Is there some software to save drivers to disk?


C

casey.o

In one of my most recent posts on here, I want to reinstall XP Home.
Rather than chance losing everything on the original drive, (and since
the 20g drive is too small anyhow), I'm just gonna unplug that drive,
and installanother hard drive, probably 40g or if I have to buy one on
ebay, maybe an 80g.

Anyhow, there are no restore files on the H.D. It has a second
partition (5g) but it was nearly empty, and contained nothing useful.

So, I only have my XP Home SP2 commercial CD to install from, to this
Compac computer. WThis leaves me driverless, as far as the mainboard
drivers. I went to the Compac site, which is really HP. They have the
drivers for the sound card, video, modem, mouse, and a few others, but
NOT for the mainboard. I did download all those others, but I still
dont have the mainboard drivers, which means I may as well not even try
to install it.

As I said before, this current install of XP was full of malware, and
since I have found there are a few obsolete items in the registry which
I can not remove. (something about a string being too long), so that
registry is semi-****ed. However it does boot fine, and I removed all
the malware and junk on the drive.

This leads me to the question, is there soem sort of software I can
download that will go thru my current installation, and find all the
drivers, and copy them to a floppy or USB Flash drive? This seems like
something that would be useful....... Or, do I just search for *.INF and
copy every .INF file on the H.D. to my flash drive?

Thanks
 
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B

BillW50

In one of my most recent posts on here, I want to reinstall XP Home.
Rather than chance losing everything on the original drive, (and since
the 20g drive is too small anyhow), I'm just gonna unplug that drive,
and installanother hard drive, probably 40g or if I have to buy one on
ebay, maybe an 80g.

Yes most of my XP use 60 to 80GB drives (a few has 320GB). But you can
get by with a lot less. My Asus EeePC 701 has XP SP2 on 4GB. Although I
don't think you can install it in 4GB, just image to it.
Anyhow, there are no restore files on the H.D. It has a second
partition (5g) but it was nearly empty, and contained nothing useful.

Well sometimes they try to be tricky and maybe it just looks that way.
They could hide things not shown in the directory and may not be counted
in the free space either.
So, I only have my XP Home SP2 commercial CD to install from, to this
Compac computer. WThis leaves me driverless, as far as the mainboard
drivers. I went to the Compac site, which is really HP. They have the
drivers for the sound card, video, modem, mouse, and a few others, but
NOT for the mainboard. I did download all those others, but I still
dont have the mainboard drivers, which means I may as well not even try
to install it.

The main board drivers (aka chipset) are probably already on any generic
Windows install disc. So you are probably ok.
As I said before, this current install of XP was full of malware, and
since I have found there are a few obsolete items in the registry which
I can not remove. (something about a string being too long), so that
registry is semi-****ed. However it does boot fine, and I removed all
the malware and junk on the drive.

Yes indeed. But I would stop messing around with this drive. And if all
possible, start with a new drive. And leave that one alone in case you
need something from it later.
This leads me to the question, is there soem sort of software I can
download that will go thru my current installation, and find all the
drivers, and copy them to a floppy or USB Flash drive? This seems like
something that would be useful....... Or, do I just search for *.INF and
copy every .INF file on the H.D. to my flash drive?

Thanks

Yes there are driver backup programs. Some are payware, but free to try.
Manually copying? Oh it is a lot more than just inf files. My Intel
graphic drivers are stored in the following:

C:\WINDOWS\system32

igfxpers.exe
igfxsrvc.exe
igfxtray.exe
igxpdv32.dll
igxpdx32.dll
igxpgd32.dll
igxprd32.dll

C:\WINDOWS\system32\drivers\
igxpmp32.sys

And I am sure this isn't a completed list. But you get the idea. I have
in the past installed Windows on a new drive and hooked up the second
drive for installing drivers. Thus I installed the inf files that I need
and Windows will ask you where the drivers are stored. So you go to the
second Windows drive and it will copy the files it needs right over to
the new Windows (you have to tell it where the right folder is). You
shouldn't do it this way though, since your drivers could be still infected.
 
R

Rasta Robert

This leads me to the question, is there soem sort of software I can
download that will go thru my current installation, and find all the
drivers, and copy them to a floppy or USB Flash drive? This seems like
something that would be useful....... Or, do I just search for *.INF and
copy every .INF file on the H.D. to my flash drive?

Thanks

Driver Magician Lite (Freeware) seems just the piece of
software you're looking for:
<http://www.drivermagician.com/Lite.htm>

"Driver Magician Lite is freeware, it identifies all the hardware in the system,
extracts their associated drivers from the hard disk and backs them up to a
location of your choice. Then when you format and reinstall/upgrade your
operating system, you can restore all the "saved" drivers just as if you had the
original driver diskettes in your hands."
 
P

philo 

In one of my most recent posts on here, I want to reinstall XP Home.
Rather than chance losing everything on the original drive, (and since
the 20g drive is too small anyhow), I'm just gonna unplug that drive,
and installanother hard drive, probably 40g or if I have to buy one on
ebay, maybe an 80g.

Anyhow, there are no restore files on the H.D. It has a second
partition (5g) but it was nearly empty, and contained nothing useful.

So, I only have my XP Home SP2 commercial CD to install from, to this
Compac computer. WThis leaves me driverless, as far as the mainboard
drivers. I went to the Compac site, which is really HP. They have the
drivers for the sound card, video, modem, mouse, and a few others, but
NOT for the mainboard. I did download all those others, but I still
dont have the mainboard drivers, which means I may as well not even try
to install it.

As I said before, this current install of XP was full of malware, and
since I have found there are a few obsolete items in the registry which
I can not remove. (something about a string being too long), so that
registry is semi-****ed. However it does boot fine, and I removed all
the malware and junk on the drive.

This leads me to the question, is there soem sort of software I can
download that will go thru my current installation, and find all the
drivers, and copy them to a floppy or USB Flash drive? This seems like
something that would be useful....... Or, do I just search for *.INF and
copy every .INF file on the H.D. to my flash drive?

Thanks


Very smart move to perform a clean install.

When I need to get the drivers off a former install I simply
save the entire "inf" and "system 32" folders

I find it helpful to place all the "inf" files right in the "system 32
folder" to prevent having to manually point the installer to the files
it needs
 
B

BillW50

On 02/27/2014 12:42 AM, (e-mail address removed) wrote:
Very smart move to perform a clean install.

When I need to get the drivers off a former install I simply
save the entire "inf" and "system 32" folders

I find it helpful to place all the "inf" files right in the "system 32
folder" to prevent having to manually point the installer to the files
it needs

Not everything is found there (maybe about <5%). I've found some parts
in other folders too. I suppose it depends on who wrote the installer.
 
P

philo 

Not everything is found there (maybe about <5%). I've found some parts
in other folders too. I suppose it depends on who wrote the installer.



Probably best to just keep the entire drive and if the installer is
looking for a specific file...do a search for it and point the installer
there.
 
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P

Paul

In one of my most recent posts on here, I want to reinstall XP Home.
Rather than chance losing everything on the original drive, (and since
the 20g drive is too small anyhow), I'm just gonna unplug that drive,
and installanother hard drive, probably 40g or if I have to buy one on
ebay, maybe an 80g.

Anyhow, there are no restore files on the H.D. It has a second
partition (5g) but it was nearly empty, and contained nothing useful.

So, I only have my XP Home SP2 commercial CD to install from, to this
Compac computer. WThis leaves me driverless, as far as the mainboard
drivers. I went to the Compac site, which is really HP. They have the
drivers for the sound card, video, modem, mouse, and a few others, but
NOT for the mainboard. I did download all those others, but I still
dont have the mainboard drivers, which means I may as well not even try
to install it.

As I said before, this current install of XP was full of malware, and
since I have found there are a few obsolete items in the registry which
I can not remove. (something about a string being too long), so that
registry is semi-****ed. However it does boot fine, and I removed all
the malware and junk on the drive.

This leads me to the question, is there soem sort of software I can
download that will go thru my current installation, and find all the
drivers, and copy them to a floppy or USB Flash drive? This seems like
something that would be useful....... Or, do I just search for *.INF and
copy every .INF file on the H.D. to my flash drive?

Thanks

It sounds like you already have most of your drivers lined up,
leaving the chipset driver for the motherboard.

It's really better if you name the computer, as then I can get a
better handle on the chipset.

Some chipsets, the drivers are already in the WinXP CD. After
the WinXP install is finished, you look in Device Manager, and the
entries already have nice descriptive text strings.

If you had a really modern motherboard, then you might have to
track down the chipset on the Internet. If it was Intel, you could
look here.

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/default.aspx

Use "Search Downloads", then enter infinst as a search term. I get
44 items back, and for an 845 chipset say, I might be looking at
a driver from 2005.

Here, I picked an item out of the 44 items.

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/De...816&DwnldID=8178&keyword=infinst+845&lang=eng

I click the Release Notes link. I see my chipset in the list.

http://downloadmirror.intel.com/8178/eng/releasenotes.htm

* Intel 845 Chipset

And then I know I'm in the right ballpark.

These drivers, the development stopped for the older
chipsets, years ago. That's why in this particular case,
I would not be worried about using a 2005 driver for 845, in
the year 2014. That set of files hasn't been touched
by Intel, in years. Newer INFINST files, would have
dropped support for my 845, as an example of a chipset.
So if I pick a 2013 release of driver, the 845 isn't in there.
That's why I felt comfortable picking one from 2005.

Also of note, look at how some of the driver logic works in
the INF files themselves. Intel has a "USB" INF entry in their
package, but for licensing reasons, it just calls an INF
already provided by Microsoft and in the OS. So you're not
really getting anything of value there, except the call
to usbport.inf . Many of the things that constitute
chipset drivers, just add a fancy text label to Device Manager.
Only a few might contain essential items (something AGP
slot related, for example)

Other chipset drivers might include ATI (on amd site), NVidia
(on their own site), ULI (on the NVidia site), ALI (don't know),
SIS (sis.com), VIA (some via site, more research required as they
move them). Intel isn't the only possible choice here.

Paul
 
C

casey.o

It sounds like you already have most of your drivers lined up,
leaving the chipset driver for the motherboard.

It's really better if you name the computer, as then I can get a
better handle on the chipset.

Some chipsets, the drivers are already in the WinXP CD. After
the WinXP install is finished, you look in Device Manager, and the
entries already have nice descriptive text strings.

If you had a really modern motherboard, then you might have to
track down the chipset on the Internet. If it was Intel, you could
look here.

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/default.aspx

Use "Search Downloads", then enter infinst as a search term. I get
44 items back, and for an 845 chipset say, I might be looking at
a driver from 2005.

Here, I picked an item out of the 44 items.

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/De...816&DwnldID=8178&keyword=infinst+845&lang=eng

I click the Release Notes link. I see my chipset in the list.

http://downloadmirror.intel.com/8178/eng/releasenotes.htm

* Intel 845 Chipset

And then I know I'm in the right ballpark.

These drivers, the development stopped for the older
chipsets, years ago. That's why in this particular case,
I would not be worried about using a 2005 driver for 845, in
the year 2014. That set of files hasn't been touched
by Intel, in years. Newer INFINST files, would have
dropped support for my 845, as an example of a chipset.
So if I pick a 2013 release of driver, the 845 isn't in there.
That's why I felt comfortable picking one from 2005.

Also of note, look at how some of the driver logic works in
the INF files themselves. Intel has a "USB" INF entry in their
package, but for licensing reasons, it just calls an INF
already provided by Microsoft and in the OS. So you're not
really getting anything of value there, except the call
to usbport.inf . Many of the things that constitute
chipset drivers, just add a fancy text label to Device Manager.
Only a few might contain essential items (something AGP
slot related, for example)

Other chipset drivers might include ATI (on amd site), NVidia
(on their own site), ULI (on the NVidia site), ALI (don't know),
SIS (sis.com), VIA (some via site, more research required as they
move them). Intel isn't the only possible choice here.

Paul


The computer is a Compaq Presario 5400USy (5000 series). It appears
everything is original. According to CPU-Z.exe, Intel Celeron
Tualatin, Brand 3 Socket 370 FC-PGA2 - Compaq Bios ver 686P9 v1.04
dated 11/14/2001 Pentium III, 1200mhz

It has 256m Ram, (2 x 128 sdram pc133) 20g HD.
Mainboard is Compaq model 07A8h - Chipset i815/E/EP Rev B
Internal modem PCTEL Platinum V.90
Video in onboard,
Has 2 sound cards, 1. plug in PCI, and 2. built into the MB.
One is called Legacy, I'm not sure which one?

Installed is XP SP2 Home Edition (appears to have been upgraded, because
a folder called i386 has all that stuff in it.).

I would suspect that the XP installer CD should have the drivers since
this was a computer made around the time XP was released.

This computer is just slightly faster than my Win98 machine (1000mhz,
but 512 RAM). I was surprised that XP would run on it. I was always
told that XP would not run on my 1000mhz machine. I do wonder if SP3
might be too much for this old computer?????

(I do intend to put in a bigger HD and upgrade the RAM to the max
allowed of 512 on this MB). I did find a PDF file online that tells
this maximum Ram limit, and some other stuff which is the same as what
CPU-Z is showing. After cleaning up the HD, removing malware, using a
Registry cleaner, and defragging, it runs about as fast as Win98 does on
my other computer.

Yet, the registry does contain about 10 items that I can not remove no
matter what I try. I used several registry cleaners, and tried to
manually remove using Regedit. I sure cant understand why something
like this cant be removed. All of them are references to folders that
have been removed. Such as one called 3LV Games, another is IOLA,
another is called Rockstar and Real Player, etc.... I intend to
reinstall, so it really dont matter, but I wanted to try to remove them,
and got soem pretty aggressive reg cleaners to try. (of course I backed
it up first).

This is an old computer, so I dont want to spend any money on it, but I
might buy a larger HD. I got some spare RAM if I can find it....
I only intend to run the internet on it. I still prefer Win98 for other
needs.
 
C

casey.o

Driver Magician Lite (Freeware) seems just the piece of
software you're looking for:
<http://www.drivermagician.com/Lite.htm>

"Driver Magician Lite is freeware, it identifies all the hardware in the system,
extracts their associated drivers from the hard disk and backs them up to a
location of your choice. Then when you format and reinstall/upgrade your
operating system, you can restore all the "saved" drivers just as if you had the
original driver diskettes in your hands."

Just what I was looking for.......
It turns out I had one similar on my Win98 computer. I forgot it was
there. That one works well too, and it's FREE. Also works on XP.
HERE:
WinDriversBackup pro
http://www.pcworld.com/product/947391/windriversbackup.html
File: wdb.zip

BTW: "Driver Magician Lite" does NOT work on Win98, but their Portable
version does. (on their website).
 
P

Paul

The computer is a Compaq Presario 5400USy (5000 series). It appears
everything is original. According to CPU-Z.exe, Intel Celeron
Tualatin, Brand 3 Socket 370 FC-PGA2 - Compaq Bios ver 686P9 v1.04
dated 11/14/2001 Pentium III, 1200mhz

It has 256m Ram, (2 x 128 sdram pc133) 20g HD.
Mainboard is Compaq model 07A8h - Chipset i815/E/EP Rev B
Internal modem PCTEL Platinum V.90
Video in onboard,
Has 2 sound cards, 1. plug in PCI, and 2. built into the MB.
One is called Legacy, I'm not sure which one?

Installed is XP SP2 Home Edition (appears to have been upgraded, because
a folder called i386 has all that stuff in it.).

I would suspect that the XP installer CD should have the drivers since
this was a computer made around the time XP was released.

This computer is just slightly faster than my Win98 machine (1000mhz,
but 512 RAM). I was surprised that XP would run on it. I was always
told that XP would not run on my 1000mhz machine. I do wonder if SP3
might be too much for this old computer?????

(I do intend to put in a bigger HD and upgrade the RAM to the max
allowed of 512 on this MB). I did find a PDF file online that tells
this maximum Ram limit, and some other stuff which is the same as what
CPU-Z is showing. After cleaning up the HD, removing malware, using a
Registry cleaner, and defragging, it runs about as fast as Win98 does on
my other computer.

Yet, the registry does contain about 10 items that I can not remove no
matter what I try. I used several registry cleaners, and tried to
manually remove using Regedit. I sure cant understand why something
like this cant be removed. All of them are references to folders that
have been removed. Such as one called 3LV Games, another is IOLA,
another is called Rockstar and Real Player, etc.... I intend to
reinstall, so it really dont matter, but I wanted to try to remove them,
and got soem pretty aggressive reg cleaners to try. (of course I backed
it up first).

This is an old computer, so I dont want to spend any money on it, but I
might buy a larger HD. I got some spare RAM if I can find it....
I only intend to run the internet on it. I still prefer Win98 for other
needs.

The same driver looks good for 815E. This is the chipset portion.
Before installing this, you can look in Device Manager, in the
System section, and see how many entries are already installed
if you want. Perhaps compare the dates on some of the driver
files, to the ones this one wants to install. In any case, if
entries in the System section are missing drivers, this should
fix it. You would need to see an entry with "AGP" in the name,
sitting in the System section, before using the next driver package.

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=8178

* Microsoft Windows 2000
* Microsoft Windows XP
* Microsoft Windows Server 2003

The Intel Chipset Software Installation Utility installs INF files
that inform the Windows operating system how to configure the chipset
for specific functionality such as AGP, USB, Core PCI, and ISAPNP services.

**Note**
This is the last version of the Intel Chipset Software Installation Utility
that supports the Intel 810/815/820/830/852/855 Chipset families, as well
as the Intel 840/860/E8870 Chipsets.

If you're using the chipset graphics (have no video card in an AGP slot),
then you'd install this driver after the previous one. The one with the "E"
in the name, is for English, rather than the Multi-Language one. If you are
using a separate video card, you wouldn't need this one today.

https://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=4665

win2k_xpe67.exe
4.29 MB

You can also install DirectX 9c. Which is a software subsystem with
stupid revision numbering scheme. If you execute dxdiag in Start : Run,
it may even identify the currently installed version. You will find
so many different versions of this on the Microsoft site, you
might possibly go crazy :-( What I find is, many times Microsoft
will tease you with a DirectX package, you download it, and then
the installer tells you it's for another OS. That's the kind of
crappy treatment I can do without.

*******

The 815E has a 512MB artificial limitation. It actually has
enough banks to support 3x512MB, but Intel restricted it.
Not all of the motherboards have three memory slots (some only two).
You could fill the two available slots on your motherboard
with 1x512MB or 2x256MB, and reach the limit. If you
installed 2x512MB it would report 512MB total. If you
got stuck with single sided 256MB memories, they'd probably
work. (My 440BX motherboard, only double sided 16 chip 256MB
sticks work, whereas your 815E should be able to handle
a 256MB high density DIMM with 8 chips total on the whole DIMM.)
So if buying from Ebay, there's less risk of getting the wrong
RAM. If I was buying for my old 440BX motherboard, odds are
high of getting snookered on high density RAM.

Suggested RAM (select speed as per what worked before)

512MB module - 16 chips (ones with 8 chips, might not exist)
256MB module - 8 chips or 16 chips total

*******

As far as I know, registry entries can have "Permissions".
And malware may set permissions to slow you down. In Regedit,
look under "Edit" for "Permissions", and see if the registry
key in question can be modified so you have permission
to change it. I've only needed to do that once, on
a Win7 system (change owner from TrustedInstaller to
Administrator or something). On the older OSes, it should
be less necessary. I seem to remember reading, the ENUM hardware
key for PCI cards, could get that screwed up, and in the
old days, would prevent some kind of driver installations.
It would be a relatively obscure thing to play with,
until you get to the more security-obsessed OSes.

Paul
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

BillW50 <[email protected]> said:
Yes most of my XP use 60 to 80GB drives (a few has 320GB). But you can
get by with a lot less. My Asus EeePC 701 has XP SP2 on 4GB. Although I
don't think you can install it in 4GB, just image to it.

I recently fired up an old XP system, and found it had a 6G drive - and
after removing lots of stuff (the previous owner had done some
accountancy so had SAGE, and was also an AOL user - getting rid of both
of those was a nightmare: not having the original discs didn't help, so
lots of manual deleting and registry searching - yes, I ran what
uninstallers I could find first), I've got that drive almost half empty!
(And it still has Word on it!) It boots and runs acceptably fast (I have
popped some more RAM in). I don't think it's SP3 - possibly even not 2;
I think 3 would struggle in a 6G drive, at least if you actually wanted
to put anything else on it.
Well sometimes they try to be tricky and maybe it just looks that way.
They could hide things not shown in the directory and may not be
counted in the free space either.

My thought too.
The main board drivers (aka chipset) are probably already on any
generic Windows install disc. So you are probably ok.

Again, my thought too, so I'd say an install attempt is probably worth
it.
[]
Yes there are driver backup programs. Some are payware, but free to
try. Manually copying? Oh it is a lot more than just inf files. My

Yes, if you look into them (they're mostly - maybe all? - just text
files), you'll see they contain settings, but also the names of other
files.
[]
 
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J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

In message <[email protected]>,
It has 256m Ram, (2 x 128 sdram pc133) 20g HD.

I _would_ put more RAM in.
Mainboard is Compaq model 07A8h - Chipset i815/E/EP Rev B
Internal modem PCTEL Platinum V.90
Video in onboard,

(I take it you meant "is" not "in" - I doubt it really has a video in
function!)
Has 2 sound cards, 1. plug in PCI, and 2. built into the MB.
One is called Legacy, I'm not sure which one?

Depending what you actually want to do with the sound, you may well find
you don't need the plugin one, unless the on-board is known to be
grotty. IME, except for serious audio work (or possibly people who want
multiple speakers - even they're catered for on modern mobos, though not
ones of your vintage), on-board is fine.
[]
This computer is just slightly faster than my Win98 machine (1000mhz,
but 512 RAM). I was surprised that XP would run on it. I was always
told that XP would not run on my 1000mhz machine. I do wonder if SP3
might be too much for this old computer?????

I think the amount of RAM rather than the processor speed is likely to
be the problem; XPSP3 runs fine on this 1.6 machine, and now that I've
put the extra memory in, XP (SP2 or 1) seems to be running OK on the old
one I mentioned in my last post which is I think a 400 MHz! It's running
out of RAM, so that it has to start using the HD, that really kills
performance. I'd say 768M is about the lower limit for XPSP3, especially
if you intend to run Firefox (especially if you're a many-tabber - in
fact I'd go for 1G then); 512M might be enough (just) for SP2, I'm not
sure. I know the old system I've mentioned used to really crawl with
256M, though the old lady accountant did actually use it!
(I do intend to put in a bigger HD and upgrade the RAM to the max
allowed of 512 on this MB). I did find a PDF file online that tells
this maximum Ram limit, and some other stuff which is the same as what

Paul has suggested some possible ways of finding bigger ones that might
work. Certainly go for as much as will - 512M _might_ be OK for SP2.
(I've also heard of people using USB RAM, though I've also heard it said
that the way Windows uses RAM means that some kinds of USB RAM when used
in this way have a life measured in hours.)
[]
This is an old computer, so I dont want to spend any money on it, but I
might buy a larger HD. I got some spare RAM if I can find it....

I hope it works with it.
I only intend to run the internet on it. I still prefer Win98 for other
needs.
(-:
 
K

Ken Blake, MVP

I recently fired up an old XP system, and found it had a 6G drive - and
after removing lots of stuff (the previous owner had done some
accountancy so had SAGE, and was also an AOL user - getting rid of both
of those was a nightmare: not having the original discs didn't help, so
lots of manual deleting and registry searching - yes, I ran what
uninstallers I could find first), I've got that drive almost half empty!
(And it still has Word on it!) It boots and runs acceptably fast (I have
popped some more RAM in). I don't think it's SP3 - possibly even not 2;
I think 3 would struggle in a 6G drive, at least if you actually wanted
to put anything else on it.


Out of curiosity, I just looked at Amazon.com. You can buy a 40GB IDE
drive for $11.11 and an 80GB one for $19. Why struggle with a 6GB
drive?
 
P

Paul

Out of curiosity, I just looked at Amazon.com. You can buy a 40GB IDE
drive for $11.11 and an 80GB one for $19. Why struggle with a 6GB
drive?

Did you see the words "refurb" or "pull" next to those advertisements ?
Those drives could have been used for 10,000 hours already,
and sound like a bag of ball bearings :) They may have been
parted-out, of some lease returns.

A "real" drive, should cost $50 or more. $11 would not cover
the cost of the electronics on the controller board, when
an appropriate markup was added. So those drives were acquired
for nothing, by their current seller. Refurb or pull is my guess.

Paul
 
K

Ken Blake, MVP

Ken Blake, MVP wrote:

Did you see the words "refurb" or "pull" next to those advertisements ?

No.


Those drives could have been used for 10,000 hours already,
and sound like a bag of ball bearings :) They may have been
parted-out, of some lease returns.


They are new. Or at least Amazon says so, and I have always found
Amazon to be honest.

A "real" drive, should cost $50 or more. $11 would not cover
the cost of the electronics on the controller board, when
an appropriate markup was added. So those drives were acquired
for nothing, by their current seller. Refurb or pull is my guess.



My guess is that they are new, but old stock that isn't selling.
Regardless of much it cost to make them, few people want such small
drives, so prices are lowered dramatically to get rid of them.
 
K

Ken Blake, MVP

They are new. Or at least Amazon says so, and I have always found
Amazon to be honest.





My guess is that they are new, but old stock that isn't selling.
Regardless of much it cost to make them, few people want such small
drives, so prices are lowered dramatically to get rid of them.


And by the way, Amazon also offers both of those drives used--$4.49
for the 80GB, and $3.48 for the 40GB.
 
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P

Paul

J. P. Gilliver (John) said:
Paul has suggested some possible ways of finding bigger ones that might
work. Certainly go for as much as will - 512M _might_ be OK for SP2.
(I've also heard of people using USB RAM, though I've also heard it said
that the way Windows uses RAM means that some kinds of USB RAM when used
in this way have a life measured in hours.)

Actually, you could put a pagefile on a gigabyte RAMDisk,
if the computer would not hold more memory. But this
is hardly practical. With a high-bandwidth storage device
for pagefile, WinXP is pretty smooth. I've had 5GB worth
of programs running on a WinXP 32 bit Sp3 machine, by having
a pagefile mounted on a 4GB/sec storage device. The
programs are swapped in, when you shift the focus to
the next program. And compared to paging from a hard
drive, the result was pretty impressive. Only a slight
delay or sluggishness was evident. Not the 30 second delay
you might see from a hard drive, grinding away. And more virtual
memory was in play, than Windows 32 bit can normally
address (because paging makes the difference).

This is the Gigabyte one that fits in a PC slot.
You can't get these any more, and I bet people reselling
these, probably charge a pretty penny for them. Then,
there's the detail of how the pagefile gets on the disk,
so it's ready at startup. The PCI bus limits the bandwidth,
but the seek time is "zero". Beats the pants off a hard drive,
for random access. Even if it could only sustain 110MB/sec.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815168001

The other one you can get, connects to a SATA port.
You can probably find some benchmarks somewhere for these.

http://www.acard.com.tw/english/newstabpop.jsp?idno=93

Those are all silly ideas, because the price of the solution
is probably more than the entire PC is worth. The solutions
are noteworthy, in that the storage media (Dynamic RAM,
DDR2 on the second one), doesn't wear out. You can get
business versions of those, with PCI Express connectors,
but those probably start at around $10,000 a piece. And
a separate box sits outside the computer.

*******

In my view, 512MB is barely adequate. I built and ran
a PC like that for a short time, but I could only keep
about 3 programs open at a time. If you only kept the
one program open, then your options for what you run,
might be a little more ambitious. But if you run three
large programs, don't expect 512MB to go very far.

Maybe some older version of Opera would use less RAM ?
The latest Opera made a platform switch, so maybe
some older version would be better.

Paul
 
P

Paul

And by the way, Amazon also offers both of those drives used--$4.49
for the 80GB, and $3.48 for the 40GB.

Did Amazon have customer reviews for the items ?
I'm curious what the customers think of them.

Paul
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

Paul has suggested some possible ways of finding bigger ones that
might work. Certainly go for as much as will - 512M _might_ be OK for
SP2. (I've also heard of people using USB RAM, though I've also heard
it said that the way Windows uses RAM means that some kinds of USB
RAM when used in this way have a life measured in hours.)

Actually, you could put a pagefile on a gigabyte RAMDisk,
if the computer would not hold more memory. But this []
Those are all silly ideas, because the price of the solution
is probably more than the entire PC is worth. The solutions
are noteworthy, in that the storage media (Dynamic RAM,
DDR2 on the second one), doesn't wear out. You can get[/QUOTE]
[]
You've got it! I'm really doing this as an intellectual/curiosity
exercise only, not really a practical approach - I intend to spend no
more money on it beyond the little I spent on some more RAM for it!
In my view, 512MB is barely adequate. I built and ran
a PC like that for a short time, but I could only keep
about 3 programs open at a time. If you only kept the
one program open, then your options for what you run,
might be a little more ambitious. But if you run three
large programs, don't expect 512MB to go very far.

(It actually has 640 now.) One of the things that does puzzle me is how
the previous owner managed to use it to do serious accountancy work:
granted, she only did it for a friend's small company, but using
heavyweight stuff like Sage accounting, and she had the CDs from HMRC
(UK equivalent of IRS) loaded. And that was with only 256M. I guess she
must have been very disciplined about doing only one thing at a time.
(She also had AOL's broadband software - the old one that took over
_everything_. But then her broadband line operated at about 128k - yes
really, she's rural and unlucky [her neighbour over the road got 1.5M] -
so I think she only really used it for email, no web.)
Maybe some older version of Opera would use less RAM ?
The latest Opera made a platform switch, so maybe
some older version would be better.

I thought Opera was payware? I admit I haven't looked at it for many
years.
 
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J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

In message <[email protected]>, "Ken Blake,
MVP said:
Out of curiosity, I just looked at Amazon.com. You can buy a 40GB IDE
drive for $11.11 and an 80GB one for $19. Why struggle with a 6GB
drive?
See my longer reply to Paul - really just intellectual curiosity, to see
if it _can_ be made into a usable machine.

Out of curiosity, what's the smallest footprint anyone knows of that's
still recognisably XP? I know the 98lite people (now called something
like PClite) claimed to have a version of 98 in IIRR 90M, or even 50M
for embedded applications, though I don't know how recognisably 98 those
are.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)[email protected]+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The truth is, almost everyone in the world is lovely. But the world is ruined
for us by the sociopaths and those who aren't lovely. - Richard Osman to
Alison Graham, in Radio Times 2013-6-8 to 14
 

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