Is HDTV Wonder gettting improved?

[online]

I'm thinking about buying ATI HDTV Wonder card. Would it work well
with my 3 year old ATI AIW 8500-DV? My system's other possessions
seem to be fine. Windows XP on P4 2.6Ghz, 1G 400DDR RAM, and 7400RPM
drive.

ATI HDTV Wonder has been out for about one year. In the beginning, I
read a lot of issues from buyers. Nowadays I don't see too many
complaints about it. The product name is still the same, but I wonder
if new batches of HDTV Wonder cards somehow improved?

 

[AAvK]

I'm thinking about buying ATI HDTV Wonder card. Would it work well
with my 3 year old ATI AIW 8500-DV? My system's other possessions
seem to be fine. Windows XP on P4 2.6Ghz, 1G 400DDR RAM, and 7400RPM
drive.

ATI HDTV Wonder has been out for about one year. In the beginning, I
read a lot of issues from buyers. Nowadays I don't see too many
complaints about it. The product name is still the same, but I wonder
if new batches of HDTV Wonder cards somehow improved?

I can't imagine why exactly, NTSC is NTSC in resolution, but maybe they used some
technology that equalizes DVD resolution, which is expandably awesome on the computer
screen... I use a "TV wonder ve" remote control edition, no stereo sound and up to NTSC
which is 640x480 only, but the frame window is expandable, which wrecks the quality of
the image when it's made bigger. I think you have a good issue which I would like to know
about myself.

 

[J. Clarke]

I can't imagine why exactly, NTSC is NTSC in resolution, but maybe they
used some technology that equalizes DVD resolution, which is expandably
awesome on the computer screen... I use a "TV wonder ve" remote control
edition, no stereo sound and up to NTSC which is 640x480 only, but the
frame window is expandable, which wrecks the quality of the image when
it's made bigger. I think you have a good issue which I would like to know
about myself.

The HDTV Wonder is an ATSC board, the resolution is a good ways beyond DVD.

 

[T Shadow]

I'm thinking about buying ATI HDTV Wonder card. Would it work well
with my 3 year old ATI AIW 8500-DV? My system's other possessions
seem to be fine. Windows XP on P4 2.6Ghz, 1G 400DDR RAM, and 7400RPM
drive.

ATI HDTV Wonder has been out for about one year. In the beginning, I
read a lot of issues from buyers. Nowadays I don't see too many
complaints about it. The product name is still the same, but I wonder
if new batches of HDTV Wonder cards somehow improved?

AFAIK the cards are still the same. Drivers and MMC have been improved 3 and
4 months ago respectively since the last updates though. I'm having no major
problems.

Your system is similar to mine except I have a AIW9600XT and a second
"capture" drive on my secondary IDE channel. Seemed to have problems keeping
up when both HDDs were on the primary. With the size of HDTV files and
current price of HDDs you'll probably want to add space anyway.

Can't say if your video card will work or not but I don't think it's up to
the system requirements on the webpage. I think someone posted on rage3d.com
or avsforum.com about using the AIW 8500-DV and HDTV Wonder together. Try
googling those sites.

 

[Rush]

I own the HDTV Wonder and the AIW 8500DV. In answer to your question
about using it with the 8500DV, there is one problem. The 8500DV
doesn't support DirectX 9.0 or above. Even though it passes the tests
when you put it through them, it is not capable of performing certain,
specific jobs made possible by DirectX 9.0 and above.

In my case, the HDTV Wonder found most of the local Digital TV OTA(Over
The Air) broadcast stations in the area. It showed the local ABC
affiliate station just fine. I could hear the CBS station very
clearly, but there was no video. The difference is that ABC broadcasts
the 720p hdtv standard (1280 x 720 progressive), but, CBS comes in at
1080i (1920 x 1080 interlaced). The 1080i broadcasts require some
DirectX 9.0 functions that cannot be performed by the 8500DV card.

If you check the ATI web site, ATI points out that the HDTV Wonder
needs either their Radeon (or AIW) 9550 video card or above to be fully
functional. Fortunately, I had previously purchased the AIW 9800 PRO,
an awesome card, and I was able to install the HDTV Wonder into the
computer that had the newer card in it.

To briefly deal with the subject line, "Is HDTV Wonder getting
improved?", I really don't know. I do know that after July 15, 2005,
all cards manufactured must meet certain guidelines as specified by FCC
legislation that is in compliance with digital broadcasting legal
requirements that were scheduled to go into effect after that time. I
don't know how this will affect the operation of the card, but we'll
all see soon enough. My card was manufactured before that time, so I
still don't know for certain how it may be affected, if at all, in
regards to its operation.

In conclusion, I am very happy with the performance of my HDTV Wonder.
If your local network affiliates broadcast in Dolby 5.1 Digital
Surround Sound, you are in for a double treat if you have the audio
system to play it through. The little antenna that comes in the box
with the HDTV Wonder is not to be laughed at either. It will pick up
all the video and audio that is being broadcast within range. The HDTV
Wonder card, the enclosed antenna, and the software in the box, do
exactly what they are advertised to do. It really makes the viewer's
experience more than worthwhile. As an additional bonus, the recording
capabilities allow you to capture the full video AND audio experience
directly to your hard drive as well. So, if you're into recording your
shows so you can watch them later (like me), you will be very happy to
know that you can do this with your HDTV Wonder card and the ATI
software bundle enclosed. FYI: the hdtv files are huge if you record
them in their "native" format as they should be (that is if you want to
get the full high resolution video and audio playback). An hour
program can take up 5 to 10 GB of space on your hard drive. But, it's
well worth it in my opinion. You cannot, as stated on the HDTV Wonder
box, view cable or satellite hdtv programs. Only the OTA broadcasts
are viewable. Also, in your case, a newer video card than the
All-In-Wonder 8500DV is necessary to support its full capabilities, so
that would mean you would need to purchase a newer video card as well
if you don't already have one. To sum it all up, it is my feeling that
the negatives are far outweighed by the positives. If I were in your
shoes, I would get the HDTV Wonder card if you have local stations
broadcasting hdtv over the air for the best home viewing experience you
have ever known. I hope this helps.

 

[Rush]

I own the HDTV Wonder and the AIW 8500DV. In answer to your question
about using it with the 8500DV, there is one problem. The 8500DV
doesn't support DirectX 9.0 or above. Even though it passes the tests
when you put it through them, it is not capable of performing certain,
specific jobs made possible by DirectX 9.0 and above.

In my case, the HDTV Wonder found most of the local Digital TV OTA(Over
The Air) broadcast stations in the area. It showed the local ABC
affiliate station just fine. I could hear the CBS station very
clearly, but there was no video. The difference is that ABC broadcasts
the 720p hdtv standard (1280 x 720 progressive), but, CBS comes in at
1080i (1920 x 1080 interlaced). The 1080i broadcasts require some
DirectX 9.0 functions that cannot be performed by the 8500DV card.

If you check the ATI web site, ATI points out that the HDTV Wonder
needs either their Radeon (or AIW) 9550 video card or above to be fully
functional. Fortunately, I had previously purchased the AIW 9800 PRO,
an awesome card, and I was able to install the HDTV Wonder into the
computer that had the newer card in it.

To briefly deal with the subject line, "Is HDTV Wonder getting
improved?", I really don't know. I do know that after July 15, 2005,
all cards manufactured must meet certain guidelines as specified by FCC
legislation that is in compliance with digital broadcasting legal
requirements that were scheduled to go into effect after that time. I
don't know how this will affect the operation of the card, but we'll
all see soon enough. My card was manufactured before that time, so I
still don't know for certain how it may be affected, if at all, in
regards to its operation.

In conclusion, I am very happy with the performance of my HDTV Wonder.
If your local network affiliates broadcast in Dolby 5.1 Digital
Surround Sound, you are in for a double treat if you have the audio
system to play it through. The little antenna that comes in the box
with the HDTV Wonder is not to be laughed at either. It will pick up
all the video and audio that is being broadcast within range. The HDTV
Wonder card, the enclosed antenna, and the software in the box, do
exactly what they are advertised to do. It really makes the viewer's
experience more than worthwhile. As an additional bonus, the recording
capabilities allow you to capture the full video AND audio experience
directly to your hard drive as well. So, if you're into recording your
shows so you can watch them later (like me), you will be very happy to
know that you can do this with your HDTV Wonder card and the ATI
software bundle enclosed. FYI: the hdtv files are huge if you record
them in their "native" format as they should be (that is if you want to
get the full high resolution video and audio playback). An hour
program can take up 5 to 10 GB of space on your hard drive. But, it's
well worth it in my opinion. You cannot, as stated on the HDTV Wonder
box, view cable or satellite hdtv programs. Only the OTA broadcasts
are viewable. Also, in your case, a newer video card than the
All-In-Wonder 8500DV is necessary to support its full capabilities, so
that would mean you would need to purchase a newer video card as well
if you don't already have one. To sum it all up, it is my feeling that
the negatives are far outweighed by the positives. If I were in your
shoes, I would get the HDTV Wonder card if you have local stations
broadcasting hdtv over the air for the best home viewing experience you
have ever known. I hope this helps.

 

[J. Clarke]

I own the HDTV Wonder and the AIW 8500DV. In answer to your question
about using it with the 8500DV, there is one problem. The 8500DV
doesn't support DirectX 9.0 or above. Even though it passes the tests
when you put it through them, it is not capable of performing certain,
specific jobs made possible by DirectX 9.0 and above.

In my case, the HDTV Wonder found most of the local Digital TV OTA(Over
The Air) broadcast stations in the area. It showed the local ABC
affiliate station just fine. I could hear the CBS station very
clearly, but there was no video. The difference is that ABC broadcasts
the 720p hdtv standard (1280 x 720 progressive), but, CBS comes in at
1080i (1920 x 1080 interlaced). The 1080i broadcasts require some
DirectX 9.0 functions that cannot be performed by the 8500DV card.

Are you sure that's not multipath? I used to see that with some
regularity--a better antenna fixed it.

If you check the ATI web site, ATI points out that the HDTV Wonder
needs either their Radeon (or AIW) 9550 video card or above to be fully
functional. Fortunately, I had previously purchased the AIW 9800 PRO,
an awesome card, and I was able to install the HDTV Wonder into the
computer that had the newer card in it.

To briefly deal with the subject line, "Is HDTV Wonder getting
improved?", I really don't know. I do know that after July 15, 2005,
all cards manufactured must meet certain guidelines as specified by FCC
legislation that is in compliance with digital broadcasting legal
requirements that were scheduled to go into effect after that time.

No, they do not. The "Broadcast Flag" regulation was struck down by the
courts in May, with the ruling holding that the FCC had exceeded its
authority by establishing such a requirement.

I
don't know how this will affect the operation of the card, but we'll
all see soon enough. My card was manufactured before that time, so I
still don't know for certain how it may be affected, if at all, in
regards to its operation.

In conclusion, I am very happy with the performance of my HDTV Wonder.
If your local network affiliates broadcast in Dolby 5.1 Digital
Surround Sound, you are in for a double treat if you have the audio
system to play it through. The little antenna that comes in the box
with the HDTV Wonder is not to be laughed at either. It will pick up
all the video and audio that is being broadcast within range. The HDTV
Wonder card, the enclosed antenna, and the software in the box, do
exactly what they are advertised to do. It really makes the viewer's
experience more than worthwhile. As an additional bonus, the recording
capabilities allow you to capture the full video AND audio experience
directly to your hard drive as well. So, if you're into recording your
shows so you can watch them later (like me), you will be very happy to
know that you can do this with your HDTV Wonder card and the ATI
software bundle enclosed. FYI: the hdtv files are huge if you record
them in their "native" format as they should be (that is if you want to
get the full high resolution video and audio playback). An hour
program can take up 5 to 10 GB of space on your hard drive. But, it's
well worth it in my opinion. You cannot, as stated on the HDTV Wonder
box, view cable or satellite hdtv programs. Only the OTA broadcasts
are viewable. Also, in your case, a newer video card than the
All-In-Wonder 8500DV is necessary to support its full capabilities, so
that would mean you would need to purchase a newer video card as well
if you don't already have one. To sum it all up, it is my feeling that
the negatives are far outweighed by the positives. If I were in your
shoes, I would get the HDTV Wonder card if you have local stations
broadcasting hdtv over the air for the best home viewing experience you
have ever known. I hope this helps.

What you're saying makes the Dvico boards seem even more attractive. They
do _not_ need a board newer than the 8500DV. In fact they'll work with a
board with no DXVA at all if your processor is fast enough. The latest
ones also have a newer tuner.

The more I hear about the HDTV Wonder the happier I am that I don't have
one.

 

[Danny Greaves]

Couple brodcast DTV related links that I found interesting.


DTV information site http://www.dtv.gov/ from the FCC. http://www.fcc.gov/dtv/

Local DTV brodcast information site. http://www.checkhd.com

 

[J. Clarke]

Couple brodcast DTV related links that I found interesting.


DTV information site http://www.dtv.gov/ from the FCC.
http://www.fcc.gov/dtv/

Local DTV brodcast information site. http://www.checkhd.com

Take that last one's antenna recommendations with a large dose of salt. It
tells me that I can get a particular station with a "small
multidirectional" antenna--an array of large unidirectional antennae with
only gets that particular station about half the time.

 

[stratus46]

Take that last one's antenna recommendations with a large dose of salt. It
tells me that I can get a particular station with a "small
multidirectional" antenna--an array of large unidirectional antennae with
only gets that particular station about half the time.

Well, checking www.checkhd.com against

http://www.nab.org/Newsroom/issues/digitaltv/DTVStations.asp

pretty much agrees. Channel 23.x is wrong on checkhd. I live about 35
miles from the towers in 90274 and get all the stations except San
Bernardino on both the HDTV Wonder and the Samsung TS-165 using a
Winegard SquareShooter.

http://www.winegard.com/offair/squareshooter.htm

I'm not connected in any way with Winegard but have always had good
experiences with their antennas and amplifiers. The SquareShooter is
small enough that it can be installed even if there are CCRs
prohibiting antennas.

Glenn Gundlach

 

[J. Clarke]

Well, checking www.checkhd.com against

http://www.nab.org/Newsroom/issues/digitaltv/DTVStations.asp

pretty much agrees.

I don't see any antenna recommendations there.

Channel 23.x is wrong on checkhd. I live about 35
miles from the towers in 90274 and get all the stations except San
Bernardino on both the HDTV Wonder and the Samsung TS-165 using a
Winegard SquareShooter.

http://www.winegard.com/offair/squareshooter.htm

I'm not connected in any way with Winegard but have always had good
experiences with their antennas and amplifiers. The SquareShooter is
small enough that it can be installed even if there are CCRs
prohibiting antennas.

Which is nice if you have a strong, clean signal with little multipath,
which should be the case if you're 35 miles from the antennas with no
intervening high terrain.

Incidentally, Federal law overrides many attempts by various local
organizations to prohibit antennas. You might want to read

 

[Danny Greaves]

I don't see any antenna recommendations there.


Which is nice if you have a strong, clean signal with little multipath,
which should be the case if you're 35 miles from the antennas with no
intervening high terrain.

Incidentally, Federal law overrides many attempts by various local
organizations to prohibit antennas. You might want to read

I thought that SquareShooter was there best urban area antenna?

 

[J. Clarke]

I thought that SquareShooter was there best urban area antenna?

"Urban area" is one step above rabbit ears. I have an array of HD6065Ps
with a tilter and there's one station that's still intermittent.

The problem with HDTV is that the broadcasters are typically transmitting
their digital signal at 1/10 or less the power level of their analog
signal, while the antenna manufacturers base their range figures on the
assumption that they're transmitting digital at the same signal level as
analog.

In conjunction with that, HD doesn't degrade gracefully, it's either there
or not.

 

[stratus46]

"Urban area" is one step above rabbit ears. I have an array of HD6065Ps
with a tilter and there's one station that's still intermittent.

The problem with HDTV is that the broadcasters are typically transmitting
their digital signal at 1/10 or less the power level of their analog
signal, while the antenna manufacturers base their range figures on the
assumption that they're transmitting digital at the same signal level as
analog.

In conjunction with that, HD doesn't degrade gracefully, it's either there
or not.

Its a little better than 'a step above rabbit ears' Average gain 4.5 dB
but NO rabbit ears get 13 dB front to back ratio. Its reasonable
performance and much better looking for what it does.

John, is that a typo on the HD6065P model number? It looks to me like
that is an FM only antenna. What am I missing?

Glenn Gundlach

 

[J. Clarke]

Its a little better than 'a step above rabbit ears' Average gain 4.5 dB
but NO rabbit ears get 13 dB front to back ratio. Its reasonable
performance and much better looking for what it does.

John, is that a typo on the HD6065P model number? It looks to me like
that is an FM only antenna. What am I missing?

HD9095P, don't know why I turned the "9"s upside down.

 

[stratus46]

HD9095P, don't know why I turned the "9"s upside down.

You said you have a tilt mount so I assmume the antennas are vertically
spaced, 2-3 feet apart with matched leads to the combiner? That would
narrow the vertical beam width. Have you tried horizontal or diagonal
spacing to narrow the horizontal beamwidth? Or are you REALLY into this
and have a quad stack?

I take it you're in a difficult reception area. What city? Are there
any analog UHF stations of similar channel and tower location to see
the multipath?

Its easy and difficult in LA. Easy because most of the transmitters are
on Mt Wilson. Difficult because there are lots of hills.

Glenn Gundlach

 

[J. Clarke]

You said you have a tilt mount so I assmume the antennas are vertically
spaced, 2-3 feet apart with matched leads to the combiner? That would
narrow the vertical beam width. Have you tried horizontal or diagonal
spacing to narrow the horizontal beamwidth? Or are you REALLY into this
and have a quad stack?
Horizontal.

I take it you're in a difficult reception area. What city? Are there
any analog UHF stations of similar channel and tower location to see
the multipath?

North of Hartford, CT. The particular station is on the other side of what
passes around here for a mountain--according to the numbers the signal path
clears it by about 100 feet. Antennaweb says I need a medium directional
with pre-amp. I can barely get _analog_ off it with that and it's a 3
million watt station in analog vs something like 200kw in digital. funny
thing--there's another station near it that transmits HD on channel 10 that
comes in just fine--I presume that the difference is due to the different
frequency.

They've improved their system though--at one time they were telling me that
I could pick up digital broadcast from Boston with a "large
multi-directional"--at least they're no longer trying to sell _that_
fantasy.

 

[Danny Greaves]

-- snip -- -- snip --

I noticed that checkhd shows two stations broadcasting using your zip
code at 23.*. Interesting...

KTBN = 33 miles at 16*
KVMD = 90 miles at 63*




-- snip -- -- snip --
Winguard charts show show a longer range for a digital over analog signal
in there specifications.

Ya any digital, cell phones really suck when that happens.


Thank's for saving me a few bucks. I was planning on buying a SquareShooter to
replace the 'ugly' multi-element antenna on my (90630 zip code) roof. But at 35 miles with a load
of five tv tuners I guess im stuck with my big ugly antenna.

oh well. At least S.C.E (electric co.) has finally repaired the power line insulators causing my noisy
signal problems.

Finally, First trying to contact the correct department. Then the RTVI technician had a two month
back log. Then it was another six month wait for them to get around to scheduling the repair order.

--end

 

[stratus46]

-- snip -- -- snip --


I noticed that checkhd shows two stations broadcasting using your zip
code at 23.*. Interesting...

KTBN = 33 miles at 16*
KVMD = 90 miles at 63*




-- snip -- -- snip --

Winguard charts show show a longer range for a digital over analog signal
in there specifications.


Ya any digital, cell phones really suck when that happens.



Thank's for saving me a few bucks. I was planning on buying a SquareShooter to
replace the 'ugly' multi-element antenna on my (90630 zip code) roof. But at 35 miles with a load
of five tv tuners I guess im stuck with my big ugly antenna.

oh well. At least S.C.E (electric co.) has finally repaired the power line insulators causing my noisy
signal problems.

Finally, First trying to contact the correct department. Then the RTVI technician had a two month
back log. Then it was another six month wait for them to get around to scheduling the repair order.

--end

Hi danny,
I bet you can use the SS-2000 SquareShooter with the preamp in the
antenna. At 35 miles there is little risk of overloading the preamp and
the added gain will make up for the splitter loss.

BTW, channel 23 digital IS Trinity Broadcast (KTBN DT). KVMD shows up
on 2 different carriers.. I don't care either way.

Glenn Gundlach

 

[Danny Greaves]

Hi danny,
I bet you can use the SS-2000 SquareShooter with the preamp in the
antenna. At 35 miles there is little risk of overloading the preamp and
the added gain will make up for the splitter loss.

BTW, channel 23 digital IS Trinity Broadcast (KTBN DT). KVMD shows up
on 2 different carriers.. I don't care either way.

Glenn Gundlach

Thanks for the help.

I'll have to take a look. Or maybe call them at a number listed in there FAQ. (800) 228-8094 ext-675


--end