In Re Epson Ink Cartridge Class Action Cases

[Burt]

I think you are excessively harsh on McDonalds, and yes there are probably
jerk clerks but I doubt that laughing about a burnt tongue is approved by
McDonalds. People want hot coffee, and if you want it cooler, then let it
sit, add cream, add water or do what you want. The fact is that coffee is
made with boiling water, but it cools in the storage carafes.

The real issue was a stupid person who put the coffee cup between her legs
(don't cars have cup holders now?)and started to drive off, and a scum
lawyer. The woman got what she deserved, burned legs, the lawyer got a
lot of money, the rest of us have to live with luke warm coffee. BTW,
the woman got 3rd degree burns because she just sat there instead of
getting out of the car and stripping off her clothes. (May have had
problems with moving but in my opinion that means the person shoud be more
careful.)

Classic Monday morning quarterbacking. Wrong on all counts.
1) there are safety standards regarding the maximum temperature at which
beverages should be served in restaurants. Employees were, or should have
been, trained regarding the setting of the coffee urns. It was their
negligence that was the issue. I'm sure that the woman, in retrospect,
would have been happier had she used a cup holder. Nonetheless, coffee
served at the proper temperature would have cause first degree burns at the
worst. No more serious than mild sunburn, and with a very short time to
heal.
2) Getting out of the car and stripping off your clothes will have little
effect as the third degree burns occured immeditately on contact with fluid
of the temperature that was served.
3) Your description of the lawyer as a "scum lawyer" is typical of a
cynical prejudiced bystander --- that is, until you receive a serious,
debilitating injury yourself as a result of someone elses negligence, in
which case you will run, not walk, to a lawyer who can represent you fairly
and effectively. It is true that there are rotten apples in every business
and profession. For better or worse, our society requires competant
representation with legal issues. The law is a learned profession and
deserves the same respect as those engaged in medical or dental practice,
and teaching, to mention just a few professions we must rely on for their
education, skill, and integrity. That is notwithstanding the fact that
there are some who have less skill or exhibit less integrity - the reality
of the human condition.

 

[TJ]

Well I've three Epsons that qualify for this class action law suite. I
have a choice of $45USD credit per printer or $25USD check for each one.
This is for screwing us on their oem ink.
Bastards!
Frank

I have two printers on the list and I bought them within the time
period, but I have no way of proving I did. I purchased one at a garage
sale for $5 and the other at a church sale for $1. No receipts. Always
used "compatible" aftermarket carts in them, too - so they didn't cost
me much. They did have a tendency to clog slightly if I didn't use them
at least once a month. I haven't had that problem since inheriting my
brother's HP PSC 2110 a couple of years ago.

I have nothing to complain about. Well, not about that, anyway.

TJ

 

[Edwin Pawlowski]

3) The law is a learned profession and deserves the same respect as
those engaged in medical or dental practice, and teaching, to mention just
a few professions we must rely on for their education, skill, and
integrity. That is notwithstanding the fact that there are some who have
less skill or exhibit less integrity - the reality of the human condition.

Yep, most personal injury lawyers are scum. They advertise on TV all the
time. My favorite is the one where the lawyer says "we can't promise you a
lot of money" while in the background they are unloading an armored truck in
a homeowner's driveway.

 

[zakezuke]

think you are excessively harsh on McDonalds,

and yes there are probably jerk clerks but I doubt
that laughing about a burnt tongue is approved by
McDonalds. People want hot coffee, and if you
want it cooler, then let it sit, add cream, add
water or do what you want. The fact is that
coffee is made with boiling water, but it cools in
the storage carafes.

The temprature of the coffee was dictated in the operational manual.
195F IIRC, and this wasn't just one McDonnalds, but everyone I visted
going on roadtrips between seattle and LA. This was the holding temp,
not the brewing temp.

Adding cream is the wrong move, while it might drop a couple of degrees
it acts as an insolator. The coffee cools down more quickly in those
stryofoam mugs and the lid off without adding cream. I used McDonnalds
coffee to clean engines. I don't know if it was the mugs, or the
coffee, but that stuff ate through grease like nobody's business, and
even getting it from 6 blocks away, the stuff was 95C according to my
thermometer.

BTW, the woman got 3rd degree burns because she just sat
there instead of getting out of the car and stripping off her clothes

Really? The funny thing about 3rd degree burns is you don't feel them,
except perhaps 2nd degree burns around the 3rd degree burn. You can
recieve a 3rd degree burn in 5 seconds at 195F. Given my experence
with the stuff, it was likely closer to 200 or 210, which was typical
from what i've observed. Add to this the fact that the person in
question had 3rd degree burns on 6% of her body, and perminate scaring
on 16% of her body. This doesn't happen with coffee served at a
normal temp. McDonnads made it a choice to serve coffee 20 degrees
hotter than the standard, and this made the difference between 1st
degree sunburn level burns, or even 2nd degree blisters, to the horrid
3rd degree loss of skin, nerve damage, the sort burn that you tend not
to know you have.

The real issue was a stupid person who put the
coffee cup between her legs (don't cars have cup
holders now?)and started to drive off, and a scum
lawyer.

No, the real issue was McDonnads was made aware of the fact that their
policy of reccomending a temprature of 195F, and the common practice of
tuning the perculator to just a hair below boiling, was burning people,
seriously. The real issue is they did nothing about it, though cutting
the temp down by 5 degrees would have made a world of difference. The
real issue was they were not willing to pay medial bills for a person
who had 3rd degree burns on 6% of their body. This is a legit dispute
and she needed a lawyer scumbag or otherwise. And guess what, they
turned their coffee temp down.

BTW, the woman got 3rd degree burns because she just sat
there instead of getting out of the car and
stripping off her clothes. (May have had problems
with moving but in my opinion that means the person shoud be more careful.)
The woman got what she deserved, burned
legs, the lawyer got a lot of money, the rest of
us have to live with luke warm coffee.

3rd degree burns on 6% of their body. a 7 day hospital stay, perminate
scaring, and nerve damage. Their coffee was so hot it put people in
the hospital. No one "deserves" that. The settlement was far less
than the millions we hear about, and the lawyer was needed because
McDonnalds wouldn't pay the medial bills. No surprise there.

 

[measekite]

Yep, most personal injury lawyers are scum.

NOT TRUE

They advertise on TV all the
time.

THOSE ARE

My favorite is the one where the lawyer says "we can't promise you a
lot of money" while in the background they are unloading an armored truck in
a homeowner's driveway.

YEAH SOUND JUST AS SLEEZY AS THE AFTERMARKETEERS

 

[measekite]

GOOD


I have two printers on the list and I bought them within the time
period, but I have no way of proving I did. I purchased one at a
garage sale for $5 and the other at a church sale for $1. No receipts.
Always used "compatible" aftermarket carts in them, too - so they
didn't cost me much. They did have a tendency to clog slightly if I
didn't use them at least once a month. I haven't had that problem
since inheriting my brother's HP PSC 2110 a couple of years ago.

I have nothing to complain about. Well, not about that, anyway.

TJ

 

[Burt]

Yep, most personal injury lawyers are scum. They advertise on TV all the
time. My favorite is the one where the lawyer says "we can't promise you a
lot of money" while in the background they are unloading an armored truck
in a homeowner's driveway.

If you said that SOME personal injury lawyers are scum (just as some in any
business or profession are scum) I would agree, I don't agree that MOST
are. Unfortunately, the feds declared, some years ago, that the code of
ethics of medicine, dentistry, and law, can not ban advertising as they
regarded it as restraint of trade. They thought that permitting advertising
might create competition and lower fees. What they accomplished was letting
the crap float to the top with the very type of advertising you mentioned.
The creeps that have more interest in the bucks and less in ethical service
to their clients come up with the biggest ads and lead you to believe that
the whole profession is like them. They have lowered the public concept of
their profession to the level of any fast-buck artist hawking his wares.
The lawyers I know have their clients' interests at heart and behave
ethically. (no, I am not a lawyer!)

 

[George E. Cawthon]

Classic Monday morning quarterbacking. Wrong on all counts.
1) there are safety standards regarding the maximum temperature at which
beverages should be served in restaurants. Employees were, or should have
been, trained regarding the setting of the coffee urns. It was their
negligence that was the issue. I'm sure that the woman, in retrospect,
would have been happier had she used a cup holder. Nonetheless, coffee
served at the proper temperature would have cause first degree burns at the
worst. No more serious than mild sunburn, and with a very short time to
heal.

Hmm. Do you just make this stuff up?

2) Getting out of the car and stripping off your clothes will have little
effect as the third degree burns occured immeditately on contact with fluid
of the temperature that was served.

You really don't know anything abouts burns from
hot liquids do you? I know from personal
experience how it works and some of the poorest
advice is given by supposed professionals.

3) Your description of the lawyer as a "scum lawyer" is typical of a
cynical prejudiced bystander --- that is, until you receive a serious,
debilitating injury yourself as a result of someone elses negligence, in
which case you will run, not walk, to a lawyer who can represent you fairly
and effectively.

You made a fatal assumption "as a result of
someone elses negligence" The woman in question
spilled the coffee on herself, there was no
negligence from others.

It is true that there are rotten apples in every
business

and profession. For better or worse, our society requires competant
representation with legal issues. The law is a learned profession and
deserves the same respect as those engaged in medical or dental practice,
and teaching, to mention just a few professions we must rely on for their
education, skill, and integrity. That is notwithstanding the fact that
there are some who have less skill or exhibit less integrity - the reality
of the human condition.

Good Grief! Get Real.

 

[George E. Cawthon]

The temprature of the coffee was dictated in the operational manual.
195F IIRC, and this wasn't just one McDonnalds, but everyone I visted
going on roadtrips between seattle and LA. This was the holding temp,
not the brewing temp.

Adding cream is the wrong move, while it might drop a couple of degrees
it acts as an insolator. The coffee cools down more quickly in those
stryofoam mugs and the lid off without adding cream. I used McDonnalds
coffee to clean engines. I don't know if it was the mugs, or the
coffee, but that stuff ate through grease like nobody's business, and
even getting it from 6 blocks away, the stuff was 95C according to my
thermometer.




Really? The funny thing about 3rd degree burns is you don't feel them,
except perhaps 2nd degree burns around the 3rd degree burn. You can
recieve a 3rd degree burn in 5 seconds at 195F. Given my experence
with the stuff, it was likely closer to 200 or 210, which was typical
from what i've observed. Add to this the fact that the person in
question had 3rd degree burns on 6% of her body, and perminate scaring
on 16% of her body. This doesn't happen with coffee served at a
normal temp. McDonnads made it a choice to serve coffee 20 degrees
hotter than the standard, and this made the difference between 1st
degree sunburn level burns, or even 2nd degree blisters, to the horrid
3rd degree loss of skin, nerve damage, the sort burn that you tend not
to know you have.





No, the real issue was McDonnads was made aware of the fact that their
policy of reccomending a temprature of 195F, and the common practice of
tuning the perculator to just a hair below boiling, was burning people,
seriously. The real issue is they did nothing about it, though cutting
the temp down by 5 degrees would have made a world of difference. The
real issue was they were not willing to pay medial bills for a person
who had 3rd degree burns on 6% of their body. This is a legit dispute
and she needed a lawyer scumbag or otherwise. And guess what, they
turned their coffee temp down.




3rd degree burns on 6% of their body. a 7 day hospital stay, perminate
scaring, and nerve damage. Their coffee was so hot it put people in
the hospital. No one "deserves" that. The settlement was far less
than the millions we hear about, and the lawyer was needed because
McDonnalds wouldn't pay the medial bills. No surprise there.

I disagree with almost everything you wrote. If
McDonalds or anyone else wants to serve coffee at
195 degrees that's fine with me. If you want to
chug-a-lug hot coffee, do so, but don't blame me
for you burning your mouth. Any other
temperatures you want lower? How about that hot
bacon grease, do you need that cooled down to 160.
Would you like your soup at 15O? Get pissed
when someone laughs at you when you stick a big
spoonful of near boiling soup in your mouth. Or
like a responsible person do you feel foolish and
embarrassed. Does that make you want a lawyer to
punish those food service jerks?

I usually pour soup in my cup when it has bubbled
gently for a minute or two because I don't like
lukewarm soup.

 

[Burt]

(snip)

Hmm. Do you just make this stuff up?

NO. All businesses have safety standards. The standards for beverage
temperatures are published and available for you to look up. All well run
businesses have the need to properly direct and train their employees.
Individuals and businesses ultimately should take responsibility for
overlooking safety standards that subsequently cause injury. When they
don't they are subject to litigation. Successful litigation requires
retaining a lawyer. Lawyers, like all others in the workplace, do their
work to earn a living. Some do it better than others and some are less
honest than others, just like in every other human endeavor. What part of
this don't you understand?

You really don't know anything abouts burns from hot liquids do you? I
know from personal experience how it works and some of the poorest advice
is given by supposed professionals.

OK, George, when I said "immediately" I should have said "a few seconds."
By the time you would get out of the car and try to remove your clothing you
would have already sustained these severe burns. We're not talking about
flaming napalm or clothing that is on fire, which would continue to create
more damage. Unfortunately, George, I've had experience with all of these
types of injuries. I'm one of those "professionals" in whom you have little
trust.

Difficult to discuss the issue with someone like you who knows better than
"the professionals". I guess that, according to your conclusions, education
and experience doesn't count for as much as your gut feeling and cynical
analysis. According to your opinion of "professionals," If I break my arm,
need my appendix removed, or find that I have cancer, I should bypass all of
my physicians and come to Geo. Cawthorn for expert diagnosis and
treatment!!!!

You made a fatal assumption "as a result of someone elses negligence"
The woman in question spilled the coffee on herself, there was no
negligence from others.

Yes, she did spill the drink on herself, but there is the reasonable
expectation that a restaurant will not serve a beverage that can produce
third degree burns. The restaurant was absolutely negligent in dispensing a
beverage that was at a temperature known to scald and produce third degree
burns if spilled on skin. You don't need to consult a medical professional
to learn what temperature will produce damage of the type this woman
sustained. Any plumber knows at what level he/she should set your water
heater to avoid burns if you inadvertantly step into the shower and the hot
water is on with no cold water flowing as well. Check out the nearest
plumbing supply store. Or don't you trust those "professionals" either.

It is true that there are rotten apples in every business

Good Grief! Get Real.

???? You trust whomever you wish with your medical care and legal issues.
I'll stay with the lawyers and physicians whom I know personally and whose
skill and integrity I trust. As they say, different strokes for different
folks. George, it is apparent that you have little faith or trust in
professionals. Hope you never need them. We'll just have to disagree and
move on to more important issues --- like printers and ink. Almost forgot
why we participate in this newsgroup.

 

[Burt]

zakezuke wrote: (snip)


I disagree with almost everything you wrote. If McDonalds or anyone else
wants to serve coffee at 195 degrees that's fine with me.

I guess that McDonalds has a right to serve 195 degree coffee, and their
customers have a right to receive compensation if/when they get burned by
it. Perfect symmetry. Looks like McD decided that it wasn't in their best
interest to serve a beverage that was potentially dangerous to their
customers. When you open McCawthornes feel free to serve coffee at 212
degrees if you wish. Just don't bitch if you get your ass sued.

If you want to

chug-a-lug hot coffee, do so, but don't blame me for you burning your
mouth. Any other temperatures you want lower? How about that hot bacon
grease, do you need that cooled down to 160.

Well, George, when was the last time you ordered a cup of hot bacon grease?
Tasty stuff but not my favorite beverage.

Would you like your soup at 15O? Get pissed when someone laughs at you
when you stick a big spoonful of near boiling soup in your mouth.

Why would someone want to laugh at a person who burns his/her mouth on hot
soup or a hot beverage? Is your sadistic streak showing, George?

Or like a responsible person do you feel foolish and

embarrassed. Does that make you want a lawyer to punish those food
service jerks?

I usually pour soup in my cup when it has bubbled gently for a minute or
two because I don't like lukewarm soup.

Braveheart Cawthorne steps up to the boiling cauldren, lifts the steaming
ladle of broth, and chuggs it down, showing all us wimps that there are no
limits to the temperatures he can endure.

 

[zakezuke]

I disagree with almost everything you wrote. If

McDonalds or anyone else wants to serve coffee at
195 degrees that's fine with me.

It was fine with me too. It cleaned engines really well. But it was
not possible to drink, not without waiting two hours, or pouring into
another cup. At that temp, we are talking third degree burns in about
5 seconds, perhaps less. That number would be lowered to 10 seconds by
dropping to 180 degrees, and that's still bloody hot. The difference
is the ability to react, and not react.

The old Mcdonnads coffee gave me and others blisters if they tried to
drink in the resturant, and this wasn't chug-a-luging. Coffee
shouldn't cause blisters when taking a small sip, and blowing on it.

Would you like your soup at 15O? Get pissed
when someone laughs at you when you stick a big
spoonful of near boiling soup in your mouth.

It's not so much an issue with soup, it's typicaly served in a bowl,
with a spoon, and heat is often lost between laddle and bowl. But if a
resturant got complaints about blisters, they would be neglant for not
turning down their thermostats. I think the rules on this vary from
state to state but serving temp of soup is covered by the health
department in Washington and an inspector may come by at any time to
check it out.

Or like a responsible person do you feel foolish and embarrassed. Does that make
you want a lawyer to punish those food service jerks?

Actually if you really want to know, I might complain in writing... too
hot. If they get complaints regarding mild second degree burns, and do
nothing about the subject, that is negligence. Odds are if they are
laughing about burning one's self I wouldn't go back, that simply is
not acceptable.

We are not talking 2nd degree burns here, we are talking 3rd degree
burns over 6% of the person's body, a week hospital stay, and skin
graffs, and scarring. I've seen people hit with streams of water from
radiators who were not burned nearly so badly.

I usually pour soup in my cup when it has bubbled
gently for a minute or two because I don't like
lukewarm soup.

I usually pour boiling water into a french press, wrap a towel around
it, wait, and pour. The end result is nice 180F coffee. Not 195F
coffee. And it was the habbit to have those perculators just a hair
below boiling, so really poured at 210F into those syrofoam mugs, and
sealed in cases that I saw.

 

[George E. Cawthon]

NO. All businesses have safety standards. The standards for beverage
temperatures are published and available for you to look up. All well run
businesses have the need to properly direct and train their employees.
Individuals and businesses ultimately should take responsibility for
overlooking safety standards that subsequently cause injury. When they
don't they are subject to litigation. Successful litigation requires
retaining a lawyer. Lawyers, like all others in the workplace, do their
work to earn a living. Some do it better than others and some are less
honest than others, just like in every other human endeavor. What part of
this don't you understand?

Most of that is just platitudes without substance,
e.g. lawyers do their work to earn a living. What
the hell is that suppose to mean. And what does
it have to do with "being wrong on all counts" or
any of the rest.

OK, George, when I said "immediately" I should have said "a few seconds."
By the time you would get out of the car and try to remove your clothing you
would have already sustained these severe burns. We're not talking about
flaming napalm or clothing that is on fire, which would continue to create
more damage. Unfortunately, George, I've had experience with all of these
types of injuries. I'm one of those "professionals" in whom you have little
trust.

The time period is short and I understand that the
woman had some difficulties in getting in and out
of a car. So she should have been extra careful
in handling any hot liquid.

Aha. I see where you got pissed, I denigrated
some "professionals." I think you missed the
adjective "supposed." So, you think professional
advice is always good, always correct, always the
best? In fact what I was think of was the advice
for treatment of burns. First they said don't use
cold water (worried about infection) and they
still say don't use ice or at least don't put it
directly against the skin. That's wrong. If you
burn (minor burn) your fingers and put ice against
the spot, chances are you won't know you were
burned in 2 days, don't use ice or don't put in
direct contact and chances are it will take
several days to heal. If I get burned badly, to
hell with infection and shock worries, I want
someone dunking me immediately in the coldest
liquid they can find.

Try a test with ice. Get a Bunsen burner (or a
propane torch) and put a nice round end on a glass
stirring rod. Lay it down and put a nice round
end on a second rod. Then pick the second rod by
mistake by the end that is hot. Run over to the
frig and put an ice cube on your fingers and keep
it there for at least 20 minutes. (Forget the crap
about freeze damage--it won't happen.) Your
fingers won't hurt and will be healed in 2 days,
but miss a finger against the ice and it will take
a week to heal.

Difficult to discuss the issue with someone like you who knows better than
"the professionals". I guess that, according to your conclusions, education
and experience doesn't count for as much as your gut feeling and cynical
analysis. According to your opinion of "professionals," If I break my arm,
need my appendix removed, or find that I have cancer, I should bypass all of
my physicians and come to Geo. Cawthorn for expert diagnosis and
treatment!!!!

Don't know where you get all this. The fact is
I'm a skeptic and not of just professional; you
just don't like skeptics or negative comments
about professionals. The kill ratio of doctors
and nurses in hospitals is a fact and it is
appalling. As for lawyers and the judicial
system, just look at the polls. Fine detail seems
not to be your forte since you can seem to spell
my namer correctly. Probably can pronounce forte
correctly either.

Yes, she did spill the drink on herself, but there is the reasonable
expectation that a restaurant will not serve a beverage that can produce
third degree burns. The restaurant was absolutely negligent in dispensing a
beverage that was at a temperature known to scald and produce third degree
burns if spilled on skin. You don't need to consult a medical professional
to learn what temperature will produce damage of the type this woman
sustained. Any plumber knows at what level he/she should set your water
heater to avoid burns if you inadvertantly step into the shower and the hot
water is on with no cold water flowing as well. Check out the nearest
plumbing supply store. Or don't you trust those "professionals" either.

Good point about stepping into a shower. If you
are so stupid as to step into a shower without
testing it with your hand first, good luck 'cause
you are going to need it. But instead you will
probably try to sue the plumber or the water
heater manufacturer if you are injured, which may
not be burn related. Of course you shouldn't need
to relay on the plumber to set you hot water temp
anymore than relying on the gas attendant to tell
you the speed limit.

BTW, those plumbing supply store people are mostly
salesmen not professionals. Some may be retired
plumbers who are also not "professionals," they
are tradesmen. Professionals mean people that
practice a profession and yes I was one of those.
Of course nowadays, people like to call every
job a profession, but that just demonstrates
ignorance.

???? You trust whomever you wish with your medical care and legal issues.
I'll stay with the lawyers and physicians whom I know personally and whose
skill and integrity I trust. As they say, different strokes for different
folks. George, it is apparent that you have little faith or trust in
professionals. Hope you never need them. We'll just have to disagree and
move on to more important issues --- like printers and ink. Almost forgot
why we participate in this newsgroup.

Hey that great that you have medical and legal
people you trust. So do I. Maybe you should get
over the "professional obsession" which you have
made into a mountain from one simple comment by me.

 

[zakezuke]

Good point about stepping into a shower. If you

are so stupid as to step into a shower without
testing it with your hand first, good luck 'cause
you are going to need it. But instead you will
probably try to sue the plumber or the water
heater manufacturer if you are injured, which may
not be burn related. Of course you shouldn't need
to relay on the plumber to set you hot water temp
anymore than relying on the gas attendant to tell
you the speed limit.

Actually... odds are a plumber setup the water tank. Depending on your
region there are regulations regarding such things, for good reason.
In Washington for example I know a strap is required because of the
risk of an earth quake.

But anyways the temp on the waterheater is geared so that you don't get
2nd or 3rd degree burns from the shower. This is more of an issue with
the elderly or hanicaped who fall and get cooked. Not all accidents
are a result of people being stupid.

If you want hot water, set it your self. That way it's no one's fault
but your own. But for a plumber installing a water tank, there is a
reccomended temp that is considered to be safe that won't boil people.

 

[Burt]

Aha. I see where you got pissed, I denigrated some "professionals."

I'm not pissed. You can think what you want. It's a free country. I'm
just expressing my opinion as you are yours.

I think you missed the

adjective "supposed." So, you think professional advice is always good,
always correct, always the best?

No. Even the most skilled and knowledgeable person can make a mistake.

In fact what I was think of was the advice

for treatment of burns. First they said don't use cold water (worried
about infection) and they still say don't use ice or at least don't put it
directly against the skin. That's wrong. If you burn (minor burn) your
fingers and put ice against the spot, chances are you won't know you were
burned in 2 days, don't use ice or don't put in direct contact and chances
are it will take several days to heal. If I get burned badly, to hell
with infection and shock worries, I want someone dunking me immediately in
the coldest liquid they can find.

Try a test with ice. Get a Bunsen burner (or a propane torch) and put a
nice round end on a glass stirring rod. Lay it down and put a nice round
end on a second rod. Then pick the second rod by mistake by the end that
is hot. Run over to the frig and put an ice cube on your fingers and keep
it there for at least 20 minutes. (Forget the crap about freeze damage--it
won't happen.) Your fingers won't hurt and will be healed in 2 days, but
miss a finger against the ice and it will take a week to heal.



Don't know where you get all this. The fact is I'm a skeptic and not of
just professional; you just don't like skeptics or negative comments about
professionals.

I am also skeptical about some individuals in the professions. I just don't
throw out the term "scum lawyer" without personal knowledge that a
particular lawyer is unethical, a ripoff artist, a crook, a child molester
or (fill in the blank for your own description of what scum means.) Some
people in this country demean all trial lawyers - an unfair
misrepresentation. I hope that was not your intent.

The kill ratio of doctors and nurses in hospitals is a fact and it is
appalling.

Agreed. Any loss of life due to poor judgement or willful misconduct is
appalling.

As for lawyers and the judicial

system, just look at the polls. Fine detail seems not to be your forte
since you can seem to spell my namer correctly. Probably can pronounce
forte correctly either.

Polls do not make an assertion about lawyers, or anything else, correct.
Before you cast the first stone about spelling and detail, please reread the
sentence above this line. "since you can seem to spell my name correctly?"
didn't you mean can't? "Probably can pronounce forte?" didn't you mean
can't? Picky, Picky, George. I'll make you a deal. I won't critically
edit your gramatic errors and you needn't chide me for misspelling your
(somewhat unusual) name. Not exactly like Smith or Brown. My bad for
messing up.

Good point about stepping into a shower. If you are so stupid as to step
into a shower without testing it with your hand first, good luck 'cause
you are going to need it. But instead you will probably try to sue the
plumber or the water heater manufacturer if you are injured, which may not
be burn related. Of course you shouldn't need to relay on the plumber to
set you hot water temp anymore than relying on the gas attendant to tell
you the speed limit.

New buildings like hotels and health clubs install shower valves that have
temperature limiters built into them. It has nothing to do with stupidity.
It is protective of children, the elderly, and others who may inadvertantly
turn the valve the wrong way. In addition to human error, changes in water
pressure due to water use in another part of a building may momentarily
lower the flow of cold water sufficiently to cause a burn if the hot water
heater temp is set up too high. You are right. You and I don't need to
rely on the plumber as we know the safe level to set our water heaters and
we also know how to set them. Everyone isn't so knowledgeable or
mechanically adept. Give the plumber his due for helping those people to
avoid injury.

BTW, those plumbing supply store people are mostly salesmen not
professionals. Some may be retired plumbers who are also not
"professionals," they are tradesmen. Professionals mean people that
practice a profession and yes I was one of those. Of course nowadays,
people like to call every job a profession, but that just demonstrates
ignorance.

Call it what you will, a skilled, knowledgeable, and honest plumber is as
necessary to our society as anyone in any other occupation or profession.
It's also valuable to have knowledgeable sales people, professional or not.
I don't hold "professionals" to be morally, ethically, or societally
superior to tradespeople, nor do I hold tradespeople to be of lesser value.

Hey that great that you have medical and legal people you trust. So do I.
Maybe you should get over the "professional obsession" which you have made
into a mountain from one simple comment by me.

No obsession. I just took issue with several of your points, one of which
was the cavalier "scum lawyer" comment. No different from making a libelous
comment about someone based on a preconception of a racial or religious
group. Without personal or public knowledge of that particular lawyer's
character it smells like prejudice to me and not just a "simple comment."

 

[Arthur Entlich]

As I understand the second option, you can receive both $25 cash plus
$20 from the Epson e-store in credit.

Art

 

[Arthur Entlich]

That has nothing to do with Epson. The plaintiff's lawyer are asking
the court to pay 25% of the value of all claims made. That's about $11.25
million per 1 million claims.

Epson is fighting this, asking the court to award no more than customary
fees to the lawyers. We won't know what the court decides until August,
after the June 22nd cut off date form filing for claims.

Art

 

[Ed Light]

I've ditched my Epson for an HP 5940. So far very nice. It will print with
only one cartridge in it and it will print until it runs out of ink. Using
the large cartridges, the HP ink will be economical if it gets close to the
claimed number of copies.

The nozzles are part of the cartridges, so if the nozzles on a cartridge get
blown then a new cartridge brings in a new set, unlike the Epson where the
nozzles are part of the printer.

The ink resists water very well but is not waterproof.

I'm hoping it can go a week not printing without starting to clog.
--
Ed Light

Smiley :-/
MS Smiley :-\

Send spam to the FTC at
(e-mail address removed)
Thanks, robots.

Bring the Troops Home:
http://bringthemhomenow.org

Fight Spam:
http://bluesecurity.com

 

[Ed Light]

My Epson C64 would just drain away black ink way faster than the color when
(always) cleaning itself.
$9 cartridges from maxpatchink.com were a must. They don't clog up the heads
any faster than the Epson$$ ink.
--
Ed Light

Smiley :-/
MS Smiley :-\

Send spam to the FTC at
(e-mail address removed)
Thanks, robots.

Bring the Troops Home:
http://bringthemhomenow.org

Fight Spam:
http://bluesecurity.com

 

[measekite]

My Epson C64 would just drain away black ink way faster than the color when
(always) cleaning itself.
$9 cartridges from maxpatchink.com were a must. They don't clog up the heads
any faster than the Epson$$ ink.

OH THEY CLOG THEM UP SLOWER SO IF YOU PRINT FASTER YOU DO NOT GET A CLOG