
| > | > | >
| > | > | >
| > | > | >
| > | >
| > | >
| >
| >
|I want as little to do with the IRS as possible, too. I think that is a
| *very* widely-shared feeling.
|
| I'm wondering why you would claim (to the IRS, I assume you mean) that
| your vacation had a greater value than the "estimated retail value"
| given on the form (that, again I assume you mean, was reported to the
| IRS)? Doing that would only cost you more taxes, so I think I must be
| misunderstanding you here . . .
|
| DCR wrote:
| > Quantas also mailed me a copy of the IRS reporting form (I don't remember the form number) so I
know
| > it WAS reported to the IRS.
| > The "estimated retail value" on the form was much, much less than I claimed, but so far at least
the
| > IRS seems to have accepted my estimate
| > $798 seems trivial in comparison, but I, for one, want as little to do with the IRS as possible.
| >
| >
| > | > | Naturally. So I, for one, would certainly want to handle it in a way
| > | that would be deemed satisfactory to the IRS *if* I happened to be (God
| > | forbid) audited.
| > |
| > | DCR wrote:
| > | > I would think that since it MUST and WILL be reported to the IRS, red flags would be raised,
| > whether
| > | > or not one is being considered for an audit, and it could even trigger an audit.
| > | >
| > | > | > | > | Well, of course one can claim less than retail. One can also not report
| > | > | the gifts at all. The question is what could one expect to be
| > | > | satisfactory to the IRS if one should be chosen for an audit?
| > | > |
| > | > | Roscoe wrote:
| > | > | >
| > | > | > | > | > | >>
| > | > | >>
| > | > | >> DCR wrote:
| > | > | >>> As to declaring the value of your "gift"...
| > | > | >>>
| > | > | >>> Two years ago I won a very nice trip to Australia, my tax preparer
| > | > | >>> said I would have to declare the "fair market value" as extra income.
| > | > | >>> If I could find an equal or better equivalent of the same trip I
| > | > | >>> could use that amount for tax purposes. The provider of the trip was
| > | > | >>> required by law to report to the IRS my winnings, so there was no way
| > | > | >>> to avoid taxes, but I did find a legitimate equivalent at a lower price.
| > | > | >>
| > | > | >> So, if one can find Vista Business and/or Office Pro advertised on
| > | > | >> sale somewhere for less than MS's declared value of them, one can save
| > | > | >> the ad for one's records and declare the sale price as the value for
| > | > | >> income tax purposes . . . ? And I wonder if one needs to factor in
| > | > | >> whatever sales taxes and/or shipping costs would have been involved in
| > | > | >> getting the products from the advertiser if one had obtained the
| > | > | >> products that way?
| > | > | >
| > | > | > Of course, this assumes that anyone will ever actually receive the
| > | > | > software.
| > | > | >
| > | > | > I see no reason why you couldn't claim lesser than retail. Nobody pays
| > | > | > retail anymore, for anything... (except the government which pays
| > | > | > exponentially over retail).
| > | > | >
| > | > | >
| > | > | >
| > | >
| > | >
| >
| >
D
Daze N. Knights
DCR said:
Thanks for your clarifications.
D
Daze N. Knights
Ah. Makes much MORE sense now. Thanks for this clarification, as well.
J
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
Anyone having concerns about taxes should consult someone who specializes in
the appropriate taxes.
What applies one place may not apply somewhere else even if the two places
seem close.
From what I have read in this thread, no one really has authoritative
information that can be counted on to protect anyone in case of an IRS
audit.
Proceed accordingly.
the appropriate taxes.
What applies one place may not apply somewhere else even if the two places
seem close.
From what I have read in this thread, no one really has authoritative
information that can be counted on to protect anyone in case of an IRS
audit.
Proceed accordingly.
D
Daze N. Knights
Of course.
J
John Barnes
IRS Publication 525 defines fair market value as
Fair market value. The fair market value of
a prize is determined by all the facts and circumstances. It is the amount
you would have
to pay a third party to buy or lease the prize.
This is determined without regard to:
.. Your perceived value of the prize, or
.. The amount your grantor paid for the
prize.
Fair market value. The fair market value of
a prize is determined by all the facts and circumstances. It is the amount
you would have
to pay a third party to buy or lease the prize.
This is determined without regard to:
.. Your perceived value of the prize, or
.. The amount your grantor paid for the
prize.
R
Roscoe
This would indicate you don't have to include sales tax, since you can
buy/lease products online from third party vendors without incurring sales
tax.
buy/lease products online from third party vendors without incurring sales
tax.
D
Daze N. Knights
That would be true for the IRS. However, it is possible one's State or
Local income tax filings might include a bit about sales tax owed on
gifts received. So one would have to watch for that on State and Local.
Local income tax filings might include a bit about sales tax owed on
gifts received. So one would have to watch for that on State and Local.
D
DCR
Yes, it DOES depend on where you are located.
Sales tax does apply here in NY. Including thing bought out of state.
| That would be true for the IRS. However, it is possible one's State or
| Local income tax filings might include a bit about sales tax owed on
| gifts received. So one would have to watch for that on State and Local.
|
|
| Roscoe wrote:
| > This would indicate you don't have to include sales tax, since you can
| > buy/lease products online from third party vendors without incurring
| > sales tax.
| >
| >
| > | >> IRS Publication 525 defines fair market value as
| >>
| >> Fair market value. The fair market value of
| >> a prize is determined by all the facts and circumstances. It is the
| >> amount you would have
| >> to pay a third party to buy or lease the prize.
| >> This is determined without regard to:
| >> . Your perceived value of the prize, or
| >> . The amount your grantor paid for the
| >> prize.
| >>
| >> | >>> Anyone having concerns about taxes should consult someone who
| >>> specializes in the appropriate taxes.
| >>> What applies one place may not apply somewhere else even if the two
| >>> places seem close.
| >>> From what I have read in this thread, no one really has authoritative
| >>> information that can be counted on to protect anyone in case of an
| >>> IRS audit.
| >>> Proceed accordingly.
| >>>
| >>> --
| >>> Jupiter Jones [MVP]
| >>> http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
| >>> http://www.dts-l.org
| >>>
| >>>
| >>> | >>>> My guess is that, when filing your income tax forms in 2008 (for
| >>>> 2007), you'll have to declare the declared (by MS) value of your
| >>>> gifts as income earned during 2007 (which will be when you receive
| >>>> your gifts). But since, as MS says, "IRS rules require that any gift
| >>>> over $600 is taxable" (Colin evidently got the amount a bit wrong in
| >>>> his post), I don't know if you'll have to declare the full combined
| >>>> value of around $798 ($499 for Office plus $299 for Vista Business)
| >>>> or only the amount exceeding $600 (which would be around $198), as I
| >>>> have never had to declare a "gift" for income tax purposes before.
| >>>> (I'm going to have to face this issue myself.) But the amount
| >>>> (whatever it is) will have to be included by you (or your tax
| >>>> preparer) as additional income for 2007, and you will be required by
| >>>> law to pay income taxes on that amount just as if you'd earned that
| >>>> amount of money working for it.
| >>>>
| >>>> Another question of interest to me on this subject is, what if you
| >>>> intend to use your gifts in your business and (at least plausibly)
| >>>> would have gone out and purchased Vista and Office anyway for your
| >>>> business computer? In the latter case, the full retail cost
| >>>> (including sales tax) could be deemed a business expense for income
| >>>> tax purposes. In this case, however, the actual cost to someone such
| >>>> as myself will be the cost of whatever additional income taxes I am
| >>>> required to pay as a result of receiving these (otherwise free)
| >>>> gifts. I'm wondering if there's some way to write off the additional
| >>>> tax expense against my business income . . . ?
| >>>>
| >>>> Unless there's a tax expert among us, we'll likely have to wait
| >>>> until tax time in 2008 to see just how much our "free" gifts
| >>>> actually cost us, but it is hard to see how, even after the tax
| >>>> expense, we will not be able to see our gifts as a really good deal
| >>>> for the price.
| >>>
| >>
| >
Sales tax does apply here in NY. Including thing bought out of state.
| That would be true for the IRS. However, it is possible one's State or
| Local income tax filings might include a bit about sales tax owed on
| gifts received. So one would have to watch for that on State and Local.
|
|
| Roscoe wrote:
| > This would indicate you don't have to include sales tax, since you can
| > buy/lease products online from third party vendors without incurring
| > sales tax.
| >
| >
| > | >> IRS Publication 525 defines fair market value as
| >>
| >> Fair market value. The fair market value of
| >> a prize is determined by all the facts and circumstances. It is the
| >> amount you would have
| >> to pay a third party to buy or lease the prize.
| >> This is determined without regard to:
| >> . Your perceived value of the prize, or
| >> . The amount your grantor paid for the
| >> prize.
| >>
| >> | >>> Anyone having concerns about taxes should consult someone who
| >>> specializes in the appropriate taxes.
| >>> What applies one place may not apply somewhere else even if the two
| >>> places seem close.
| >>> From what I have read in this thread, no one really has authoritative
| >>> information that can be counted on to protect anyone in case of an
| >>> IRS audit.
| >>> Proceed accordingly.
| >>>
| >>> --
| >>> Jupiter Jones [MVP]
| >>> http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
| >>> http://www.dts-l.org
| >>>
| >>>
| >>> | >>>> My guess is that, when filing your income tax forms in 2008 (for
| >>>> 2007), you'll have to declare the declared (by MS) value of your
| >>>> gifts as income earned during 2007 (which will be when you receive
| >>>> your gifts). But since, as MS says, "IRS rules require that any gift
| >>>> over $600 is taxable" (Colin evidently got the amount a bit wrong in
| >>>> his post), I don't know if you'll have to declare the full combined
| >>>> value of around $798 ($499 for Office plus $299 for Vista Business)
| >>>> or only the amount exceeding $600 (which would be around $198), as I
| >>>> have never had to declare a "gift" for income tax purposes before.
| >>>> (I'm going to have to face this issue myself.) But the amount
| >>>> (whatever it is) will have to be included by you (or your tax
| >>>> preparer) as additional income for 2007, and you will be required by
| >>>> law to pay income taxes on that amount just as if you'd earned that
| >>>> amount of money working for it.
| >>>>
| >>>> Another question of interest to me on this subject is, what if you
| >>>> intend to use your gifts in your business and (at least plausibly)
| >>>> would have gone out and purchased Vista and Office anyway for your
| >>>> business computer? In the latter case, the full retail cost
| >>>> (including sales tax) could be deemed a business expense for income
| >>>> tax purposes. In this case, however, the actual cost to someone such
| >>>> as myself will be the cost of whatever additional income taxes I am
| >>>> required to pay as a result of receiving these (otherwise free)
| >>>> gifts. I'm wondering if there's some way to write off the additional
| >>>> tax expense against my business income . . . ?
| >>>>
| >>>> Unless there's a tax expert among us, we'll likely have to wait
| >>>> until tax time in 2008 to see just how much our "free" gifts
| >>>> actually cost us, but it is hard to see how, even after the tax
| >>>> expense, we will not be able to see our gifts as a really good deal
| >>>> for the price.
| >>>
| >>
| >
P
Paul
My free copy of Vista Business finally came in today's mail, a full week
before the "official release"; I'll install it tonight.
before the "official release"; I'll install it tonight.
G
Guest
yep
I got vista business and office '07
MS rulz
Thank you
I got vista business and office '07
MS rulz
Thank you