Interesting Question !!!

[Emerald Saint]

I have 4 partitions on my HD, all are type NTFS, and no space in between
them.
The first record in the partition table points to the first partition,
second record points to the second partition, etc.
1st line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(1)\windows="PARTITION #1"
2nd line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(2)\windows="PARTITION #2"
3rd line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(3)\windows="PARTITION #3"
4th line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(4)\windows="PARTITION #4"

My WinXP system is in partition #1. I use Norton Ghost to write a back up
copy of partition #1 into partition #2. Partitions #3 and #4 are usually
non-bootable data areas. Immediately before I do the back up of partition
#1 I delete the drive letter entries in the "Mounted Devices" registry key
so that XP can't remember which partition corresponds to C drive. Also, I
always keep these two partitions hidden from each other. (I use Ranish
Partition Manager to do any manipulations I need in the partition table.)
If partition #1 gets broken I can copy #2 back into #1 - or I can boot #2 in
place by selecting it with the boot menu. I have done it many times - it
works great. Also I can tell #1 from #2 right away because they are
different size.

I was doing some tinkering with physical sector zero (some call it the MBR)
and I apparently goofed something up. I could still boot partition #1 but
when I changed #1 to 'hidden' type or if I zeroed out the #1 slot in the
partition table I got the message MISSING OPERATING SYSTEM when I tried to
boot #2. Boot.ini menu never displayed.

MISSING OPERATING SYSTEM is a
message that gets displayed by the code in the IPL. You can see it in there
if you look with a disk editor. I think it means the IPL program doesn't
find a partition table record with the boot flag set (i.e. no 'active'
partition). But I looked at the partition table with a disk editor and with
the Ranish program and partition #2 is not hidden type and it has it's boot
flag set. There is no problem in the partition table. And when I hide #2
and unhide #1 again - #1 still boots up OK.

 

[Pegasus \(MVP\)]

I have 4 partitions on my HD, all are type NTFS, and no space in between
them.
The first record in the partition table points to the first partition,
second record points to the second partition, etc.
1st line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(1)\windows="PARTITION #1"
2nd line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(2)\windows="PARTITION #2"
3rd line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(3)\windows="PARTITION #3"
4th line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(4)\windows="PARTITION #4"

My WinXP system is in partition #1. I use Norton Ghost to write a back up
copy of partition #1 into partition #2. Partitions #3 and #4 are usually
non-bootable data areas. Immediately before I do the back up of
partition
#1 I delete the drive letter entries in the "Mounted Devices" registry key
so that XP can't remember which partition corresponds to C drive. Also, I
always keep these two partitions hidden from each other. (I use Ranish
Partition Manager to do any manipulations I need in the partition table.)
If partition #1 gets broken I can copy #2 back into #1 - or I can boot #2
in
place by selecting it with the boot menu. I have done it many times - it
works great. Also I can tell #1 from #2 right away because they are
different size.

I was doing some tinkering with physical sector zero (some call it the
MBR)
and I apparently goofed something up. I could still boot partition #1 but
when I changed #1 to 'hidden' type or if I zeroed out the #1 slot in the
partition table I got the message MISSING OPERATING SYSTEM when I tried to
boot #2. Boot.ini menu never displayed.

MISSING OPERATING SYSTEM is a
message that gets displayed by the code in the IPL. You can see it in
there
if you look with a disk editor. I think it means the IPL program doesn't
find a partition table record with the boot flag set (i.e. no 'active'
partition). But I looked at the partition table with a disk editor and
with
the Ranish program and partition #2 is not hidden type and it has it's
boot
flag set. There is no problem in the partition table. And when I hide #2
and unhide #1 again - #1 still boots up OK.

Nice report - but what is the interesting question?

 

[Emerald Saint]

My question is this:

I made an XP 'boot' disk by formatting a floppy and copying NTLDR,
NTDETECT.COM, and Boot.ini onto the floppy. I copied the same Boot.ini file
as I described above. When I boot with this floppy and select partition #1
in the Boot.ini menu it boots partition #2 !!!!! When I select partition #2
on the boot menu I get the message MISSING OPERATING SYSTEM. I just don't
see how I can get that message. It indicates that the computer never gets
past the MBR

So I fired up Recovery Console from my XP CD and did FIXMBR command. Now I
start up (not using floppy) and select partition#1 on the Boot.ini menu and
it boots #2 !!!

Now I look at the Boot.ini file on #2 and find that the partition numbers
have all been incremented by 1. Specifically, the Boot.ini lines now have
values 2 thru 5 instead of values1 thru 4. Specifically, they now read:
1st line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(2)\windows="PARTITION #1"
2nd line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(3)\windows="PARTITION #2"
3rd line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(4)\windows="PARTITION #3"
4th line in Boot.ini has: disk(0)partition(5)\windows="PARTITION #4"

My question is 'What's going on here ???!!!"

 

[Pegasus \(MVP\)]

I suspect your volume names are confused. It is even possible
that Windows uses some files from partition 1 and some from
partition 2, regardless of their hidden state. Have a close look
at your mounted devices, then compare the various strings with
the output from mountvol.exe. Here is an example from my own
machine:

G:\Pegasus>mountvol
\\?\Volume{a42a78a0-5a60-11dc-b86d-00061bdefdfc}\
C:\

The volume label for the partition that is visible as drive C:
is obviously a42a78a0-5a60-11dc-b86d-00061bdefdfc.

Now regedit tells me under MountedDevices that the value
\\?\Volume{a42a78a0-5a60-11dc-b86d-00061bdefdfc}\
has "B6 2B B4 D7 00 F4 A1 EE 02 00 00 00" as its data.

Looking a bit further down, I find that this data is the same as
the data for the value \DosDevices\C:, which happens to be
my system drive as reported by the command
"echo %SystemDrive%".

Perhaps some of these relationships are disturbed on your
machine. You can find out by renaming D:\Windows to
D:\Windows.bad (for example) before rebooting, thus
making your backup folder inaccessible to the boot process.
Caution: Do this only if you have alternative means to restore
the original name!

 

[Emerald Saint]

Thanks for the info Pegasus. I will look into it. My next task is to get
an NTFS-aware disk editor that fits on a floppy.
I been using Helix Disk Editor (49kB) since about 1998. I don't want to buy
new Norton. I found this one
http://www.omnixray.com/ but I don't know what size it is.

I'll get back to you about the drive signature question.
Thanks again for the info.

 

[M8RIX]

My interesting question is:
Why make a backup image of the OS on the same physical disc? If the disc
fails, doesn't the backup fail with it?
What am I missing here?

 

[Malke]

My interesting question is:
Why make a backup image of the OS on the same physical disc? If the disc
fails, doesn't the backup fail with it?
What am I missing here?

Nothing. You are 100% correct. It is foolish to back up to the same
physical hard drive.


Malke

 

[Unknown]

Very intelligent observation. You're missing nothing.

 

[AJR]

Also interesting - Boot.ini lists four installations of Windows - also
insteresting - that this computer boots at all -based on his actions I would
say Emerald has been "flirting" with disaster.

 

[Emerald Saint]

I have a back up on another disk also. I didn't mention it because I
assumed everybody here in the group wasn't interested in the finer details
about my personal setup. The back up that I keep on the same disk is what
I use for downloading pornography and pirated software..

 

[Guest]

How quaint, a sense of humor!

I have a back up on another disk also. I didn't mention it because I
assumed everybody here in the group wasn't interested in the finer details
about my personal setup. The back up that I keep on the same disk is what
I use for downloading pornography and pirated software..